# Views on Planned Parenthood?



## riummi (Dec 6, 2015)

are you overall - favorable or unfavorable? why?




i know some people who feel strongly about this topic but please keep it respectful


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## boujee (Dec 6, 2015)

It all depends on the individual and their situation.
You can't kill something that doesn't have a conscious that it even exist yet.
But this can also apply to people who are favor to life and that every living thing should experience it.
It depends on them.


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## riummi (Dec 6, 2015)

Gamzee said:


> It all depends on the individual and their situation.
> You can't kill something that doesn't have a conscious that it even exist yet.
> But this can also apply to people who are favor to life and that every living thing should experience it.
> It depends on them.



yes i know but im asking about _you_


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## boujee (Dec 6, 2015)

I'm netural


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## piichinu (Dec 6, 2015)

favorable


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## Hermione Granger (Dec 6, 2015)

I appreciate Planned Parenthood because it is very helpful and the easiest resource for many women and men alike. I support it fully because no old man or baby boomer has the right to tell a woman what to do with her body.


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

favourable because im a decent human being


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## PastelPrincess (Dec 6, 2015)

I'm definitely for planned parenthood. Having a child should be a blissful and beautiful moment of your life. Not something you regret.


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## Sugilite (Dec 6, 2015)

Depends on the situation 
If you 16 hack having sex and got no sense of a condomn then that's on you 
If you can't keep your legs close and that's on your main resort then again it's something up with you


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## Matramix (Dec 6, 2015)

I'm favorable.


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## mirukushake (Dec 6, 2015)

It plays a very important role in a country that doesn't adequately provide all of its citizens (especially the poor) access to affordable healthcare and decent sexual education. 

Also, only 10% of PP's clients actually get abortions, and they aren't even funded by the federal government, so...


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## Chicha (Dec 6, 2015)

John Lennon said:


> I appreciate Planned Parenthood because it is very helpful and the easiest resource for many women and men alike. I support it fully because no old man or baby boomer has the right to tell a woman what to do with her body.



Exactly. A lot of people fail to realize the majority of clinics also provide birth control and care for men, women's, and LGBT's reproductive health as well as pregnancy care and general care. It's a blessing for those who are under-insured or uninsured at affordable prices. It's horrible it's being considered to be shut down and shows how pathetic our healthcare system is. :/


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## riummi (Dec 6, 2015)

mirukushake said:


> It plays a very important role in a country that doesn't adequately provide all of its citizens (especially the poor) access to affordable healthcare and decent sexual education.
> 
> Also, only 10% of PP's clients actually get abortions, and they aren't even funded by the federal government, so...



i was trying to explain this to a classmate before but that didnt turn out well lol
she has a very conservative view on this topic u.u


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## GalacticGhost (Dec 6, 2015)

Not too sure what it is tbh


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## tobi! (Dec 6, 2015)

they dont just do abortions either. 

they offer birth control pills, condoms, etc.


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## Cailey (Dec 6, 2015)

favorable overall.


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## kayleee (Dec 6, 2015)

Favorable cause at least one organization is realistic about sex lord knows schools aren't


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 6, 2015)

I'm in the minority here when I say I'm against it.


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## Hermione Granger (Dec 6, 2015)

kayleee said:


> Favorable cause at least one organization is realistic about sex lord knows schools aren't



They're afraid of teens going out and getting pregnant or catching a disease if they teach it, yet it's been actually damaging teens when they have to learn it on their own.


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## ZekkoXCX (Dec 6, 2015)

i'll never have children
but if your planning to go ahead


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## Beardo (Dec 6, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> I'm in the minority here when I say I'm against it.



Any particular reason why? 

I support it. They help make sure sex is safe and protected, keeping people who aren't ready for a baby (like a 16 year old) from getting pregnant. Spreading awareness about these kinds of issues and educating people is great.


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## tae (Dec 6, 2015)

i'm all for planned parenthood. and those against it i find are close minded and don't see past the whole "abortion" aspect of it.

what about the affordable healthcare from them?
the affordable birth control?
the information available to people who need to seek help but can't? 

the good outweighs the abortion side tremendously, but i'm pro choice anyway so it doesn't bother me.


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## Brad (Dec 6, 2015)

I do not see how anyone in their right mind could advocate for a complete loss of, or even a reduction in funding for Planned Parenthood. PP provides necessary healthcare, affordable birth control, as well as helps to teach about and advocate for safe sex.

And for those who see Planned Parenthood as _*only*_ an abortion thing (which I'm not making an argument for or against here); only 3% of Planned Parenthood's business comes from abortion.

This can be extremely helpful for people who are underage, can't afford help, or just aren't educated on the matters of safe sex and pregnancy (like people from a place where abstinence-only sex education is taught).


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## boujee (Dec 6, 2015)

was this topic made due from the recent shooting


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## tae (Dec 6, 2015)

Brad said:


> I do not see how anyone in their right mind could advocate for a complete loss of, or even a reduction in funding for Planned Parenthood. PP provides necessary healthcare, affordable birth control, as well as helps to teach about and advocate for safe sex.
> 
> And for those who see Planned Parenthood as _*only*_ an abortion thing (which I'm not making an argument for or against here); only 3% of Planned Parenthood's business comes from abortion.
> 
> This can be extremely helpful for people who are underage, can't afford help, or just aren't educated on the matters of safe sex and pregnancy (like people from a place where abstinence-only sex education is taught).



bless your entire post brad. just, bless you.

- - - Post Merge - - -



Gamzee said:


> was this topic made due from the recent shooting



do you mean the one in my home city?
the centennial shooting in colorado springs?


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## boujee (Dec 6, 2015)

uh huh
topics like this always form over something that recently happened
it also gets boring seeing people say the same thing repeatedly


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## Hermione Granger (Dec 6, 2015)

Gamzee said:


> uh huh
> topics like this always form over something that recently happened
> it also gets boring seeing people say the same thing repeatedly



Or also the fact that recently the Senate voted to defund Planned Parenthood.


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 6, 2015)

Beardo said:


> Any particular reason why?
> 
> I support it. They help make sure sex is safe and protected, keeping people who aren't ready for a baby (like a 16 year old) from getting pregnant. Spreading awareness about these kinds of issues and educating people is great.



I do, but if I share them I don't want to get into a giant debate. I'm against abortion in general and that is a big function of Planned Parenthood. Why should someone who is against abortion have their tax dollars be used through the federal funds given to Planned Parenthood for abortions? Furthermore, Planned Parenthood was recently exposed through selling aborted babies' body parts for profit which to me is sickening. Honestly, there would be less unwanted pregnancies if people stopped having casual sex with their partners with whom they are not even married to like they're constantly showing on television these days. There is no 100% guaranteed safe method of sex. Condoms are not 100% effective and neither are birth control pills. They only reduce your chances. My mom was the 8th child of her family in an unplanned pregnancy even though my grandmother had not missed a pill.


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> I do, but if I share them I don't want to get into a giant debate. I'm against abortion in general and that is a big function of Planned Parenthood. Why should someone who is against abortion have their tax dollars be used through the federal funds given to Planned Parenthood for abortions? Furthermore, Planned Parenthood was recently exposed through selling aborted babies' body parts for profit which to me is sickening. Honestly, there would be less unwanted pregnancies if people stopped having casual sex with their partners with whom they are not even married to like they're constantly showing on television these days. There is no 100% guaranteed safe method of sex. Condoms are not 100% effective and neither are birth control pills. They only reduce your chances. My mom was the 8th child of her family in an unplanned pregnancy even though my grandmother had not missed a pill.



Literally all of this is untrue (save the thing about your mom)
Read the rest of the thread.

Also not everyone who has had sex wanted to have sex but I'd really rather not get into that.


