# New Sonic Colors Trailer, Box Art, and Release Date



## Tyeforce (Aug 6, 2010)

<big><big><big>Sonic Colors will be released for Wii and Nintendo DS
<big><big>November 16, 2010</big></big></big></big></big>
http://www.youtube.com/v/3CNcdGQCo64&hd=1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CNcdGQCo64&hd=1









http://blogs.sega.com/usa/2010/08/06/sonic-colors-gets-a-pack-front-release-date-and-new-trailer/


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## Bacon Boy (Aug 6, 2010)

I might end up getting this one depending on what the wi-fi is. What'd be awesome if it was like a SA2 2P battle system and you could face each other online. 

Regardless, as long as this doesn't have some random alternate evil (that isn't a Sonic Character) other than Eggman, then I probably won't get it. They all started looking the same after Sonic 06.


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## DarthGohan1 (Aug 6, 2010)

Looks like Sonic Adventure 2 Battle + Sonic Riders recycled together...


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## David (Aug 6, 2010)

Be cooler if I was still 12 years old and hadn't already essentially played this game 5 times before.


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## Jas0n (Aug 6, 2010)

Is this not the same as every other Sonic game?


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## Rawburt (Aug 6, 2010)

Looks fun.

But...that music :x


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## masterfangs (Aug 6, 2010)

The top left creature thingy on the DS case looks like the aliens from Chicken Little.... It looks like any other sonic game lately though, so I probably wont get it


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## [Nook] (Aug 6, 2010)

Yawn. 

@ Only little Noobish kids use "Gay" as a term replacing "dumb" or "bad". 

And HTML doesn't work here, Einstein.


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## -Aaron (Aug 6, 2010)

Oh, this isn't out yet??
Coolbeans. I still have time to get that hat.


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## Mino (Aug 6, 2010)

I get older, Sonic stays the same age.

Oh wait.


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## Psychonaut (Aug 6, 2010)

I can't help the urge to say..
this game's going to be the fruitiest sonic ever.
/sonic's really showing his true colors, now.
/rainbow themed jokes.

I can see the second one being in bolded letters on the back of the box, too.


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## Trent the Paladin (Aug 7, 2010)

UGH THE SINGING. FREAKING BRITISH 80 POP ROCK.

I guess it doesn't look to bad. Looks like the same *censored.2.0* I dealt with in Unleashed if I were to only Daytime Missions. Will they let us use the GC Controller though? Wii control is *censored.2.0*. :L


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## Entei Slider (Aug 7, 2010)

*snaps fingers* I GOT IT! The power-ups are the little creatures *EM-ER-AL-DS* and does anyone notice something suspicious about the yellow emera-I mean creature power-up?
*COUGH*SMG2 drill power-up*COUGH*


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## Ciaran (Aug 7, 2010)

Meh.
I'm not gonna get it, I'm just gonna wait until they release all the sonic 4 episodes together on a single disk + a little extra to get my sonic fill.


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## Bulerias (Aug 7, 2010)

Yeah, I dunno.  I liked Unleashed, mostly for the music, but the music here is downright atrocious.  Gameplay engine looks like it's exactly the same...and I thought Sonic moved way too fast in Unleashed...


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## Entei Slider (Aug 7, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> Yeah, I dunno.  I liked Unleashed, mostly for the music, but the music here is downright atrocious.  Gameplay engine looks like it's exactly the same...and I thought Sonic moved way too fast in Unleashed...


Or way too slow in the night stages... There wasnt that good medium they had in the past games....


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## Bacon Boy (Aug 7, 2010)

K.K.Slider said:
			
		

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The games actually kinda died after Sonic Heroes. However, I agree with Bul, the music in Sonic Unleashed was a new and cool style. I even have some of it on my iTunes.

Personally, I think this might be good as long as it's not gimmicky. The reasons why I liked the SA-SH games was because there were no real gimmicks. Sure in SH you had to switch between three people, but it became habit after playing it a while. Other than that, you were just going through the levels with your characters as fast as you could go (with Sonic/Shadow of course).


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## Tyeforce (Aug 7, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> Yeah, I dunno.  I liked Unleashed, mostly for the music, but the music here is downright atrocious.  Gameplay engine looks like it's exactly the same...and I thought Sonic moved way too fast in Unleashed...


You've heard _one_ song (which I rather love, but this isn't about me). The actual music that plays in the levels is supposed to be different (or, as you would put it, "better").


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## DarthGohan1 (Aug 7, 2010)

>


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## Tyeforce (Aug 7, 2010)

DarthGohan1 said:
			
		

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wat


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## DarthGohan1 (Aug 7, 2010)

notice the greater than sign


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## Tyeforce (Aug 7, 2010)

DarthGohan1 said:
			
		

> notice the greater than sign


Didn't see it.

But still, my point is valid; wat


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## DarthGohan1 (Aug 7, 2010)

old sonic >>> new sonic / sonic colors


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## D Man 83 (Aug 7, 2010)

I don't think it looks all that bad


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## DarthGohan1 (Aug 7, 2010)

D Man 83 said:
			
		

> I don't think it looks all that bad


It is pretty colorful, I guess.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 7, 2010)

DarthGohan1 said:
			
		

> old sonic >>> new sonic / sonic colors


That's nice, you have an opinion.

