# Spawn rates for Insects were stealth-nerfed



## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

Source: 



__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1253495611300741126
- Spawn rates have been unified for all insects e.g. agrias butterfly used to be less common in April than in its other available months. wharf roach had a higher rate in March. That’s all gone now.

- Peacock butterflies have been cut by 80-90%; 

- Emperors and atlas moths by 50% 

- Regular stinkbugs are up 100%, man-faced ones down 50% 

- Tiger beetles up by 33%, scarab beetles down 40% 

- Scorpions and tarantulas have both been nerfed significantly as well

Raw Data: https://wuffs.org/acnh/insects120.html


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## xara (Apr 24, 2020)

i’m a little disappointed about the butterflies - those were a huge chunk of my income lmao


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## Reginald Fairfield (Apr 24, 2020)

I didn't even know scarabs were on the menu yet.

	Post automatically merged: Apr 24, 2020



xara said:


> i’m a little disappointed about the butterflies - those were a huge chunk of my income lmao


Same.


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## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

Reginald Fairfield said:


> I even didn't know scarabs were on the menu yet.



It seems 1.2.0 as a whole had a lot of income reducing changes made. Only one of which was publicly stated.


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## Amissapanda (Apr 24, 2020)

It kind of boggles (and disappoints) me that they would want to nerf so many of these and actively discourage players from spending time catching bugs and working up their own income (even without time traveling).


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## LambdaDelta (Apr 24, 2020)

flick was so powerful, that nintendo had to kneecap his bliss


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## Clock (Apr 24, 2020)

Didn’t realize they lowered the chances, I‘m probably not paying attention. I hope it doesn‘t affect fish as well, because I usually make profit from selling red snapper, barred knife jaw and oarfish as well.


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## starlightsong (Apr 24, 2020)

as someone who's scared of tarantulas and scorpions i don't mind that particular nerf too much lol but overall i feel like this really stinks for non-tters, especially with the interest rate being severely nerfed too  i tt and have a ton of bells but my dad and brother play more normally--and i don't think either of them sell stuff on forums and such at all--and interest and bug catching are big moneymakers for them so this'll make things harder! i get that the interest could kinda be exploited by tting but i don't understand why they'd nerf the bug spawns at all. especially since i've already been seeing people saying they felt like it was too hard to make bells in this game ever since release day...


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## Khaelis (Apr 24, 2020)

Eh, nerfs happen. I still see them enough, so it's good enough for me.


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## trashpedia (Apr 24, 2020)

Tbh I really don’t want to resort to turnips to make more bells due to how greedy some people can be about them but there really aren’t many options to make lots of bells without it being extremely time consuming.


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## Raz (Apr 24, 2020)

I indeed saw tiger beetles more often today. Like, they were everywhere.

Scorpions were rampant on my island: I recall having three straight encounters in less than 10 minutes a week ago.


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## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

Crossing123 said:


> Didn’t realize they lowered the chances, I‘m probably not paying attention. I hope it doesn‘t affect fish as well, because I usually make profit from selling red snapper, barred knife jaw and oarfish as well.



Fish have separate spawning mechanics and there doesn't seem to be any changes to them.


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## flurrybuster (Apr 24, 2020)

Definitely noticed way fewer good butterflies this morning...

I guess it's good I've already made a few million on turnips, but anyone who just starts the game after this patch is really getting the short end of the stick.


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## Reginald Fairfield (Apr 24, 2020)

Bioness said:


> It seems 1.2.0 as a whole had a lot of income reducing changes made. Only one of which was publicly stated.


If you have a bunch of iron nuggets saved up, the iron frame sells for 15,000, of course it uses 20 pieces.


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## Mooglemog (Apr 24, 2020)

Nintendo: 

Let’s allow everyone who duped bells in the first week to keep their 999m bells

But let’s make it harder for the people who actually have to work for their bells to earn them


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## Reginald Fairfield (Apr 24, 2020)

Reginald Fairfield said:


> If you have a bunch of iron nuggets saved up, the iron frame sells for 15,000, of course it uses 20 pieces.


Then there's the stone arch.


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## Insulaire (Apr 24, 2020)

I loved the PC butterfly for easy big bells, but let’s be real here: it was clearly spawning way too often for how big its payoff was. I will miss them, but this makes sense


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## Jas (Apr 24, 2020)

definitely noticed the lack of pc butterflies! i understand but i'll miss seeing 3-4 of them constantly and having a big stack to sell to flick LOL


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## Mink777 (Apr 24, 2020)

Glad I completed my encyclopedia before this nonsense was implemented.


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## CrankyCupcake (Apr 24, 2020)

Can't say I'm surprised. 

I remember thinking, on more than a few occasions while playing, that New Horizons is way easier than Wild World or New Leaf because so many of the more expensive insects spawn so often. (And I did spend an unreasonable amount of time in my game just catching and selling them.)  

From the developers' point of view, Animal Crossing is meant to be played for short periods at a time, so that the pace is relaxed, and you unlock more things as you go along. It isn't meant to be played like most of us are playing now, for crazy long hours at a stretch, day after day.


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## Nefarious (Apr 24, 2020)

_Nerf Tarantulas they say, as I get a heart attack back to back from encountering two within 15 minutes of each other._

I did notice that pea butterflies weren't spawning much at all today. A shame really, that was one of the only ways I was able to make money. It was definitely hard making money without abusing turnips before the update, it's even _harder_ now. Guess it wasn't a bad idea letting my friend abuse my 443 turnip price today. _Hopefully the few mil bells they tipped me holds me over for a while._


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## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

CrankyCupcake said:


> Can't say I'm surprised.
> 
> I remember thinking, on more than a few occasions while playing, that New Horizons is way easier than Wild World or New Leaf because so many of the more expensive insects spawn so often. (And I did spend an unreasonable amount of time in my game just catching and selling them.)
> 
> From the developers' point of view, Animal Crossing is meant to be played for short periods at a time, so that the pace is relaxed, and you unlock more things as you go along. It isn't meant to be played like most of us are playing now, for crazy long hours at a stretch, day after day.



A big part of that problem was due to hybrid flowers constantly reproducing and filling up islands. Peacock Butterfly spawns in particular were reduced by 90%, which is excessive.