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## tae (Dec 6, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> I do, but if I share them I don't want to get into a giant debate. I'm against abortion in general and that is a big function of Planned Parenthood. Why should someone who is against abortion have their tax dollars be used through the federal funds given to Planned Parenthood for abortions? Furthermore, Planned Parenthood was recently exposed through selling aborted babies' body parts for profit which to me is sickening. Honestly, there would be less unwanted pregnancies if people stopped having casual sex with their partners with whom they are not even married to like they're constantly showing on television these days. There is no 100% guaranteed safe method of sex. Condoms are not 100% effective and neither are birth control pills. They only reduce your chances. My mom was the 8th child of her family in an unplanned pregnancy even though my grandmother had not missed a pill.



like kai said, all of this is untrue except your family crap.

abortion is just one small aspect on planned parenthood.
why should my tax dollars go to people on food stamps? huh?
because it helps people in need, that's why. i don't agree with food stamps, i think there should e drug testing done and all kinds of regulations for it, but i don't want to defund it because i don't agree with it. it helps people. just like planned parenthood helps millions of people who need it. 

there may be no 100% guarantee against unwanted pregnancy, but defunding a place that helps prevent SO MANY pregnancies with things that DO HELP prevent it is a stupid reasoning. *just because you're celibate or not sexually active doesn't mean everyone has to be. you don't get to push that on people.*


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## Sugilite (Dec 6, 2015)

If you don't want kids then use a condomn 
You're not that horny to stop what you don't want 
It's common sense, I guess he's saying people resort to that as a back up plan, like **** it I can abort it 
But anywhore


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## boujee (Dec 6, 2015)

'family crap'
don't say that, that's rude. had to point that out.


anyways I still stand neutral. 
depends on the person.
some people are dumb as sht
others are quite logical.
some people are probably abusing the system others may not.

people can do whatever the *** they want with their body, it ain't mine


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## piichinu (Dec 6, 2015)

i guess my view is that if you get rid of it, in the end things will end up worse and it wont help at all


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

Also re: "selling aborted babies' body parts"

More than 90% of PP's abortions (which only take up 3% of their whole activity like others have said) is during the first trimester. The "baby" is only the size of a kidney bean. What parts could they possibly be selling?


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## tae (Dec 6, 2015)

Sugilite said:


> It's common sense, I guess he's saying people resort to that as a back up plan, like **** it I can abort it
> But anywhore



i don't agree with people using it as a back up either. 
if your mind set is "oh i can just get an abortion anyway who cares" 
yaeh that's wrong and i don't condone that at all. but that doesn't mean it's alright to de-fund something that helps more than it "hinders."


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## Hermione Granger (Dec 6, 2015)

I would sure hope not a lot of women resort to abortion as a birth control. Excessive abortions will more than likely lead to lifelong health risks. Not to mention, seeing it as a birth control seems silly. If that is the woman's point of view on abortion, then they're irresponsible.


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 6, 2015)

taesaek said:


> like kai said, all of this is untrue except your family crap.
> 
> abortion is just one small aspect on planned parenthood.
> why should my tax dollars go to people on food stamps? huh?
> ...



You're comparing apples to oranges with the food stamps. You can't compare paying taxes for food stamps to funds put toward ending a human life. Planned Parenthood may have other parts to it, but some of that money is still funded towards abortion. As for how Planned Parenthood receives tax dollars for abortions:

"Federal money might not be used to fund abortions directly, but it is used to pay for the facilities, for the utilities and for equipment used for abortions."

Source

You can look it up to about the only 3% being abortions. It's a higher number than you think. The part about them selling aborted baby body parts is true. 

Source

I personally think people shouldn't be so sexually active before marriage, but you're right that I can't force that on people. I'm just disappointed so many people are having casual sex before marriage. I don't expect to convince anyone here. I just wanted to throw in my two cents. Thank you for the reasonable response.


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

DarkDesertFox your "source" is an organization that's notorious for making false accusations (and making fake, edited videos) about Planned Parenthood.

They don't sell baby parts. When women have an abortion with PP, they are asked if they would like to donate the fetal tissue to scientific research. Otherwise the fetus is just thrown in the garbage. No one is slicing and dicing any babies.


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## FruitsChinpoG (Dec 6, 2015)

@jinico rofl, saying that fetuses are thrown in the garbage doesn't really help people side with ya x)


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

FruitsChinpoG said:


> @jinico roll saying that fetuses are thrown in the garbage doesn't really help people side with ya x)



What else are they supposed to do with a tiny bowl of goop? Drink it?

I'd imagine most parents don't wanna keep their abortion.


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## boujee (Dec 6, 2015)

i do love people standing out and not kissing ass- all the time
shoutout to you darkdesertfox

I see where you're coming from, especially since abortions is more of a decision towards the holder.
Lets use a example, a rape victim who gets pregnant by the person. Now this is a tough decision. Do they get a abortion because of what this man has done or keep the bad and have inner conflicts with it. This baby may have physical traits that resembles the attacker and that may be traumatizing for them. I'm glad that you appreciate life for people may still make decisions of still conceive the baby for this child has done nothing wrong.

This thread can go both ways.
Some people may think that this place can help people with these problems.
Others may see it as stupid because we've been taught this already[common sense], knowing wrong from right. BUT THEN others may not have the same resources as you so the argument still continues. That is why I'm neutral.


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## FruitsChinpoG (Dec 6, 2015)

Welp, I imagine leaving that tidbit out would have been more valuable, ahaha


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

FruitsChinpoG said:


> Welp, I imagine leaving that tidbit out would have been more valuable, ahaha


Eh maybe it's a bit discomforting for some people.
But at least I'm telling the truth about the place


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## Sugilite (Dec 6, 2015)

Gamzee said:


> i do love people standing out and not kissing ass- all the time
> shoutout to you darkdesertfox
> 
> I see where you're coming from, especially since abortions is more of a decision towards the holder.
> ...




I love you so so much


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## FruitsChinpoG (Dec 6, 2015)

@Gamzee It's also terrifying that rapists can have custody/visitation rights


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## The Hidden Owl (Dec 6, 2015)

jinico said:


> What else are they supposed to do with a tiny bowl of goop? Drink it?
> 
> I'd imagine most parents don't wanna keep their abortion.



it's not "goop", it's alive.

well, until its not. then it's a dead baby.


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## seliph (Dec 6, 2015)

The Hidden Owl said:


> it's not "goop", it's alive.
> 
> well, until its not. then it's a dead baby.



If it's early it'll be goopy after the deed is done.


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## Nuclear Bingo (Dec 6, 2015)

women are going to abort babies regardless of if there is a legal establishment allowing them to do so or not. So you might as well build safe and legal places to do so. I suppose that is a logical fallacy though


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## Twisterheart (Dec 6, 2015)

I don't really have any opinion on them.


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## kayleee (Dec 6, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> Honestly, there would be less unwanted pregnancies if people stopped having casual sex with their partners with whom they are not even married to like they're constantly showing on television these days.



So I shouldn't be having casual enjoyable sex with my partner which enhances and strengthens our relationship cause we aren't married?
Newsflash even people who are married sometimes don't want kids?? Are they supposed to abstain from sex forever until they decide to produce offspring or should everyone who doesn't want kids just die a sad virgin


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## santoyo.bay (Dec 6, 2015)

100% in favor of Planned Parenthood, because the government should not regulate a woman's uterus.


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## riummi (Dec 7, 2015)

Gamzee said:


> was this topic made due from the recent shooting



nope. i've been wondering what other people think after i had a discussion with my class


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## contententity (Dec 7, 2015)

i get my birth control cheap from them, so... definitely favorable. i also think it's such a silly misconception that their main thing is abortions :u not that i am in any way against abortions. your body, your choice, 100%.  they also do STD testing, breast exams, pap smears, and just in general anything related to sexual health. tbh whenever i go there i'm not remembered, and the front desk people always seem like they're having a bad day. but  maybe that's just the one i go to ~_~ but yeah, planned parenthood is pretty cool


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## Chicken Tender (Dec 7, 2015)

Sugilite said:


> Depends on the situation
> If you 16 hack having sex and got no sense of a condomn then that's on you
> If you can't keep your legs close and that's on your main resort then again it's something up with you



*this.*
people who think like this. 
stop degrading women for their choices, sex is not some evil thing we should shame women on.