So do I.

(Also, you haven't even played the game yet, so don't say you don't like it. You could end up loving it, if you gave it a chance and played it once it's released.)


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## DarthGohan1 (Aug 7, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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I know, just messing around


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## Tyeforce (Aug 7, 2010)

DarthGohan1 said:
			
		

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Well, most people who say "Old Sonic > New Sonic" aren't just messing around. =P


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## Bulerias (Aug 7, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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Plenty of things wrong with this post.

1) I have heard more than one song from this game.
2) The music that plays in the levels is different, but that doesn't automatically make it "better".
3) In fact, the gameplay music isn't that much better.  It's fairly average for a Sonic game.
4) Your use of quotation marks with the word "better" implies that I have a pretentious view of constitutes makes good music.  Actually, there are objective barometers that have nothing to do with opinion.  There's plenty of rock music with interesting melodies, cool harmonies, adventurous instrumentation, etc...the rock music in Sonic is objectively derivative and uninteresting.  If you like it, good for you, but that's a matter of opinion, not objective musical worth.


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## Bulerias (Aug 7, 2010)

Bacon Boy said:
			
		

> ...the music in Sonic Unleashed was a new and cool style. I even have some of it on my iTunes...


Same here.  The French, gypsy-jazz style tune (called "Spagonia Day 2", I believe) is pretty freakin' cool...


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## Bacon Boy (Aug 7, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

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Both night and day levels were great for the music. That was pretty much the only reason I liked that game.


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## Rawburt (Aug 7, 2010)

Hmm, the Sonic Unleashed music sounds like it's pretty great, I might have to check it out.


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## Ciaran (Aug 7, 2010)

Rawburt said:
			
		

> Hmm, the Sonic Unleashed music sounds like it's pretty great, I might have to check it out.


It's good if you're into soundtrack music.

I never heard it all because I refuse to finish that godawful game.


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## Bulerias (Aug 7, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

> I never heard it all because I refuse to finish that godawful game.


Haha.  I just downloaded the OST and kept a few of the tunes I liked.  I was inspired to start looking for gypsy jazz after hearing Sonic Unleashed's soundtrack and found this, might be of interest to some of you guys:

http://www.amazon.com/About-That-Time-Club-Detroit/dp/B003BQO11O/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1281216467&sr=8-2

cookin' modern jazz with gypsy sensibilities

anyway, back on topic........colors looks like a new texture pack for Unleashed with some new gimmicks thrown in.  news at 11


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## Rawburt (Aug 7, 2010)

Speaking of music, since this is an amusement park-themed game, I hoping for some carnival-style music thrown in this game, I lurve me some carnival-style music.

Also on a quick Wikipedia research, I read that the script is being written by the guys who wrote "Happy Tree Friends" and the really violent game "Mad World." Seems a bit misplaced to me. o-o


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## Ciaran (Aug 7, 2010)

Rawburt said:
			
		

> Speaking of music, since this is an amusement park-themed game, I hoping for some carnival-style music thrown in this game, I lurve me some carnival-style music.
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> Also on a quick Wikipedia research, I read that the script is being written by the guys who wrote "Happy Tree Friends" and the really violent game "Mad World." Seems a bit misplaced to me. o-o


People don't watch HTF for it's gripping dialogue.


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## Rawburt (Aug 7, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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Haha, you might have a point there. (never watched HTF, so I wouldn't know)

I'm mostly just wondering how one goes from Mad World to Sonic Colors.


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## Bacon Boy (Aug 7, 2010)

Rawburt said:
			
		

> Speaking of music, since this is an amusement park-themed game, I hoping for some carnival-style music thrown in this game, I lurve me some carnival-style music.
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> Also on a quick Wikipedia research, I read that the script is being written by the guys who wrote "Happy Tree Friends" and the really violent game "Mad World." Seems a bit misplaced to me. o-o


http://www.youtube.com/v/k2xWguSihjU


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## Mino (Aug 7, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

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Dude.  You're doing it wrong.  You're presenting your opinion as fact.  Or something!


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## Ciaran (Aug 7, 2010)

Rawburt said:
			
		

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Both games are SEGA produced, and with work as scarce as it is nowadays Im sure the writers were delighted to just have something to do.


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## zantrul (Aug 7, 2010)

Sonic colors looks AWSAUM i wonder whats going to be on NWC


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## Trent the Paladin (Aug 7, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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^

Though due to my new obsession with finishing games, I'll end up returning to it at some point to get pissed. Again.


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## -Aaron (Aug 7, 2010)

Dohohoho, the guy who made the MadWorld script, eh?

-Aaron gained 900 Interest EXP.
-Aaron's interest rose to level 3.

EDIT: Happy Tree Friends too? I expect to see some sort of mutilation or violent act, in-game, on-screen or off.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 8, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

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1. How, and what? No other music has been released. You can hear some music in some of the gameplay videos from E3, but it's all very faint and barely hearable among all the noise.

