# Sexual Orientation & Gender Identity Support Thread



## Chris

A support thread that lacks support is simply sad. Love is love. Let's celebrate it and encourage one another; not tear each other down. In the words of the iconic RuPaul Charles: "If you can't love yourself, how in the hell are you going to love somebody else?"

*This thread will operate on a no aggression policy. 

That means:*


No insulting, swearing at, or otherwise talking down to other users. This is meant to be a supportive environment. People should not be scared to post for fear of being outcast. I'm sure we've all faced enough of that in our lives. We don't need it here too.
Understand that the LGBT+ community in different areas of the world, and of different age groups, may use different terminology. What may seem like a slur to someone may be completely harmless in another user's local LGBT+ community. Unless the person is quite obviously using a word as an insult, try to keep discussion about word choice polite.
Do not discriminate against or make negative generalisations about particular groups of people regardless of race, age, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc. Think: do you like it when people do that about you?
Respect that if a staff member asks you to cease posting certain content to then immediately stop doing so. Take up any disagreements you may have with us via the *Contact The Staff* board or via PM, thank you.
And finally, yes, *all users are welcome to post in this thread* regardless of how you identify.

*If you don't feel you can abide by these terms then please do not post. Disagreements are not a reason to instigate WW3. This is meant to be a supportive environment, so let's keep it so. In some cases it is wiser to agree to disagree. If you feel yourself getting angry I strongly advise you to take a break from your computer for an hour or so before replying - or simply to not respond at all. Users who repeatedly try to disturb the peace will be dealt with. Please use the Report Button rather than directly engaging obvious trolls or aggressive users yourself.*


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## Bowie

First.

Perfection. I love this concept.


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## Brookie

Yayyy! I'm so glad this is happening. Thanks! It's great to see this forum move forward despite what has happened.


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## pawpatrolbab

Thankyou so much for this


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## visibleghost

lmao

i have a question are we not allowed express be sadness or that we r upset about things we have experienced in real life bc i dont rly understand But it's not a support thread if u cant talk about things u experienced that werent 100% happy and perfect and glitter and pride so ... ?


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## Chris

visibleghost said:


> lmao
> 
> i have a question are we not allowed express be sadness or that we r upset about things we have experienced in real life bc i dont rly understand But it's not a support thread if u cant talk about things u experienced that werent 100% happy and perfect and glitter and pride so ... ?



Talking about experiences is perfectly fine as long as you're not attacking or discriminating against others with your posts. Fighting discrimination with further discrimination isn't the way to go!


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## Bowie

visibleghost said:


> lmao
> 
> i have a question are we not allowed express be sadness or that we r upset about things we have experienced in real life bc i dont rly understand But it's not a support thread if u cant talk about things u experienced that werent 100% happy and perfect and glitter and pride so ... ?



You're good as long as you don't get into childish arguments with people and report people rather than bait them on. That's precisely what put the other thread into the grave.

Positivity and encouragement of peace and harmony is what should drive any support community above all else.


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## visibleghost

Tina said:


> Talking about experiences is perfectly fine as long as you're not attacking or discriminating against others with your posts.



ok but is it discrimination or attacking people to complain about a system that people may or may not feel like theyre a part of


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## Bowie

visibleghost said:


> ok but is it discrimination or attacking people to complain about a system that people may or may not feel like theyre a part of



Generalisation is the problem, as well as misuse of terminology. Just be respectful.


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## moonford

Thank you Tina, you are a darling for this.


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## pawpatrolbab

Casually tries to bring some good vibes on 

In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes. 

He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.


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## Bowie

pawpatrolbab said:


> Casually tries to bring some good vibes on
> 
> In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes.
> 
> He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.



Oh, gosh! I've been there before! I think you'll love it.

Near the exit there's a little kind of garden set up, and it has some statues of the Beatrix Potter characters and I think a little fountain. I remember sitting on the stones and getting some pictures taken with family. It was such a beautiful day, as well!

I long to go back to Scotland someday.


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## Fleshy

pawpatrolbab said:


> Casually tries to bring some good vibes on
> 
> In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes.
> 
> He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.



I'm so beyond excited to have you here and get to spend so much time together - I miss you so much. It's not long now!!



Bowie said:


> Oh, gosh! I've been there before! I think you'll love it.
> 
> Near the exit there's a little kind of garden set up, and it has some statues of the Beatrix Potter characters and I think a little fountain. I remember sitting on the stones and getting some pictures taken with family. It was such a beautiful day, as well!
> 
> I long to go back to Scotland someday.



Ooh, that sounds really nice!


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## pawpatrolbab

Bowie said:


> Oh, gosh! I've been there before! I think you'll love it.
> 
> Near the exit there's a little kind of garden set up, and it has some statues of the Beatrix Potter characters and I think a little fountain. I remember sitting on the stones and getting some pictures taken with family. It was such a beautiful day, as well!
> 
> I long to go back to Scotland someday.



That's so nice!! Our original plan was to see the Beatrix Potter ballet but it doesn't seem like that's a thing that's going on anymore. But apparently there's a puppet show in the museum that should be cool! 

I've seen pictures of the garden area and stuff it looks so nice an relaxing, uber excited to go uwu


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## moonford

pawpatrolbab said:


> Casually tries to bring some good vibes on
> 
> In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes.
> 
> He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.



Amazing!

I really hope you enjoy yourself over there, how could you not when you have someone as great as Fleshy as your husband! It's also nice to see the forums helping you form a relationship, this site is basically a dating site. Haha!

Hope you and Fleshy have an amazing time together!


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## Chris

visibleghost said:


> ok but is it discrimination or attacking people to complain about a system that people may or may not feel like theyre a part of



There's a difference between politely expressing an opinion and being aggressive or hateful. As I stated in my original post, if you're angry about something then it's better off waiting a while to post than doing so in the heat of the moment. Respect everyone. If you can't do that then don't post.


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## Bowie

pawpatrolbab said:


> That's so nice!! Our original plan was to see the Beatrix Potter ballet but it doesn't seem like that's a thing that's going on anymore. But apparently there's a puppet show in the museum that should be cool!
> 
> I've seen pictures of the garden area and stuff it looks so nice an relaxing, uber excited to go uwu



You just reminded me of something that happened, actually. Before you're allowed to go into the actual museum, you have to sit through a short film about Beatrix Potter, and last time I was there the tape malfunctioned somehow and we just kinda had to awkwardly move on, and I think I had to tell some security guy about it before we went in. Very funny.

I'm really chuffed for you both! I'll be thinking of you if I ever head back!


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## Watchingthetreetops

Looks like I missed the drama train.  I'm sorry we had to reestablish an already existing thread.


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## MorphiGalaxi

pawpatrolbab said:


> Casually tries to bring some good vibes on
> 
> In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes.
> 
> He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.


Aw that's so sweet! I'm sure you'll both have a wonderful time 

And remember, airplanes now are very safe, there's nothing to worry about. It'll all go smoothly.


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## Chris

pawpatrolbab said:


> Casually tries to bring some good vibes on
> 
> In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes.
> 
> He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.



Hope you both have fun!  I didn't even know there was a museum. I travelled through Perth not too long back to attend a conference and looking it up now I see it's nearby.


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## Bowie

Forgive me if I'm wrong but it's not actually in Scotland, is it? I'm pretty sure it's in the Lake District (which is still pretty close, but not in Scotland). My favourite place in the whole world, honestly.

I know because Beatrix Potter was situated in the Lake District and all her books were about Lake District wildlife, hence the location of the museum. It's in Windermere, I think.


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## Nightmares

Thanks so much, Tina! The last thread got kinda ruined ;;


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## Chris

Bowie said:


> Forgive me if I'm wrong but it's not actually in Scotland, is it? I'm pretty sure it's in the Lake District (which is still pretty close, but not in Scotland). My favourite place in the whole world, honestly.
> 
> I know because Beatrix Potter was situated in the Lake District and all her books were about Lake District wildlife, hence the location of the museum. It's in Windermere, I think.



There are two locations according to Google Maps. One in the Lake District and the other in Dunkeld.


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## Bowie

Tina said:


> There are two locations according to Google Maps. One in the Lake District and the other in Dunkeld.



Oh, how interesting! I was in the one in Windermere, then. I don't know how different they are in terms of features, but in mine there was a little sort of hub area with a huge, moving clock with little characters sitting on the clock hands, and it used to play music and rotate every hour. Also a little gift shop with lots of cute tea tins, biscuit tins, and ornaments!


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## Fleshy

Bowie said:


> Oh, how interesting! I was in the one in Windermere, then. I don't know how different they are in terms of features, but in mine there was a little sort of hub area with a huge, moving clock with little characters sitting on the clock hands, and it used to play music and rotate every hour. Also a little gift shop with lots of cute tea tins, biscuit tins, and ornaments!



That's the one we'll be going to, I believe it's much bigger and has the shops and tea room too!


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## Fearthecuteness

pawpatrolbab said:


> Casually tries to bring some good vibes on
> 
> In less than 3 weeks I get to go see my husband in Scotland!! We're gonna go to the Beatrix Potter museum which I'm really excited for and we're gonna catch pet snails for each other. I'm just worried about the flight because it's at night and it's 6 hours long, not to mention I'm scared of airplanes.
> 
> He's been to me twice but this is my first time over there! It's funny too because it's super close to when we got together and we actually met because of these forums.



Aww that's nice. Bet you can't wait. Hope the time goes by fast until you get to see him again. 

I've been there before with my family when I was a kid. I was a big Beatrix Potter fan so I really enjoyed it. When we were outside by the garden there were a lot of people there so my Mum went on the wall to get a better picture. She got told off though. XD

I can only imagine how scary it is to fly a plane when you're scared of flying. Would it help if I told you that you're more likely to end up in a car accident than a plane crash? 
Also, I've traveled on a plane for 12 hours before and everything was fine so I'm sure you'll be ok. 

- - - Post Merge - - -



Bowie said:


> Forgive me if I'm wrong but it's not actually in Scotland, is it? I'm pretty sure it's in the Lake District (which is still pretty close, but not in Scotland). My favourite place in the whole world, honestly.
> 
> I know because Beatrix Potter was situated in the Lake District and all her books were about Lake District wildlife, hence the location of the museum. It's in Windermere, I think.



That's the one I went to. I didn't even know there more museums.
The more you know.


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## ZetaFunction

Thank you for making a new thread Tina.  I'm in a really uncomfortable position as it is questioning if I'm bi or ace or maybe straight or what with literally no support considering my family is 100% homophobic transphobic lgbtphobic etc so I have no clue where to begin or even what to do, and all the discussion threads on here seemed really hateful (especially considering I'm probably bi/ace, which made it even more uncomfortable), so I appreciate setting some guidelines and rules down.  I'm still super uncomfortable with myself and really scared about _even thinking_ about coming out so I probably won't really "join" the community for a while but I definitely appreciate knowing it's not a toxic area of on this site anymore.


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## riummi

Lucanosa said:


> Thank you for making a new thread Tina. I'm in a really uncomfortable position as it is questioning if I'm bi or ace or maybe straight or what with literally no support considering my family is 100% homophobic transphobic lgbtphobic etc so I have no clue where to begin or even what to do, and all the discussion threads on here seemed really hateful (especially considering I'm probably bi/ace, which made it even more uncomfortable), so I appreciate setting some guidelines and rules down. I'm still super uncomfortable with myself and really scared about _even thinking_ about coming out so I probably won't really "join" the community for a while but I definitely appreciate knowing it's not a toxic area of on this site anymore.



I found this cool site about asexuality so maybe it could help you identify more clearly or at least understand it more c: (I personally found it helpful since I was wondering about it alot)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, it says in my sig but I'm ace. I don't think I'd even bother telling my friends or family...


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## Corrie

Lucanosa said:


> Thank you for making a new thread Tina.  I'm in a really uncomfortable position as it is questioning if I'm bi or ace or maybe straight or what with literally no support considering my family is 100% homophobic transphobic lgbtphobic etc so I have no clue where to begin or even what to do, and all the discussion threads on here seemed really hateful (especially considering I'm probably bi/ace, which made it even more uncomfortable), so I appreciate setting some guidelines and rules down.  I'm still super uncomfortable with myself and really scared about _even thinking_ about coming out so I probably won't really "join" the community for a while but I definitely appreciate knowing it's not a toxic area of on this site anymore.



I feel like in general that bi people in the LGBT community get hate, especially those who are in a straight relationship. It's difficult. ^^; So let's make this area welcoming to them and everyone else! 

What I'd do to determine what you are is honestly ask yourself questions about your sexuality. What you like, who yoy like, how your feelings work, etc. But remember that you don't have to label yourself and you definitely don't have to tell anyone about it. Unless of course you come home with someone where you are not in a straight relationship cause then your family would probably ask questions. I'm in a straight relationship even though I'm bi so I don't have to tell anyone that I also like girls. I'd like to tell people but I feel nervous about it so I just don't mention it. Nobody really needs to know either.


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## Mr. Cat

Oh, good. I'm glad I decided to wait until I joined in on these discussions. I'm not sure what happened in the last thread.

I'm nonbinary and I'm in a realtionship with a cis straight male. I basically don't pay any mind to gender at all and I also don't understand sexual attraction. I am the opposite of my partner, pretty much. I considered myself asexual for a very long time because I wasn't attracted to anybody and I was celibate (but I still always wanted a romantic relationship). Anyway, I still don't understand sexual attraction. I don't feel it at all for anybody. What confuses me though is that I still have the urge to have s** (not sure if I'm allowed to talk about that here, so I censored it, lol) just because it relieves stress and I get to bond with my partner. He always says I seem like I'm not into it and I have no desire to initiate it myself, which is actually all true. But I still enjoy it for some reason. It makes me happy knowing he likes it and I get to have his full attention for a bit. It's nice. Does that mean I'm not asexual or what...?


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## riummi

Mr. Cat said:


> Oh, good. I'm glad I decided to wait until I joined in on these discussions. I'm not sure what happened in the last thread.
> 
> I'm nonbinary and I'm in a realtionship with a cis straight male. I basically don't pay any mind to gender at all and I also don't understand sexual attraction. I am the opposite of my partner, pretty much. I considered myself asexual for a very long time because I wasn't attracted to anybody and I was celibate (but I still always wanted a romantic relationship). Anyway, I still don't understand sexual attraction. I don't feel it at all for anybody. What confuses me though is that I still have the urge to have s** (not sure if I'm allowed to talk about that here, so I censored it, lol) just because it relieves stress and I get to bond with my partner. He always says I seem like I'm not into it and I have no desire to initiate it myself, which is actually all true. But I still enjoy it for some reason. It makes me happy knowing he likes it and I get to have his full attention for a bit. It's nice. Does that mean I'm not asexual or what...?



From what I know, you can still be asexual and like s--. My understanding of sexual attraction is when you find someone attractive or hot and you want to sleep with them basically. It is possible to be asexual and like s-- but it seems quite rare.  Sexuality is complicated so don't worry if you don't fit into one "category/sexuality" specifically. If you feel that it best fits you then use it.


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## Ghost Soda

Lucanosa said:


> Thank you for making a new thread Tina.  I'm in a really uncomfortable position as it is questioning if I'm bi or ace or maybe straight or what with literally no support considering my family is 100% homophobic transphobic lgbtphobic etc so I have no clue where to begin or even what to do, and all the discussion threads on here seemed really hateful (especially considering I'm probably bi/ace, which made it even more uncomfortable), so I appreciate setting some guidelines and rules down.  I'm still super uncomfortable with myself and really scared about _even thinking_ about coming out so I probably won't really "join" the community for a while but I definitely appreciate knowing it's not a toxic area of on this site anymore.



Well you should know that there's nothing wrong with questioning! Don't be afraid to try different labels to see what fits you best, even if you decide you don't want any labels at all. It's all up to you to decide that, and weather you come out or not! Anyone that pressures you on coming out one way or the other is not looking for your best interests!


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## PromWithUrMom

Mr. Cat said:


> Oh, good. I'm glad I decided to wait until I joined in on these discussions. I'm not sure what happened in the last thread.
> 
> I'm nonbinary and I'm in a realtionship with a cis straight male. I basically don't pay any mind to gender at all and I also don't understand sexual attraction. I am the opposite of my partner, pretty much. I considered myself asexual for a very long time because I wasn't attracted to anybody and I was celibate (but I still always wanted a romantic relationship). Anyway, I still don't understand sexual attraction. I don't feel it at all for anybody. What confuses me though is that I still have the urge to have s** (not sure if I'm allowed to talk about that here, so I censored it, lol) just because it relieves stress and I get to bond with my partner. He always says I seem like I'm not into it and I have no desire to initiate it myself, which is actually all true. But I still enjoy it for some reason. It makes me happy knowing he likes it and I get to have his full attention for a bit. It's nice. Does that mean I'm not asexual or what...?


hi! I'm just gonna throw my 2 cents in. I'm cis het female, but I know some asexuals. For one, he said that he found the frick frack to be "a fun way to pass the time" but was very firm that he still identified as ace. From what I understand of his standpoint, enjoying the act is _not_ congruent with sexual attraction, and thus you can be frick fractive (see what I did there ohoho) and still be ace. I know that everyone's situation is different, but from what I've read, it seems like you might benefit from hearing that, so I'm putting it out there for you. Seems to me that the identity of ace is based mainly on whether you feel the attraction or not, so if you don't and you like that identity, don't feel like you need to give it up just because you're enjoying yourself! I hope maybe that helps? I hope it's not dumb for me to reply as a non-ace, I just like trying to help people. But most importantly it's about what you feel most comfortable identifying as. If you feel comfy as ace, then it's ok! It's all about what you feel best describes you, in your own terms &#55357;&#56469;


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## piichinu

lol, sometime i am sitting here thinking like, why arent otherkin , factkin, fiction kin, etc included in lgbt? i think they should, idk i dnt think otherkin are the same as a furry, so thats not an argument against what im saying...