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 7, 2015)

kayleee said:


> So I shouldn't be having casual enjoyable sex with my partner which enhances and strengthens our relationship cause we aren't married?
> Newsflash even people who are married sometimes don't want kids?? Are they supposed to abstain from sex forever until they decide to produce offspring or should everyone who doesn't want kids just die a sad virgin



You don't need casual sex to have a strong relationship with someone you're not married to. The main reason why I'm unfavorable towards sex before marriage is because of the possible chance of an unwanted  pregnancy before you and your partner even make a full commitment to each other. At least if something happened from sex during a marriage it would be easier to work things out. Another family story, but my older cousin had sex before marriage and it resulted in the girl getting pregnant and they had a baby boy together. However, they ended up splitting apart and not getting married like they planned. Now my aunt has to watch him a lot because my cousin and his ex are working. Of course couples can still have sex if they don't want kids when they're married. I'm just saying *know the risks* that may result from it. Life is precious and I don't think it's fair to have a baby aborted knowing those risks. I'm not going to get into a giant debate about abortion because you won't convince me and I doubt I'll convince you. I just felt I needed to respond to this.


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## kayleee (Dec 7, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> You don't need casual sex to have a strong relationship with someone you're not married to. The main reason why I'm unfavorable towards sex before marriage is because of the possible chance of an unwanted  pregnancy before you and your partner even make a full commitment to each other. At least if something happened from sex during a marriage it would be easier to work things out. Another family story, but my older cousin had sex before marriage and it resulted in the girl getting pregnant and they had a baby boy together. However, they ended up splitting apart and not getting married like they planned. Now my aunt has to watch him a lot because my cousin and his ex are working. Of course couples can still have sex if they don't want kids when they're married. I'm just saying *know the risks* that may result from it. Life is precious and I don't think it's fair to have a baby aborted knowing those risks. I'm not going to get into a giant debate about abortion because you won't convince me and I doubt I'll convince you. I just felt I needed to respond to this.



Abstaining from sex before marriage is unrealistic for a lot of people, so your personal view should not be projected on to others. Sex is a normal part of the human experience and it's great. Planned Parenthood wants people to have great normal sex while knowing the risks; that's why they provide birth control and condoms. Choosing to wait until marriage doesn't decrease the risk of unwanted pregnancy, and there's a thing called divorce, so I don't really understand how being married even makes a difference, but again obviously it's your choice but people having premarital sex aren't bad or wrong.


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## lazyislander (Dec 7, 2015)

i've always been pro choice. i'm not saying it's okay to get pregnant once a month and have the child aborted, but if it was a sincere accident, why should anyone decide if you should keep the child or not but you? of course, everyone should practice safe sex. maybe go on birth control. but always use condoms, of course. because there are many stds out there that your partner will most likely not tell you about until afterwards.


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## Knopekin (Dec 7, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> There is no 100% guaranteed safe method of sex. Condoms are not 100% effective and neither are birth control pills. They only reduce your chances. My mom was the 8th child of her family in an unplanned pregnancy even though my grandmother had not missed a pill.



I've just moved to a new area and registered with a new doctor and under 'contraception method' I put 'lesbianism'. 100% effective, baby! 

I'm pro-choice, and I like the work that PP does, but I don't like that it's not entirely publicly-funded* and state-run. In my leftie, socialist, European opinion, the services that PP provides should be available at any clinic, which should be free at the point of use.

Basically, it's good, but it could be better.

*I don't like my tax money being spent on bombs being dropped on Syrian children, you can fund women's abortions.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> You don't need casual sex to have a strong relationship with someone you're not married to.


*strums guitar* Not every relationship works the same



DarkDesertFox said:


> The main reason why I'm unfavorable towards sex before marriage is because of the possible chance of an unwanted pregnancy


*strums guitar* Okay but what about non-hetero relationships or infertile people, where there's no chance of a pregnancy?



DarkDesertFox said:


> Another family story


*strums guitar* Your personal story is irrelevant



DarkDesertFox said:


> I'm just saying know the risks


*sweet riff* What do you think you could educate us on, oh sweet teenager who thought people were selling baby limbs on the black market?


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

I'm personally against certain aspects of Planned Parenthood, but I also am not informed enough about the recent controversy surrounding the organization to downright condemn them (if they truly are selling aborted baby body parts like certain videos claim, I definitely think they should be shutdown or pay massive legal repercussions for doing so). The sole factor that I'm personally against about the organization is abortions. I personally believe that the baby (not a fetus) conceived in the womb is a human being that has a soul and spirit. Due to that reason, I view abortion as legalized murder and a violation of the inalienable rights that the child has to live. Another aspect I find disturbing about abortions is that many women become truly hurt by doing it (especially on the emotional side or have to deal with medical complications from it), but yet certain people continue to advocate it as good for women. :/ If you do not want a child, you should at least let the child be adopted by someone who wants a child to raise (like couples who want a child, but are not biologically capable of doing so). To me, the only way we can truly eliminate abortions is to greatly compensate women who are willing to follow through a pregnancy (since it really can be hard on them in every aspect especially when they do not have moral support because some jerk decided to leave them because they did not want to take responsibility) and deliver a healthy child for adoption (if the mother is found to be abusing the system or endangering the well being of the child by doing the wrong things while pregnant [like drugs] then the mother should pay legal consequences). I do however have nothing against birth control since it enables a woman to be truly free (even though I may be against casual sex, people have the liberty to ultimately decide how they want to live their lives as long as they do not violate the life of another [hence why I'm against abortions]) and allow couples to truly live how they want to live in that aspect of their relationships.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

GATHER ROUND KIDS IT'S TIME TO BE EDUCATED ON ABORTIONS



MasterM64 said:


> (if they truly are selling aborted baby body parts like certain videos claim


They aren't. I already explained it here



> I personally believe that the baby (not a fetus) conceived in the womb is a human being that has a soul and spirit.


It's a fetus, usually aborted during the first trimester. If it's later than that, usually it's due to health reasons that would put the mother and/or the baby at risk if it isn't removed anyways.



> Another aspect I find disturbing about abortions is that many women become truly hurt by doing it (especially on the emotional side or have to deal with medical complications from it), but yet certain people continue to advocate it as good for women. :/


Let me make something clear: No one _wants_ to have an abortion.
But if they choose to do so, for whatever reason, they should be able to do it legally and safely. Otherwise we're going to go back to the days where people used hangers and other grotesque, and unsafe methods.



> If you do not want a child, you should at least let the child be adopted by someone who wants a child to raise


You aren't the one carrying a baby inside you for 9 months dealing with all the physical and emotional pain it creates, what makes you think you have a say on whether someone should have to give birth to said baby or not?
And do you think giving a baby up for adoption won't cause emotional pain as well?


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

jinico said:


> GATHER ROUND KIDS IT'S TIME TO BE EDUCATED ON ABORTIONS
> 
> 
> They aren't. I already explained it here
> ...



For the first point, I am waiting until something official is released about the issue before I make an ultimate judgement about the organization. For the second point, the baby inside is still a human being and should be treated with respect as such (& be recognized as having inalienable rights). For the third and fourth point, even "safe" abortion is not necessarily safe for the mother if you want absolutely no harm done in any perspective to the woman. To address the aspect of them carrying the child, that is why they should be heavily compensated for following through. By following through, the woman is able to gain significant compensation (alongside any legal compensation in the perspective of someone raping them) and also bless a couple who are not able to bear a child of their own (there are so many amazing people out there who love children, but have to deal with biological complications). Another aspect of following through is that it also would give the mother time to decide if they want to keep the child in the end. If the child is not wanted by the mother in the end, the mother won't have any emotional feelings anyways towards the child.