2. I never said it did. I said you'd probably think it is, since you seem to despise the main theme.

3. That's not "in fact", it's an opinion. I can't really say anything about it at this point, having not been able to hear the music very well in gameplay videos. But from what's been said about it, I have no doubts that it will be pretty good.

4. Your claim that Sonic music is "derivative and uninteresting" and doesn't have "interesting melodies, cool harmonies, adventurous instrumentation, etc." is an opinion itself. I certainly think that Sonic music has all that and more. Not every single Sonic song, of course, but a lot. And I would more than likely find music that you feel is the best in the world to be dull and boring. We have different tastes, just as everyone does. Music is art, and art is subjective.


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## Hub12 (Aug 8, 2010)

Aww, c'mon, it can't be THAT ba-, wait, was that a giant donut?

...nevermind.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 8, 2010)

Hub12 said:
			
		

> Aww, c'mon, it can't be THAT ba-, wait, was that a giant donut?
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How is that bad? It's fun, exaggerated, non-realisting settings, just like the Genesis games. Isn't that what people have been asking for?


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## Ciaran (Aug 8, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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No, we want 2D sonic or nothing at all.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 8, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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Why does it have to be 2D? Why can't you have a good 3D Sonic game? Besides, there's Sonic 4, and Sonic Colors for DS will be 2D as well, so don't act like you're not getting any 2D Sonic.


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## Ciaran (Aug 8, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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I didn't say anything about getting no 2D sonic.

I said that I didn't want sonic to venture outside the third dimension.

And I think the now infamous 'Sonc Team' has proven that it's quite a challenge for them to make good 3D sonic games.


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## -Aaron (Aug 8, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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Quite ironic, no?


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## Ciaran (Aug 8, 2010)

-Aaron said:
			
		

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Dimps are sega's saviours. Without them sonic would be long gone.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 8, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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Why don't you have faith in the developers. They're finally at a point where they're taking all the criticism from the fans very seriously, so seriously that they delayed Sonic 4 to change the physics and such to satisfy all the whiners like you. As for Sonic Colors, they're taking the reception of Unleashed and building upon the great daytime gameplay for Colors, and removing the not-so-well-recieved Werehog gameplay. And they're also taking a page out of Super Mario Galaxy with the Wisp power-ups and whatnot, and I don't see how that can be a bad thing. You just _want_ this game to fail. You're not even giving it a chance, and you probably never will. You'll just continue to express your hatred and rage towards it, while you'll never actually play the game for yourself.


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## Ciaran (Aug 8, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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I said nothing whatsoever about hating the game, I said that I don't want it because I prefer 2D Sonic.




			
				Tye said:
			
		

> Unleashed and building upon the great daytime gameplay



Thou shalt not state thou opinion as fact!!


EDIT: And that song was the most pointless piece of uninspired drivel I've heard in a good long while.


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## BlueDaisy (Aug 8, 2010)

OMG! I love Sonic. I've played almost every Sonic game, so I'll definitely be picking up this one.


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## Bulerias (Aug 8, 2010)

Lots of fanboy rage in this thread...they're just games, Jesus Christ.  Nobody is supposed to "have faith" in developers, if their track record is *censored.2.0* then chances are the next game in the series won't be any good either.


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## Trent the Paladin (Aug 8, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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I don't remember seeing giant donuts in the Genesis games.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 8, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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You can not prefer it all you want, but that doesn't mean that it won't be a good game. There are many games that I don't prefer, but I'm not going to call them garbage just because I don't like them.

And I wasn't stating my opinion as fact. >_> The daytime gameplay of Sonic Unleashed is widely well received by many fans, and many people will tell you that it's the some of the best gameplay in a 3D Sonic game, if not _the_ best, ever. So I think using the word "great" was appropriate. Maybe it wasn't "great" to you, because you just don't like 3D Sonic games, but there's no denying that it was great gameplay for a 3D Sonic game. It's like saying that Super Mario Galaxy didn't have great gameplay for a 3D Mario game. Ridiculous. You're just trying to pick a fight, as usual.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 8, 2010)

Tom said:
			
		

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Giant mushrooms, giant donuts, same difference. The point is that the Genesis games took place in colorful, fantastic locations, just as Sonic Colors does. Plus, what's _not_ to love about a level full of giant desserts?!


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## TheYoshiGamer (Aug 8, 2010)

SO excited!  And I also noticed that the release date is just two days after my birthday...


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## -Aaron (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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I'm diabetic. Way to offend me Tye. Way to offend me.


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## Pokeman (Aug 9, 2010)

i love the music, dont know y. hate the lyrics


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## Ciaran (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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Well the word *censored.2.0* should be appropriate to describe almost every other recent venture of the sonic team, so I think it's fair to have no faith whatsoever in the developers.

And also, Super mario galaxy is overrated.

And also: Not once did I say this was a bad game (well before this post, anyway. I just said I didn't want it. Lrn2basiccomprehension.