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## CrankyCupcake (Apr 24, 2020)

@Bioness 

Agreed. I wonder if they would... nerf the spawn rate of hybrid flowers!?


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## FireNinja1 (Apr 24, 2020)

Amissapanda said:


> It kind of boggles (and disappoints) me that they would want to nerf so many of these and actively discourage players from spending time catching bugs and working up their own income (even without time traveling).


Definitely agree, especially since the developers aren't exactly keen on the idea of time-traveling. Nerfing the spawn rates for bugs would give people stronger reason to TT, not the other way around.

Wonder if they're going to nerf the stalk market next.


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## Hesper (Apr 24, 2020)

Press F to pay respects for Flick.


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## Reginald Fairfield (Apr 24, 2020)

Did they also nerf the bells from yellow balloons? I don't remember getting so many socks from those.


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## Eirrinn (Apr 24, 2020)

I don’t understand why they nerfed the rates by so much? This only hurts legitimate players


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## KeatAlex (Apr 24, 2020)

Ugh, I have yet to see a Scorpion and now they're RARER!? How am I ever going to find one now :/


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## FireNinja1 (Apr 24, 2020)

Bioness said:


> A big part of that problem was due to hybrid flowers constantly reproducing and filling up islands. Pea**** Butterfly spawns in particular were reduced by 90%, which is excessive.


I mean, is it _really _a bad thing if the spawn rate for hybrids is high?


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## skylucario (Apr 24, 2020)

oddly enough, i feel like i’m seeing PC butterflies MORE often now...but that’s probably just because it finally isn’t raining in my town anymore.


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## Sharla Smith (Apr 24, 2020)

KeatAlex said:


> Ugh, I have yet to see a Scorpion and now they're RARER!? How am I ever going to find one now :/


I mean, there’s Tarantula and Scorpion Islands, but I agree.

It’s hard to find even warf roaches ffs... my island feels kinda empty with so few bugs. Why, Nintendo? If you really want to nerf players, I’d nerf the turnip market.


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## JKDOS (Apr 24, 2020)

Yeah....Screw making an honest living, I'm going to invest in stalks full time.


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## skogkyst (Apr 24, 2020)

It's really disappointing to me that this will likely have a very negative effect on Tarantula Island farming, which is my main source of major income besides the (completely unreliable) stalk market. This is going to slow progress on my house, terraforming, buying expensive items at Nook's Cranny, etc. I'm not really sure where to make my money now.


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## JKDOS (Apr 24, 2020)

Reginald Fairfield said:


> If you have a bunch of iron nuggets saved up, the iron frame sells for 15,000, of course it uses 20 pieces.



How much does a single piece of iron sell for? 15,000 is chunk change for 20 pieces of iron.


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## Sharla Smith (Apr 24, 2020)

skogkyst said:


> It's really disappointing to me that this will likely have a very negative effect on Tarantula Island farming, which is my main source of major income besides the (completely unreliable) stalk market. This is going to slow progress on my house, terraforming, buying expensive items at Nook's Cranny, etc. I'm not really sure where to make my money now.


How do you reliably get it? I have never gotten to there or Scorpion Island. Or Shark Island.


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## Envy (Apr 24, 2020)

That's a bit disappointing. Butterflies were one of my largest sources of income.

Also, I liked how common tarantulas were. In past games, they were so rare, I believe I only saw like one over the span of WW, CF, and NL. They're really fun to run into and catch, as well. 

The tarantula island exploits were a bit much for me, though. I ran into the real tarantula island once and that was fun (it is an island scenario programmed by the developers to act that way, so I see no problem with it), but making every island into a tarantula island seemed to be over thetop.


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## JKDOS (Apr 24, 2020)

skogkyst said:


> I'm not really sure where to make my money now.



If you play the stalks, you're guaranteed to make millions per week, you just have to put a little effort into looking for someone. I haven't tried it yet, but there is a website called turnip.exchange that should help. If you or the host is TT'ing, well, you can make probably a few hundred million per day by keep buying more turnips and then going off to sell them.


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## skogkyst (Apr 24, 2020)

Guinevere44 said:


> How do you reliably get it? I have never gotten to there or Scorpion Island. Or Shark Island.


I make my own "Tarantula Island" by removing all trees and flowers and such so that flower/tree/stump bugs don't spawn. It's time consuming but it works for making a good 200-400k depending on how many you catch.


JKDOS said:


> If you play the stalks, you're guaranteed to make millions per week, you just have to put a little effort into looking for someone. I haven't tried it yet, but there is a website called turnip.exchange that should help. If you or the host is TT'ing, well, you can make probably a few hundred million per day by keep buying more turnips and then going off to sell them.


Thanks for the info, but I don't know if I have the energy to fit the long ques and high entry fees in NMT for online stalk market trading. I've mostly stuck to living with what my island has to offer so far.


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## Dormire (Apr 24, 2020)

No wonder. I thought butterflies were kinda not frequent in my flower fields anymore...


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## Baroque (Apr 24, 2020)

Well I did feel like there weren’t nearly enough stinkbugs showing up. Finally!


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## JKDOS (Apr 24, 2020)

skogkyst said:


> besides the (completely unreliable) stalk market.



Unless you don't have Nintendo Online, there's nothing unreliable about the Stalk Market, especially when you find hosts who charge IGB and not NMT.

I've kind of stayed away from the Stalk Market because it was too easy to make millions. I was comfortable catching the peacock butterflies while going back and forth my town throughout the day. Now that Nintendo has nerfed this and interest rates, I'm just going to do Stalks out of spite to show Nintendo they failed to nerf my bank. Besides, bridges, ramps, and moving isn't cheap.


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## alitwick (Apr 24, 2020)

That’s disappointing to hear, especially given how close we are to summer. I was really looking forward to catching a ton of beetles and making bank off of them. It was my tried and true method in WW & NL. :C

Stalks are the only way now. Can’t pay off my inclines/bridges/house expansions in a reasonable amount of time without it.


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## JKDOS (Apr 24, 2020)

Eirrinn said:


> I don’t understand why they nerfed the rates by so much? This only hurts legitimate players



Bank interest, maybe, as for bugs, hackers don't need nerfed bugs to be hurt, neither do TT'ers. Nintendo intended to hurt legitimate players with this.