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## Beardo (Dec 7, 2015)

It's pretty much a given that if you make something illegal, people are going to do/get it in unsafe ways.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> For the first point, I am waiting until something official is released about the issue before I make an ultimate judgement about the organization. For the second point, the baby inside is still a human being and should be treated with respect as such (& be recognized as having inalienable rights). For the third and fourth point, even "safe" abortion is not necessarily safe for the mother if you want absolutely no harm done in any perspective to the woman. To address the aspect of them carrying the child, that is why they should be heavily compensated for following through. By following through, the woman is able to gain significant compensation (alongside any legal compensation in the perspective of someone raping them) and also bless a couple who are not able to bear a child of their own (there are so many amazing people out there who love children, but have to deal with biological complications). Another aspect of following through is that it also would give the mother time to decide if they want to keep the child in the end. If the child is not wanted by the mother in the end, the mother won't have any emotional feelings anyways towards the child.



There have been many official releases lmao. Of course organizations against PP don't want you to find them.

Abortions are hardly ever performed after the first trimester. Like I said, if they are, it's for the mother's own safety. None of you who are against abortion can ever give a rebuttal for it no matter how much it's mentioned: Would you rather have both the mother and child die, or remove the child so the mother can live?

And how _dare_ you say that someone who has been raped should be forced to carry their rapist's child. How much of a disgusting and vile monster do you have to be to believe that? She's suffering for not only the rest of her life, but now has to carry the child of someone who violated her and ruined her entire life. What the **** is wrong with you?



> For the third and fourth point, even "safe" abortion is not necessarily safe for the mother if you want absolutely no harm done in any perspective to the woman.


No pregnancy is guaranteed safe either, so again, would you rather a woman have a safer abortion done by professionals, or go back to the unsafe methods I've mentioned? 'Cause guess what, if someone feels the need to have an abortion, they're gonna find a way to do so.

As for your ending, of course they're going to have emotional feelings for them. They're a human being that the woman made a bond with and nurtured for 9 months of her life. Chances are they aren't going to be like "Welp here's the thing I spent 9 really hard months on but I don't care take it away so I never have to see it again"


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

Beardo said:


> It's pretty much a given that if you make something illegal, people are going to do/get it in unsafe ways.



This is why the compensation needs to outweigh doing an abortion. I also think that women who follow through should have access to services for moral support and anything else absolutely necessary to bear a healthy child (without causing too much money on taxpayers).

@Jinico:
Sure the child may have been created by the irresponsibility of someone, but the child itself is innocent and should not be legally murdered. Every child has a right to live a happy life. When it comes to cases that the mother's life is in danger, I do think they should try to deliver the child if at all possible before terminating their life regrettably.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> For the third and fourth point, even "safe" abortion is not necessarily safe for the mother if you want absolutely no harm done in any perspective to the woman.To address the aspect of them carrying the child, that is why they should be heavily compensated for following through. By following through, the woman is able to gain significant compensation (alongside any legal compensation in the perspective of someone raping them) and also bless a couple who are not able to bear a child of their own (there are so many amazing people out there who love children, but have to deal with biological complications). Another aspect of following through is that it also would give the mother time to decide if they want to keep the child in the end. If the child is not wanted by the mother in the end, the mother won't have any emotional feelings anyways towards the child.



1. yeah there's still complications but having the option to remove the baby due to health and complication's is better than having to die because someone told you you're not able to make your own decision about your own body. 
that's not right. and that mother is more important than that unborn fetus. 

2.yeah lots of people can't have children of their own, but they can go to orphanages and adopt. why don't they do that?
they want a baby to take care of? do a sergeant mother program. 

you can't force a person to follow through on a pregnancy they don't want.
that's like me telling you you're not allowed to have life saving surgery on your brain because i think it's harmful to your brain.
like, that's not my call and how i feel about your body shouldn't matter because ultimately if you want to survive you're gonna do what you need to do to survive. 



- - - Post Merge - - -



MasterM64 said:


> This is why the compensation needs to outweigh doing an abortion. I also think that women who follow through should have access to services for moral support and anything else absolutely necessary to bear a healthy child (without causing too much money on taxpayers).



so you want victim of abuse and potential 



Spoiler:  tw



r*pe


 to be forced to follow through with an unwanted pregnancy and then be rewarded for it? that's sadistic if you ask me.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

My lung surgery was a risk to my life.
Guess I shouldn't have done it and just gone along with only 1 lung working. Swag.


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

Edited my response to you jinico.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> @Jinico:
> Sure the child may have been created by the irresponsibility of someone, but the child itself is innocent and should not be legally murdered. Every child has a right to live a happy life. When it comes to cases that the mother's life is in danger, I do think they should try to deliver the child if at all possible before terminating their life regrettably.



okay then cut yourself open and you carry the child yourself since you're all for saving the fetus. 

it's not like they go "oh no it's MIGHT BE A RISK BETTER ABORT"
pretty sure aborting a fetus is last measure. but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be offered. 


in your argument you state that "every child deserves the right to a happy life"
but what about the mother? does she not get the option to be happy and healthy?
like you can say you're all for human life, but you're choosing something the size of a bean over a living, breathing, human being. and that's just not right.


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## nintendofan85 (Dec 7, 2015)

I personally don't support abortion, as I believe it's against my religion. However, I'm not against contraception.


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

taesaek said:


> 1. yeah there's still complications but having the option to remove the baby due to health and complication's is better than having to die because someone told you you're not able to make your own decision about your own body.
> that's not right. and that mother is more important than that unborn fetus.
> 
> 2.yeah lots of people can't have children of their own, but they can go to orphanages and adopt. why don't they do that?
> ...



For your first point, I addressed that in my previous reply (in response to jinico). For the second point, I have no idea why some don't do orphanages, but it most likely has to do with being able to raise a child that they can practically can call their own perhaps. For your third point, nowhere did I say that abortions should be illegal. I just simply disagree with it and I am simply proposing an idea that could reduce the overall amount of abortions conducted annually. When it comes to compensation, that is definitely better than having nothing at all. The compensation route would just be alternate path of dealing with an unwanted pregnancy.


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## kayleee (Dec 7, 2015)

I love the "unborn fetus is a human and therefore has rights" argument lmao it's like okay but what about the rights of the human woman who the fetus is inside of


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> @Jinico:
> Sure the child may have been created by the irresponsibility of someone, but the child itself is innocent and should not be legally murdered. Every child has a right to live a happy life. When it comes to cases that the mother's life is in danger, I do think they should try to deliver the child if at all possible before terminating their life regrettably.



First off there's no child being murdered. There's a clump of cells being removed from the uterus.
You have no single idea how mentally damaging it is for that to happen, do you? How could you, someone who claims to be so pro-LIFE, want to ruin someone's life like that?

As for the last bit, abortion is usually the last resort, as in the mother has tried her best to carry the baby but her life is now in severe danger and she must terminate the pregnancy before she dies. Do you know how many women have died because they were either shamed into not having an abortion, or couldn't do so because of legal reasons?
Too damn many.
You're ****ing nasty just stop typing please.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> I am simply proposing an idea that could reduce the overall amount of abortions conducted annually.



but your logic behind it is sadistic and sick. like bribing women to bring an unwanted or dangerous pregnancy to term? like you don't see how traumatic and harmful that is? like do you just not care about women at all? 

that's just disgusting.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

taesaek said:


> like do you just not care about women at all?



I thought that was a given lmao. They're all "pro-life" "pro-baby rights" but what if that baby grows up to be a poor 15 year old girl who gets violated by a family member and wants to terminate the pregnancy because all she can think about is how betrayed she was and how this child is a production of that flat out deception. Then to boot carrying that baby is causing her health problems and she can't move and all she wants to do is die.