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## toonafeesh

You can be ace and still enjoy woohooing but not want to initiate it. There's aces who are repulsed by it, ones who are neutral (like me) and ones who enjoy it :> basically what everyone else said is right, or at least I agree with them!

I'm still a bit confused despite claiming to be an aroace (wow this gets autocorrected to roach) - like what exactly is sexual attraction?? I talked about this with a friend but she said my viewpoint might've been black and white. I told her I thought it was just finding people hot and wanting to do the do with them, while she told me she sees it as something more intimate.. but I thought the intimate thing was more romantic attraction, then I just confused her 8C

I'm pretty sure I'm aro, thinking about being in a romantic relationship make me go ????nothx not for me. But sometimes I come across girls and think wow she's really pretty (or even hot?? I'm not the type to call ppl hot)... but maybe that's just 'aesthetic' attraction - is that even a thing? I don't have these thoughts about guys though.


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## Legendery

toonafeesh said:


> I'm still a bit confused despite claiming to be an aroace (wow this gets autocorrected to roach) - like what exactly is sexual attraction?? I talked about this with a friend but she said my viewpoint might've been black and white. I told her I thought it was just finding people hot and wanting to do the do with them, while she told me she sees it as something more intimate.. but I thought the intimate thing was more romantic attraction, then I just confused her 8C


There is two types of attraction, physical attraction, and attraction to ones personality. "Sexual attraction" is a relative term which can be either and or both physical and personal attraction.


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## Phibble

Lucanosa said:


> Thank you for making a new thread Tina.  I'm in a really uncomfortable position as it is questioning if I'm bi or ace or maybe straight or what with literally no support considering my family is 100% homophobic transphobic lgbtphobic etc so I have no clue where to begin or even what to do, and all the discussion threads on here seemed really hateful (especially considering I'm probably bi/ace, which made it even more uncomfortable), so I appreciate setting some guidelines and rules down.  I'm still super uncomfortable with myself and really scared about _even thinking_ about coming out so I probably won't really "join" the community for a while but I definitely appreciate knowing it's not a toxic area of on this site anymore.



Bro, if you're bi and liking the same sex would disappoint everyone you know, just stick with the opposite sex and call yourself straight. If you can't do without the same sex, then you're gay and you should just come out. I stg it seems like most people in the lbtqwrtys community just want to rebel against what they were raised with. It's gotten so overcomplicated


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## Hopeless Opus

Phibble said:


> Bro, if you're bi and liking the same sex would disappoint everyone you know, just stick with the opposite sex and call yourself straight. If you can't do without the same sex, then you're gay and you should just come out. I stg it seems like most people in the lbtqwrtys community just want to rebel against what they were raised with. It's gotten so overcomplicated



thing is though, you can't help who you fall in love with. if he/she falls in love w the same sex, or the opposite sex, that's totally uncontrollable. and because his/her family is entirely anti-lgbt, i imagine it would be a billion times harder to just simply come out. it's one thing to tell someone to come out, but another thing entirely to actually do it! 

@lucanosa i hope you find out what to do soon but if i were in your situation i would probably do the same that you're doing currently.. eventually your fam will probably find out if you come out to others, but i wish you all the luck in the world!!


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## visibleghost

badgrl2 said:


> lol, sometime i am sitting here thinking like, why arent otherkin , factkin, fiction kin, etc included in lgbt? i think they should, idk i dnt think otherkin are the same as a furry, so thats not an argument against what im saying...



what why
that has nothing to do w sexuality or gender identity, their community has never been close to the lgbtq community, they already have a community thats uh 'working' lol. i dont even think the mogai community (aka the community that would argue that a rock is lgbtq bc it doesnt experience sexual attraction) has tried to include kin in lgbtq....
just bc something is a part of ur identity doesnt mean it is lgbtq. also factkin :||||| No Thx


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## Dogemon

Phibble said:


> Bro, if you're bi and liking the same sex would disappoint everyone you know, just stick with the opposite sex and call yourself straight. If you can't do without the same sex, then you're gay and you should just come out. I stg it seems like most people in the lbtqwrtys community just want to rebel against what they were raised with. It's gotten so overcomplicated



Enjoying the same sex does not make you gay if you also like the opposite sex. It's not cool to invalidate bisexuality and say people are just wanting to rebel for enjoying both. For the most part, people cannot control whether they will fall for a male or female when they are bisexual, if that is somehow very complicated to understand, I'm not sure what to tell you.


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## Brookie

Phibble said:


> Bro, if you're bi and liking the same sex would disappoint everyone you know, just stick with the opposite sex and call yourself straight. If you can't do without the same sex, then you're gay and you should just come out. I stg it seems like most people in the lbtqwrtys community just want to rebel against what they were raised with. It's gotten so overcomplicated



If you cannot refrain from being insensitive, then please don't post in this thread. If you want to help, just accept and let the discussion thrive mainly from them even if you may not fully understand. You don't know what it feels like as a cishet/straight person. This thread is called support for a reason. Invalidating is not part of that. I don't know if you knew you sounded that way, so sorry if you didn't.

I know this may be your opinion, but that's no excuse to come in here and invalidate the community. Let's keep it supportive in here, shall we?


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## brutalitea

Lucanosa said:


> Thank you for making a new thread Tina.  I'm in a really uncomfortable position as it is questioning if I'm bi or ace or maybe straight or what with literally no support considering my family is 100% homophobic transphobic lgbtphobic etc so I have no clue where to begin or even what to do, and all the discussion threads on here seemed really hateful (especially considering I'm probably bi/ace, which made it even more uncomfortable), so I appreciate setting some guidelines and rules down.  I'm still super uncomfortable with myself and really scared about _even thinking_ about coming out so I probably won't really "join" the community for a while but I definitely appreciate knowing it's not a toxic area of on this site anymore.



You can join the community without outing yourself IRL thanks to the internet. You can join the community without knowing what label fits you best. There hundreds of resources online you can peruse. Asexuality.org for example. Autostraddle for getting involved with the community (or just keeping tabs) though it's more for non-hetero woman than non-hetero men. There's good people on twitter and tumblr amidst the sea of mediocrity and bigotry. 

Remember, there's no deadline where you have to figure who you are by. Don't put unnecessary pressure on yourself.



Mr. Cat said:


> Oh, good. I'm glad I decided to wait until I joined in on these discussions. I'm not sure what happened in the last thread.
> 
> I'm nonbinary and I'm in a realtionship with a cis straight male. I basically don't pay any mind to gender at all and I also don't understand sexual attraction. I am the opposite of my partner, pretty much. I considered myself asexual for a very long time because I wasn't attracted to anybody and I was celibate (but I still always wanted a romantic relationship). Anyway, I still don't understand sexual attraction. I don't feel it at all for anybody. What confuses me though is that I still have the urge to have s** (not sure if I'm allowed to talk about that here, so I censored it, lol) just because it relieves stress and I get to bond with my partner. He always says I seem like I'm not into it and I have no desire to initiate it myself, which is actually all true. But I still enjoy it for some reason. It makes me happy knowing he likes it and I get to have his full attention for a bit. It's nice. Does that mean I'm not asexual or what...?



If you do not feel sexual attraction, you're ace. There are asexuals who enjoy sex, there are asexuals who tolerate sex, and there are asexuals who hate sex. I believe sex-positive, sex-neutral, and sex-repulsed are the terms, respectively.


----------



## piichinu

visibleghost said:


> what why
> that has nothing to do w sexuality or gender identity, their community has never been close to the lgbtq community, they already have a community thats uh 'working' lol. i dont even think the mogai community (aka the community that would argue that a rock is lgbtq bc it doesnt experience sexual attraction) has tried to include kin in lgbtq....
> just bc something is a part of ur identity doesnt mean it is lgbtq. also factkin :||||| No Thx



ok, this is your opinion, and that is mine .


----------



## Bowie

Let's not have this thread go like the other one, please!


----------



## Chris

Mr. Cat said:


> ... s** (not sure if I'm allowed to talk about that here, so I censored it, lol) ...



You can say "sex". 




badgrl2 said:


> lol, sometime i am sitting here thinking like, why arent otherkin , factkin, fiction kin, etc included in lgbt? i think they should, idk i dnt think otherkin are the same as a furry, so thats not an argument against what im saying...



I see it simply as a case of that otherkin has no relation to sexual orientation or gender identity, whereas that is what the LGBT+ community is about. Of course these people can identify as LGBT+ in addition to otherkin, but they are different things that don't necessarily have to have any crossover. That's just my take on it though. I can't say I've done much research on it.




Phibble said:


> Bro, if you're bi and liking the same sex would disappoint everyone you know, just stick with the opposite sex and call yourself straight. If you can't do without the same sex, then you're gay and you should just come out. I stg it seems like most people in the lbtqwrtys community just want to rebel against what they were raised with. It's gotten so overcomplicated



Sexuality isn't that black and white for a lot of people. I'm currently in a heteronormative relationship but I'd be lying if I claimed to be straight. Nor when I'm attracted to those who aren't the opposite sex do I think I'm dating someone of the wrong sex! Coming out isn't necessarily easy either, especially with a homophobic home environment like the one Lucanosa described. And if you're still exploring your sexuality, rather than knowing for certain, that makes it even harder.

There are people who claim to be LGBT+ for attention, that's certainly true, but they are the minority. So let's not make allegations like that in this thread please.


----------



## skarmoury

Ahh interesting thread! <3 Thank you having this, Tina!
Personally, I'd like to separate my orientation for sex and romance. I'm a heteroromantic, but I'm still exploring my sexual orientation (right now I'm thinking bisexual). I'm honestly uncomfortable thinking "sex" when I'm in a romantic relationship with someone, so it's just a preference to separate the two. c: To each his/her own!

I'm thankful for my parents who 100% support me no matter my orientation (like, when I was a kid I asked my parents "what if I like a girl", and they were like, "sure go on ahead kiddo, whatever makes you happy. we're happy with whatever choice as long as you pick someone worth your time"). I'm really sorry so many are struggling with homophobic or unsupportive household members and are unable to come out, but remember that it's never wrong to like anyone as long as you pick someone who you're comfortable sticking around with! <3 I can't understand why so many don't want to give basic support in terms of love. It's saddening.


----------



## pawpatrolbab

badgrl2 said:


> lol, sometime i am sitting here thinking like, why arent otherkin , factkin, fiction kin, etc included in lgbt? i think they should, idk i dnt think otherkin are the same as a furry, so thats not an argument against what im saying...



As someone who's otherkin, it shouldn't be included. Spiritual belief has nothing to do with sexuality/gender identity


----------



## Soda Fox

Sorry to see the other thread ended in a train wreck.  I hope this one doesn't go the same route.

Anyway, I'm in a straight relationship, but once again I'm here to show my support.


----------



## visibleghost

Tina said:


> There are people who claim to be LGBT+ for attention, that's certainly true, but they are the minority. So let's not make allegations like that in this thread please.


+ people might not be faking it, like, questioning and exploring ur identity is normal (especially in your teens) and people might identify in lots of different ways before settling for something. it can be hard to tell the difference between types of attraction (is it a Romantic Crush or a platonic "yo this person is cool" thing?) so that might cause more confusion as well.
 i know i identified as bi, pan and questioning (/giving up on figuring it out lel) before coming to terms w my sexuality, and w my gender identity uh that was Wild too.

 there might be some people who are faking it but honestly i don't think they're very common at all, most "fakers" are probably people who explored their sexuality/gender (maybe because it was Trendy or bc their friends did it) and identified as something that they later realized didnt fit them. idk


----------



## Mr. Cat

Tae said:


> If you do not feel sexual attraction, you're ace. There are asexuals who enjoy sex, there are asexuals who tolerate sex, and there are asexuals who hate sex. I believe sex-positive, sex-neutral, and sex-repulsed are the terms, respectively.



Thank you! I didn't know there were different terms. This makes me feel like I'm definitely ace. I'm sex-positive and often times sex-neutral. But a lot of times I just see asexual people completely uniterested sex at all... makes me feel like I don't really belong there.


----------



## visibleghost

Mr. Cat said:


> Thank you! I didn't know there were different terms. This makes me feel like I'm definitely ace. I'm sex-positive and often times sex-neutral. But a lot of times I just see asexual people completely uniterested sex at all... makes me feel like I don't really belong there.



there are a lot of different ppl in the ace community, some are sex repulsed, some just dont care, and some are cool w it but dont experience sexual attraction. from what i've seen the most common is to be negative or uninterested in sex so i guess it can seem like you dont "belong" there (especially because of True Aces aka the gross type of people who shame everyone for having sex and are pretty much the me an intellectual meme)  but, like, u do  ..

i feel kinda weird in ace spaces too because i can't relate to what most other people there experience (like romantic attraction and whatever) but uhh   h  idk i geuss what im trying to say is that just bc youre not like the Stereotypical ace person doesnt mean you cant be ace or talk about being ace


----------



## Brookie

Hey, guys! This is really random, but if you are a fan of Disney, you will love these news.

Elsa's voice actress, Idina Menzel, is in support of Elsa getting a *girlfriend* in Frozen 2: the sequel.


----------



## nostalgibra

Brookie said:


> Hey, guys! This is really random, but if you are a fan of Disney, you will love these news.
> 
> Elsa's voice actress, Idina Menzel, is in support of Elsa getting a *girlfriend* in Frozen 2: the sequel.



I saw a headcanon on tumblr where Elsa meets a princess from a faraway country during her royal duties who has fire powers, and falls in love with her. That would be so PERFECT! Fire and ice <3


----------



## Jake

This is a Sexual Orientation & Gender Identity Support Thread, please remember to stay on topic and try not to stray too far from the conversation. Additionally, please remember we do not allow public advertising and all advertising should remain within your signature. Thanks.


----------



## Wolfie

This thread definitely came at the right time. I been struggling with my sexuality for most of my life. I have always supported LGBTQ rights and believe everyone should love who they love, and be allowed to identify as what they feel they are. So I am gladly here to support.
I also have a dilemma of my own. I know for a fact I like guy, as I am in a relationship with a man currently and we are happy together. I have no interest in being with anyone else at all. The only issue with me really is that I have struggled with whether or not I am bisexual. I have never dated or had sex with a girl, but I have had full blown crushes on girls in the past and been sexually attracted to girls. Now I am a firm believer that you can be bisexual and still date the opposite sex, it doesn't take away from the fact that both genders attract you, just like you can date a cisgender person and still be pansexual. I just struggle with my own self that fear that if I came out as bisexual, since I have only ever been with guys, people will think I am saying it for attention. In addition, I fear if I came out now it would be inappropriate because as I said, I am in a happy relationship with a man and have no intentions on leaving. I feel like certain people may think I am trying to imply that I want to leave him for a girl, which I don't I just feel like despite me being more shy with and fearful of pursuing girls and having almost no history with girls, I feel like I am holding in a part of me that needs to be let out. My boyfriend doesn't even know of this. He is straight but very open-minded and supportive of the LGBTQ community as well.


----------



## pawpatrolbab

Jake said:


> This is a Sexual Orientation & Gender Identity Support Thread, please remember to stay on topic and try not to stray too far from the conversation. Additionally, please remember we do not allow public advertising and all advertising should remain within your signature. Thanks.



Oops sorry, since I'm not affiliated with the site I didn't know it was advertised! Also thought this was just for LGBTQA+ folks to hang out, sorry again


----------



## Corrie

Wolfgirl0712 said:


> This thread definitely came at the right time. I been struggling with my sexuality for most of my life. I have always supported LGBTQ rights and believe everyone should love who they love, and be allowed to identify as what they feel they are. So I am gladly here to support.
> I also have a dilemma of my own. I know for a fact I like guy, as I am in a relationship with a man currently and we are happy together. I have no interest in being with anyone else at all. The only issue with me really is that I have struggled with whether or not I am bisexual. I have never dated or had sex with a girl, but I have had full blown crushes on girls in the past and been sexually attracted to girls. Now I am a firm believer that you can be bisexual and still date the opposite sex, it doesn't take away from the fact that both genders attract you, just like you can date a cisgender person and still be pansexual. I just struggle with my own self that fear that if I came out as bisexual, since I have only ever been with guys, people will think I am saying it for attention. In addition, I fear if I came out now it would be inappropriate because as I said, I am in a happy relationship with a man and have no intentions on leaving. I feel like certain people may think I am trying to imply that I want to leave him for a girl, which I don't I just feel like despite me being more shy with and fearful of pursuing girls and having almost no history with girls, I feel like I am holding in a part of me that needs to be let out. My boyfriend doesn't even know of this. He is straight but very open-minded and supportive of the LGBTQ community as well.