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## DJStarstryker (Apr 24, 2020)

JKDOS said:


> Bank interest, maybe, as for bugs, hackers don't need nerfed bugs to be hurt, neither do TT'ers. Nintendo intended to hurt legitimate players with this.



Agreed. People abusing mechanics in the game aren't bug hunting for bells. 

Sure, people got a lot of money from tarantula islands, but it's not like they come up all the time. I have never found the actual tarantula island. The closest thing I've found is the bamboo island, and that's a LOT of work to chop down all of the bamboo to get it out of the way. I tried it once and I kept getting too many mole cricket spawns. I didn't get a single tarantula spawn, and I ran around for nearly an hour AFTER the time it took to remove all of the plants. It was taking too much time and just felt not worth it. 

Even if you get a tarantula island, it's not as fruitful per night as visiting the NL island a few times per night, year-round. Unless you use the stalk market, you simply aren't getting bells legitimately as fast as you could in NL.


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## kirbbys (Apr 24, 2020)

JKDOS said:


> Yeah....Screw making an honest living, I'm going to invest in stalks full time.



I was going to write the same thing. I finally made over 1 million this week from turnips with my friend having a 500+ selling price. Will continue selling my $1k+ bugs to Flick (I don't finish enough for CJ at the moment, covered up my rivers), but I'm fine making my character a Bear of Wall Street (got her a bear hat).


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## Miss Misty (Apr 24, 2020)

I feel like this is Nintendo trying to force people into buying Online memberships. Because DJStarstryker and JKDOS are right, this is targeting people who _don't_ TT, who _don't_ min-max their turnips by buying from islands for 90 and selling for 600 week after week. This is targeting people who try to earn what they need from doing things around their own islands. Nintendo is trying to back those people into a corner and tell them that the only way to consistently earn money is to get an Online membership so they are guaranteed access to good stalk market towns.


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## Larimar (Apr 24, 2020)

I really wouldnt have minded if it was a small nerf, but these are MASSIVE hits to people's ways of making bells. I already mentioned in a previous thread that it's starting to feel like nintendo is trying to OVER-balance some features in the game, and its making them way too much trouble than its worth

Cant wait for them to remove bugs, money trees, fish and selling all items except turnips entirely. You Will Play The Stalk Market And You Will Like It


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 24, 2020)

JKDOS said:


> Yeah....Screw making an honest living, I'm going to invest in stalks full time.



Not only that but my playtime has been severely cut.  Once I'm done with everything, instead of playing for a few more hours catching butterflies which allow me to fish, dig clams, pop balloons at the same time since its all center around the beach.  I had a total of only 2 hours of playtime yesterday.  I now might have to look into other game to keep me company during this quarantine because Nintendo literally just screw over non-tters and those who don't abuse the stalk market.

I don't see it changing today either especially since I'm still 6 days from moving all buildings to even start terraforming.  I been so bum out I started to go back to old habit that I stop prior to this game coming out.


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## Tako (Apr 24, 2020)

I'm part of the minority who welcome the change. I've been playing Animal Crossing everyday without fail, and I'm starting to notice that I'm filling up my museum way too fast. By the third week of March, I have already collected all the fishes and bugs I could get in both the Northern and Southern hemisphere (my boyfriend is in the Southern hemisphere). When April rolled around, I only had a small handful of new fishes and bugs to catch before I was done with it.

For a game that was meant to be enjoyed for years, this is just too much progression in too little time.

When Nintendo designed the game, they probably did not anticipate that the world will be going into lock down, which gives everyone more time on their hands. They probably anticipated that players would need more time to collect all the fishes and bugs. I'm pretty sure they intended for us to have to hunt down the bugs and fishes we're lacking, and even having to wait several months for the next opportunity to catch them.


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## randomforeignguy (Apr 24, 2020)

Bioness said:


> It seems 1.2.0 as a whole had a lot of income reducing changes made. Only one of which was publicly stated.



Yea idk why they are trying to nerf income but personally i think the spawn rate on all rare bugs and fish is too high... Or was....


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## ForbiddenSecrets (Apr 24, 2020)

Eh re-balancing happens in games so I'm not surprised. For the northern hemi in April 4 bugs got lowered and 28 went up (per Ninji's data). Obviously they lowered the rarer ones but man did those Pea Butterflies spawn way more than I expected for a rare bug. Agrias, Madagascan, and Rajah went up a tiny but. So did the Orchid Mantis and Jewel beetle which are also comparable in cost. It doesn't fully make up the Pea Butterfly spawn nerf but meh. It's not like their goal was to make people suffer.


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## Romaki (Apr 24, 2020)

Those nerfs seem unreasonably extreme, especially for the p. butterflies. I can understand it compared to the other games, but they really should make tarantula/scorpion spawns more frequent on islands (or just kept it the same as before while tweaking our own island). 

They also made a lot of common furniture so expensive, so I don't get why they back down from the new economy they seem to have set up. Online players can make so much money from turnips (and many people glitched bells), why would you nerf regular singleplayer gameplay?


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## DJStarstryker (Apr 24, 2020)

Tako said:


> I'm part of the minority who welcome the change. I've been playing Animal Crossing everyday without fail, and I'm starting to notice that I'm filling up my museum way too fast. By the third week of March, I have already collected all the fishes and bugs I could get in both the Northern and Southern hemisphere (my boyfriend is in the Southern hemisphere). When April rolled around, I only had a small handful of new fishes and bugs to catch before I was done with it.



Oh, at first I was confused by your post. I feel like I'm filling up my museum at the same rate I always have. But I haven't gotten to visit a southern hemisphere island.

If you travel between the two hemispheres, you absolutely will fill it up quicker. I feel like Nintendo should've known people visiting each other for that was a thing. They probably did - I imagine that is partly why we didn't get artwork until over a month after the game was released.


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## Sudsofsplash (Apr 24, 2020)

yeah i noticed this when my flower dump had no butterflies around it at all


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## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

ForbiddenSecrets said:


> Eh re-balancing happens in games so I'm not surprised. For the northern hemi in April 4 bugs got lowered and 28 went up (per Ninji's data). Obviously they lowered the rarer ones but man did those Pea Butterflies spawn way more than I expected for a rare bug. Agrias, Madagascan, and Rajah went up a tiny but. So did the Orchid Mantis and Jewel beetle which are also comparable in cost. It doesn't fully make up the Pea Butterfly spawn nerf but meh. It's not like their goal was to make people suffer.