"Pro-life" my ass


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

jinico said:


> First off there's no child being murdered. There's a clump of cells being removed from the uterus.
> You have no single idea how mentally damaging it is for that to happen, do you? How could you, someone who claims to be so pro-LIFE, want to ruin someone's life like that?
> 
> As for the last bit, abortion is usually the last resort, as in the mother has tried her best to carry the baby but her life is now in severe danger and she must terminate the pregnancy before she dies. Do you know how many women have died because they were either shamed into not having an abortion, or couldn't do so because of legal reasons?
> ...



To answer the first point, the only reason why you have that view is that you don't see the "clump of cells" as a human being even if it is still indistinguishable. Of course getting an unwanted pregnancy is traumatic. Do you honestly think I'm not aware of that? Like I said a few times now, nowhere did I say abortion should be illegal. I just think that people should have another route of dealing with the problem. If the woman wants an abortion, that is her choice even though I may personally disagree with the practice.

For your last point, I already addressed that.

Now on your last comment:

"but your logic behind it is sadistic and sick. like bribing women to bring an unwanted or dangerous pregnancy to term? like you don't see how traumatic and harmful that is? like do you just not care about women at all? "

Did I ever say anywhere that they would be forced to do that? Nowhere did I say that their choice of abortion should be illegal. Also, how dare you question if I care for women or not. Do you have any ****ing idea what I would do if I saw a woman being raped or abused? I would freakin' beat the **** out of the perpetrator (or go even more extreme if the woman's life is truly endangered).


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> Do you have any ****ing idea what I would do if I saw a woman being raped or abused? I would freakin' beat the **** out of the perpetrator (or go even more extreme if the woman's life is truly endangered).




yeah of course you would, but then you'd beg her to keep the fetus.


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## AwkwardSwan (Dec 7, 2015)

Why is this topic even on here? Like it's an opinion based discussion and people are going to fight about it. I don't see the point other than instigating and can we not use foul language? There are children that use this site.


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## MasterM64 (Dec 7, 2015)

taesaek said:


> yeah of course you would, but then you'd beg her to keep the fetus.


You obviously are not reading fully. Even though I may disagree with abortions, I would not ever do that. You obviously do not know me well enough so stop assuming before you make an *** out of yourself.

I think I made my point on this discussion. If you want to continue our debate, lets take it to a PM.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> To answer the first point, the only reason why you have that view is that you don't see the "clump of cells" as a human being even if it is still indistinguishable. Of course getting an unwanted pregnancy is traumatic. Do you honestly think I'm not aware of that? Like I said a few times now, nowhere did I say abortion should be illegal. I just think that people should have another route of dealing with the problem. If the woman wants an abortion, that is her choice even though I may personally disagree with the practice.
> 
> For your last point, I already addressed that.
> 
> ...



You've probably seen those fear-mongering anti-abortion photos that show fetuses as like 6 month old babies lmao. The fetus pretty much doesn't even have a life yet.
If you truly knew how traumatic it was you wouldn't advocate for the woman keeping that baby.

That last response was to Tae but I'll reply anyways.
Even if you would beat up an abuser that doesn't mean you care about women, you're saying some pretty sexist things in this thread even if you're unaware of it. Because sometimes bigots are unaware they're bigots, which is (IMO) the most harmful form of bigotry.

- - - Post Merge - - -



AwkwardSwan said:


> Why is this topic even on here? Like it's an opinion based discussion and people are going to fight about it. I don't see the point other than instigating and can we not use foul language? There are children that use this site.



I mean I'm just saying the children swear even more than I do.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

MasterM64 said:


> You obviously are not reading fully. Even though I may disagree with abortions, I would not ever do that. You obviously do not know me well enough so stop assuming before you make an *** out of yourself.



lol alrighty then.


you have no issue defending the woman in that case of seeing her being hurt, but then you're thinking of every reason for her to be bribed into keeping something she does not want. has no love for. something that might kill her. something that is just cells. not developed. something that is hurting her. 

but no of course, i'm the one making an ass out of myself because i believe a woman should have every right to her own god damn body. you're totally right jared, silly me for thinking people deserve rights. what a concept.


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 7, 2015)

jinico said:


> *strums guitar* Not every relationship works the same
> 
> 
> *strums guitar* Okay but what about non-hetero relationships or infertile people, where there's no chance of a pregnancy?
> ...



This is why I've been ignoring you. Your responses are downright rude.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> This is why I've been ignoring you. Your responses are downright rude.



You think women shouldn't have rights to their own bodies but ok.

I really do wanna know your stance on the second point though. You're against premarital sex because of unwanted pregnancies, but not everyone can get pregnant, so are you against it for them too?


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## ams (Dec 7, 2015)

There's a pretty simple solution to the abortion debate - we should just castrate the men who disagree with it so their girlfriends won't get abortions. Everyone's happy. Although it might start a new debate about those millions of sperm we'd be killing.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

ams I don't know you and I've never seen you before but you're one of my favs now


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

100% agree with you ams.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

Also just saying if you two are against abortions so much then you better be all for forcing the baby daddy who leaves to stay with that child as well


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 7, 2015)

jinico said:


> You think women shouldn't have rights to their own bodies but ok.
> 
> I really do wanna know your stance on the second point though. You're against premarital sex because of unwanted pregnancies, but not everyone can get pregnant, so are you against it for them too?



Women do have a choice obviously. I just think not having an abortion is the right one. I realize not everyone feels the same way.

I said that unwanted pregnancies was my "main" reason. I really do think sex is something special you should share with the person you decide to commit your life to. I agree with some of the points listed here. Whether you disagree or agree with them is up to you.


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## remiaphasia (Dec 7, 2015)

The issue with preaching abstinence to kids and teenagers is that it doesn't prevent unwanted pregnancies. In fact, research shows that in states were abstinence is the sole form of sex education, teen pregnancy rates skyrocket. If you were actually interested in lowering teen pregnancy and abortion rates, Planned Parenthood and organizations like it that provide a full range of sex education and health screenings should be your ally.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

DarkDesertFox said:


> Women do have a choice obviously. I just think not having an abortion is the right one. I realize not everyone feels the same way.
> 
> I said that unwanted pregnancies was my "main" reason. I really do think sex is something special you should share with the person you decide to commit your life to. I agree with some of the points listed here. Whether you disagree or agree with them is up to you.



i don't know who wrote that thread of your's explaining why sex before marriage is bad, but sounds like a whole crap load of personal preference instead of actual fact. to me it sounds like op just had bad sex and didn't know how to enjoy it.

"For women sex usually means a complete surrender to the guy and she creates expectations that he will surrender to her too, but no."  uh what? she's not surrendering herself to you, she's sharing something with you. intimacy. 

"Not everyone who has sex before marriage gets married."  well yeah because they didn't wanna get married. doesn't mean they didn't enjoy the sex and what they shared while together. 

"Another possibility is the undesired or “desired” pregnancy. Those who get pregnant unintentionally, completely change direction and become a mother at the wrong time." well okay, but i know like 4 people in my immediate friend circle who were married and got pregnant when they didn't want to. ??? ???

"Sex gives the couple intimacy at the wrong time." 
well okay how any time's are you going to throw your opinion on others and claim that they aren't ready for it? like is it your relationship? no. butt out. lol.


that entire article is opinionated and not even worth reading.

l


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## Gregriii (Dec 7, 2015)

who can explain me what planned parenthood is?

I thought you were talking about abortion lmao


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

Tae you forgot the best part:



> And the sexually transmitted diseases… no one speaks about the subject but there is a lot of people carrying incurable diseases out there!