I struggle with the same thing and am in the same situation as you. You don't have to come out. My plan is to just hint it until questioned. Then spill the beans. Anyone who is worth hanging out with should believe you and not think you're doing it for attention.


----------



## Wolfie

Corrie said:


> I struggle with the same thing and am in the same situation as you. You don't have to come out. My plan is to just hint it until questioned. Then spill the beans. Anyone who is worth hanging out with should believe you and not think you're doing it for attention.



This is exactly what I been doing, hinting toward it. You are right about that though, not coming out unless questioned and only people who matter will know you are telling the truth.


----------



## Fearthecuteness

Jake said:


> This is a Sexual Orientation & Gender Identity Support Thread, please remember to stay on topic and try not to stray too far from the conversation. Additionally, please remember we do not allow public advertising and all advertising should remain within your signature. Thanks.



So who's going off topic exactly? I've only seen one topic that went off topic but Tina was even replying about it so I'm pretty sure this thread is for more general use as well as support. Also where's the advertising because I haven't seen that. 
Since this is Tina's thread and she's staff shouldn't she be the one having say on what's ok to be said here?
Besides slight bumps everything's been at at peace and respecting the rules, so what's the problem?


----------



## Chris

Fearthecuteness said:


> So who's going off topic exactly? I've only seen one topic that went off topic but Tina was even replying about it so I'm pretty sure this thread is for more general use as well as support. Also where's the advertising because I haven't seen that.
> Since this I Tina's thread and she's staff shouldn't she be the one having say on what's ok to be said here?
> Besides slight bumps everything's been at at peace and respecting the rules, so what's the problem?



Please don't question staff taking action against posts that break the rules. Those posts have been deleted, so unless you saw them before they were deleted it doesn't matter. I can still see the content Jake removed and he was correct in doing so.


----------



## Fearthecuteness

Tina said:


> Please don't question staff taking action against posts that break the rules. Those posts have been deleted, so unless you saw them before they were deleted it doesn't matter. I can still see the content Jake removed and he was correct in doing so.



Ah I see. He did not mention that he deleted any posts which is why I was questioning this. Sorry.


----------



## Soda Fox

Wolfgirl0712 said:


> This is exactly what I been doing, hinting toward it. You are right about that though, not coming out unless questioned and only people who matter will know you are telling the truth.



Not sure if this helps but I'm married to a man and I'm attracted to girls. In fact, on our wedding night we had a manage et trois with my best friend (a girl).  We're haven't invited another girl to our bed for a long time, but it's been very liberating to be open about it, we had a good time, and we both feel great knowing if sometime down the road we'll want to spice things up, that we're both on board. Of course we'd talk about it and not assume the feeling is still the same but it's a much easier conversation to have now.

Good luck with whatever you choose to do!


----------



## Wolfie

Soda Fox said:


> Not sure if this helps but I'm married to a man and I'm attracted to girls. In fact, on our wedding night we had a manage et trois with my best friend (a girl).  We're haven't invited another girl to our bed for a long time, but it's been very liberating to be open about it, we had a good time, and we both feel great knowing if sometime down the road we'll want to spice things up, that we're both on board. Of course we'd talk about it and not assume the feeling is still the same but it's a much easier conversation to have now.
> 
> Good luck with whatever you choose to do!



Thank you! I appreciate you sharing your story with me. It does make me comfortable knowing how accepting some are and how I am not alone in this. I am not judging you for your threesome, I think that is definitely good to spice things up for some, but my boyfriend and I are not a fan of threesomes. Even if I like girls too I do not really like the idea of having another person join us and he has said the same. I am glad you were able to open up though and your husband is accepting. Thank you!


----------



## pawpatrolbab

Just to prevent breaking rules; is this thread specifically for only LGBTQA+ talk? Or are you free to talk about anything as long as you're LGBTQA+?


----------



## Soda Fox

pawpatrolbab said:


> Just to prevent breaking rules; is this thread specifically for only LGBTQA+ talk? Or are you free to talk about anything as long as you're LGBTQA+?



As far as I could tell it's any sexuality, straight included.


----------



## pawpatrolbab

Soda Fox said:


> As far as I could tell it's any sexuality, straight included.



Nono I know, I'm just curious if the conversation or post has to be specifically related to being LGBTQA+ or not

I'm just curious so feel free to remove my posts; don't wanna clog up or start anything


----------



## Esphas

pawpatrolbab said:


> Nono I know, I'm just curious if the conversation or post has to be specifically related to being LGBTQA+ or not
> 
> I'm just curious so feel free to remove my posts; don't wanna clog up or start anything



here u go 



Jake said:


> This is a Sexual Orientation & Gender Identity Support Thread, *please remember to stay on topic* and try not to stray too far from the conversation. Additionally, please remember we do not allow public advertising and all advertising should remain within your signature. Thanks.


----------



## brutalitea

skarmoury said:


> Ahh interesting thread! <3 Thank you having this, Tina!
> Personally, I'd like to separate my orientation for sex and romance. I'm a heteroromantic, but I'm still exploring my sexual orientation (right now I'm thinking bisexual). I'm honestly uncomfortable thinking "sex" when I'm in a romantic relationship with someone, so it's just a preference to separate the two. c: To each his/her own!
> 
> I'm thankful for my parents who 100% support me no matter my orientation (like, when I was a kid I asked my parents "what if I like a girl", and they were like, "sure go on ahead kiddo, whatever makes you happy. we're happy with whatever choice as long as you pick someone worth your time"). I'm really sorry so many are struggling with homophobic or unsupportive household members and are unable to come out, but remember that it's never wrong to like anyone as long as you pick someone who you're comfortable sticking around with! <3 I can't understand why so many don't want to give basic support in terms of love. It's saddening.



Re: first paragraph: I'm the same. My romantic and sexual orientations are different (as of right now, we'll see how I feel if I ever enter into a relationship). 

I'm 100% certain I'll never come out to my family. One day I'll move out of the house and be able to create friendships with other people and I won't hide my orientation from them but I'll forever hide it from my family. They're all homophobic.


----------



## Brookie

Two things (it's really old though):

1. What do you guys think of them "featuring" a lesbian couple on a Good Luck Charlie episode? Not really the show I'm asking your opinion of, just like how you feel about Disney having one of the first openly LGBTQA pop-up (idk what else to call it) on a popular show? I'm for one happy about it 

2. What do you think about the scene in Frozen where Oaken points to his family including his [husband]. Many believe this is just the big brother of his family, but I think Disney was being purposefully ambiguous so that people could think of it either way.


----------



## forestyne

posting out of appreciation for the rupaul quote. i want mama ru to adopt me


I think I recall a thread like this one last week or so. What happened to that one? If I may ask?


----------



## Brookie

forestyne said:


> I think I recall a thread like this one last week or so. What happened to that one? If I may ask?



The tone of it was angry and unwelcoming, Tina shut it down to make a new one that she can monitor


----------



## Soda Fox

I don't know anything about Good Luck Charlie so I have no comment on that, sorry.

I always thought the Oaken family was a big brother, tiny mother on the right side, and several unspecified younger children. But I think it makes sense either way. I like that we see so little of the family that it can be open to intrepetation.


----------



## pawpatrolbab

Brookie said:


> Two things (it's really old though):
> 
> 1. What do you guys think of them "featuring" a lesbian couple on a Good Luck Charlie episode? Not really the show I'm asking your opinion of, just like how you feel about Disney having one of the first openly LGBTQA pop-up (idk what else to call it) on a popular show? I'm for one happy about it
> 
> 2. What do you think about the scene in Frozen where Oaken points to his family including his [husband]. Many believe this is just the big brother of his family, but I think Disney was being purposefully ambiguous so that people could think of it either way.



The animators have confirmed several times that his wife is featured in the scene, and the male is in fact not his husband


----------



## Brookie

pawpatrolbab said:


> The animators have confirmed several times that his wife is featured in the scene, and the male is in fact not his husband



Ugh, that sucks  I was thinking Disney finally took another big step for non-cis/Het minorities


----------



## forestyne

In case you guys haven't seen Beauty and The Beast and wanted to see it for the 'gay scene', don't bother. All they did was slow dance and had like 2.5 seconds of screen time. At the very end. I wish they had more LGBT characters in movies and on TV so that kids don't have to think that being gay or trans is wrong.


----------



## Soda Fox

forestyne said:


> In case you guys haven't seen Beauty and The Beast and wanted to see it for the 'gay scene', don't bother. All they did was slow dance and had like 2.5 seconds of screen time. At the very end. I wish they had more LGBT characters in movies and on TV so that kids don't have to think that being gay or trans is wrong.



I thought the character and his (while small) development  was pretty well done. But my view comes from having a cousin from a very religious family recently come out - he acted very much like the "bro" to try throw off his parents and the people around him. Good news, he came out, got out of his toxic family's lives, and is very successful and has a loving boyfriend.

I wanted to add that I agree that I would like to see more LGBT characters around too.


----------



## Ghost Soda

Brookie said:


> Two things (it's really old though):
> 
> 1. What do you guys think of them "featuring" a lesbian couple on a Good Luck Charlie episode? Not really the show I'm asking your opinion of, just like how you feel about Disney having one of the first openly LGBTQA pop-up (idk what else to call it) on a popular show? I'm for one happy about it



I was ecstatic when I first heard about that! The feeling was somewhat ruined by finding out that it got the cast, including the literal child actress for Charlie herself, death threads. Homophobes always ruin everything.


----------



## Brookie

Ghost Soda said:


> I was ecstatic when I first heard about that! The feeling was somewhat ruined by finding out that it got the cast, including the literal child actress for Charlie herself, death threads. Homophobes always ruin everything.



Yeah, that was terrible. I heard they even had to cancel the show, because it got too much out of hand. I can't believe people are that terrible to send death threats to a 4-5 year old.


----------



## skarmoury

I just watched the music video of Clean Bandit's Symphony (ft. Zara Larsson). The song was personally really good, and coupling that with a black gay couple in the music vid made it all the more empowering!
I see some comments saying the two men looked more like brothers, but idk personally I saw right off the bat that they were gay. For anyone who hasn't seen the music video, you should go watch! It's lovely (and sad, shh) <3


----------



## Ghost Soda

Brookie said:


> Yeah, that was terrible. I heard they even had to cancel the show, because it got too much out of hand. I can't believe people are that terrible to send death threats to a 4-5 year old.



Tbh, I heard that the show what ending anyway. Either way, yeah, sending death threats to a child is despicable. Can't imagine what these people thought they would accomplish.


----------



## Brookie

Ghost Soda said:


> Tbh, I heard that the show what ending anyway. Either way, yeah, sending death threats to a child is despicable. Can't imagine what these people thought they would accomplish.



I also loved the way the show handled it in the episode. The parents weren't like "OMG LOOK A LESBIAN COUPLE" or "I've never met a lesbian couple before!!!" or "Wow, this is the first time we've met some" or something like that, lol. It was just portrayed as an everyday occurence, and rightfully so.


----------



## Ghost Soda

Brookie said:


> I also loved the way the show handled it in the episode. The parents weren't like "OMG LOOK A LESBIAN COUPLE" or "I've never met a lesbian couple before!!!" or "Wow, this is the first time we've met some" or something like that, lol. It was just portrayed as an everyday occurence, and rightfully so.



Tbh, I've never actually seen the episode but it sounds like they did a good job on it! :>


----------



## Corrie

Brookie said:


> I also loved the way the show handled it in the episode. The parents weren't like "OMG LOOK A LESBIAN COUPLE" or "I've never met a lesbian couple before!!!" or "Wow, this is the first time we've met some" or something like that, lol. It was just portrayed as an everyday occurence, and rightfully so.



This is really good news, especially for Disney Channel. You wouldn't expect something like that to happen on that channel so good for them! ^^ The way they made it seem normal too was amazing cause yes, that's what it is: normal.


----------



## Ghost Soda

And since we're on the topic of Disney and LGBT representation, I heard that they've stopped airing the SVTFOE episode "Just Friends" because it features same gender couples kissing. :U


----------



## Corrie

Ghost Soda said:


> Assuming this is a serious question, I'm pretty sure you can find other people attractive and not be attracted to their gender. (Not that I would know, lel)
> 
> Can you picture yourself happily dating a man? If so then you might be gay, or you could be bi/poly/pan. Who knows?
> 
> Edit: Curses, I was ninja'd!



I also wanna add that your sexual and romantic feelings can be totally different from each other.


----------



## Trundle

Corrie said:


> I also wanna add that your sexual and romantic feelings can be totally different from each other.



What's the point of having a relationship if it isn't romantic and sexual? A relationship needs physical and emotional aspects to thrive.


----------



## Ghost Soda

Apple2013 said:


> What's the point of having a relationship if it isn't romantic and sexual? A relationship needs physical and emotional aspects to thrive.



Maybe for you, but not all relationships are alike. Don't act like your personal needs for a relationship are somehow universal rules.

Also adding that there's more ways to be physical in a relationship than just doing the do.


----------



## Trundle

Ghost Soda said:


> Maybe for you, but not all relationships are alike. Don't act like your personal needs for a relationship are somehow universal rules.
> 
> Also adding that there's more ways to be physical in a relationship than just doing the do.



o sry


----------



## Ghost Soda

Apple2013 said:


> o sry



You have been forgiven.


----------



## brutalitea

Apple2013 said:


> What's the point of having a relationship if it isn't romantic and sexual? A relationship needs physical and emotional aspects to thrive.



No it doesn't.


----------



## Soraru

anyone read "Always Human" and "Shoot Around" in line webtoons? I hope this isnt considered advertising, but _it is on topic_, since both comics have main characters are LGBT+ (actually both comics nearly have every character thats on the spectrum)

i personally dont put myself under a lable in LGBT+ stuff, im currently not really on a quest to figure out what or who i like, since theres other social issues/minority stuff i put alot of my energy and concern into. although all i know is that i dont have any problem with who/what/things others like and sensible enough to know that minorities should not be discriminated against based off of their love/sexual preference and that human rights should also apply to said people. it shouldnt even be a debate, haha. I really appreciated the diversity both ethnically and both comics have alot of positive LGBT+ relationships, and its not entirely glitters and sunshine. notably, always human has more realistic sides of a relationship thats added in. seeing more diversity and less typical vanilla, cookie cutter stuff is really refreshing.

both comics normalize LGBT+ and its refreshing to see a relationship that isnt being made a big deal out of as if its abnormal or strange, or exceptionally *insert adjetive* one thing i love about both comics was how they werent obnoxious like "OMGLOOK. IM/HES/SHES/THEY'RE GAY." kind of vibe. it was normalized, not fetishized, and not treated like some sort of exotic exhibition. and it really changes the perspective of normalcy in today's general society.


----------



## faelien

Howdy everyone! I'm Bec, I posted in the other forum like twice or three times maybe? because it just didn't seem very... mm I'll let that thought just trail off. Anyway, I just wanted to let y'all know I'm here for you and completely understand being in the closet. I'm nonbinary and pan, but I haven't told my parents even though I am an Adult because they're...not the most supportive people and I still live with them because the economy is.... you know. Anyway, I'm a huge nerd! Animal Crossing is the happiest game that I've recently gotten back into (New Leaf and HHD) and they're definitely games that help calm me down.

 I also read webcomics and a few I've read that are LGBT themed but not angsty coming out stories that I can think of off the top of my head are Witchy, which is about a world where the longer your hair is the more power you have! It features LGBT characters and I thought it was a cool read. I also read Rock and Riot which is a webcomic set in the 50s with cute lesbians, bisexual characters, nonbinary/trans characters, as well as gay men. Think Grease but super gay. 

Anyway sorry about how long this post is I'm not good about talking about stuff.


----------



## skarmoury

Apple2013 said:


> What's the point of having a relationship if it isn't romantic and sexual? A relationship needs physical and emotional aspects to thrive.



The point is that some like me are more comfortable with someone in one aspect and another person in the other aspect. I've never had intimate, sexual feelings with any of my past boyfriends except one. I've had one sexual relationship but it was never driven by romance. When I'm in a romantic relationship, most of the time I'm very uncomfortable with any sexual advances, bc I just don't feel that it's right for me in our situation.

Romance and sex aren't mutually exclusive, of course, but some people prefer to sort it that way! And while some need physical and emotional aspects in a relationship, romance and sex isn't just one or the other aspect; romance and sex both have physical and emotional aspects!

And just a P.S.: I've mixed romantic and sexual feelings once, and it was really messed up bc I didn't cope well with the heartbreak that followed. Not to dwell on the past but from then I learned how to separate my feelings, for the sake of me.  Of course, this is my way of coping with feels and stuff, it's different for everyone so a little respect for everyone can go a long way! <3


----------



## forestyne

Soda Fox said:


> I thought the character and his (while small) development  was pretty well done. But my view comes from having a cousin from a very religious family recently come out - he acted very much like the "bro" to try throw off his parents and the people around him. Good news, he came out, got out of his toxic family's lives, and is very successful and has a loving boyfriend.
> 
> I wanted to add that I agree that I would like to see more LGBT characters around too.



I had a panic attack mid-film and walked out, I missed a pretty big chunk of the film. I only came back around the end of 'Something There that Wasn't There Before'. I wish the scene at the end could've been a bit more... _more_, but I guess it's better than nothing.