True, but it should also be the goal of the company to communicate these changes. They did this without letting people know. The cynic in me believes they  thought their player base too ignorant or stupid to notice. The interest rate changes were something that anyone would have picked up instantly, but bug spawns aren't so easily tracked.


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## thegunpowderincident (Apr 24, 2020)

I wonder if turning regular (in my case, usually bamboo) islands into tarantula islands is still viable with them having a nerfed spawn rate. It already took a lot of chasing away of wharf roaches and tiger beetles.


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## Morningowl (Apr 24, 2020)

I think it little extreme to say they think we too stupid or ignorant to notice. Yes the communication could of been better. I am indifferent to the change mostly because of my play style. I understand the frustration. I am guessing the bug were not as balance as they intended. Doesn’t mean you have agree with their intentions.


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## ForbiddenSecrets (Apr 24, 2020)

Bioness said:


> True, but it should also be the goal of the company to communicate these changes. They did this without letting people know. The cynic in me believes they  thought their player base too ignorant or stupid to notice. The interest rate changes were something that anyone would have picked up instantly, but bug spawns aren't so easily tracked.


They aren't doing something shady to try to get us to buy micro transactions or anything like that and honestly this is probably not the last time they will adjust spawn rates. Should they have told us? Sure. Maybe they felt that unlike Splatoon 2, which has detailed notes on weapon changes, this game was more casual and it wasn't warranted the same way. I don't know their reasoning but I sincerely doubt they were sitting around thinking of ways to get one past us. They felt, in their game, the spawn rates were not where they wanted them and they changed it. It's not that deep.


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## Lellyna (Apr 24, 2020)

That’s very sneaky of them to do a stealth nerf but people already figured out something was with the spawns so it was a matter of time before the info got out


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## Blue Triangles (Apr 24, 2020)

I understand that updates are to iron out bugs in the game but I didn't realise it'd be bugs of that variety.

Another observation; I normally spawn around 8-10 hybrids per day but today just a lousy 3. I hope they haven't decreased hybrid rates too.


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## skogkyst (Apr 24, 2020)

thegunpowderincident said:


> I wonder if turning regular (in my case, usually bamboo) islands into tarantula islands is still viable with them having a nerfed spawn rate. It already took a lot of chasing away of wharf roaches and tiger beetles.


Based on the numbers, if I remember right, it looked like an increase to tiger beetles, wharf roaches, giant water bugs, and a 33% decrease for tarantulas. My totally unscientific guess is that it could take up between 1.5-2x the time it used to.


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## thegunpowderincident (Apr 24, 2020)

skogkyst said:


> Based on the numbers, if I remember right, it looked like an increase to tiger beetles, wharf roaches, giant water bugs, and a 33% decrease for tarantulas. My totally unscientific guess is that it could take up between 1.5-2x the time it used to.


Which, I don't know if I'm just slow at it, but for me was already about an hour or more. Not particularly worth it if it'll take even longer, imo. Although water bugs are not an issue if you use a bamboo island, so at least one less bug to account for.


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## skogkyst (Apr 24, 2020)

thegunpowderincident said:


> Which, I don't know if I'm just slow at it, but for me was already about an hour or more. Not particularly worth it if it'll take even longer, imo. Although water bugs are not an issue if you use a bamboo island, so at least one less bug to account for.


You're not slow, it took me upwards of an hour to an hour and a half, so it would suck having to spend 2+ hours on an island just to get some tarantulas. At that point, fishing off the pier might even be a better bell maker for my time.


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

Definitely sad to be forced to kick my Peacrack habit. That was part of my daily routine. I had hybrids all along my route of other chores and I'd just snap them up along the way. It was a low-key way to make money throughout the day. If they're so against time traveling they should nerf that, or other things that they perceive as game-breaking. They even could have specifically nerfed bank interest IF time travel occurred, but not for regular people who were just saving their bells for a rainy day. Oh well.


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## Mello (Apr 24, 2020)

This is dumb. Nerfed interest rates *hard*, nerfed spawn rates on bugs. I really don't understand what the need was to make the game grindy.


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## Krissi2197 (Apr 24, 2020)

You can catch scarabs in the northern hemisphere rn??


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## pinkfawn (Apr 24, 2020)

i am never going to financially recover from this


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

At least for now the turnips are still giving large spikes, though who knows if they have reduced the frequency of those too. I think I'm going to lean in hard on turnip buying this Sunday and see if I can bolster my savings that way. With the Nooklings upgrade, cataloging stuff has just gotten hella expensive.


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## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

Krissi2197 said:


> You can catch scarabs in the northern hemisphere rn??



No, those are in July and August. This information includes all months of the year.


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## Aleigh (Apr 24, 2020)

And here we are taking what little money Ali had and shoving it even farther in the stink hole once again


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## LuchaSloth (Apr 24, 2020)

I've been noticing more of the valuable moths/butterflies on my island. I keep finding the sunset moth, agrias and birdwing butterflies flying around. All of which sell for a decent chunk. Much preferred to the stinkbugs and common butterflies that I was seeing previously.


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## Solio (Apr 24, 2020)

Why would they do this?! If anything needs fixing, it's the completely busted turnip prices!
I really liked that you could actually make a decent sum off of common bugs instead of waiting for summer for the palm tree bugs to appear.


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## PajamaCat (Apr 24, 2020)

RIP to my peacock butterfly income. You'll be missed.


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

On the plus side, we can now say peacock as much as we want without being bleeped out by the forums! lol


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 24, 2020)

stickymice said:


> Definitely sad to be forced to kick my Peacrack habit. That was part of my daily routine. I had hybrids all along my route of other chores and I'd just snap them up along the way. It was a low-key way to make money throughout the day. If they're so against time traveling they should nerf that, or other things that they perceive as game-breaking. They even could have specifically nerfed bank interest IF time travel occurred, but not for regular people who were just saving their bells for a rainy day. Oh well.





Mello said:


> This is dumb. Nerfed interest rates *hard*, nerfed spawn rates on bugs. I really don't understand what the need was to make the game grindy.



They aren't otherwise they would nerf the broken online stalk market.  What they are doing is forcing online membership down solo player throat.  A lot of us don't have online.  Its all a cash scheme by Nintendo.  I'm more likely to time travel than participate in the online stalk market as that thing is beyond broken.