AND ALSO: Whatever happened to not accepting anything that ever came out of a major publication, Tye. Whatever happened to 'not thinking about games that are right for me?' If you're going to bash gaming journalism in one topic, you can't use them toback up your claims in another.


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## Bulerias (Aug 9, 2010)

Did you just compare Sonic Unleashed and Super Mario Galaxy, Tye?

http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/xbox360/sonicunleashed

http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/wii/supermariogalaxy

Some of the best 3D Sonic gameplay, indeed.  And oddly enough I agree.  Which just goes to show you that the Sonic franchise, Genesis games aside, is on a completely different (read: lower) level.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> Did you just compare Sonic Unleashed and Super Mario Galaxy, Tye?
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I compared them to their respective franchises, not to each other. And, yes, Sonic games don't exactly have the same level of quality as Nintendo's main series Mario games, but _many_ games don't. Just because they're not at the same level as Mario doesn't mean they're not good and can't be fun, because that's certainly not the case. While Mario games may be a bit more fine tuned than Sonic games, I have about the same amount of fun with both franchises.

Also, review scores aren't everything. They don't dictate how much people will like a game or how much fun it is, and they certainly don't dictate which franchise is better than another. Review scores are opinions, not fact, yet so many people, yourself included, use them as if the are facts.


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## Miranda (Aug 9, 2010)

Why do they keep butchering Sonic? Can't they just leave him alone, and let the old sonic games just be around...they're giving Sonic a bad name and future generations are actually going to think this stuff is good and miss out on when Sonic was good...I pity those kids.


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## Ciaran (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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That can be said for 1 review, but a site like metacritic has dozens of reviews for everygame, so you can see trends, and reviewers back up their opinions with facts and comparisons, so they're not as pointless as you make them out to think.


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## Bulerias (Aug 9, 2010)

This whole "fact vs. opinion" debate is BS, Tye.  This is a videogame _discussion_ forum.  You don't discuss facts, you discuss opinions.  If you use the "everyone is entitled to their own opinion" argument escape, then that eliminates the point of discussion in general.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

Miranda said:
			
		

> Why do they keep butchering Sonic? Can't they just leave him alone, and let the old sonic games just be around...they're giving Sonic a bad name and future generations are actually going to think this stuff is good and miss out on when Sonic was good...I pity those kids.


How is this butchering Sonic? Have you even been following the news about this game? If anything, it's a step in the _right_ direction.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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There are a lot of Sonic haters out there, you know. Besides, you yourself don't agree with review scores (since you claim that Super Mario Galaxy 2 is way overrated), so why are you backing them up?


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> This whole "fact vs. opinion" debate is BS, Tye.  This is a videogame _discussion_ forum.  You don't discuss facts, you discuss opinions.  If you use the "everyone is entitled to their own opinion" argument escape, then that eliminates the point of discussion in general.


I'm aware of that, but how is it possible to discuss opinions when one person believes their opinion to be the absolute truth?


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## «Jack» (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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That seems to be you, with how you handwave all negative thoughts about this game aside.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

Jak said:
			
		

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There really is no reason for negativity at this point. If you don't like these types of games, then don't even bother posting in this thread. If you do like these types of games, then you're in luck, because Sonic Colors is looking to be a great improvement upon 3D Sonic gameplay.


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## -Aaron (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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Because we all know how you ignored the 3D Dot Heroes and Call of Duty threads.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

-Aaron said:
			
		

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The 3D Dot Hero thread was only one instance, and I only posted in that thread because of the similarities to Zelda, which _is_ a franchise that I like. And I believe the only time I posted in any Call of Duty thread was when I was messing with David.


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## BlueDaisy (Aug 9, 2010)

Why is everyone bashing Sonic? I will admit, some of the other 3D Sonic games were pretty terrible, but that doesn't mean this one has to be.


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## -Aaron (Aug 9, 2010)

Because of past experiences.


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## BlueDaisy (Aug 9, 2010)

-Aaron said:
			
		

> Because of past experiences.


Things can change though


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## Rawburt (Aug 9, 2010)

BlueDaisy said:
			
		

> Why is everyone bashing Sonic? I will admit, some of the other 3D Sonic games were pretty terrible, but that doesn't mean this one has to be.


It's healthy skepticism really.

Although I admit the game looks fun, I can understand why people would be doubtful.


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## Entei Slider (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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You dont know that person believes it's the absolute truth. You can't tell by text that he is stating it as a fact. So stop using that BS answer/reply to everything everyone says that you dont agree with./ends mini rant


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## -Aaron (Aug 9, 2010)

BlueDaisy said:
			
		

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Yes, but I'm not going to spend $60 +tax everytime for the possibility of a good game.
I want a guarantee.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

K.K.Slider said:
			
		

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> the rock music in Sonic is objectively derivative and uninteresting.


That doesn't sound like he's stating a fact to you? He's saying that Sonic music is bad, period. Not "I don't like Sonic music", he's flat out saying that it's bad, and that's a fact.


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## Rawburt (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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Oh lawd, who cares?

It's still just an opinion and no matter how it's worded it shouldn't upset you.