- - - Post Merge - - -

To be honest, I wish I was an entirely different person. In fact, I barely even wish to exist at all. I feel _ashamed_ of my sexuality, even the LGBT community seems to hate people like me because we aren't 'gay enough' or something. I feel all over the place and I don't even feel happy the way I am. I have nobody to support me, not even people _like me._ I just want to curl up and hide for the rest of my life because I'm a complete embarrassment to everybody.

Okay, rant over.


----------



## AnonymousFish

Soraru said:


> anyone read "Always Human" and "Shoot Around" in line webtoons? I hope this isnt considered advertising, but _it is on topic_, since both comics have main characters are LGBT+ (actually both comics nearly have every character thats on the spectrum)
> 
> i personally dont put myself under a lable in LGBT+ stuff, im currently not really on a quest to figure out what or who i like, since theres other social issues/minority stuff i put alot of my energy and concern into. although all i know is that i dont have any problem with who/what/things others like and sensible enough to know that minorities should not be discriminated against based off of their love/sexual preference and that human rights should also apply to said people. it shouldnt even be a debate, haha. I really appreciated the diversity both ethnically and both comics have alot of positive LGBT+ relationships, and its not entirely glitters and sunshine. notably, always human has more realistic sides of a relationship thats added in. seeing more diversity and less typical vanilla, cookie cutter stuff is really refreshing.
> 
> both comics normalize LGBT+ and its refreshing to see a relationship that isnt being made a big deal out of as if its abnormal or strange, or exceptionally *insert adjetive* one thing i love about both comics was how they werent obnoxious like "OMGLOOK. IM/HES/SHES/THEY'RE GAY." kind of vibe. it was normalized, not fetishized, and not treated like some sort of exotic exhibition. and it really changes the perspective of normalcy in today's general society.



I'll have to check these out, they sound awesome! I'm straight myself but I'm an ally  and I love seeing people treat the LGBT+ community as it is: normal! Of course, pride parades and things like it that show off the community are fantastic and help promote so much good, but at the same time "normalizing" it is a huge step in the right direction.


----------



## Sig

just say lgbt


----------



## carp

Sig said:


> just say lgbt



personally, i think lgbt+ or lgbtqia+ or quiltbag are more inclusive. acceptance is the most important thing, especially for people who are not sure of their gender/sexual identity.


----------



## Ghost Soda

My gender is so confusing because sometimes I feel like I just don't want to be gendered in any way but then other times I feel like I could live happily as a somewhat feminine but also male aligned person??? :/


----------



## Bulbadragon

Ghost Soda said:


> My gender is so confusing because sometimes I feel like I just don't want to be gendered in any way but then other times I feel like I could live happily as a somewhat feminine but also male aligned person??? :/



I feel the same way! I normally just would prefer to be seen as genderless, but then other times I am entirely okay with being so feminine and going by female pronouns. But then other times I really wish I could be masculine and maybe transition? I'm not genderfluid though, I'm agender, so it gets confusing feeling that way. Not sure if it's similar to what you're feeling but I thought I'd chime in since my gender is also pretty confusing.


----------



## Corrie

Here's a weird question guys. I'm not sure what to think of it. 

So my sister went to ask me about her private area and what all the parts of it are called. So I told her and she eventually broke down crying saying she was terrified of vaginas. She says that they look ugly, scary and they're so complex and apparently it freaks her out. She wouldn't even talk about the more "intense" parts of it and made me stop too.

I didn't even know how to answer her. This is 100% serious and I'm not sure if this is a gender or sexuality thing? Maybe it's just her being young? She's 16. I don't know the labels all that well so I was wondering if any of you have anything to help me with. I really wanna help her but I don't really know how or where to begin.

Thanks everyone!


----------



## pinkcotton

Happy Pride month everyone! <3


----------



## Chris

*Plenty of new users have joined The Bell Tree lately and among them I've already interacted with many members of the LGBT+ community so giving this thread a formal bump. *


----------



## SillyPrinny

Vrisnem said:


> *Plenty of new users have joined The Bell Tree lately and among them I've already interacted with many members of the LGBT+ community so giving this thread a formal bump. *
> 
> I find that this time of year (Jan-Mar) is when I consistently tend to have some sort of identity crisis. It's also the time of year I struggle most to keep motivated.



Just remember friend, we all love you. You can never hear those words enough, and I'll always regret never saying that enough to the ones I've lost. Yes, you may not feel motivated right now, but you're smart enough to realize this and willingly want to better yourself. Remember that.


----------



## visibleghost

throwback to when i wrote in this thread and was all like "yeah i know my gender identity 100%" and then it changed lmao wild. anyway i realized that i won't be happy just switching from one binary to the other when what i really want is liberation from gender itself. but also i don't want to tell people that i don't id as whatever gender they think i am because then i have to live up to the expectations of that gender identity, even though it's more of a non-identity to me so like yeah no i'm chilling. idk if i even id as trans anymore because like i just don't want to deal with that stuff. not that i'm cis but u know. yea. hashtag transtrender and so on


----------



## d3_3p

> throwback to when i wrote in this thread and was all like "yeah i know my gender identity 100%" and then it changed lmao


I feel like I know nothing about life.
It _changed_? I can't even comprehend...


----------



## Bowie

I used to be so sure I wanted to be a woman, but being in a relationship with a bisexual somehow made me more comfortable than ever with just being a gay man. Not sure how that works but my body dysphoria just poofed when I was around him. Now he’s gone and, while it’s kind of come back, I still know what it feels like to not feel that way and I know I’m capable of repressing it.


----------



## Kaiaa

This is such a nice thread, what a wonderful place to talk and not be judged! I’m here for anyone who needs someone to talk to. I’m here to support each and every one of you as you discover who you were always meant to be <3


----------



## xara

my sexuality is always fluctuating - one day i think i’m bi, the next day i think i’m pan. i think i might be bi but i have no s***** attraction towards boys - maybe my sexuality is just ‘confusion’ lmao


----------



## SheepMareep

Oh I had no idea this thread existed until I saw your signature just now!!! This is awesome thank you c:
I'm Pansexual and cis! It took me a loooong time (from 4th/5th grade to 12 grade) to come to terms that I wasn't straight. Like I knew it but it wasn't ok to be non-straight in my house so I repressed it for a while. Bisexual didn't feel right to me when I referred to myself as Bi (tried for a year or so in my final years of hs) and eventually I found out about pansexuality and that made me feel more... sure? I'm honestly not 100% positive on how to describe finally feeling like I had an identity that was truly me. 

Also!!
Just a question.... I brought up the idea of adding (optional and changeable/customizable) pronouns to the sidebar where our join date is on posts in the HQ forum; do you know if this is something that will be implemented? A lot of the discord groups for AC have this in their groups as well (with the use of roles) and it feels like bell tree is falling behind in that regard :c


----------



## Alienfish

Bowie said:


> I used to be so sure I wanted to be a woman, but being in a relationship with a bisexual somehow made me more comfortable than ever with just being a gay man. Not sure how that works but my body dysphoria just poofed when I was around him. Now he’s gone and, while it’s kind of come back, I still know what it feels like to not feel that way and I know I’m capable of repressing it.



Can I say how much I appreciate this post... Not everyone dares to come out with this and come to terms with body and/or gender dysphoria.. and they have to go thru to be accepted and some getting pushed/bullied even by the care system and some thing go too fast. Keep on being strong, we all love you <3

(pansexual here, any pronoun is fine though cis)


----------



## Sanaki

I love the idea of this thread being active again. Thanks for bumping it up <3


----------



## Stil

I have no problem with people of other sexual orientation, but this kind of thread is the reason why we look at people differently. This thread is *literally* segregating LBGT+ by singling out their sexuality. People need to just ignore the fact that people are different and stop feeling like everybody is special or unique. We are all here existing, and nobody is special. Everybody demands equality, but nobody wants to admit that these groups like this are a part of the problem as to why people are treated differently.

Dont segregate.
We are all equal.


----------



## radical6

i dont discuss stuff like this open on public anymore but im glad theres a new thread! the last one was like..1k posts or something i think so its nice to start new for the new ac game



Infinity said:


> I have no problem with people of other sexual orientation, but this kind of thread is the reason why we look at people differently. This thread is *literally* segregating LBGT+ by singling out their sexuality. People need to just ignore the fact that people are different and stop feeling like everybody is special or unique. We are all here existing, and nobody is special. Everybody demands equality, but nobody wants to admit that these groups like this are a part of the problem as to why people are treated differently.
> 
> Dont segregate.
> We are all equal.



some people still live in hostile countries with little to no support. i really no longer benefit from this stuff since i no longer identify as nb but i found threads/blogs/etc similar to this helpful. also its not like only lgbt people can post. make a separate thread complaining about this if you want, but the whole idea of this one is to be supportive. not have a debate.

edit: oh lol this thread was bumped not remade. either way good idea bringing it back


----------



## Kaiaa

Infinity said:


> I have no problem with people of other sexual orientation, but this kind of thread is the reason why we look at people differently. This thread is *literally* segregating LBGT+ by singling out their sexuality. People need to just ignore the fact that people are different and stop feeling like everybody is special or unique. We are all here existing, and nobody is special. Everybody demands equality, but nobody wants to admit that these groups like this are a part of the problem as to why people are treated differently.
> 
> Dont segregate.
> We are all equal.



I respect your opinion, but what most people who think like that don’t realize is that many people don’t have a safe place outside of the internet to talk or express themselves. Especially teenagers who’s parents want cis children and would quite literally disown them if it was spoken about at home. I’ve never seen a person disowned over being straight. A don’t ask don’t tell policy makes people fearful, and a thread like this can give people confidence in who they are. Maybe one day, instead of ignoring people’s sexuality or gender identity we can embrace it and accept it. You are right, we are all equal and one day it won’t be an issue and one day we won’t need a thread like this, but until then it is here to help lift people up and I hope you can show your support to those who need it.


----------



## Chris

Infinity said:


> I have no problem with people of other sexual orientation, but this kind of thread is the reason why we look at people differently. This thread is *literally* segregating LBGT+ by singling out their sexuality. People need to just ignore the fact that people are different and stop feeling like everybody is special or unique. We are all here existing, and nobody is special. Everybody demands equality, but nobody wants to admit that these groups like this are a part of the problem as to why people are treated differently.
> 
> Dont segregate.
> We are all equal.



This is not the appropriate thread for this discussion. If you would like to discuss it on TBT then you are welcome to make your own thread. This thread is for giving support to a group of people who feel a need to speak with like-minded people in order to feel normal and sane. Coming to terms with being LGBT+ can be confusing and lonely, and for many it is filled with a lot of self-hatred. Many people can't find—or are too afraid to reach out—to people in their offline lives about it. This thread is intended as a safe space where people can feel free to discuss what is worrying them, share their own experiences, and celebrate coming to terms with and accepting themselves as they are.


----------



## Chris

visibleghost said:


> throwback to when i wrote in this thread and was all like "yeah i know my gender identity 100%" and then it changed lmao wild. anyway i realized that i won't be happy just switching from one binary to the other when *what i really want is liberation from gender itself*. but also i don't want to tell people that i don't id as whatever gender they think i am because then i have to live up to the expectations of that gender identity, even though it's more of a non-identity to me so like yeah no i'm chilling. idk if i even id as trans anymore because like i just don't want to deal with that stuff. not that i'm cis but u know. yea. hashtag transtrender and so on



I agree with the bold so much. I don't address gender at all in my offline life unless someone asks me (and even then I avoid going into depth) because even some people who are accepting can't see beyond the idea of it being black and white. I've encountered quite a few trans allies who believe it's simply a matter of, _"if you're not a boy then you must be a girl"_ and vice versa. They've good intentions - but either they can't get their heads around seeing gender as a spectrum or have yet to encounter it.

I feel too many issues that contribute to young people questioning their gender are man-made problems, and things would be a whole lot simpler if gender stereotypes, gender roles, etc did not exist to begin with. I volunteer with an organisation where I focus a lot of time to answering young people's questions on sex and relationships, and naturally with that comes questions such as _'am I trans because...'_ - and that is typically followed up with a list of gender-related stereotypes. It would be much simpler for everyone if these things just went away and there were no expectations linked to gender. Then fewer people wouldn't feel as if they don't fit in the right box.  





Bowie said:


> I used to be so sure I wanted to be a woman, but being in a relationship with a bisexual somehow made me more comfortable than ever with just being a gay man. Not sure how that works but my body dysphoria just poofed when I was around him. Now he’s gone and, while it’s kind of come back, I still know what it feels like to not feel that way and I know I’m capable of repressing it.



What I'm going to say is easier said that done, of course, but it sounds like what you need to find is something that grounds you that doesn't involve being dependent on another person. For me that one thing is writing fiction. I use character's as avatars to explore things in a safe space and generally argue with myself.  





Irishchai said:


> Oh I had no idea this thread existed until I saw your signature just now!!! This is awesome thank you c:
> I'm Pansexual and cis! It took me a loooong time (from 4th/5th grade to 12 grade) to come to terms that I wasn't straight. Like I knew it but it wasn't ok to be non-straight in my house so I repressed it for a while. Bisexual didn't feel right to me when I referred to myself as Bi (tried for a year or so in my final years of hs) and eventually I found out about pansexuality and that made me feel more... sure? I'm honestly not 100% positive on how to describe finally feeling like I had an identity that was truly me.
> 
> Also!!
> Just a question.... I brought up the idea of adding (optional and changeable/customizable) pronouns to the sidebar where our join date is on posts in the HQ forum; do you know if this is something that will be implemented? A lot of the discord groups for AC have this in their groups as well (with the use of roles) and it feels like bell tree is falling behind in that regard :c



I sometimes feel like not knowing the right label can sometimes make it worse. Like, here's a group of people who you think feel the same - but then you still don't somehow fit in! 

I never said anything even knowing my parents were okay with the LGBT+ community until they asked me about someone I was dating and used the wrong pronouns for them. I guess I treated it as 'don't ask, don't tell' for a lot of years. Didn't come out to them until I was 25. To be honest I don't think I was even comfortable saying it aloud until then! I had wanted a sex change from early teens (didn't even know the word 'trans' - it hadn't really entered mainstream usage back then) and realised I lacked gender preferences from as young as 12/13.

As for the thread you linked: I'll try post over in that thread sometime today.


----------



## StrangeDog

Hello, all! I'm glad I saw this thread!

I've run my own organization helping transgender people learn social media management skills since 2014 - almost 6 years now. I'm a transgender man. I walked away from my home with nothing but a backpack in 2016 and never loooked back. If any of you need help becoming more independent or just working on your social media presence, please feel free to message me.


----------



## SheepMareep

Vrisnem said:


> I sometimes feel like not knowing the right label can sometimes make it worse. Like, here's a group of people who you think feel the same - but then you still don't somehow fit in!
> 
> I never said anything even knowing my parents were okay with the LGBT+ community until they asked me about someone I was dating and used the wrong pronouns for them. I guess I treated it as 'don't ask, don't tell' for a lot of years. Didn't come out to them until I was 25. To be honest I don't think I was even comfortable saying it aloud until then! I had wanted a sex change from early teens (didn't even know the word 'trans' - it hadn't really entered mainstream usage back then) and realised I lacked gender preferences from as young as 12/13.



Yeah its definitley hard when you KNOW you are different but are unsure what other label to use so you just... stick with it while not feeling confident at all. Like a lot of my friends were bi but I just would not come out to them at all because I did not feel confident in who I was yet to say what I was.
&& oh god I cant even imagine coming out to my parents. I'm 23 now and so far my only relationship has been with a cis guy, so although I post a lot of things indicating I'm not straight on fb I dont think they have connected the dots at all-- no angry messages yet lol 

I think it's crazy how people outside of the lgbt community think we dont know these things about ourselves until we are older. Like... all of us learned early on as children and just weren't open until later! Even if there is confusion we can be positive that we are not het or cis from young ages!!!!


----------



## radical6

personally people describe me as nb sometimes but i prefer gnc. i don't dress gnc that much though. 

i guess i would say i want gender abolition. like imagine not needing to identify as trans or something because gender roles wouldnt exist and we would just be people. though there is also the fact people have gender dysphoria sometimes so. 

i think a reason i was drawn to the nb because i didnt like facing misogyny when i was younger (i didnt want to be harassed by older men) over an innate feeling of another gender. i totally support people who feel that way however but i think thats where my complicated relationship with gender is. 

in terms of sexuality i guess bi works but i don't feel much of a connection with the lgbt communities at time, idk not as much as i used to. i think i just dont focus a lot on the sexuality part of my life really, I guess I'm more worried about other things that they preoccupy my time.


edit: gnc = gender non conforming


----------



## visibleghost

d3_3p said:


> I feel like I know nothing about life.
> It _changed_? I can't even comprehend...



ikr it's some wiiiild stuff bro. some people are all like "gender doesnt change and everyone whos trans has always been this gender and if you say anything else youre stupid" and i see their point but also like.... if gender is going to be defined by your personal feelings that's bound to change for some people at some point, and there's nothing wrong with that. 

i get that it's harmful for the trans community and all that to say it can change but like what am i supposed to say? that i was never trans and never had gender dysphoria? that's not true. i had gender dysphoria, both bodily and socially for years, i was actually diagnosed with it for transition reasons that i didn't end up going through with. now i don't. it's at most something that slightly bothers me. and all of that is because my outlook on life, my identity and gender has changed which in turn has changed what i view as important in my life, and gender is not one of those things.