	Post automatically merged: Apr 24, 2020



Solio said:


> Why would they do this?! If anything needs fixing, it's the completely busted turnip prices!
> I really liked that you could actually make a decent sum off of common bugs instead of waiting for summer for the palm tree bugs to appear.



To force online membership.


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

thelonewanderer said:


> They aren't otherwise they would nerf the broken online stalk market.  What they are doing is forcing online membership down solo player throat.  A lot of us don't have online.  Its all a cash scheme by Nintendo.  I'm more likely to time travel than participate in the online stalk market as that thing is beyond broken.
> 
> Post automatically merged: Apr 24, 2020
> 
> ...


Hmm how does the online thing make them richer? Honest question.


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## BambieTheMayor (Apr 24, 2020)

I figured they did something when my tarantula farms weren't working nearly as well anymore. 

I had a feeling they'd do something about it eventually as well... I made 2+ million bells with Flick within my first week or two just by selling bulk tarantulas, and everyone on Twitter had posts of how Flick was giving them 480,000 bells for a full inventory of tarantulas.

I don't really catch bugs for profit now, as I make enough from turnip profits; I just feel bad for newer players/people who can't visit other islands for better turnip prices because bugs are definitely one of the easiest sources of income, especially with Flick.


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## Faeryn (Apr 24, 2020)

I thought I was doing something wrong. Used to catch so many peacock butterflies. xD


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 24, 2020)

stickymice said:


> Hmm how does the online thing make them richer? Honest question.



Because every online membership make Nintendo 20 dollars and there a lot of solo AC players out there.  That 1/3 the price of the profit they make from the game itself.


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

thelonewanderer said:


> Because every online membership make Nintendo 20 dollars and there a lot of solo AC players out there.  That 1/3 the price of the profit they make from the game itself.


Ahhh yes ok, of course. That makes sense. Yeah I like the social gaming aspect but my boyfriend hates it. He gets frustrated when I sell my turnips at a stranger's island for 500+ when we both have bad prices, but he doesn't want the hassle of interacting with strangers. I can appreciate that. And your point of view as well. Sigh.


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## Figment (Apr 24, 2020)

For the amount I play, I really haven't noticed too much of a difference so far. I'm going to miss getting as many of the pc butterflies though.


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 24, 2020)

stickymice said:


> Ahhh yes ok, of course. That makes sense. Yeah I like the social gaming aspect but my boyfriend hates it. He gets frustrated when I sell my turnips at a stranger's island for 500+ when we both have bad prices, but he doesn't want the hassle of interacting with strangers. I can appreciate that. And your point of view as well. Sigh.



Also I don't know if you know this but New Horizon is the #1 selling console game in history thanks to this crisis we are dealing with.  So not only is Nintendo super rich from New Horizon (considering most purchase were digital) (no need to spend money on handling, shipping, etc...) but now they want to be even more greedy and even richer.  They wouldn't even make this much sale if it wasn't for the covid situation.  

Nintendo has no shame.  I will time travel before I buy an online membership.  Bring back the dream suit than we'll talk Nintendont!


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## Bioness (Apr 24, 2020)

stickymice said:


> On the plus side, we can now say peacock as much as we want without being bleeped out by the forums! lol



Peacock peacock peacock peacock.


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## Mello (Apr 24, 2020)

thelonewanderer said:


> They aren't otherwise they would nerf the broken online stalk market.  What they are doing is forcing online membership down solo player throat.  A lot of us don't have online.  Its all a cash scheme by Nintendo.  I'm more likely to time travel than participate in the online stalk market as that thing is beyond broken.


I thought about it some more and you're 100% right. This is disgusting


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 24, 2020)

Mello said:


> I thought about it some more and you're 100% right. This is disgusting



One island per switch.  Force online membership.  What next?  Microtransaction for future installment?

Some non-tters are starting to think of TTing, Nintendo just screw themselves over. Bring back the dream suite than I will get online, but until then I'm not interested in trading or the stalk market.  

Not to mention with my slow internet and how bad Nintendo online is.....that a recipe for disaster.  Isn't the loading screen like really annoying?


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## FinnQuill (Apr 24, 2020)

This thread is probably why Nintendo didn't say anything... I love how people have taken: 'We nerfed one valuable bug, increased the spawn rates on others' and turned it into: 'NINTENDO IS GREEDY AND TRYING TO RUIN US ALL AND FORCE US TO BUY THEIR TERRIBLE ONLINE SUBSCRIPTION!'

No one's forcing you to play the game at all. Nintendo wants the game to be played at a slow pace, you don't have to agree with that, but it's literally what the series was built on. I don't always like it, but minus some genuine annoyances (like the lack of bulk crafting), there are tons of ways to make Bells, and maybe... Just maybe... you don't need to burn through the content in a month.

Also, y'know, the part where they increased spawn rates of other valuable bugs.

But hey, to the sane people here, is anyone _a little_ disappointed the bugs don't have different spawn rates each month now? I feel like unifying them so that any given bug always spawns at the same rate whenever they're available took away a small piece of cool flavor. That is honestly my biggest disappointment here.


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

Animal Crossing nerfed bug moneymakers, dataminers say
					

Sorry, Flick




					www.polygon.com
				




Welp, here's an article about it, FML


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 24, 2020)

FinnQuill said:


> This thread is probably why Nintendo didn't say anything... I love how people have taken: 'We nerfed one valuable bug, increased the spawn rates on others' and turned it into: 'NINTENDO IS GREEDY AND TRYING TO RUIN US ALL AND FORCE US TO BUY THEIR TERRIBLE ONLINE SUBSCRIPTION!'
> 
> No one's forcing you to play the game at all. Nintendo wants the game to be played at a slow pace, you don't have to agree with that, but it's literally what the series was built on. I don't always like it, but minus some genuine annoyances (like the lack of bulk crafting), there are tons of ways to make Bells, and maybe... Just maybe... you don't need to burn through the content in a month.
> 
> ...



If they wanted the game to be slow, they would not allow the online stalk market because that the opposite of slow.


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## stiney (Apr 24, 2020)

FinnQuill said:


> But hey, to the sane people here, is anyone _a little_ disappointed the bugs don't have different spawn rates each month now? I feel like unifying them so that any given bug always spawns at the same rate whenever they're available took away a small piece of cool flavor. That is honestly my biggest disappointment here.