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## David (Aug 9, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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Dude, don't argue with him, he's a musician, and I'm sure he's heavily into music, and knows what makes a good or a bad song.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

-Aaron said:
			
		

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In Color's case, it's either $50 or $35 plus tax, since it's on Wii and DS. And no one's forcing you to buy it without renting it first, or at least watching gameplay videos.


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## Bacon Boy (Aug 9, 2010)

Of all the things to get worked up over, getting worked up over someone's opinion as to why or why not they do not like Sonic Games/Sonic Music in general is ridiculous. As well as trying to piss Tye off as well, is a redundant and stupid thing to do.


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## Bulerias (Aug 9, 2010)

Tye,

I don't want to seem pretentious, but by "objectively" I mean "anyone who bothers to analyze music".  And by analyze, I don't mean sitting down with a pen/paper and working out chords, melodies, etc...I mean just intuitively being aware of what's going on in the music.  You don't even have to **know** what you're hearing...you just have to consider that, hmm, maybe this isn't so original.  Maybe I've heard this melody a million times before.  That's what I mean by derivative.

If I said "rock music, ALL OF IT, is objectively boring and derivative", that would be stupid.  I don't make blanket statements, or at least try not to.  In this case, I'm referring to _one_ song, and we don't even have to deal with opinions here.  The opinion is whether you like it or not.  The fact is whether it's actually any good.  You can like terrible music and be none the wiser, and hey, if that's what floats your boat then whatever.

And trust me, it's not like I never went through this phase myself.  I have a CD of the soundtrack from Sonic Adventure 2 (which had some decent tunes actually), but I listened to most of it and enjoyed it.  I wasn't an idiot for listening to it, but I wouldn't be caught dead with some of that stuff on my iPod nowadays.   It's just a natural progression, you like what you like now...and that's cool...but chances are you won't later on, IF that music doesn't have lasting value.  There is certain music, that rare album or composition, that is timeless.  This music is present in any genre, be it rock or classical or jazz.  It often appeals intuitively from the get-go, and also is interesting intellectually.  But it's rare that lasting music is appealing only intuitively.  If it's not an interesting composition, musically, it's not going to last.  And that's why my point stands -- the music in this trailer is OBJECTIVELY uninteresting and derivative.  But that doesn't make it intuitively uninteresting...at least to those who don't care to get deeper into it...you know what I mean?

Sorry for the "music appreciation 101" lecture, but...


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## Tyeforce (Aug 9, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> Tye,
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> I don't want to seem pretentious, but by "objectively" I mean "anyone who bothers to analyze music".  And by analyze, I don't mean sitting down with a pen/paper and working out chords, melodies, etc...I mean just intuitively being aware of what's going on in the music.  You don't even have to **know** what you're hearing...you just have to consider that, hmm, maybe this isn't so original.  Maybe I've heard this melody a million times before.  That's what I mean by derivative.
> 
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I'd like it if you didn't act like you know everything about my own musical tastes, thank you very much. No, it's not some "phase". I've been listening to Sonic music for nearly ten years now, and I love it just as much as I always have. I've changed _a lot_ in ten years, but something that hasn't changed is my taste in music, as well as in video games. It's no phase, it's just what I genuinely like. And maybe Sonic music isn't the most original music out there, but since when does being unoriginal equal not good?

Listen, I understand that you're a musician and you know your musical stuff, and I respect that, but that doesn't make your tastes in music any better or worse than mine, because it's all just opinion. You like the music you like for different reasons than I do. You like music based on more technical aspects, while I like music because it just sounds good to me, and Crush 40 sounds the best to me. It's not unlike gaming. Some people play games for the graphics or the story, but I play games for the reason why they are created; for fun. And, I gotta say, my choice in games has never let me down in the fun department.


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## Bulerias (Aug 10, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

> And maybe Sonic music isn't the most original music out there...I like music because it just sounds good to me.


OK, so we agree.  Not original = derivative, and you like this music strictly on an intuitive level.  What's the argument here?


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## Ciaran (Aug 10, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

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It's Tye, there's always an arguement.


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## Miranda (Aug 10, 2010)

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Tye doesn't accept other's opinions, he argues his points only and isn't open to other opinions. It's best to just ignore it really.


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## Jas0n (Aug 10, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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You're misunderstanding his point.

The like and dislike is the opinion, but the opinion has nothing to do with whether the music is technically good or not. Just because you like the song does not make it technically good, and it never will be.

He's not saying that you shouldn't like that music, because that's all down to your personal opinion.


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## David (Aug 10, 2010)

Soooo much fanboyism...


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## Bulerias (Aug 10, 2010)

Jas0n said:
			
		

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^^^^  Yep...


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## Tyeforce (Aug 10, 2010)

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Okay, that's *censored.3.0*ing it. I've had it with people like you who think that. WHO'S GODDAMN OPINION AM I NOT ACCEPTING?!