Infinity said:


> I have no problem with people of other sexual orientation, but this kind of thread is the reason why we look at people differently. This thread is *literally* segregating LBGT+ by singling out their sexuality. People need to just ignore the fact that people are different and stop feeling like everybody is special or unique. We are all here existing, and nobody is special. Everybody demands equality, but nobody wants to admit that these groups like this are a part of the problem as to why people are treated differently.
> 
> Dont segregate.
> We are all equal.



lmao what are you on. you sound like one of those "i don't see color" people and i mean that in a negative way


----------



## motheaten

I've jumped around the gender binary quite a bit for a good majority of my life and only recently have taken on nonbinary after identifying as male for maybe 4 or 5 years and this label is just. It feels great. I love not having the constrictions of gendered pronouns to hold me down. I've found myself to be gnc nonbinary but leaning a bit more towards being feminine. Its honestly so nice to have a group of people to share experiences like this with!


----------



## cornimer

Eyy it's nice to see this thread back! I'm a cis girl and I've identified as asexual since the middle of high school when I found out such a term existed and suddenly stopped feeling like a weirdo. I thought I was ace and hetero-romantic for a few years until I finally admitted to myself that I was madly in love with my "best friend" and had been denying it for two years (except she was actually emotionally abusive and it's a good thing I'm not in contact with her anymore). Now I identify as panromantic because since I don't experience attraction, I could fall for anyone if I'm drawn to their personality. Although I do find that whenever I imagine being in relationships, I much prefer to imagine being with a girl. So ngl if I met someone that knew nothing about the LGBTQ+ community and had to come out, I would probably just tell them I'm gay (and oddly enough I have had a few people, including one of my professors, assume I'm gay in recent times)


----------



## goro

i'm a gnc gay guy. bounced around from asexual to bisexual to whatever until i realized i just like men and a lot of the past stuff was just compulsory heterosexuality


----------



## dragonpisces69

Regarding sexuality, I thought I discovered I was bisexual at age 15½, but a little over 2 months ago, I found out that I really am pansexual, as gender really doesn't matter to me if it comes to crushing and relationships. (Even tho I only had crushes so far, and have been single since birth!) Furthermore, I'm polya-curious, I don't know why or how, but the idea of having more than one romantic partner is somehow quite comfortable in my thoughts, and it somehow makes me kind of happy, too.

As for a gender identity, I was always confused about that (since I have quite a lot of masculine traits) and thus questioning it until age 16, when I discovered Undertale where two characters were genderless/nonbinary, and ever since, I've finally found my true gender identity... which, unfortunately, still isn't accepted by/among people like my family, counsellors and most of my friends, as they never refer to me as a they, which is really my primary preferred pronoun.

In a nutshell: I'm pansexual, polya-curious, and nonbinary, and my (preferred) pronouns are he/they.


----------



## deerprongs

In term of gender, I identify as demifluid. _Not_ to be confused with genderfluid! As a demifluid person, I identify with my birth gender (female) but often feel masculine or non-binary or even everything and nothing at times. This does bother me sometimes, but I'm slowly learning to live with it. Before I discovered my gender identity, I always just labeled myself as cisfemale even though that never felt right. It feels good to know what I am.

I am also demisexual- yes, I am both demi in gender and in sexuality, which for some reason is really soothing to me and I don't know why! My romantic preference is in women, making me homoromantic; I am currently dating my best friend and my amazing girlfriend.


----------



## John Wick

I'm a straight male, and my wife is gender fluid.

She isn't attracted to women, she wears makeup, has beautiful long (currently blonde and pink) hair, but she identifies as mostly male.

She's like one of the guys, in Goddess form.

I think it's why we've never had a fight.

I believe it's the Soul of the person that attracts us. Not the gender.

My wife is my person, and I worship her.


----------



## Buttonsy

Just a gay trans dude saying "hey"


----------



## Lady Timpani

Irishchai said:


> Yeah its definitley hard when you KNOW you are different but are unsure what other label to use so you just... stick with it while not feeling confident at all.



This was me up until a couple years ago. I kind of just go with the flow more than I used to and try not to worry too much about making absolutely sure I have a label to use to describe myself, because all that really brought me in the past was grief. I'd say bi works, though.

Anyway like someone else said earlier I try not to talk about this stuff much publicly anymore, but it's good to see this thread doing well!


----------



## Soigne

y'know, i wish i had been able to question my gender identity more when i was younger. sexuality, yes, of course. but i never really had the space to question gender in my life, so in a way that was an issue that never came up with me. don't really feel attached to a particular gender, but who knows what that means. certainly not me. and maybe that's okay.


----------



## Rosie Moon

I’m an asexual cis woman married to a demisexual cis man. Possible TMI, but we pretty much have no s** life because neither of us are really interested in it. As a result, people our age (and even some family members) have given us advice on how to ‘fix it’. Some people act shocked and even accuse me of ‘depriving’ him. It really bugs us, because we have a really happy relationship and we genuinely love each other, but apparently none of that matters because there’s no s**. Ugh. >_>


----------



## lambshu

hi! im a nb/agender  person..  i have a very complicated relationship with gender and identity, and im still very closeted but im doing the best i can :0)

ive known ive been not het since i was in elementary, like age 8-9? (i had multiple “boyfriends” but still really just wanted to kiss my girl best friend) and known i was not cis since i started middle school, like ages 11-12.

as for sexuality label its complicated- i say bi but it rlly might be wlw bc im only rlly attracted to fictional men as opposed to all kinds of gals so... who knows!

but yeah im learning to love myself and my identity everyday ..


----------



## Jamborenium

I'm going to keep this short and simple

I'm Non Binary and Biromantic Ace​


----------



## Dinosaurz

i dislike being trans a lot and the lgbt community just because I feel like it’s making being gay a personality trait not your sexuality in the land of Shane Dawson and all that I do feel like some people think it’s cool to be lgbt now it used to be about acceptance but I think that has primary shifted


----------



## lionrt60

So I kinda debated sharing on a public forum but ehh.
So I'm a gay cis guy basically.



Dinosaurz said:


> i dislike being trans a lot and the lgbt community just because I feel like it’s making being gay a personality trait not your sexuality in the land of Shane Dawson and all that I do feel like some people think it’s cool to be lgbt now it used to be about acceptance but I think that has primary shifted



I can kinda get this. While I don't think that people identify as LGBTQ+ just because it's cool, and it's a good thing that people know its a possibility now and that they feel comfortable enough to publicly identify as such, among people who lack the understanding it can seem like being sassy or whatever is what defines being LGBTQ+, or at least gay, not the actual, y'know, liking the same sex / having a different gender identity. Kinda linked to that i've been driven to do things that I probably wouldn't have or to act a certain way that I don't normally to assert myself as gay, or like, make it known that I am.


----------



## Argent

I identify as a cis gay man! I have a boyfriend who I've been lucky to have for almost a year now, but it sucks that we might be spending our anniversary apart due to the current health crisis going on. I never thought I'd ever be as happy as I am, not to say I am solely reliant on him to make me happy, but I just feel so much more positive about myself and the world around me as a whole because of him. Our families are so supportive as well. I can't remember what life was like without him, and I hope I never have to go back to it.

It's great to meet you all, hope everyone is staying safe!


----------



## Bubbsart

I identify as a nonbinary/genderfluid greyace Pansexual.


----------



## lionrt60

[Deleted]


----------



## primandimproper

Hey there, I'm a transgender, asexual, panromantic man currently 5 weeks on T. I started questioning my gender when I was around 15, but didn't realize I was trans until I was about twenty-seven. I don't really have a good support system at home. My family is extremely transphobic and love to misgender me because I conform to their toxic masculinity standards. Last night, for example, my sister told me I wasn't a real man because I thought baby bunnies were cute -_-

Other than that, life is good. I have my own apartment and I'm filing to have my name changed next month, and I am getting ready for my freshman year of college. Just waiting to hear back from my first choice school, and if that's no, I guess I'll have to settle for community college which is meh. 

Good to meet all of you.


----------



## mizzsnow

.


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## rainboxys

Hey, everyone! 

Just saw this thread and thought I was overdue to pop in. 

My name is Bats, yes really. I’m a nonbinary butch lesbian. My complicated experience with gender revolves mostly being a butch lesbian and while it’s difficult to put into words, I think the best descriptor aside from genderflux/genderfluid/nonbinary/genderless etc., is to say that I only identify as a woman or even feel any kind of gender when I’m dating another woman. Been out of a relationship for almost a year now, and while I’m enjoying the single life, I’m waiting for the moment for the world to come back to order so I can get a job and reenter the dating pool lol. 

Cheers and ignore the haters, y’all. 
Bats


----------



## Vex L'Cour

IDK why I'm doing this but IG it's because of the length of time I've been away and how I am as a person and how I identify has changed a lot over the years, even to the point of sparking controversy within the community.

I consider myself Genderfluid (I am male, but sometimes I like to "be" female) and have wrestled with this decision since I was a kid, For the longest time I just considered myself cis with female tendencies. I guess I always avoided finding a.. "LBGT" identity due to how I came to perceive the community, it's "loud majority" and it's methodology of getting it's point across, it's the same thing with why I only came out as a furry last year whilst being one for at least 7 years. I've usually found it difficult to include myself in a community where I've seen the whole "we don't discriminate" but is also very toxic and can be fairly pushy (When I used to interact with those within a few LBGT online communities they would spend days, even weeks, trying to push me into identifying as trans when I do not see myself that way, even to the point of vilifying me as a "Self hating trans"). Obviously I know this doesn't apply to everyone/everywhere which is why I finally came out with it all, but it doesn't help people who're trying to come to terms with their identities that there are a lot of places which do force this kind of stuff.


----------



## Ezamoosh

Hi all! Just ducking my head in to say hey. I'm a bonafide nonbinary trans man. I'm also aspec and bi. My name is Aaron and I use he/him pronouns.
I've done lots of work and activism in the community and make a living making art about being trans and disabled. I'm sure I don't need to explain that life as a trans person is difficult - just the other week I had the lovely experience again of having a transphobic slur shouted at me on the street. I'm not someone that subscribes to the idea of hating transness or other trans people though. Life is hard and we're all muddling through.
I've been with my very beautiful trans girlfriend for going on three years now, and she bought a switch lite so that we can play new horizons together! It's been really lovely since we're quarantined apart at the moment. She's going for a full cow island. 

Nice to meet you all!


----------



## SublimeDonut

Figuring out a label that fits oneself feels so unimportant and meaningless tbh. I mean, I respect people who want that, but I can't help but wince when I come across an LGBT post that features like 50 different labels. Sounds even more menial when it comes from someone my age who like me, has no idea who they're attracted to, so with each new person they make out with, they pick up a different word for themselves.


----------



## Shiluc

Hello guys, I am somewhat new to the community, and I've been trying to figure myself out. I am cisgender and use he/him pronouns, but as of a few months ago, I finally figured out that I was gay, after previously identifying as bi/asexual for several months. I'm the only person like this in a Christian family, and support is limited after announcing my split from the faith. Yet, I've been doing well lately and my family is slowly starting to (somewhat) accept me. Happy to be here


----------



## f11

I just found out that micro dosing on testosterone is a thing??? I’m like ~nb~ but I wish I looked more masc/androgynous but the idea looking completely masculine was terrifying??? But I’m probably not gonna do any hrt until I start university this fall because my parents are like crazy lol


----------



## visibleghost

it's so cool to see a bunch of other trans/nb people on here. it's easy to feel alone when you don't know a bunch of other people who feel the same about gender.

anyway, i have an issue with my name. i stopped going by my birth name with my family five years ago when i was 15 and instead went by oliver. i still feel like that's my name but i don't want to present myself as nb/assumed cis and use a masculine name. at the same time i don't want to use my birth name because it feels like i'm gendering myself as cis if i do. but also i don't like any gender neutral names that aren't extremely common or snowflake-y. so i am having a Problem. rip


----------



## trashpedia

I am a cis gay male and I knew that since I was 11. I did come out to some of my friends until I was 13, and since the January of this year, I came out to my mom. Fortunately, my mom didn't care and was accepting, so my coming-out was as chaotic as I imagined it would be (then again we're Buddhist so it probably didn't matter anyways).

Heck, my family has been so accepting and so chill about it that some days I almost forgot I came out to them because they never really brought it up unless I brought the subject up myself.


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## primandimproper

f11 said:


> I just found out that micro dosing on testosterone is a thing??? I’m like ~nb~ but I wish I looked more masc/androgynous but the idea looking completely masculine was terrifying??? But I’m probably not gonna do any hrt until I start university this fall because my parents are like crazy lol



Have you thought about just getting an androgynous hair cut and maybe some masc/gender-neutral clothes? That's how I started out way back when I was in high school and didn't even know trans guys were a thing.


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## uboa

For context: I'm a gay trans man living with a really transphobic Cuban family. I'm not gonna go into details but they're not supportive at all.

I'm unsure what to do considering I want to start testosterone as soon as I turn 18 this October but they don't think I have the capability of making decisions for myself and will guilt trip me and probably cut off financial support if I leave them. I have a job and I struggle with like really severe gender dysphoria. I'm unsure how to progress in my transition- they've said in the past all my family will leave me and stop loving me if I start testosterone, but it's the only thing I'm looking forwards to and it's keeping me sane. I could probably go live with someone else, but I don't know if I've been rejected or accepted by any of the universities I applied to so my future is so unstable right now. I just want to finally feel at home in my body. I'm probably gonna be able to start t I'm just nervous ig


----------



## cannedcommunism

SublimeDonut said:


> Figuring out a label that fits oneself feels so unimportant and meaningless tbh. I mean, I respect people who want that, but I can't help but wince when I come across an LGBT post that features like 50 different labels. Sounds even more menial when it comes from someone my age who like me, has no idea who they're attracted to, so with each new person they make out with, they pick up a different word for themselves.


I really feel you there. technically you could consider me a cis gay man but I don't see the point in excessive labels since I don't date anyways and things honestly might change. I understand that sometimes people want to make sense of their attraction/gender so labels may feel comfortable, but for me they've always felt constraining because there's almost always an exception. besides, not much of my identity is based around my attraction anymore so there's just no point.


----------



## Feferily

Howdy! I’m a trans enby who doesn’t quite understand their orientation but is fine with being that weird bi aro-ace bean. I haven’t been around others in the community much anymore thanks to discourse and toxicity on tumblr and Twitter and ... yeah! I tend to stay away from things like that now.... So how’s everyone doing?


----------



## Lovi

Actually, I too stopped using twitter and tumblr because they seemed highly toxic to me, I had too many negative interactions in both spaces to keep myself using them, and isolated myself to what I knew best which was one person I was closest friends with in the end. 

I consider myself aro-ace, and I was told by said person that I should be careful being honest about that on any platform because its been treated with so much severity and exclusion lately, but, I just really don't feel the need to hide after leaving those negative places behind to be honest, so... I am also gender-fluid, and prefer using they/them pronouns online.


----------



## Feferily

Lovi said:


> Actually, I too stopped using twitter and tumblr because they seemed highly toxic to me, I had too many negative interactions in both spaces to keep myself using them, and isolated myself to what I knew best which was one person I was closest friends with in the end.
> 
> I consider myself aro-ace, and I was told by said person that I should be careful being honest about that on any platform because its been treated with so much severity and exclusion lately, but, I just really don't feel the need to hide after leaving those negative places behind to be honest, so... I am also gender-fluid, and prefer using they/them pronouns online.


Yes, this is a big mood. The exclusion around aro/ace identies was wild but the outright hatred I received sometimes was even more wild. But thankfully on forums like this, things never get heated, or all that!


----------



## deleted

Oh, I didn’t even know that this thread existed!

Well, since I’m deeply closeted at home and stuck because of quarantine, I’d like to say it: I’m bisexual.

I‘m a bisexual cis female (she/her). My problem is that I go to Catholic high school in the southern USA. I’m sort of out at school to friends. My primary friend group consists of two aces, two bisexuals, two genderfluid people, and a trans male, all closeted except for one of the other bisexuals.

In fifth grade, I found myself liking girls, but since I didn’t know anything about LGBT identities I just ignored it. In seventh grade, I had a huge crush on a girl and a guy at the same time. My feelings for the guy faded and I wondered if I was a lesbian. During this time I thought people were either gay or straight (I was not taught about anything LGBT at home or at school). In eight grade, I started dating a cis male and thought that I was straight again for a bit, but soon rediscovered feelings for girls during my relationship with him. We broke up right before high school began. He ended it and I was a bit relieved. Freshman year of high school, I met one of my best friends, a closeted trans male named *Devon (name changed). He came out to me and taught me a lot about LGBT things. One day out of curiosity he asked me what I was and I said that I was straight, but with enough hesitation and uncertainty for him to question my answer. I explained my past experiences with feelings and he said, “Oh, you’re definitely bi.” Suddenly everything made sense. I never knew about the concept of bisexuality before then. I didn’t even know what the LGBT acronym stood for before then. Through the first few months of school I had little crushes on both boys and girls before meeting my boyfriend.