REMEMBER KIDS: Only non-married people have STDs! Marriage creates a barrier made of pixie dust and makes you safe.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

jinico said:


> Tae you forgot the best part:
> 
> 
> 
> REMEMBER KIDS: Only non-married people have STDs! Marriage creates a barrier made of pixie dust and makes you safe.



i literally choked on coffee.


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## Gregriii (Dec 7, 2015)

and in case we're talking about abortion I'm in favour

 if the "thing" has less than a three months yeah why not 

and anyways it's just a life tons of people die every second so killing something that hasnt even born is not a problem IMO

- - - Post Merge - - -



jinico said:


> Tae you forgot the best part:
> 
> 
> 
> REMEMBER KIDS: Only non-married people have STDs! Marriage creates a barrier made of pixie dust and makes you safe.


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## Deak (Dec 7, 2015)

Lmao, what a mindset.


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## DarkDesertFox (Dec 7, 2015)

taesaek said:


> i don't know who wrote that thread of your's explaining why sex before marriage is bad, but sounds like a whole crap load of personal preference instead of actual fact. to me it sounds like op just had bad sex and didn't know how to enjoy it.
> 
> "For women sex usually means a complete surrender to the guy and she creates expectations that he will surrender to her too, but no."  uh what? she's not surrendering herself to you, she's sharing something with you. intimacy.
> 
> ...



A lot of this thread is opinionated if you haven't noticed. I knew I'd get negative feedback for my opinions in this thread, but I don't regret writing them. I was just hoping for more respectful responses like the thread description was saying. I think I've dragged this on long enough so thank you to those who did address their concerns and thoughts in a considerable manner.


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## 00jachna (Dec 7, 2015)

I like how people always get pissed off at these kinds of threads


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

I tried to be nice and informative but I just can't believe people bought the "PP sells baby parts" thing like it's so bizarre it's kind of hilarious.
Like I guess if you didn't know how abortions worked it'd seem believable but...

Also I just _really_ do not like when people try to dictate what others should or shouldn't do with their bodies, especially when it's men trying to do so to women. So sorry if i went tf off but also I'm not that sorry 'cause damn I'm here for girls doing whatever the hell they want regardless of what boys think.


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## kayleee (Dec 7, 2015)

It's so sad that we live in a world where people are taught that sex is bad and that we should be ashamed to be having it and I also feel really sorry for the people who are "waiting for the one" like think of all the great sex youre missing out on


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## boujee (Dec 7, 2015)

I think he's thinking about the bible like sin and sht.
If you don't like sex then whoopie
If you like yes then whoopie 
Both are completely fine. Can't stand someone who thinks it's okay to judge people for doing either.
At least I got educated a bit more here, kudos to this.


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## nintendofan85 (Dec 7, 2015)

ams said:


> There's a pretty simple solution to the abortion debate - we should just castrate the men who disagree with it so their girlfriends won't get abortions. Everyone's happy. Although it might start a new debate about those millions of sperm we'd be killing.



That's disturbing... I see your point but I'm feeling disturbed right now...


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## EloquentElixir (Dec 7, 2015)

Im pro-choice
But I personally don't like planned parenthood because it was created by this person named Margaret Sanger who was a racist who said something along the lines of "Colored people are like weeds to be exterminated."

Planned Parenthoods are usually placed in places where theres a high black population, or any other unfavorable minority present to continue on with margaret's dream. Rarely do you see them in white neighborhoods/populated areas. I could go on, but you see where im going.​


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## Hermione Granger (Dec 7, 2015)

EloquentElixir said:


> Im pro-choice
> But I personally don't like planned parenthood because it was created by this person named Margaret Sanger who was a racist who said something along the lines of "Colored people are like weeds to be exterminated."
> 
> Planned Parenthoods are usually placed in places where theres a high black population, or any other unfavorable minority present to continue on with margaret's dream. Rarely do you see them in white neighborhoods/populated areas. I could go on, but you see where im going.​



The only two in my city are in white populated areas. I didn't know this was a thing until now. The more you learn!


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## nami26 (Dec 7, 2015)

I understand when a pregnant woman or girl wants to kill her baby at the age of 14 and in school and they got raped, but they could give it up for adoption or something, even if they think that its not a living thing. if someone gets an abortion, yeah its not a living thing, but you are preventing a life from being lived, that baby could have been the best and cutest person who grew up to be an awesome and kind person, but they just ruined that chance. that's just how I feel


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> I understand when a pregnant woman or girl wants to kill her baby at the age of 14 and in school and they got raped, but they could give it up for adoption or something, even if they think that its not a living thing. if someone gets an abortion, yeah its not a living thing, but you are preventing a life from being lived, that baby could have been the best and cutest person who grew up to be an awesome and kind person, but they just ruined that chance. that's just how I feel



but that entails you'd rather make a 14 year old child go through 9 months of pregnancy AND childbirth?? 
like 14 years of age is hard enough going through the 48 hormonal resets a teenager goes through each month, but thinking it's best for a 14 year old child to bare a child rather than an abortion is pretty messed up..


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> but you are preventing a life from being lived, that baby could have been the best and cutest person who grew up to be an awesome and kind person, but they just ruined that chance. that's just how I feel



You know what else? The mother could have been the kindest and cutest person ever. But now because she was forced to carry an unwanted child she's bullied at school, abandoned by her friends, physically and emotionally miserable, and struggling to live. Not only that, but her family leaves her too so now she's homeless and struggles to find scraps of money or food. Would you want a baby to brought up in that environment?

No one with this "Just put the baby up for adoption!" mindset ever thinks about the mother. The life that's already been living. It's appalling.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

jinico said:


> No one with this "Just put the baby up for adoption!" mindset ever thinks about the mother. *The life that's already been living*.



this. the entire argument about keeping all the fetus' alive completely invalidates the mother's lives and their choice all together. and i agree, it's appalling.


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## Beardo (Dec 7, 2015)

Besides the stress that can be caused just by being pregnant, a lot of teenagers can't take care of a baby, born or in the womb.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

Beardo said:


> Besides the stress that can be caused just by being pregnant, a lot of teenagers can't take care of a baby, born or in the womb.



That too like do you really want the girl who does vodka shots every other day and chain smokes to have a baby inside her...


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## boujee (Dec 7, 2015)

I sometimes think people exaggerate specific scenarios.
I personally have a neighbor who was 15 and pregnant. She had the baby and the one who's taking care of the child is her aunt who adopted her. Not saying that what you guys are saying isn't true but not every scenario is "omg life is hard".


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## Beardo (Dec 7, 2015)

Gamzee said:


> I sometimes think people exaggerate specific scenarios.
> I personally have a neighbor who was 15 and pregnant. She had the baby and the one who's taking care of the child is her aunt who adopted her. Not saying that what you guys are saying isn't true but not every scenario is "omg life is hard".



Oh yeah, totally. Situations like the one you mentioned, though kinda rare, can happen. When things like that work out, it's great. The baby is taken care of, gets to know its mom (adopted and birth), and gets to grow up safe and happy


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## Jacob (Dec 7, 2015)

oo, abortion is a really sensitive and varied subject. Obviously abortion is a horrible and disgusting thing when like teenagers willingly have sex with 0 disregard for the consequence, conceive, and just kill off a baby. Its just horrible. It becomes a different story when the woman is raped. 

Women should have the right to abortion if:
1. The birth will cause fatal or extreme harm to the woman.
2. The birth will cause fatal or extreme harm to the baby.
3. The woman is too young (14 below, imo) or too old to thoroughly take care of a baby, how ever limits could be adjusted I suppose.
4. The woman has tried with birth control or other contraceptives, yet she still has a baby. (Honestly should not apply to women who voluntarily engage in sex.)

These are really my opinion, but of course, it is completely up to a woman if she wants to have a baby or not. It is her body.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

Gamzee said:


> I sometimes think people exaggerate specific scenarios.
> I personally have a neighbor who was 15 and pregnant. She had the baby and the one who's taking care of the child is her aunt who adopted her. Not saying that what you guys are saying isn't true but not every scenario is "omg life is hard".