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## Mr. L (Aug 10, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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Miranda's.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 10, 2010)

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I never said that my liking the song means that it's not bad, but it's not _bad_ music. It may not be the best, but it's certainly not crap. And it may be derivative, but again, that doesn't mean it's not good.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 10, 2010)

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What do you mean? If you mean her opinion that I don't accept other people's opinions, of course I don't accept that, because it's a false opinion. She can think that that's the truth all she wants, but it's not true at all.


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## Bulerias (Aug 10, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

> I never said that my liking the song means that it's not bad, but it's not _bad_ music.


Huh?  You're misunderstanding the point, again (what is this, the fifth or sixth time?).  If a piece of music is derivative, it is unoriginal.  If it is unoriginal, it doesn't have lasting value.  And if it doesn't have lasting value, guess what -- it isn't any good.  But you're still entitled to your opinion, and if you like it, that's cool.  It's just a question of musical standards...you're saying it's not crap, well, I'm saying it is.  Undeniably.  It has no musical merit.  If you dig it, fine.  That's the intuitive appeal I was talking about.  But please, don't try to defend it musically.


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## Jas0n (Aug 10, 2010)

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You can't really argue whether it's technically good or bad music against someone's who's dedicated his life to everything music related, whereas you just like it because "it sounds good to you"


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## Tyeforce (Aug 10, 2010)

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Okay, I'm fine with you saying that it may be derivative, and that it may not be as good as other music from a technical point of view, but don't *censored.3.0*ing tell me that it doesn't have lasting value, because its value has lasted nearly ten years for me, and it's not going to fade anytime soon. Value is subjective. You have no authority to dictate how other people value music, no matter how musically talented you are.


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## Ciaran (Aug 10, 2010)

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<object type='application/x-shockwave-flash' width="250" height="250" data='http://www.youtube.com/v/szu6VwFGNlI'>
					<param name='AllowScriptAccess' value='never' />
					<param name='wmode' value='transparent' />
					<param name='movie' value='http://www.youtube.com/v/szu6VwFGNlI' /><param name='play' value='true' />
					<param name='loop' value='true' /><param name='quality' value='high' /></object>

This is a video of you playing the ocarina out of tune (somehow). With notes in front of you.


<object type='application/x-shockwave-flash' width="250" height="250" data='http://www.youtube.com/v/a41hC3cLL6s&playnext=1&videos=fayiGVkZihY'>
					<param name='AllowScriptAccess' value='never' />
					<param name='wmode' value='transparent' />
					<param name='movie' value='http://www.youtube.com/v/a41hC3cLL6s&playnext=1&videos=fayiGVkZihY' /><param name='play' value='true' />
					<param name='loop' value='true' /><param name='quality' value='high' /></object>

Now here's Bulerias playing a piece he composed himself.


In any music arguement you can possibly imagine, Bul wins.(save for maybe which volume Crush 40 sounds best at or some piece of trivial Fangirl crap akin to that)


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## Tyeforce (Aug 10, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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I'm well aware that I'm not nearly as musically talented as Bul, thank you very much. But I don't have to be musically talented to know that lasting value is completely subjective, and no matter how musically talented you are, you can't dictate how others value music.


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## Bulerias (Aug 10, 2010)

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I don't understand if you're purposely ignoring what I'm talking about or what...lasting value is not subjective by definition.  I'm talking about lasting value on a broad basis.  We all know Bach but we sure as hell don't know about a lot of his contemporaries.  I don't care what YOU find to have lasting value, this was never the point of this conversation.  The point I made was on a universal level.  This music is 1) derivative, 2) harmonically and melodically dull -- we've established these points already -- and thus 3) has no lasting value.  Not to *you personally*, but in the grand scheme of things.  The point I'm attempting to drive home is that I try to listen to music that has lasting value because, chances are, if it doesn't, then it's not worth listening to.  If you're at a point where you enjoy this kind of music, more power to you, dude.  But just be aware that there is cooler stuff out there.  That's it.  Don't take offense when I refer to it as a "phase", either, because that's not necessarily a negative thing.  "Phases", for example, can also refer to listening to rock first, then to psychedelic rock, then to heavy metal, etc...you like different things at different points in your life, some better and some worse.  No need to get worked up about it, man.  I am also not dictating how others value music.  You can listen to Soulja Boy for all I care.  But please don't misunderstand my point -- I mean lasting value on a universal level.


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## Jas0n (Aug 10, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> I don't understand if you're purposely ignoring what I'm talking about or what...


I find Tye always does this, he ignores any points he can't argue.


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## Bulerias (Aug 10, 2010)

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Yup.  I'm done here.  I don't know if it's possible to dumb down my argument any further.


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## Ciaran (Aug 10, 2010)

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And then inserts his usual thing about being aloud to have his own opinions on things, and how you shouldnt bash things he likes etc. etc. and how no-one understands his Godly, all knowing way of viewing things.


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## Entei Slider (Aug 10, 2010)

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Damn I love this forum...


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## Tyeforce (Aug 10, 2010)

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I'm not ignoring your points at all. I've acknowledged that you know what you're talking about when it comes to music, and I know you're looking at things from a technical level. Still, you're flat out calling the music I listen to "crap", which I do take offense to. You're insulting my taste in music. Okay, maybe you're not insulting my taste in music, but you are insulting the music itself. I don't insult your music, do I? No. I certainly don't like your type of music, but I don't go around calling it "downright atrocious", even if that was what I believed. This whole argument would have never started if you hadn't taken that ignorant jab at Sonic music.