I‘m a junior in high school now. I’ve been with the same guy for two years and four months. Despite only having been in straight relationships with cis males, I’m still bisexual. It is so comforting to know that there was nothing wrong with me. I hope to go to college in a more LGBT-friendly state so that I don’t have to hide it anymore. My parents don’t know and I don’t plan on telling them anytime soon. 

That was long. I’m sorry. I needed to get that out. Thanks for reading!


----------



## mizzsnow

uboa said:


> For context: I'm a gay trans man living with a really transphobic Cuban family. I'm not gonna go into details but they're not supportive at all.
> 
> I'm unsure what to do considering I want to start testosterone as soon as I turn 18 this October but they don't think I have the capability of making decisions for myself and will guilt trip me and probably cut off financial support if I leave them. I have a job and I struggle with like really severe gender dysphoria. I'm unsure how to progress in my transition- they've said in the past all my family will leave me and stop loving me if I start testosterone, but it's the only thing I'm looking forwards to and it's keeping me sane. I could probably go live with someone else, but I don't know if I've been rejected or accepted by any of the universities I applied to so my future is so unstable right now. I just want to finally feel at home in my body. I'm probably gonna be able to start t I'm just nervous ig


I'm in the same spot, I need hormones to feel more comfortable with myself but my parents don't approve so I just started it without my parents knowing 
I started hormones in secret with the intention of moving out before my family can see any noticable differences, I'm 2 months along and they haven't said anything about it yet... 
Anyway you should save up if you haven't done so already I chose not to use my parent's insurance and seeing someone plus getting the prescription costed me a lot more than I thought it would be ):


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## Lucky22

Oh this seems cool! I'm a nonbinary lesbian myself i go by they\them pronouns and overall not lots of people would ever be supportive of me irl lol but that's okay in general already used to being the odd one out since like birth haha if anybody wants to chat that'd be epic!


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## Eirrinn

Ive recently been thinking i might be genderfluid, sadly my friends aren't very supportive about it lol
If anyone has some genderfluid stuff to share with me please let me know! cuz im very alone on the topic


----------



## Que

Not something I've actually, well, TALKED about in detail, but I haven't ever heard of anyone with quite the same issue, and I always fear the responses if I try to talk it out with other LGBT+ people.

I've identified as FtM trans and gay (so into boys) ever since I was 10 (I'm 19 now). I've fully looked, behaved, thought like I was just a cis guy to the point of forgetting I wasn't sometimes. My whole family knows, my friends know, and while not all have been supportive it's just been a fact of life for a while.

Not too long ago (about 1-2 years) I kind of gave up on claiming to be gay because let's be fair; I'm not. I've dated more girls than the rest combined and my excuse was that they were an "exception" each time, so that's an absolute lie. I just decided to give up on labeling that one.

HOWEVER, MY ISSUE is that ever since I moved away from my family, I've been sort of.. confused? I'm familiar with my name Nicklas, my birthname still bothers me, but I don't want to be confined to only dressing and looking and liking masculine things. My favorite color is pink, I want to grow my hair long again (it's shoulder length now, hurray!), I want to wear skirts and dresses sometimes - sometimes, I like using make-up and I'm fond of my nails and want to put stuff on those too, I just want to be... a girl? I guess. My current boyfriend has been super kind and even though it must look like madness from the outside, he's been great about it. But I'm not sure what I am? Would that mean that I am not, in fact, trans and therefore can't transition? I still feel the same. I still view myself as a man, but it's confusing lmao;; 

My biggest fear is probably having to "come out" again as genderfluid. Until now I've just told people I'll look however I want without their input, but it's still scary thinking some of them might assume I'm just doing it to look cool with the kids and it sucks ><


----------



## nintendofan85

Aeri Tyaelaria said:


> IDK why I'm doing this but IG it's because of the length of time I've been away and how I am as a person and how I identify has changed a lot over the years, even to the point of sparking controversy within the community.
> 
> I consider myself Genderfluid (I am male, but sometimes I like to "be" female) and have wrestled with this decision since I was a kid, For the longest time I just considered myself cis with female tendencies. I guess I always avoided finding a.. "LBGT" identity due to how I came to perceive the community, it's "loud majority" and it's methodology of getting it's point across, it's the same thing with why I only came out as a furry last year whilst being one for at least 7 years. I've usually found it difficult to include myself in a community where I've seen the whole "we don't discriminate" but is also very toxic and can be fairly pushy (When I used to interact with those within a few LBGT online communities they would spend days, even weeks, trying to push me into identifying as trans when I do not see myself that way, even to the point of vilifying me as a "Self hating trans"). Obviously I know this doesn't apply to everyone/everywhere which is why I finally came out with it all, but it doesn't help people who're trying to come to terms with their identities that there are a lot of places which do force this kind of stuff.


I can honestly relate with this even though I've never identified as anything other than my birth sex (male), because of a sexuality standpoint-I'm bisexual and a lot of us bisexuals have faced judgement in the LGBT community, especially us bisexual men...


----------



## fallenchaoskitten

Que said:


> ...HOWEVER, MY ISSUE is that ever since I moved away from my family, I've been sort of.. confused? I'm familiar with my name Nicklas, my birthname still bothers me, but I don't want to be confined to only dressing and looking and liking masculine things. My favorite color is pink, I want to grow my hair long again (it's shoulder length now, hurray!), I want to wear skirts and dresses sometimes - sometimes, I like using make-up and I'm fond of my nails and want to put stuff on those too, I just want to be... a girl? I guess. My current boyfriend has been super kind and even though it must look like madness from the outside, he's been great about it. But I'm not sure what I am? Would that mean that I am not, in fact, trans and therefore can't transition? I still feel the same. I still view myself as a man, but it's confusing lmao;;
> 
> My biggest fear is probably having to "come out" again as genderfluid. Until now I've just told people I'll look however I want without their input, but it's still scary thinking some of them might assume I'm just doing it to look cool with the kids and it sucks ><


You can still be trans and do/want those things. You don't have to be genderfluid just because even though you feel yourself as male, you enjoy the stereotypical gender norms of a women.

Pink was originally for boys and blue for girls. Blame Hitler for making them flip-flop. (... no, really)

Guys have long hair. A lot of hot guys have long hair I might add. 
Fabio is the big old name for this iconic look. Jason Momoa for more modern take. 
The hottest guy I have EVER went on a date with (like on a 10pt scale he was a 100. Idk how someone like him can just be real honestly. No I don't have a photo T^T) had long hair... he was a metalhead tho so that is sort of a given? #headbangers

Several cultures there are men who where skirts and dresses... though, usually they don't call them that BUT THAT IS WHAT THEY ARE. Lookin at you kilts. lol

Make-up is a new things modern cishet men are dipping their toes into. "If women can do it, so can I!" ... also, I know it is NOT the same thing as trans, but drag queens. Several of them are not trans and some are straight males at that. Fabulous makeup.

My uncle is pretty cishet male redneck. We talkin beer bellied, gun lovin with them all over the house, fishin all the time kind of guy... he will go get manny-peddies. He likes how it feels. Though, he will get clear on his nails and SOMETIMES colors on his toes.

ANYWAYS, my point is, you can still be trans/a guy if you do, want, act out of "societies norm" for a guy.
BUT, if later you feel that genderfuild just fits better for you, wear it. ^-^


----------



## Que

fallenchaoskitten said:


> You can still be trans and do/want those things. You don't have to be genderfluid just because even though you feel yourself as male, you enjoy the stereotypical gender norms of a women.
> 
> Pink was originally for boys and blue for girls. Blame Hitler for making them flip-flop. (... no, really)
> 
> Guys have long hair. A lot of hot guys have long hair I might add.
> Fabio is the big old name for this iconic look. Jason Momoa for more modern take.
> The hottest guy I have EVER went on a date with (like on a 10pt scale he was a 100. Idk how someone like him can just be real honestly. No I don't have a photo T^T) had long hair... he was a metalhead tho so that is sort of a given? #headbangers
> 
> Several cultures there are men who where skirts and dresses... though, usually they don't call them that BUT THAT IS WHAT THEY ARE. Lookin at you kilts. lol
> 
> Make-up is a new things modern cishet men are dipping their toes into. "If women can do it, so can I!" ... also, I know it is NOT the same thing as trans, but drag queens. Several of them are not trans and some are straight males at that. Fabulous makeup.
> 
> My uncle is pretty cishet male redneck. We talkin beer bellied, gun lovin with them all over the house, fishin all the time kind of guy... he will go get manny-peddies. He likes how it feels. Though, he will get clear on his nails and SOMETIMES colors on his toes.
> 
> ANYWAYS, my point is, you can still be trans/a guy if you do, want, act out of "societies norm" for a guy.
> BUT, if later you feel that genderfuild just fits better for you, wear it. ^-^


Not gonna lie, means a lot to get a positive response ;-; I want to do whatever I want to do, and it took a lot of courage to go out and buy pink clothes, cute sweaters and even a skirt (haven't dared to buy a dress yet, but I want to). I still see a LOT of negativity around transgender people not fully appearing masculine/feminine but I really haven't changed a bit in how I behave or think, I just like cute things too. Thank you for answering me and giving me amazing examples from around you how I can still be me and it wouldn't be too weird - I'll absolutely keep that close to heart! It's almost weird being assigned female at birth and then struggling with people looking down at me for liking cute things, almost ironic, but kinda my fault for working so hard to appear hyper-masculine for so many years and then switching it up on the dot lmao

(Also that hot guy sounds like a literal dream, WELL DONE)


----------



## Veestah

Popping in to say what a wonderful thread.

I'm a demimale nonbinary person. 
I came out about 4 years ago or more, and it's been a developing adventure, coming out a little later in life. I was what, 28? I'm 32 now. 
There's a lot of soul searching and doubting myself, but at the end of the day I just want to be comfortable being and presenting as myself and my gender, whatever it feels like that day.


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## Jared:3

Would just like to start off by saying I'm gay but I unfortunately have to hide it from my family members due to some being religious and since I'm the only male in my family and the only sibling my parents, grandparents, all expect me too carry the name, have a wife, and have kids but that's not what I want. Eventually they will find out but I'm waiting until I'm 18 later this year just so that I feel more confident coming out knowing I'm an adult.


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## Antonio

Jared:3 said:


> Would just like to start off by saying I'm gay but I unfortunately have to hide it from my family members due to some being religious and since I'm the only male in my family and the only sibling my parents, grandparents, all expect me too carry the name, have a wife, and have kids but that's not what I want. Eventually they will find out but I'm waiting until I'm 18 later this year just so that I'm more coming out knowing I'm an adult.


I was gonna do that when I was 18 but not i'm 19 and here I am.


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## f11

Lucky22 said:


> Oh this seems cool! I'm a nonbinary lesbian myself i go by they\them pronouns and overall not lots of people would ever be supportive of me irl lol but that's okay in general already used to being the odd one out since like birth haha if anybody wants to chat that'd be epic!


 non binary lesbians are the most powerful


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## Lucky22

f11 said:


> non binary lesbians are the most powerful


Hehe thanks a bunch! This put SUCH a big grin on my face when i read this lol


----------



## Cwynne

Hello! It’s quite late at night so I might end up updating this post when I’m a bit more articulate but I just really wanted to jump in here I guess. 

I’m currently still living with my parents and am a pansexual ftm trans guy. My parents aren’t particularly supportive (it’s a very taboo thing in my house, and for them I’m not allowed to transition in pretty much any way, change my name, cut my hair, etc until I’ve moved out) so I look very much like a girl. it absolutely sucks. I have to live with being called my deadname on a daily basis, even my boyfriends slip up and refer to me as she/her occasionally (i know they mean well, and I’ve been with one for three years and the other six months).

Albeit being very assured in my FTM identity, I still love some typically very feminine things (“just being gay” as I chalk it up to). It’s become an odd thing, though, because although I feel like I love wearing makeup and floofy cosplay dresses it’s sort of... clashed? I almost am not sure if I actually still like those things due to the fact that I’m constantly afraid to be open about that for fear of the questions of “but I thought you were trans” “didn’t you want to be a boy” etc. I try to reason myself in that cis men can wear eyeliner and skirts and no one necessarily questions their gender identity as much (not an attempt to generalize, as that i have not experienced that personally it may very well just be how I feel) if they just identify as gay.

I very often feel like I’m just waiting for the ability to actually live my life. I’m afraid to meet new people and have to go through the whole “well actually” when I need to explain the fact that I am, indeed, a trans man. 

I’m working as much as I can (quite a feat in the current times) and trying to save up to move out of my parents home, but until then... it’s hard. It’s difficult. At times it has felt impossible. Looking in the mirror and not seeing who you know you are is bewildering. Feeling constantly ashamed of your body and even the simplest curves in the shape of your face is downright frustrating. Trying to explain it to people is embarrassing. 

I’m not sure how many people will actually end up reading through all of this (bless you if you have, I know it must be very stream-of-consciousness and possibly a bit confusing) but if you’re a young trans or gender non-conforming person, I want you to know that it’s not just you. You’re not alone. It’s normal to feel like you’re a contradiction sometimes. It’s normal to doubt yourself. It doesn’t mean you’re a “faker” or anything like that. You are who you are. People will almost definitely try to tell you who they think you are, but at the end of the day, the only person who can decide that is you.

If anyone needs anything, I’m around. I’ll listen. I’ll give you advice if I have it. Just pop me a PM—I’ve been through a lot of LGBTQ+ related stuff. And I’m always open to answering questions.

	Post automatically merged: Apr 29, 2020




cannedcommunism said:


> I really feel you there. technically you could consider me a cis gay man but I don't see the point in excessive labels since I don't date anyways and things honestly might change. I understand that sometimes people want to make sense of their attraction/gender so labels may feel comfortable, but for me they've always felt constraining because there's almost always an exception. besides, not much of my identity is based around my attraction anymore so there's just no point.



I get that. I always feel so dumb when I pull out multiple labels identify myself for fear of being pinned to the whole “snowflake” stereotype.

Part of the whole amalgamation of labels (I guess mine could technically be polyamorous pansexual genderqueer or non-conforming transgender man? which is a ridiculous mouthful for me, I’m fine with saying I’m trans and ending it at that if asked) is that I find a lot of cishet people don’t process the whole “that’s just who I am” thing. There needs to be a label for them. Their definition of a trans guy is one thing, and because I may deviate from that, I must be something else. It’s not always necessarily malicious, either. Maybe I’m struggling to communicate the concept at this particular point in time, but hopefully that’s at least somewhat understandable.


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## Santana

Hi Guys! This may not be the most conventional place to share this, but currently I need your help. Here in Puerto Rico, government is trying to pass a bill that strips LGBTQ+ couples of their rights and acknowledges conversion therapy as the parents right. The government strategically did so in a times where most of us are at home, so we cannot protest. I would really appreciate it if you guys could look over at this petition, it could save a life. Thanks!









						Sign the Petition
					

¡No al Nuevo Código Civil!




					chng.it


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## necrofantasia

i honestly completely despise myself for realising i was straight after so long and wasn't as interested in women as i thought i was.
i feel like i'm not supposed to be in any way happy about it.


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## Santana

necrofantasia said:


> i honestly completely despise myself for realising i was straight after so long and wasn't as interested in women as i thought i was.
> i feel like i'm not supposed to be in any way happy about it.


Figuring out your sexuality is generally s very hard and confusing process . Don’t need to be so hard on yourself, its okay to realize who you are


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## Seastar

I'm really nervous about this but okay...

Firstly, I've decided I'm asexual. I have social anxiety that mostly affects me talking to strangers in person. I also cannot imagine myself ever falling in love with another human being. 


Spoiler: ...



Did you notice I said "human being"? That's because of something I noticed about myself. I get obsessed over fictional characters who are usually not human. I've never been obsessed with a real person. Only fictional. Like Pokemon, Kirby, etc. I may actually be bisexual but apparently I'm not attracted to humans, so does it even matter? I've been too afraid to tell anyone this part because I think I sound insane.


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## necrofantasia

Santana said:


> Figuring out your sexuality is generally s very hard and confusing process . Don’t need to be so hard on yourself, its okay to realize who you are


i've been crying about it quite a bit, i feel like an outsider or traitor i guess.


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## Santana

necrofantasia said:


> i've been crying about it quite a bit, i feel like an outsider or traitor i guess.


I am part of the LGBTQ myself, and I can assure you, you are not a traitor. Hang in there, it may not be today, but one day this will blow


----------



## Cancoon

I'm not sure where I lie in terms of gender but I've been going with non-binary she/her, they/them
I am somewhere on the asexual spectrum and I think I'm straight!

I have a boyfriend of 9 years, we tried being in a poly-amorous relationship with a woman but it didn't work out for many reasons and I realized I'm not very interested in women sexually.

When I discovered that I'm ace, it was hard on my bf especially since when we first started dating, my libido was different due to us being in high school (puberty and all that LOL). I still worry that I'm not enough for him and vice versa. However, we're powering through since we love each other greatly.


----------



## MyLifeIsCake

I feel like I don't have a sexuality until I start dating someone.


----------



## Neb

About three years ago I came out as bisexual to my moms. They were very accepting, which was a nice contrast from my intolerant rural area. More recently I realized pansexual describes me better and decided to stick with that.


----------



## Goop

I'm hella tired of 'acting' straight honestly. Like being in a straight relationship feels so draining in comparison to a queer or a homosexual one, because then you gotta deal with all the straights and cis who can be real ignorant, sexually conservative, unfun, and they feel safe confiding in you because they think you're straight so they can express their sometimes toxic opinions.