I thought the same thing. From a gameplay perspective I appreciate the simplification, but I liked the realism of the rarity changing.


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## FireNinja1 (Apr 24, 2020)

FinnQuill said:


> This thread is probably why Nintendo didn't say anything... I love how people have taken: 'We nerfed one valuable bug, increased the spawn rates on others' and turned it into: 'NINTENDO IS GREEDY AND TRYING TO RUIN US ALL AND FORCE US TO BUY THEIR TERRIBLE ONLINE SUBSCRIPTION!'


I don't think it's a particularly irrational response, given Nintendo's recent moves and the moves of other game companies. Pocket Camp contained microtransactions, so did Fire Emblem heroes, and don't even get me started on Mario Kart Tour. 

In isolation, I don't think this is specifically a bad thing, but people are correct in pointing out that this fits into a broader, profit-driven trend that Nintendo's games have followed recently.


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## Corrie (Apr 24, 2020)

thelonewanderer said:


> One island per switch.  Force online membership.  What next?  Microtransaction for future installment?
> 
> Some non-tters are starting to think of TTing, Nintendo just screw themselves over. Bring back the dream suite than I will get online, but until then I'm not interested in trading or the stalk market.
> 
> Not to mention with my slow internet and how bad Nintendo online is.....that a recipe for disaster.  Isn't the loading screen like really annoying?


The minute they add paid DLC is the day everything goes to crap.


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## FinnQuill (Apr 24, 2020)

thelonewanderer said:


> If they wanted the game to be slow, they would not allow the online stalk market because that the opposite of slow.



I mean, if you're taking advantage of exploits, yeah... There's pretty much always a way to cheat the system, and Nintendo isn't going to waste time trying to stop it. So if you want to burn content, you go ahead and mess with the online stalk market, and if not, the game is consistent with their intended play style.

I mean, Nintendo also doesn't intend for people to speed run Calamity Ganon in _Breath of the Wild_, but it's your game, if you can find a way to do it. Go for it. If you want to cheat the way they intended you to play _Animal Crossing_, go for it. Everyone else can play the way they intended.

Most of this thread is why companies choose not to be transparent, because people love to just get angry at ****. The internet loves to talk bad about 'Karens', but this is just the video game version of Karen-ing.

EDIT because Ninja'd:



FireNinja1 said:


> I don't think it's a particularly irrational response, given Nintendo's recent moves and the moves of other game companies. Pocket Camp contained microtransactions, so did Fire Emblem heroes, and don't even get me started on Mario Kart Tour.
> 
> In isolation, I don't think this is specifically a bad thing, but people are correct in pointing out that this fits into a broader, profit-driven trend that Nintendo's games have followed recently.



Why are we talking about mobile games? That's clearly an entirely different sort of market at this point. I don't care how _Pocket Camp _works, because I didn't buy a console and pay $60 for _Pocket Camp_. Mobile games are a different beast.

In the meantime, _Animal Crossing_ is getting free updates, _Splatoon_ got free updates, and no other mainstream Nintendo game is nickel and diming it's customers. _Odyssey_ and _Breath of the Wild _came out of the gate with crazy amounts of content and no DLC, and the DLC intentions for _Three Houses_ and _Pokemon_ have been clear from the beginning, and _Ultimate_ DLC really seems like more of a welcome surprise as far as I've seen.


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## Bcat (Apr 24, 2020)

Dammit! Catching butterflies while I ran around terra-forming was my main source of income.


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## avieators (Apr 24, 2020)

i really didnt want to rely on the stalk market but it seems they're trying to force my hand :/ stalks dont have me yet tho,,,there's still fishing!


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## skogkyst (Apr 24, 2020)

rosefells said:


> i really didnt want to rely on the stalk market but it seems they're trying to force my hand :/ stalks dont have me yet tho,,,there's still fishing!


Now hopefully they don't nerf the spawn rates for rare fish as well...


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## Fey (Apr 24, 2020)

I’m upset by this decision too—not only was it profitable, but it was fun! Just a week ago I was talking with a friend about how bugcatching on our own Islands has been much more worthwhile compared to NL, and I genuinely feel like there’s less game to enjoy now. Sure I can still catch cheaper bugs, but it just feels tedious and grindy to me.

If the spans had always been set to these rates I wouldn’t have noticed or minded, but it definitely feels like a downgrade and punishment now. Psychologically speaking, people never respond well to having positives removed. Doing that in a game is counterintuitive to the purpose of games imo.


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## sunchild (Apr 24, 2020)

making the rare butterflies... more rare makes sense to me. i have many hybrids and it caused pea butterflies to spawn like crazy. yeah i'm sad it's nerfed because i did make a good chunk of spending money for the day that way, but i'll get it over it.. before it was nerfed i did think it was sorta broken just how MANY were spawning.


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## Fey (Apr 24, 2020)

To add to my previous post, I think it also doesn’t help that it coincided with the decrease in interest rate. It’s very clear that Nintendo is trying to stop or correct _something_, but they’re not being upfront about it. Whatever it is doesn’t seem fair to people who earn their bells honestly (and I’m including lots of TTers in that group as well!)


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## Sheep Villager (Apr 24, 2020)

Anyone else here _only now_ learning they could have been making bank from peacock butterflies? I guess the good news is I can't feel as upset about it if I'm only now learning of this.

It does sound lame from what I read in this thread though.​


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## FireNinja1 (Apr 24, 2020)

FinnQuill said:


> Why are we talking about mobile games?


Nintendo created those games. That's why they are relevant.


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## Jared:3 (Apr 24, 2020)

Lets be honest here, the best example of this is Pokemon when they snapped half the dex out of existence, and now we have to pay for DLC in June to get new Pokemon, and then we have to pay for Pokemon home which I'm sure they make a lot of money because at the end of the day its business and that's how companies operate


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## g u a v a (Apr 24, 2020)

uhg no wonder i havent seen peacock butterflies


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## windloft (Apr 24, 2020)

i can kinda' understand why they decided not to say anything about the nerfed spawn rates, but then again ... nintendo's a bit infamous for being extremely vague with their patch notes for whatever reason : everybody's still speculating if the amiibo glitch's been completely fixed or not after all.