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## David (Aug 11, 2010)

And what's with the drum work for half the song?? it sounds like an autistic kid is repeatedly slamming the  drum.


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## Callie (Aug 11, 2010)

This looks pretty good but I'll probably pass. Or wait a while so it'll get cheaper.


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## Mr. L (Aug 11, 2010)

Tyeforce said:
			
		

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You do kind of not accept people's opinions sometimes :/......


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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He's a lost cause, you'd be better talking to a brick wall, because they don't spurt out the same *censored.2.0* constantly and provide insulation, which make them a million times more useful and less annoying than Tye.


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## Mr. L (Aug 11, 2010)

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Yeah, Tye could be really annoying, a lot.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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No, I _always_ accept them. But then people expect me to change my own opinions to match theirs, which isn't going to happen. That doesn't mean that I'm not accepting their opinions, though.


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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O.K Tye, whatever you say. :3 *ruffles hair*


Kids these days, eh??


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## David (Aug 11, 2010)

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I find it funny how he's actually older than the majority of people on this forum. Yet he's got the mind of a brainwashed 13 year old fanboy.


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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Exactly, if he acts like a child, I'm going to treat him like a child.


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## Mr. L (Aug 11, 2010)

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Well you're not accepting mine right now >:l, and also, you *don't* accept most people opinions, you just attack them like how David said, a brainwashed fan boy.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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Whoa, whoa, whoa. What opinion of yours am I not accepting? And don't say "the opinion that you don't accept other people's opinions", because that's not an opinion, it's a statement, and a false one at that. And I'm not attacking David's opinions at all, unlike he is mine. I'm not getting on his case for playing M-rated games. If those are the games he likes, then so be it. This argument isn't about that, it's about what makes an M-rated game an M-rated game, and he believes that it's the deep stories, which, by definition, is wrong. No attacking of opinions from my side at all.


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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No he doesn't, he just said that you're more likely to have a better story in an M-rated game.

Once again, your lack of ability to comprehend things on a basic level is startling.


:3. But it's ok, because you dont need to understand people to stack shelves at a toy shop :3 You're doing very good, Tye. *ruffles hair some more. :3 :3


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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How am I acting like a brainwashed fanboy? If anyone's brainwashed, it's you. You can't even accept the fact that people like different games, and there's nothing wrong with that. I, on the other hand, do, and as I've stated before, you like the games that you like because you enjoy them, and that's all fine. But it's also fine that I like the games that I do, but you can't seem to understand that. You think that if you're not a little kid, you can't play games that are made for everyone, which is completely ignorant and untrue.


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## Jas0n (Aug 11, 2010)

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But you can't deny that stories in M rated games are, in general, much more in depth and developed than in games rated lower. This is because M rated games are aimed at a mature audience, and therefore they can understand and appreciate the more in-depth, exciting and enthralling stories. That's all David was saying, not that the stories are what make the game M-rated.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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When did I ever say that some M-rated games don't have better stories? All I've said is that there are non-M-rated games out there that have stories just as deep as some M-rated games have, which is true. They may not have all the blood, violence, and swearing, but that doesn't mean that they can't have stories that are just as deep.

And continue to treat me like a child all you want. It only shows your true colors of a troll even more.


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## Mr. L (Aug 11, 2010)

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<div class='spoiler_toggle'>Spoiler: click to toggle</div><div class="spoiler" style="display:none;">
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





</div>


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## John102 (Aug 11, 2010)

The thing in the bottom left hand corner looks like phione.


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## Jas0n (Aug 11, 2010)

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I've still yet to see a good example.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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I'm not denying that. But, no, that's not what David said at first. He said that the deep stories is what makes an M-rated game what it is, not the violence and adult themes, which isn't true.


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## muffun (Aug 11, 2010)

John102 said:
			
		

> The thing in the bottom left hand corner looks like phione.


And the one in the right-middle looks like Parasect

OH GOD SEGA IS COPYING NINTENDO SUE SUE SUE

What has this topic come to?


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## Mr. L (Aug 11, 2010)

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Same old Tye rage.


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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Have you ever played an EarthBound/MOTHER game? Final Fantasy? The World Ends With You? And don't pass up Metroid: Other M once it's released.

And maybe they don't have the violence and adult themes that M-rated games do, but, again, that doesn't determine how good a game's story is.


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## David (Aug 11, 2010)

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I clearly said in that other thread, that violence, some language, and some suggestive themes  makes the game more realistic and believable. if you're in a life and death situation, you're gonna swear, and possibly have to use violence, if the developers want to connect you more to the characters in the story, they may put in some intimate moments, between 2 main characters. or sometimes they just want to give you some eye candy so they put in sexy girls.


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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Tye, david never said that the deep story was the only thing making M rated games good, hat's just what you took it to mean when he clearly meant that the ability to explore more adult themes in a game made for stories that easier to relate to for a mature audience, such as death, war and supression.