I high key feel like a lot of my queer friends don't believe I'm pansexual because I'm cis and not wildly flamboyant.


----------



## seularin

glad i found this thread! >< ( i’m a girl c: )

my parents are heavily against LGBTQ, so i’ll have to keep up the straight act. they’re expecting me to get married and give them grandchildren. i consider myself pansexual, since i have that mindset of ‘love who you love’. i’m currently dating two girls! i’ve never thought weird of poly relationships; it’s just having extra everything: “i love you” and hugs <3 i have a few friends who support me, which i’m very thankful for. however, i did have a hard time trying to let go of the ones who left me. i’m okay now though; i just need to find the right time to come out to my closeminded parents :’)


i also have this feeling where i want to be male, but still be classified as female; though i feel uncomfortable when i’m called either. a friend of mine said that i may be non-binary. i’m still confused and trying to sort these out!


----------



## virtualpet

Might as well pop in here, hey 

We're a system that mostly identifies as nonbinary and presents as such collectively, though we all have differing genders and sexualities. A majority of us for gender are xenogender and for orientation are aspec and/or multispec (medusan too). Most of us also use microlabels individually as well as neopronouns (they/them gets confusing as a system). 

We're pretty much one of those weird queers who over-analyzes their identity and uses terms that most people don't get and appears as fluffy, but we're pretty open about it and willing to discuss it provided people are polite


----------



## windloft

My parents are heavily supportive of LGBTQ+ and have raised me well regarding that : they want me to be happy and comfortable with my identity, on top of being a good person. 

I've come to terms with being bisexual and being comfortable with it, on top of my boyfriend being bi himself. I've always been more conflicted over my gender identity though : I present myself as a cisgender woman, but I never felt any strong feelings towards my gender and who I really indentify as. I just couldn't ... care, to do so, maybe? I feel comfortable not being of a particular indentity, so I might be what they call ... 'nonbinary-fem', if that's correct? I'm pretty new to gender identity, ha.


----------



## limiya

This thread makes my heart so happy! I am a bisexual woman and I have been with my girlfriend for almost four years now! I am not out to my parents due to being from a VERY conservative religious desi background, but this can be very difficult at times because me and my girlfriend have been talking about getting married recently, but she is also from a super conservative religious family and it makes it difficult for both of us. Both of our sets of parents have been thinking that we are “just roommates” (how CJ and Flick of us, amiright) for all these years, but we take everything one step at a time. This community has been such a pleasure to be a part of and I just love the love and passion of this thread.


----------



## DinosaurDumpster

I'm asexual and aromantic. I never really knew until the 7th grade, when me and some other friends were talking about it. I can't tell my family because of our religious background, and I would probably get kicked out and wouldn't support at all. Haven't even thought of coming out because I'm just too scared of what my family would think about it.


----------



## kelpy

ok so context: i’m a trans guy and i’ve been out for 4 years and started medical transition about... 2 1/2 years ago. i know, i’m lucky
i feel so so self conscious and invalidated by my own interests. i don’t like societal expectations of masculinity and will gladly express that.
but for some reason i can’t just let myself be feminine sometimes. or i’m not allowed to enjoy art, cute things, i even stopped wearing what i really like a long time ago.
i’m a small guy. cute stuff fits me well.
one time a couple years ago i bought a skirt. i wore it once, and had fun and liked experimenting (and let’s be honest skirts are way more comfortable than pants.)
anyway i felt so guilty for liking it. i never wore it again, and haven’t had fun with clothing like that since.
i feel guilty for enjoying conventionally feminine things. really guilty. like i’m not a real trans person if i don’t stay super masculine all the time. 
it sucks. i don’t really think it’s from the community either, it’s mostly from me.
anyhow, anyone have the same experience? i feel lowkey alone haha


----------



## Veestah

Lythelys said:


> i feel guilty for enjoying conventionally feminine things. really guilty. like i’m not a real trans person if i don’t stay super masculine all the time.
> it sucks. i don’t really think it’s from the community either, it’s mostly from me.
> anyhow, anyone have the same experience? i feel lowkey alone haha



I'm a demiguy and I feel you. I got top surgery almost 2 years ago. 
I feel invalid if I enjoy a feminine outfit from time to time. It's like, "hello, you're nonbinary. you can do what the heck you want with your presentation" But I still feel partially like I'm betraying a part of myself somehow?


----------



## MarshyMellow

I'm Panromantic, Demisexual, and Genderfluid, though I prefer male identifying people, and to be referred to as a male.
I go by Marsh Jacob Winchester.


----------



## jeni

this is a lovely thread full of lovely lovely people 

[edited bc i'm shy but i'm ]


----------



## Bread Kennedys

I'm bisexual, which is something I've discovered about myself recently. For the longest time, I convinced myself I was simply straight cause I had more of a preference towards women anyway, but I've found myself being attracted to dudes a lot more easily recently. I also really enjoy crossdressing, which isn't just an LGBT thing as I've seen straight people do it too but I know there's a large amount of crossdressers in the LGBT community so I sorta wanted to mention that as this seems like a fairly appropriate place to do so, being a haven/safe space for LGBT people.



kelpy said:


> ok so context: i’m a trans guy and i’ve been out for 4 years and started medical transition about... 2 1/2 years ago. i know, i’m lucky
> i feel so so self conscious and invalidated by my own interests. i don’t like societal expectations of masculinity and will gladly express that.
> but for some reason i can’t just let myself be feminine sometimes. or i’m not allowed to enjoy art, cute things, i even stopped wearing what i really like a long time ago.
> i’m a small guy. cute stuff fits me well.
> one time a couple years ago i bought a skirt. i wore it once, and had fun and liked experimenting (and let’s be honest skirts are way more comfortable than pants.)
> anyway i felt so guilty for liking it. i never wore it again, and haven’t had fun with clothing like that since.
> i feel guilty for enjoying conventionally feminine things. really guilty. like i’m not a real trans person if i don’t stay super masculine all the time.
> it sucks. i don’t really think it’s from the community either, it’s mostly from me.
> anyhow, anyone have the same experience? i feel lowkey alone haha


I don't think you need to feel guilty for enjoying feminine stuff as a trans man! Being somewhat feminine doesn't all of a sudden invalidate you as a trans man. What you wear doesn't dictate what gender you are. One of my buddies is a trans woman but she does wear stuff sometimes that's traditionally more on the masculine side, doesn't make her any less of a woman. Just wear what you feel comfortable in, wear what you like wearing, don't let anyone tell you otherwise or judge you for it either.


----------



## celesludenberg

I’m a pan ace which is kind of new to me because up until recently I identified as bi but am trying to open up more to calling myself pan. I also like to be more feminine presenting or gender neutral and even though I am female at birth I don’t really consider myself to have a gender. Just me. So hello!


----------



## Blueskyy

I think the most important label a person can have is human. Each human has so many intricate layers beneath the surface but we are all human at the core. I love that every human is different from another and each layer that they have had a story behind it as well. If only society as a whole understood the concept!


----------



## cloudmask

love this thread! good vibes to all. i'm a nb (genderfluid) lesbian. been struggling with my gender identity for a long time and still am tbh. i'm out to my family as a lesbian and they're very cool with it, but i probably won't come out as nb. for me personally, the lesbian part of my identity is much more important and frankly something that they need to know, since i am gonna end up marrying a girl one day lol

god i love girls


----------



## tanisha23

I'm pansexual, but usually use the label bisexual b/c I know labels are supposed to help people understand who you're interested in. I know now people are more familiar with pansexuality, but, b/c I know it may be confusing to understand to some, I usually go with bisexual so that they get a general idea of who I'm interested in without any confusion (if they happen to ask).

I've always known but refused to accept it until I was about 18, probably thanks to people getting more accepting of different sexualities over time. I was deathly afraid of admitting it to myself and constantly tried to talk myself into believing that the thoughts I was having had nothing to do with me liking girls.

I sometimes still struggle with being bisexual b/c I know it in some communities, bisexuality is not accepted as a sexuality and some people believe you need to just "choose one." Despite the fact I know that it's not true, sometimes in my head I think, "what if I'm just some poser?"

I'm only out a very few people, and I've decided that there's no point of coming out to some people. I guess I view "coming out" more as "inviting in." Since it took me so long to accept my "closet," the way I see it is that I worked very hard to make this closet a comfortable place for me to be in, and I don't see the point in coming out to people who would just trample all over the things that I struggled so hard to finally accept. I "invite" people into my closet when I feel comfortable with them, and if I know they wouldn't give me **** over something that took me a long time to accept. I guess my closet is a sacred place, and there's no need for some people to be allowed in if they aren't going to respect it.


----------



## SleepyMimeko

I'm a hetero-romantic ace. It's difficult at times because the majority of people don't understand why I'm this way, and others don't even think a person like me exists. I do though. Much love to my fellow aces. ❤


----------



## FRANS_PLAYER

I’m bisexual. It took me a while to figure it out, but I had subtle crushes on female cartoon characters that I didn’t realize were crushes until I was older - having crushes on girls in the real world is rarer for me because I usually know them and don’t look at them that way as much, but I had a wild crush on my girl best friend, and on another girl now. Gradually, I’m drifting closer and closer to girls. I came out in the 7th grade to friends, but first I came out to the other bisexual girl in the grade. It was nice to tell people. My family is homophobic/transphobic and my own father has said things like, “Gay marriage shouldn’t have been legalized” “There is no point in gay marriage” (He says that the point of marriage is to reproduce, but gay people can’t do that, so therefore there is no point) I asked him about bisexuality (For context, I pretend to be a Trump supporter but I really hate him, so my dad has no clue how I really feel) He said he had a woman friend who said she was bisexual, but in the end she married a man, so he was basically saying you have a preference (Yeah, Dad, that’s kinda the point, not all people are perfectly balanced!) and that bisexuality doesn’t exist. It makes me sad, because my parents gave me a great childhood, but if I come out in the future, they may not support me. Sorry for all this heavy stuff, it was nice to get it off my chest.


----------



## moonbox

cloudmask said:


> love this thread! good vibes to all. i'm a nb (genderfluid) lesbian. been struggling with my gender identity for a long time and still am tbh. i'm out to my family as a lesbian and they're very cool with it, but i probably won't come out as nb. for me personally, the lesbian part of my identity is much more important and frankly something that they need to know, since i am gonna end up marrying a girl one day lol
> 
> god i love girls


i really relate to this! i'm pan and p genderfluid but honestly i think i've been leaning towards women at this stage of my life. and i'm still weird about discussing my gender identity. like if i can tell people aren't open to it i won't bring it up. i guess gender is more low priority for me and my identity?


----------



## Stella-Io

Ooh cool a thread to discuss things like this yes

I say I'm pan (thou I kinda question it which I will get into later) thou I'm only out to my sister and strangers on the internet lol. Idk how both of my parents will react to me comin out, esp when they think I'm super straight. They literally do not suspect me of dating people who aren't guys. I've had 1 bf. That's it. I don't discuss crushes with them, and I've never had a gf. I would love to date someone that isn't a cis guy next time I date. I tell myself I'll come out to my parents when I'm dating someone who isn't a cis guy, but that has never happened. It's been literal years now. Like, 3 atleast. It doesn't help that I don't actively seek people to date either. I've had a single crush since then, but I never asked to date them.

I realized my sexuality pretty late. In my junior year of high school I finally realized I was attracted to people's personality, not gender identity, but I thought maybe I was just bi. I still questioned this until my senior year of high school when I had a huge crush on this girl, who was also my first girl crush. Later I learned of pansexual, which I was mistakenly told meant attraction to personality.

Still in my senior year of high school I'm finally using social media and I gain a much bigger understanding of sexuality and gender orientation.

Now this is where I question my sexuality. 



Spoiler: Can I be pan with a preference?



I know I am attracted to people's personality, but this is where I question if I am truly pan or bi. To my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong, bi means attraction to two or more genders. Pan means attraction to all (?) gender identity. I find myself more attracted to personalities of people who are more feminine, softer, less harsh or just not a cis guy, but that isn't to say I won't ever date more masculine personalities or cis guys. I have a preference, but I'm not sure if pan people can have a preferences or if that instantly invalidates me of being pan. I also have yet to hear of a sexuality that definitely says 'you are this sexuality because you have attraction to personalities regardless of that person's gender identity'.


----------



## lyradelphie04

I identify as a bisexual woman,

When I was a freshman high schooler, I believed myself to be pansexual as I don't really apply gender when I'm noticing aspects of a person. But a very close friend of mine at the time told me that being pansexual is a phase and that I'm just a bisexual who wants to feel special. This is why I only describe myself as bi, even though I feel my sexuality and the way I find myself attracted to a person correlates more with being pan.

@Stella-Io I feel like I almost understand what you're coming from on preferences. I tend to be attracted based on the person's level of attractiveness (shallow, I know, but hopefully I'll grow out of this as I age) with no regard to gender. But I do tend to be into more feminine personalities with a more masculine physique. I'd say you're definitely allowed to have a preference, it doesn't invalidate you. Just like bisexuals can prefer to date men but still consider themselves bi and vice versa. I think your definition of "you're this sexuality because you have attraction to personalities regardless of a person's gender identity" is a perfect way to describe being pan.


----------



## Santana

happy pride month yall!


----------



## seularin

i've been dealing with stuff since pride month began. my parents are keeping me inside; not for quarantine, because they don't want me to 'learn from the lgbt ways' or whatever? it's honestly pretty stupid, and i'm still afraid of telling them about my sexuality--i mean they're planning out my whole future right now, and a lot of it is making so many assumptions that I'm straight. i know they mean well, but i just can't bring myself to tell them.

now about pridefall; i'm getting more insecure, and I keep forgetting to put my social media accounts on private, so i'm constantly getting hate dms + gore videos. my friend has had to report to the police because some homophobe had been sending multiple death threats, so i really need to get off the internet.


----------



## acnh.eclipse

seularin said:


> i've been dealing with stuff since pride month began. my parents are keeping me inside; not for quarantine, because they don't want me to 'learn from the lgbt ways' or whatever? it's honestly pretty stupid, and i'm still afraid of telling them about my sexuality--i mean they're planning out my whole future right now, and a lot of it is making so many assumptions that I'm straight. i know they mean well, but i just can't bring myself to tell them.
> 
> now about pridefall; i'm getting more insecure, and I keep forgetting to put my social media accounts on private, so i'm constantly getting hate dms + gore videos. my friend has had to report to the police because some homophobe had been sending multiple death threats, so i really need to get off the internet.


Oh man! That’s tough, do you have anyone to talk to about your problems? I do identify as a straight woman (I’m literally pregnant)! Anyway just wanna let you know YOU ARE accepted <3


----------



## seularin

acnh.eclipse said:


> Oh man! That’s tough, do you have anyone to talk to about your problems? I do identify as a straight woman (I’m literally pregnant)! Anyway just wanna let you know YOU ARE accepted <3


ahh thats so kind   i've been struggling with it for a while now, so hearing that makes me happy ;; i do have a couple of friends that i could talk to, but it's just pretty tough since i can't see them atm </3


----------



## Metal Scorpion

While I know I'm either pan or ace, which I use interchangeably, recently I'm having a bit of an identity confusion.


----------



## Lady Timpani

Metal Scorpion said:


> While I know I'm either pan or ace, which I use interchangeably, recently I'm having a bit of an identity confusion.


Ah if it helps you feel any better I can understand this perfectly.  Recently I've been questioning again as well because I'm honestly not sure if I'm attracted to men or if I feel like I _should_ be. Try not to stress too much about finding the perfect label for yourself. Besides, you could be both!


----------



## Rubombee

Here we go, I'm finally posting in this thread!