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## Volmise (Apr 24, 2020)

I'm more of a nocturnal player so I haven't really noticed too much of a difference with bug spawns. I very rarely got to see peacock butterflies to begin with, and tarantulas weren't exactly on my radar either unless I managed to hit tarantula island during Mystery Tours.

Definitely does seem like they're trying to usher people towards turnips or trading online. Which isn't in itself a bad thing, but it can be frustrating for anyone who doesn't have the online service.


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## sdw4527 (Apr 24, 2020)

Honestly, this was more of a balance change (or "fix") than anything. The amount bugs were worth sometimes didn't correspond with their rarity. The peacock butterfly for example was *five times* more common than the Rajah Brooke, Agrias Butterflies, and Sunset Moths, yet were worth basically the same amounts. It sucks since many people were already used to the high spawn rates, but I can't really fault them here. The majority of the adjusted rates fell in line with the sell price of each of the bugs so it seems fair.


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## R. Planet (Apr 24, 2020)

As a LONG time Nintendo fanboy (check the avy. Nintendo Cereal represent) and someone that used to be the lead writer/news reporter for a Nintendo fansite let me make this clear.

Nintendo is barely aware they have an online program. They don't care if you use it. They just don't care. They never ever will care. Nintendo online features will always be half-assed because they don't really care. They do SO little to steer people towards their (incredibly inexpensive. Less than $2 a month) online service that it's hilarious.

They have a vault of classic titles they could easily add to the SNES and NES online libraries at any time. This would be such a major selling point for their online service if they cared to do it right. Do they? No. It's been months and they don't even have Donkey Kong Country up yet. Why? Because they just don't really care. Not at the top level where those kinds of decisions are made.

Nintendo has always been run by a bunch of 90 year old men who are still waiting to see if this whole "internet thing" is just a fad like hoola-hoops and doing the Twist.

They have their reasons (which may or may not make any damn sense) but I promise you they never do diddly nor squat with the intentions of making untold billions on their online service.

They probably just thought it was too easy (and admit it. You know it was just too damn good to be true) to catch a 2500 bell butterfly over and over and over again. They clearly meant for that one insect to be a bit rare. You can tell by the price they gave it. It was odd that we got so many before and now they've corrected it.

Nobody is going to go in-game broke over this. There is no conspiracy.


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## RedPanda (Apr 24, 2020)

Sheep Villager said:


> Anyone else here _only now_ learning they could have been making bank from peacock butterflies? I guess the good news is I can't feel as upset about it if I'm only now learning of this.
> 
> It does sound lame from what I read in this thread though.​



It wasn’t lame. It was fun catching butterflies! It wasn’t so valuable as to be game breaking. It was valuable enough to be worth the effort though, unlike some of the lower value butterflies I have been seeing all day.


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## avieators (Apr 24, 2020)

skogkyst said:


> Now hopefully they don't nerf the spawn rates for rare fish as well...



i will probably cry if they do, at that point it'd be obvious that they're trying to steer everyone towards nintendo online and the stalk market, when i've never relied on the stalk market in 19 yrs


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## skogkyst (Apr 24, 2020)

rosefells said:


> i will probably cry if they do, at that point it'd be obvious that they're trying to steer everyone towards nintendo online and the stalk market, when i've never relied on the stalk market in 19 yrs


Me too, I'm dipping into stalks for the first time but I'm trying not to get involved with the online madness it brings.


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## Fey (Apr 24, 2020)

stickymice said:


> It wasn’t lame. It was fun catching butterflies! It wasn’t so valuable as to be game breaking. It was valuable enough to be worth the effort though, unlike some of the lower value butterflies I have been seeing all day.



I read that as them agreeing that it’s lame the spawns were reduced, but I could be wrong. 

Also 100% agreed—catching them was profitable but not OP. I’ve been hunting for the available insects for two days now, and they barely feel worth spending my time on. 

I think the raised price + frequent spawns were actually balanced pretty well, considering that the cost of things has been increased in general. Today I didn’t even scrounge together enough Bells to buy everything from my stores, much less move a building or work toward paying off my loan >.>’ This update coinciding with day-by-day players’ Nook Store upgrade is just icing on top of the annoyance cake haha 

(Apologies for the rantiness—I promise I’m ok lol)


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## Spooky. (Apr 24, 2020)

It's funny...last night I was trying to do a 'catch 5 insects' for nm+ and I was wondering why I couldn't find ANYTHING. I gave up because I couldn't get a thing to spawn for over 20 minutes.


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## thelonewanderer (Apr 25, 2020)

The hard life of a bug catchers.


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## Soot Sprite (Apr 25, 2020)

I noticed way fewer butterflies on my hybrids after the update, I guess that's why. I don't even mind so much that they were nerfed, more that it was done silently. It seems a little shady tbh, but I'd rather have it actually stated next time because it's kind of a bad look for Nintendo. I've TT'ed a little bit but that was mostly just to get my island back to a liveable condition after I terraformed everything to the ground, there wasn't really a need to before when you could easily catch butterflies.


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## FinnQuill (Apr 25, 2020)

FireNinja1 said:


> Nintendo created those games. That's why they are relevant.



Sony also used to make VCRs, but that doesn't make them reasonably relevant to the Playstation.

Mobile games are not console games, they do not correlate to Switch game design strategies in the least.



Fey said:


> To add to my previous post, I think it also doesn’t help that it coincided with the decrease in interest rate. It’s very clear that Nintendo is trying to stop or correct _something_, but they’re not being upfront about it. Whatever it is doesn’t seem fair to people who earn their bells honestly (and I’m including lots of TTers in that group as well!)



And this is almost definitely where the problem lies... Apparently the lesser mentioned truth of coincidence does not equal correlation needs to be wider spread. Redd was also added in this patch, do you think he's in on the conspiracy too?! Or maybe, the bell interest thing was to fix a different perceived problem than the bug spawn rate thing.

The answer to the peacock butterfly thing is, almost definitely, that Nintendo likely made the spawn rate too high, probably thinking that they would be harder to get because they required hybrid flowers, and then realized that they were spawning like crazy (which honestly, they were, it was kinda stupid how much they spawned once you had even a single blue flower laying around) and fixed the spawn to a reasonable rate. It's not some insane conspiracy...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT: So I decided to look at the actual numbers... the 90% reduction in Peacock Butterflies is a _MASSIVE _oversimplification of what happened. In the original code, *a ton* of bugs had higher spawn rates in March, likely something Nintendo always meant to readjust. In fact, a ton of bugs got a buff to spawns in April, because they were lower than average for April.