And that's great for her, but assuming every teenage pregnancy is gonna go swell is even more harmful IMO (not accusing you of this, just mentioning it).
Also that was her choice to have the baby, no? I'm saying you shouldn't take away a girl's/woman's choice to have said baby or to end the pregnancy and "Just put it up for adoption!" is a rather dumb argument because it's completely ignoring the previous 9 months.


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## boujee (Dec 7, 2015)

They can do whatever they want with their body.
Everyone is different.


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## Tao (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> yeah its not a living thing, but you are preventing a life from being lived, that baby could have been the best and cutest person who grew up to be an awesome and kind person, but they just ruined that chance. that's just how I feel



It could have also been the reincarnation of Hitler and the abortion has just saved the world from Holocaust v1.2.


Guys splooging into tissues is also preventing a potential life. People turning down sex are preventing potential life. Lots of things are potential life. End of the day, if the mother doesn't want it and they're being forced to keep it, that mass of cells is more of a potential tumor than potential life.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

Tao said:


> if the mother doesn't want it and they're being forced to keep it, that mass of cells is more of a potential tumor than potential life.



this. this hit's the nail right on the head.
and i really wish more people understood this. 

if the technology was present and the ability to pass a pregnancy onto the father instead was possible, i'm sure abortion would be much more accepted since it wouldn't only be women baring the burden of being forced into bringing a pregnancy to term.


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## nami26 (Dec 7, 2015)

Tao said:


> It could have also been the reincarnation of Hitler and the abortion has just saved the world from Holocaust v1.2.
> 
> 
> Guys splooging into tissues is also preventing a potential life. People turning down sex are preventing potential life. Lots of things are potential life. End of the day, if the mother doesn't want it and they're being forced to keep it, that mass of cells is more of a potential tumor than potential life.



the point I was trying to make though was that yeah the baby could turn out to be bad, but theres always the "if". who knows what the baby will turn out to be, but just the thought of knowing, "I made the choice to kill (abort for some people) a baby, I may have not been able to support it and I didn't want to go through the pain of childbirth." well, you kinda just killed something, living or not.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> well, you kinda just killed something, living or not.




you cannot kill what is not living.


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## nami26 (Dec 7, 2015)

and the rate the world is going with abortion, I bet you that in a 20 years or so, we won't have any babies to grow up because they are all dead, and the world population will either stay the same, or decrease, due to the fact that abortion is becoming more poplar

- - - Post Merge - - -

popular sorry


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> and the rate the world is going with abortion, I bet you that in a 20 years or so, we won't have any babies to grow up because they are all dead, and the world population will either stay the same, or decrease, due to the fact that abortion is becoming more poplar
> 
> - - - Post Merge - - -
> 
> popular sorry



you do understand how incredibly over-populated the world currently is right?


"i bet in 20 years there will be no more babies"

yeah because all the people who do want kids are just going to decide to abort them instead because it's "popular" right? did you listen to what you even said before you hit enter?


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## nami26 (Dec 7, 2015)

taesaek said:


> you cannot kill what is not living.



exactly then. the definition on google of abort is somewhere along the lines of bringing to a premature end. yeah you might not be killing it but you are bringing something to an end, otherwise preventing a life. yeah like tao said, the baby could grow up to be another Hitler or whatever, but they might not, and taking the chance is all it takes, evil baby or not.

- - - Post Merge - - -



taesaek said:


> you do understand how incredibly over-populated the world currently is right?
> 
> 
> "i bet in 20 years there will be no more babies"
> ...



sorry I misworded myself on the no babies part

- - - Post Merge - - -

in 20 years or so, yeah the world is still overpopulated, but witht eh amount of abortions right now in the present day, just think what its going to be later on. there wont be no babies, sorry I said that, but there will be more likely chance that each baby formed as a fetus will most likely be aborted.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> exactly then. the definition on google of abort is somewhere along the lines of bringing to a premature end. yeah you might not be killing it but you are bringing something to an end, otherwise preventing a life. yeah like tao said, the baby could grow up to be another Hitler or whatever, but they might not, and taking the chance is all it takes, evil baby or not.



so you're not killing anything. you're not murdering anything.
you're terminating a pregnancy, that fetus is just cells at this stage.


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## seliph (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> yeah you might not be killing it but you are bringing something to an end, otherwise preventing a life.



And forcing a woman to carry an unwanted child is preventing _her_ life.
Literally why can't any of you understand that? You guys are all pro-baby but why aren't you still rooting for them when that baby becomes a woman? If you're pro-baby and pro-fetus then you have to also be pro-that-baby-when-its-a-teenager and pro-that-fetus-when-its-an-adult


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## That Zephyr Guy (Dec 7, 2015)

All things in context.

If the situation calls for it, and the child would be better off unborn, then yeah man do what you need to do.

But in the same situation, you probably shouldn't get one if you're just doing it because of your own irresponsibility. If you're not ready for the burden of having a kid, then I'd advice you invest in some condoms or something similar.


Because god knows the investment of a child or two is significantly more stressful on the wallet.


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## tae (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> in 20 years or so, yeah the world is still overpopulated, but witht eh amount of abortions right now in the present day, just think what its going to be later on. there wont be no babies, sorry I said that, but there will be more likely chance that each baby formed as a fetus will most likely be aborted.




denver's public school system has failed you horribly.


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## nami26 (Dec 7, 2015)

taesaek said:


> so you're not killing anything. you're not murdering anything.
> you're terminating a pregnancy, that fetus is just cells at this stage.



you know what? whoop syou got me! you got me on this one. youre right im wrong. we should kill babies I guess. dead or alive. or forming. mass of cells. disgusting. 

maybe its because of my religion I don't know. but I just feel abortion is wrong and I don't want to keep arguing. ur right Im wrong. just a mass of cells still forming

- - - Post Merge - - -

actually, the northeast and Pennsylvania's public school system ahs failed me horribly. I lived in Denver since 6 so they didn't teach us about the cruelties of the world like we have today. the old day s were so much different back then.

- - - Post Merge - - -

and the public school system is the thing that forms the idea that abortion is ok and is natural. which is bs. why I moved from Denver I don't know.


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## Tao (Dec 7, 2015)

Pika123 said:


> and the rate the world is going with abortion, I bet you that in a 20 years or so, we won't have any babies to grow up because they are all dead, and the world population will either stay the same, or decrease, due to the fact that abortion is becoming more poplar



...I mean, I guess that could happen? I mean, it's highly unlikely, but I guess the potential is there for the human race to be wiped out because we went bat**** crazy with abortions? 

For every person who's having an abortion, there's a couple somewhere actually trying to have a baby, or a mother who got pregnant by mistake yet wants to keep it, or people who _have to_ keep it for religious reasons. The likelihood that in 20, 40, 200 years down the line nobody wants kids and we abort ourselves into extinction are so low that we may as well start talking about the potential for dinosaurs to rise from their graves and do battle among the mole people.

Even if we do hand out abortions so liberally that in the near future you're expected to have had at least 6 by the time you're 15, humans have enough common sense to enforce ways to keep the species going. Cloning, artificial births, surrogate mothers, whatever, we'll exist.

Point being, "we'll abort ourselves to death" is a none issue.



We could do with the population decreasing anyway. Earth is pretty overcrowded with humans.


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## Princess (Dec 8, 2015)

Favourable! Women's health is hella important, it's time to stop limiting resources.


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## gem83 (Dec 8, 2015)

I support the organization itself because of all of the things they do to help women, even the abortion aspect. Yes, I think it's horrible and I see it as killing a baby and no one will ever convince me otherwise (so don't try), BUT I still believe it should be a legal option for anyone who wants/needs to get one, and I don't believe in shaming people who do get one. You don't know their situation, and even if you do, it's none of your business.