Seriously Tye, how do you pass English?


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## David (Aug 11, 2010)

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Final Fantasy may have some good stories, but the gameplay can be sooo boring, and so damn repetitive.


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## Jas0n (Aug 11, 2010)

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There are a select few games rated lower than M which have "good" storylines, like the ones you listed there, but then compare those to the ASTOUNDING storylines some M rated games have. Take Heavy Rain or Dragon Age for example.


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

David, we poast sa-um ting at sa-um tiem. LOL !


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

Ciaran said:
			
		

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				David said:
			
		

> They're rated MATURE because their stories go beyond saving a princess


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## Tyler. (Aug 11, 2010)

I think I'll probably get this game. It does look fun


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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And INTO deep stories about war, death, relationships, murder, mystery, depression and so much more. Read between the lines. You're 4 years older than me and even I could figure out what he meant.


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## David (Aug 11, 2010)

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lol wtf? Are you seriously this dumb? The violence and stuff makes the stories more realistic and believable, and is just overall part of what makes a complex story. Holy *censored.2.0*, how many times do I have to repeat it?


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## Tyeforce (Aug 11, 2010)

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A game doesn't have to be M-rated to deal with those types of stories, you know. They just can't have the same amount of violence and swearing and such, which doesn't make the story anyway.


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## Ciaran (Aug 11, 2010)

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Give me an example of a critically acclaimed game that deals with each of those issues that has a rating lower than M.

And if a developer wants to make a truly bold statement about something, violence and swearing help immerse the player in the gritty world.


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## -Aaron (Aug 11, 2010)

@Tye: Sometimes the blood and swearing helps.
http://www.youtube.com/v/Cp2gCw6A_3A


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## //RUN.exe (Aug 11, 2010)

-Aaron said:
			
		

> @Tye: Sometimes the blood and swearing helps.
> http://www.youtube.com/v/Cp2gCw6A_3A


so wait

in a discussion about mature and deep stories

you bring up no more heroes 2?

i love the game but even i think that's *censored.3.0*in' stupid :v


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## Bulerias (Aug 11, 2010)

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OK, I'm going to tell you what I think outright.  You don't have the capacity to call my music "downright atrocious" because you have no *censored.3.0*ing idea what constitutes technically interesting music.  You like music because you do, plain and simple, and I have no problem with that.  You're right, I'm not insulting your taste in music, but I am insulting the music you listen to.  And I don't see the problem with that.  I can back up my statements with cold, hard facts (tired major-minor-dominant chord progressions, meandering melodies, typical 4/4 beat rhythms), but you wouldn't be able to talk back to those points.  That's why I don't want to go into the musical analysis.  I didn't want the debate to get this far, but you're forcing me to act pretentious by playing the "music analysis card", so to speak.  And I don't like to act in a pretentious way, especially when it comes to music.  If you like this music, great.  But the bottom line is that there is cooler music out there, and Crush40 or whatever the name of the band is happens to be on the lower end of the spectrum any way you slice it.  Harmonically, melodically, rhythmically, and thematically.  If you like it for what it is, ok, then that's what you like.  There is no problem with this whatsoever and it doesn't mean you have a bad taste in music...it's just what jives with you.  Some people like rock music just for the rhythm, and that is cool.  They get their musical kick from headbanging.  That is totally legitimate.  In this case, the music does work for the modern Sonic games but I personally prefer the older tunes because they're interesting musically, not just fitting for the era of Sonic games.  And that, indeed, is a matter of opinion.


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## //RUN.exe (Aug 11, 2010)

Bulerias said:
			
		

> OK, I'm going to tell you what I think outright.  You don't have the capacity to call my music downright atrocious because you have no *censored.3.0*ing idea what constitutes technically interesting music.  You like music because you do, simple as that, and I have no problem with that.  You're right, I'm not insulting your taste in music, but I am insulting the music you listen to.  And I don't see the problem with that.  I can back up my statements with cold, hard facts (tired major-minor-dominant chord progressions, meandering melodies, typical 4/4 beat rhythms), but you wouldn't be able to talk back to those points.  That's why I don't want to go into the musical analysis.  I think you should simply take my word for it.  I didn't want the debate to get this far, but you're forcing me to act pretentious by playing the "music analysis card", so to speak.  If you like this music, great.  But don't assume it's any good.  The bottom line is that there is cooler music out there, and that Crush40 or whatever the name of the band is happens to be on the lower end of the spectrum any way you slice it.  Harmonically, melodically, rhythmically, and thematically.  If you like it for what it is, ok, then that's what you like.


the amount of pretentiousness in this post is downright atrocious.


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## -Aaron (Aug 11, 2010)

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I think the second one had a deeper story than the first, considering his primary objective in the first was to get laid.


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## Bulerias (Aug 11, 2010)

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Yeah man, whatever.  I tried my best not to resort to arguments that had even a shred of pretentiousness, but I don't think Tye will understand any other way.  Pretentious or not, it's the truth.  Sorry.


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