Peacock Butterflies have been reduced to the same as all other rare butterflies (I'm going to say a '5-point' spawn rate, because I don't know for sure these are percentages or how those percentages would work in relation to overall spawn rates even if they were percentages). This is the same as every other rare butterfly. Also, it was only reduced from a 45 in _March, _where most bugs had a higher spawn rate in general. In every other month, it was reduced from 30. That makes this a 25-point reduction in the original intended spawn rate. Meaning it was reduced to about one-sixth the amount it was before (actually, more than that, since for April, it was set to 27 previously).

Looking at the numbers shown, Nintendo _absolutely_ always intended to adjust spawn rates, since March and April were the only months without unified spawn rates across the board. All rare types of butterfly have been evened out to a 5-point spawn rate, which is only down from 10-points for most, and 30-points for Peacock Butterflies. The spawn rates for Man-Faced Stinkbugs and normal Stinkbugs were switched (which makes sense since Stinkbugs are worth less than the Man-Faced variety), and Tarantulas and Scorpions when from 4-points to 2-points.

Looking at the way the spawn rates look, Nintendo _definitely _meant to adjust them at some point in April, and probably just wanted to get some gameplay feedback to determine how rare they wanted to make rare bugs. Even if the latter part there is speculative, any reasonable reading of the spawn rates for March and April versus the rest of the year would definitely suggest that Nintendo intended to adjust at least the spawn rates for those months, from the beginning.

But you know, that's not as sensational as: '_Nintendo is trying to ruin players and force them to buy Online Subscriptions!!!'_

And this is why we can't have nice things (like patch note transparency), because people will pitch a fit over everything.


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## Cheallaigh (Apr 26, 2020)

you know balance is one thing, and stealth nerfing is one of the reasons i gave up on a certain online game(plus ruining servers by starting new ones  far too soon/often), but this feels excessive.

around 4 hours of straight playing and my hubby saw 2 peacocks.
i was on my island all day, working on decorating and building gardens, 12+ hours(hey it was sat okay?! i did take some breaks)... i saw 0, as in ZERO peacocks. 5 papers, 1 agrias, 1 orchard mantis, 2 preying, 3 or so face bugs, 2 ladybugs, and i haven't seen a horrible nasty hairy spider try and get me since the update(that part i am so not complaining about). what i did see was a lot of yellow and common butterflies, about a half dozen jewels,  a dozen+ citrus, and a lot of stinkers. i have about a 100 hybrids between two areas and i was checking them all day after reading about the stealth nerf. one thing they also didn't mention in those notes is the doubling of shells as well.

so yeah, when i'm seeing it going from overload, to nothing... it does ruin my game a bit.


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## Sansy (Apr 26, 2020)

The biggest reason this stealth nerf makes me angry is... they take the time to do this but they can't add crafting fishing bait in bulk? Or a shopping cart to the Able Sister's fitting room? *THIS* was what they prioritized?


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## Bioness (Apr 26, 2020)

Sansy said:


> The biggest reason this stealth nerf makes me angry is... they take the time to do this but they can't add crafting fishing bait in bulk? Or a shopping cart to the Able Sister's fitting room? *THIS* was what they prioritized?



I mean, adjusting spawn rates is something that likely takes minutes to do. Adding an entirely new interface/function is dozens to hundreds of hours of work.


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## Dim (Apr 26, 2020)

Hoping sharks and other rare fishes won't be nerfed as well, come summer


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## pocky (Apr 26, 2020)

I don't even care about the bells. I just liked seeing all those butterflies flying around in my fields of flowers. Very sad!


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## sdw4527 (Apr 26, 2020)

This might sound a bit harsh...but instead of overreacting, I think people should take a closer look at the actual datamined rates. Some of them just straight up made no sense. You'll also notice there were a lot of bugs with even higher spawn rates in March. Almost as if Nintendo was purposely testing the waters to see what sort of balance changes were needed. Some were probably just mistakes too (Peacock butterfly/Man-faced stinkbug). Peacock butterfly has been discussed to death at this point, so I'll mention the man-faced stinkbug. I think they most likely swapped the rates by mistake with the regular stinkbug. There's no reason for the man-faced version to have double the rate of the regular version which has a lower sell price.

Yes it sucks for us end users, but at the end of the day these are fair changes. Honestly, the best way to fix this was to increase the sell price even more for some bugs (such as the rarer butterflies). It's always been an issue in AC games where the summer months are the big money makers while the other months generally aren't. Needs to have a better distribution.


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## AlyssaAC (Apr 26, 2020)

Did all the bugs spawn rates change? Cause I just can't find a giant water bug for the life of me... This is going to make completing my museum that much harder...


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## Sharla Smith (Apr 26, 2020)

sdw4527 said:


> [...], so I'll mention the man-faced stinkbug. I think they most likely swapped the rates by mistake with the regular stinkbug. There's no reason for the man-faced version to have double the rate of the regular version which has a lower sell price[...]


 Oddly I’ve been getting just as many of the man faced stinkbug, if not more than prior to the patch.


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## brockbrock (Apr 26, 2020)

It's disappointing that they nerfed the pea butterflies. 

Is a tarantula island even possible now?


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## FinnQuill (Apr 26, 2020)

Bioness said:


> Sansy said:
> 
> 
> > The biggest reason this stealth nerf makes me angry is... they take the time to do this but they can't add crafting fishing bait in bulk? Or a shopping cart to the Able Sister's fitting room? *THIS* was what they prioritized?
> ...



It is absolutely baffling that this even needs to be said...


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## mermaidshelf (Apr 26, 2020)

Oh no! I need to catch a scorpion but I have yet to see one...


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## Sharla Smith (Apr 26, 2020)

mermaidshelf said:


> Oh no! I need to catch a scorpion but I have yet to see one...


They start to appear in May iirc


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## mermaidshelf (Apr 26, 2020)

Guinevere44 said:


> They start to appear in May iirc


Oh thank god! I've been playing for HOURS at night terraforming.


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