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## KaydeeKrunk (Dec 8, 2015)

I'm favorable towards Planned Parenthood, I know the heated bit is always about the abortions but that is just a very small part of what they do, they provide free contraception for most people, help women without other options to take care of their bodies, and helps with education as well as many other things. They aren't a one trick pony and the people saying that they're selling babies parts and stuff just boil my blood, but like honestly even if they were selling off baby parts for stem cell research that will help us grow organs for people and like a million other things that they're working on I would give them all of the baby parts ever. Also I am supportive of abortion by itself too, honestly it's up to the owner of the womb if they'd like a baby in them or not, and sure I can see how it's kind of wrong for people with access to preventative options like contraceptives will blatantly not use them and get knocked up again and again and just keep getting abortions, but there are so many more reasons a woman could need an abortion and to me it's amazing that they offer a safe environment for a woman to seek one, if we shut down places like Planned Parenthood there would be a massive influx of children that starving, that can't find homes, that are abandoned and abused, and also plenty of women who will do themselves bodily harm to try and get rid of the baby by themselves. I wish there were more places like Planned Parenthood to be honest, I remember in my town our local Planned Parenthood had a booth at the summer fair and they took quizzes on all the youth about being sexually active and the like and then gave out Chinese food boxes with condoms and flavored lubricants, which was awesome, because we all know a lot of the younger population is sexually active.


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## xiaonu (Dec 8, 2015)

The original question is very vague, so I'm kinda confused why everyone associates PP with abortions only. There's more to the facility than just assisting in abortons, its not some evil place.
I'm for PP because I can get birth control perscription without a hassel of the dr. office to prevent unwanted pregnancies and regulate my menstrual cycle.
its easy and convenient.


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## Yoshisaur (Dec 8, 2015)

xiaonu said:


> The original question is very vague, so I'm kinda confused why everyone associates PP with abortions only. There's more to the facility than just assisting in abortons, its not some evil place.
> I'm for PP because I can get birth control perscription without a hassel of the dr. office to prevent unwanted pregnancies and regulate my menstrual cycle.
> its easy and convenient.



Exactly this. The question was not if you are pro-life or pro-choice the question was about PP, which abortions are only about 3% of their services performed. People don't seem to realize this.


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## hydrophonic (Dec 8, 2015)

EVERYONE should have the right to choose, and when i say EVERYONE i mean EVERYONE. (Being obvious that the person willing to do so has a reason and isn't using abortion as a contraceptive and the time when they are doing it so is before the fetus has developed its nervous system [[because YES, condoms break, molestation sufferers aren't guilty WHATEVER CLOTHES THEY WERE WEARING, a fetus malformation IS a valid reason, not being able to give the future person a deserving life IS a valid reason, and IT IS a choice OVER ANYTHING]]). This being said, i'm not willing to exchange words with anyone, because debates over this kind of topics almost always end up with anger and not a minimal change of opinions if both parts aren't able to express themselves in a propper way, explaining their arguments in a neutral and adequate tone (i couldn't do this, i find expressing myself uber difficult).
Oh, and by saying this, i'm not saying that any other opinion which differs from mine aren't valid!!, I'm just stating mine!! XXO.

OH LMAO, forgot about the other stuff going with the topic.
Planned parenthood all the way!! Everyone should be able to choose. (Taking into account eerything that involves Planned Parenthood (pills, operations, condoms, blah blah, right?) that isn't abortion, lmao, i've already expressed myself up there.


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## Han Solo (Dec 8, 2015)

support it 100%.


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## SoftFairie (Dec 8, 2015)

I used to be against it until one of my good friends was in "that" situation.

It really opened up my eyes and now I support it.


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## Shimmer (Dec 8, 2015)

A woman has the right to do whatever with her body as she pleases. End of story.


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## Mimi Cheems (Dec 8, 2015)

U-um. I'm sorry to ask such a dumb question but what exactly _is_ planned parenthood? ^^;;


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## Hermione Granger (Dec 8, 2015)

Papyrus said:


> U-um. I'm sorry to ask such a dumb question but what exactly _is_ planned parenthood? ^^;;



Planned Parenthood Google definition:
a nonprofit organization that does research into and gives advice on contraception, family planning, and reproductive problems.

Planned parenthood helps both men and women with contraceptives, STD/STI screenings and such. They also assist with abortions, but that's just 3% of their service yet people assume PP is just an abortion clinic when it is more than that. You can look it up for more detailed information. ^^


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## Kittyinpink87 (Dec 8, 2015)

I support it.


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## inkling (Dec 11, 2015)

planned parenthood is about planning parenthood literally, so why are people against it? Just go to the website. They even go the pull-out method on there. its about education in general and they give a little help. again, this is one of those things thats more about class and less about morality...or maybe it is about morality i donno...


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## abbydoll (Dec 11, 2015)

I stand with PP, all the way.


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## Soot Sprite (Dec 12, 2015)

I read through some of the posts, but I'm not going to quote anyone so I'll assume you'll know what I'm talking about.

First off, I am favorable of planned parenthood, and pro-choice in regarding abortions.

This https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/abortion/in-clinic-abortion-procedures is where I'm getting the information about abortion. It can cost up to $1,500. I am not only pro-choice, I think it should be covered by all Medicare. Currently, it's only available for coverage if the pregnancy in question is by rape, incest, or life endangerment. Some states in the United States cover it, but I don't know how many. I know some people don't think taxes should pay for abortions, but let me give you a little bit to reconsider.

If you can't afford an abortion, you _damn sure_ can't afford a child. So what would be a smaller cost in the long run, paying for a woman's abortion once, or giving her federal aid throughout the child's life to help support it's upbringing?

Planned Parenthood does so much more than just abortions, though. And if anyone uses the "keep your legs closed and you won't need an abortion" argument, that's not only not realistic, but not anyone's business. People are free to do as they chose. That means going to Planned Parenthood for any kind of aid they need, that means having as much or as little sexual activity as they please, and having an abortion if they so choose.


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## Knopekin (Dec 12, 2015)

Kyoko said:


> This https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/abortion/in-clinic-abortion-procedures is where I'm getting the information about abortion. It can cost up to $1,500. I am not only pro-choice, I think it should be covered by all Medicare. Currently, it's only available for coverage if the pregnancy in question is by rape, incest, or life endangerment. Some states in the United States cover it, but I don't know how many. I know some people don't think taxes should pay for abortions, but let me give you a little bit to reconsider.



That's mad. That's Ireland levels of mad (sorry Irish people, but your laws are wack).


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## cIementine (Dec 12, 2015)

i'm all for planned parenthood.
that guy that shot up the abortion clinic recently should go **** himself. he argues he's a pro-lifer and that's why but if you're pro-life, then why would you go kill three people? he's basically saying don't kill people by killing people. if he's so pro-life maybe he should have got one.


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## lolita.x (Dec 12, 2015)

favourable- i am definitely pro choice


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## Kess (Dec 12, 2015)

Favorable. There's too many reasons not to be


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## Ghost Soda (Dec 12, 2015)

It's funny when people come into these kinds of threads just to go "lol don't have sex!!111"


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## Red Cat (Dec 12, 2015)

It's funny how a lot of the people who consider themselves "pro-life" vote for politicians who are against any kind of gun control whatsoever, who are more than eager to start wars which cost hundreds of thousands of lives, and who don't give a s*** about climate change which is a threat to all of humanity. I mean, even if you think Planned Parenthood is a baby killing factory, shutting it down is probably very far down on the list of things you could support to save lives. People who want to reduce the number of abortions would probably have more success actually trying to make the world a better place to raise children instead of trying to ban abortions, because making them illegal will just cause women to go to illegal, unsafe abortion providers which are more likely to result in both the woman and the fetus getting killed.


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