…So, it's pretty obvious from my avatar for anyone who knows most LGBTQIA+ flags ;p
But I'm a nonbinary demiromantic ace lesbian! (yes i know it's kinda long lmao, but i find it funny how i've got four whole flags)
Another funny thing: up until a bit more than a year ago, I knew nothing about this part of my identity! But then, after wondering about being ace for probably at least one month and a half, I stumbled into a Discord server that helped me bloom into the person I am today. And I'm very grateful for all the lovely people in it! <3

Also, when I first found out I was nb, I had a very clear idea of my gender; but it seems like after this discovery, my gender felt too overwhelmed by the possibilities and it had an existential crisis — cause rn i just have, no idea what it is lmao
And if you've read my user title you've probably noticed, but in addition to they/them I have neopronouns I've made up myself! It's a mix of she and they, and while I'm not sure about actually asking people irl to use them, I still like them a lot :3


----------



## shion

bisexual aromantic feels right but sometimes i still get confused


----------



## Celinalia

oh gosh i hope my mom doesn't see this, she's on this forum lmao i'm not out yet

so i'm still kinda wondering if i'm bisexual or a lesbian? i definitely like girls, no question! but i'm unsure about the boys part. i do find a lot of boys cute/handsome but i would never want to have anything romantic/sexual with them. when i picture my future, i always picture myself with a wife. but when i was younger, i had a lot of crushes on boys. and i do find some boys attractive but only the ones that are unavailable to me (celebrities, gay, in a relationship) so i don't know if i just feel obligated to like boys and henceforth choose the unavailable boys.. 

okay sorry for my identity crisis right here i'm gonna click send now


----------



## pitchtheripoff

Celinalia said:


> oh gosh i hope my mom doesn't see this, she's on this forum lmao i'm not out yet
> 
> so i'm still kinda wondering if i'm bisexual or a lesbian? i definitely like girls, no question! but i'm unsure about the boys part. i do find a lot of boys cute/handsome but i would never want to have anything romantic/sexual with them. when i picture my future, i always picture myself with a wife. but when i was younger, i had a lot of crushes on boys. and i do find some boys attractive but only the ones that are unavailable to me (celebrities, gay, in a relationship) so i don't know if i just feel obligated to like boys and henceforth choose the unavailable boys..
> 
> okay sorry for my identity crisis right here i'm gonna click send now


tbh i feel the same way about girls
i think i'm attracted to them but i never really wanted to do anything with them romance-wise, unlike boys which i would basically die for.
it's extremely confusing but i think i'm getting it together, and i hope you do too! it's always hard to figure this stuff out so i honestly don't blame you.
i call myself bisexual panromantic and yet i feel like i could be just gay


----------



## nintendoanna

i just wanted to share that i luv women ;; that’s all have a great day everyone LOL

	Post automatically merged: Jun 20, 2020



limiya said:


> This thread makes my heart so happy! I am a bisexual woman and I have been with my girlfriend for almost four years now! I am not out to my parents due to being from a VERY conservative religious desi background, but this can be very difficult at times because me and my girlfriend have been talking about getting married recently, but she is also from a super conservative religious family and it makes it difficult for both of us. Both of our sets of parents have been thinking that we are “just roommates” (how CJ and Flick of us, amiright) for all these years, but we take everything one step at a time. This community has been such a pleasure to be a part of and I just love the love and passion of this thread.



aw this really hits hard for me. i’m also from a religious family; my parents are immigrants from ukraine so they have a traditional mindset. i cant even imagine being out to them; i was dating a girl for over a year and they had no clue lol they just thought we were bestfriends—i mean a pro to that is all the sleepovers ! haha. but wow 4 years! you gotta be strong for that and i hope things work out where u can be yourself around your family. good vibes


----------



## ReanimatedSorceress

Wanted to revive this thread and say that it's totally ok to change your labels as you learn more about yourself and grow. Many of us didn't really get the chance to know our real selves at a young age in any way.

I identified as agender for a few years before coming to the realization that I was actually rejecting gender entirely because I didn't understand my own. I am not saying this is the case for all Non-binary people, but it was in my case. Turns out I was a trans woman all along, though I do still attach the Non-binary label to myself as well. Your gender, your sexuality, and every other descriptor about yourself is mutable as you grow and learn and experience, please don't let anyone ever take that away from you.


----------



## DeltaLoraine

Celinalia said:


> oh gosh i hope my mom doesn't see this, she's on this forum lmao i'm not out yet
> 
> so i'm still kinda wondering if i'm bisexual or a lesbian? i definitely like girls, no question! but i'm unsure about the boys part. i do find a lot of boys cute/handsome but i would never want to have anything romantic/sexual with them. when i picture my future, i always picture myself with a wife. but when i was younger, i had a lot of crushes on boys. and i do find some boys attractive but only the ones that are unavailable to me (celebrities, gay, in a relationship) so i don't know if i just feel obligated to like boys and henceforth choose the unavailable boys..
> 
> okay sorry for my identity crisis right here i'm gonna click send now



I'm was in the same boat! I had crushes on boys when I was young, but whenever I learned that the feelings were mutual I would run and hide and avoid them at all cost. Idk what was wrong with me...I think maybe I just liked them a lot as friends and didn't want things to go further? But I loved being around them and wanted to be close, so it was a strange thing to figure out for myself.
Now that I'm in college I've realized all the times I've had crushes on girls in my past, and I find myself way more attracted to them than I do guys. Even in my head, I picture myself with a wife way better than I do a husband. But part of me can't deny that I've liked guys before. So even though I believe I'm a lesbian, I feel deep inside that I must acknowledge my past, so now I'm a fully expressed bisexual (I just consider myself more of a gay bi than a straight bi). 

And I totally get the parents thing. It can be really scary to open up after they've known you as straight this whole time.I came out to my mom first because I expected her to accept me, but turns out she doesn't think bisexuality exists....So then i got too nervous to tell my dad who in the past has been a very traditional man. But after 4 more months, I managed to get enough courage to tell him about my sexuality, and he accepted me wholeheartedly! He was proud of me for telling him and was happy that I found out who I was. I literally cried haha. Needless to say, there's a reason I'm closer to my dad than my mom now


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Rosie Moon said:


> I’m an asexual cis woman married to a demisexual cis man. Possible TMI, but we pretty much have no s** life because neither of us are really interested in it. As a result, people our age (and even some family members) have given us advice on how to ‘fix it’. Some people act shocked and even accuse me of ‘depriving’ him. It really bugs us, because we have a really happy relationship and we genuinely love each other, but apparently none of that matters because there’s no s**. Ugh. >_>


Stuff like this is why I'm so afraid to go into a relationship with someone because I feel like that's expected. I've mentioned here before but I'm ace so if I ever started dating someone then they wouldn't get anything like that from me. I haven't yet met anyone who legitimately wants to be w me and I'm slightly scared that I'll just be alone forever lol T___T


----------



## Bread Kennedys

NoUsernameHere said:


> I'm bisexual, which is something I've discovered about myself recently. For the longest time, I convinced myself I was simply straight cause I had more of a preference towards women anyway, but I've found myself being attracted to dudes a lot more easily recently. I also really enjoy crossdressing, which isn't just an LGBT thing as I've seen straight people do it too but I know there's a large amount of crossdressers in the LGBT community so I sorta wanted to mention that as this seems like a fairly appropriate place to do so, being a haven/safe space for LGBT people.


Update: It turns out I'm not just a crossdresser after all! I'm a trans woman and I feel more comfortable with talking about this now. I've been thinking it for awhile, even back when I made the crossdressing comment but I never felt comfortable with talking about it. Question: should I come out to my mom about this? I know my dad wouldn't be very accepting, but I was wanting to know if it's worth trying to talk to my mom about it. I used to think she was very transphobic but after recent interactions with her, I'm not so sure what she thinks and feels. Is there anything I can do to determine if I should talk to her about this?


----------



## Cosmic_Crossfade

Vrisnem said:


> *Mar 27 2020:
> Plenty of new users have joined The Bell Tree lately and among them I've already interacted with many members of the LGBT+ community so giving this thread a formal bump. *
> 
> A support thread that lacks support is simply sad. Love is love. Let's celebrate it and encourage one another; not tear each other down. In the words of the iconic RuPaul Charles: "If you can't love yourself, how in the hell are you going to love somebody else?"
> 
> *This thread will operate on a no aggression policy.
> 
> That means:*
> 
> 
> No insulting, swearing at, or otherwise talking down to other users. This is meant to be a supportive environment. People should not be scared to post for fear of being outcast. I'm sure we've all faced enough of that in our lives. We don't need it here too.
> Understand that the LGBT+ community in different areas of the world, and of different age groups, may use different terminology. What may seem like a slur to someone may be completely harmless in another user's local LGBT+ community. Unless the person is quite obviously using a word as an insult, try to keep discussion about word choice polite.
> Do not discriminate against or make negative generalisations about particular groups of people regardless of race, age, sexual orientation, gender identity, etc. Think: do you like it when people do that about you?
> Respect that if a staff member asks you to cease posting certain content to then immediately stop doing so. Take up any disagreements you may have with us via the *Contact The Staff* board or via PM, thank you.
> And finally, yes, *all users are welcome to post in this thread* regardless of how you identify.
> 
> *If you don't feel you can abide by these terms then please do not post. Disagreements are not a reason to instigate WW3. This is meant to be a supportive environment, so let's keep it so. In some cases it is wiser to agree to disagree. If you feel yourself getting angry I strongly advise you to take a break from your computer for an hour or so before replying - or simply to not respond at all. Users who repeatedly try to disturb the peace will be dealt with. Please use the Report Button rather than directly engaging obvious trolls or aggressive users yourself.*



This is a very precious thread  Sending love and light to everyone here!


----------



## seulty

—i’m a proud pan, and i’m vv lucky to have accepting parents

today marks the day since i came out to my parents 2? 3 years ago and everything’s been easier since then, i don’t have to hide my feelings anymore


----------



## FrogslimeOfficial

Eep, I wish I could magically change my parents' minds about, well, almost everything so I could just come out and not worry about being outed.
Also, since I can't really be bishrekual irl, I like to reference that I am a lot online, but sometimes I feel like I'm forcing it onto other people.


----------



## Rubombee

NoUsernameHere said:


> Question: should I come out to my mom about this? I know my dad wouldn't be very accepting, but I was wanting to know if it's worth trying to talk to my mom about it. I used to think she was very transphobic but after recent interactions with her, I'm not so sure what she thinks and feels. Is there anything I can do to determine if I should talk to her about this?


Well, I don't know if I have much advice to give, but I think the most important thing is making sure you're safe before you do anything. If you know that you can be safe even if your mom ends up being unsupportive, then maybe instead of coming out all of a sudden, you could try to bring up the subject a few times first? I do realize it's easier said than done, but if you could know a bit more about her opinion on trans people it'd help you decide whether you want to come out to her.


----------



## Bowie

I never really formally came out to my parents. They always knew, and one time they caught me talking with a boy and interpreted it as me being gay, so it just kind of went from there. But it was a taboo subject and it was just easier for them to be oblivious towards my personal feelings. They always loved me for who they thought I was rather than who I really was.

I still haven’t said it, but I don’t think I need to. I left home in October 2018 and since then have gradually minimised communication. I’m hopeful someday things will be different but these days I don’t have time to deal with their ignorance and abuse.

But boy! How this thread has changed. I remember talking about being genderqueer for the first time and being berated for triggering people with that word, but I think that’s still how I feel? I get dysmorphic from time to time, but I owe a lot to my bisexual ex-boyfriend for showing me it’s possible for someone to love every side of me, whether that’s masculine or more effeminate.


----------



## ReanimatedSorceress

I'm also on the "never came out to my family" train and most likely I never will, about either my gender or sexuality. It's just better for my safety and well-being if I don't. It makes me happy to at least see so many in this thread have been able to experience that positively.


----------



## Bread Kennedys

Rubombee said:


> Well, I don't know if I have much advice to give, but I think the most important thing is making sure you're safe before you do anything. If you know that you can be safe even if your mom ends up being unsupportive, then maybe instead of coming out all of a sudden, you could try to bring up the subject a few times first? I do realize it's easier said than done, but if you could know a bit more about her opinion on trans people, and it'd help you decide whether you want to come out to her.


Well, miraculously I got an answer out of my mom despite only asking an LGBT-related question once. She said she would never kick any of her children out over something like that, and she thinks it's ultimately harmless despite not really understanding it. So I've pretty much got my answer. Thank you! I'm gonna try to come out to her as soon as I feel ready. 

And yeah, I understand why a lot of you would never come out to your parents. I'm lucky that I have my mom, at least, but a lot of parents still unfortunately have crappy mindsets on the subject. I hope you all are able to grow and blossom one day like the beautiful flowers you are! And if any of y'all ever need to vent or want someone to talk to about these sorts of topics, my VMs/PMs/Discord DMs are always open~


----------



## ReanimatedSorceress

Vent time? Vent time

I've been feeling more dysphoric than normal recently. I don't really know why, I get gendered more correctly at work even by customers than I ever have (I blame the mask lol). I just sort of always feel like no-one takes me seriously as a woman. I feel like even my friends are so attached to my previously perceived androgynous identity and I'm not sure what I have to do for people to shake it. I'm starting HRT soon, and I feel like that will help for sure, but I don't want people to wait until it's more convenient or it makes more sense to them to treat me as the person I am.


----------



## deleted

FrogslimeOfficial said:


> Eep, I wish I could magically change my parents' minds about, well, almost everything so I could just come out and not worry about being outed.
> Also, since I can't really be bishrekual irl, I like to reference that I am a lot online, but sometimes I feel like I'm forcing it onto other people.



I have the same problem! I’m so closeted at home that I end up talking about being bi way too much at school with friends and online. I don’t want to be annoying about it, but I can’t help it. It’s really hard to repress a part of myself that I’m so proud of, especially since I’m hiding it from loved ones at home. I don’t think I’ll ever tell them, at least not while I’m living with them. I’m not sure how they’d react and I do NOT feel like taking that gamble.


----------



## Bread Kennedys

NoUsernameHere said:


> Well, miraculously I got an answer out of my mom despite only asking an LGBT-related question once. She said she would never kick any of her children out over something like that, and she thinks it's ultimately harmless despite not really understanding it. So I've pretty much got my answer. Thank you! I'm gonna try to come out to her as soon as I feel ready.


Update: So I came out to her and...it went really well! She accepted me with no problems. I actually wanted to cry when she did, haha. Needless to say I see myself getting very close with my mom now. Although, she wants me to eventually tell my dad before I start estrogen. I guess I will eventually, my mom at least said she has my back and will be there with me when I decide to come out to him. So there's that at least. 



ReanimatedSorceress said:


> Vent time? Vent time
> 
> I've been feeling more dysphoric than normal recently. I don't really know why, I get gendered more correctly at work even by customers than I ever have (I blame the mask lol). I just sort of always feel like no-one takes me seriously as a woman. I feel like even my friends are so attached to my previously perceived androgynous identity and I'm not sure what I have to do for people to shake it. I'm starting HRT soon, and I feel like that will help for sure, but I don't want people to wait until it's more convenient or it makes more sense to them to treat me as the person I am.



_hugs_ Dysphoria seems to be like depression in a sense where we have it in waves, sometimes it's not as bad as other times. At least for me, that's how my depression is anyway, and that's sorta like my experience with dysphoria too. Side-note: having dysphoria on top of depression is not very fun. If it's any consolation, although this is coming from an internet person, you're absolutely by all means a woman. A queen, even. I'm happy to hear you're starting HRT soon at least! Like I said, if you ever need someone to talk to, my PMs/VMs/Discord DMs are always open <3


----------



## -Lumi-

I am a lesbian. I’ve clicked into this thread a dozen or so times and thought about posting but always end up leaving. I’m out to some friends but not to my family/wasn’t out when I was working. I go through periods of being okay/fine with my sexuality and other times where it drives me absolutely batty and I wish I could be straight. It can be hard sometimes but right now I’m feeling okay about it which is why I’m posting now.


----------



## ReanimatedSorceress

NoUsernameHere said:


> Update: So I came out to her and...it went really well! She accepted me with no problems. I actually wanted to cry when she did, haha. Needless to say I see myself getting very close with my mom now. Although, she wants me to eventually tell my dad before I start estrogen. I guess I will eventually, my mom at least said she has my back and will be there with me when I decide to come out to him. So there's that at least.
> 
> 
> 
> _hugs_ Dysphoria seems to be like depression in a sense where we have it in waves, sometimes it's not as bad as other times. At least for me, that's how my depression is anyway, and that's sorta like my experience with dysphoria too. Side-note: having dysphoria on top of depression is not very fun. If it's any consolation, although this is coming from an internet person, you're absolutely by all means a woman. A queen, even. I'm happy to hear you're starting HRT soon at least! Like I said, if you ever need someone to talk to, my PMs/VMs/Discord DMs are always open <3



I appreciate that, a lot, I've just been working too much to respond to anything.

I don't want to comment without contributing something to the thread, and I just had a conversation with a friend that's relevant to the topic; I think it's strange that people haven't accepted that sexuality is as nuanced , if not more nuanced, than gender. I know multiple people who struggle because they assign themselves a label but don't quite fit into it 100%. For example, a friend who is attracted primarily to men but occasionally a girl and feels at odds with his identity as "gay", not experiencing the attraction to women often enough to want to use "bi". I don't think it's important that you find a label that matches you completely. I think it's more important that you find a label that makes you comfortable with. Hope this helps someone.


----------



## Bread Kennedys

ReanimatedSorceress said:


> I appreciate that, a lot, I've just been working too much to respond to anything.
> 
> I don't want to comment without contributing something to the thread, and I just had a conversation with a friend that's relevant to the topic; I think it's strange that people haven't accepted that sexuality is as nuanced , if not more nuanced, than gender. I know multiple people who struggle because they assign themselves a label but don't quite fit into it 100%. For example, a friend who is attracted primarily to men but occasionally a girl and feels at odds with his identity as "gay", not experiencing the attraction to women often enough to want to use "bi". I don't think it's important that you find a label that matches you completely. I think it's more important that you find a label that makes you comfortable with. Hope this helps someone.


I personally felt this for a long time. I thought I might be bi in high school as I was attracted to a guy in my class (I identified as a male at the time) but after awhile I eventually thought I was just straight cause I felt more attraction to women and most guys I didn't seem sexually attracted to. But it's also totally possible to be bi and just prefer one sex over the other. For example, I'm bi but very lesbian leaning, but I will gladly date a guy if I find one I really like and find attractive. I have stricter tastes in guys, that said, but at the end of the day sexuality is all about preferences. I hope this also helps someone who might be on the fence, I know it helped me when I realized this.


----------



## oak

Well I thought it was about time to post here considering some people thought I was cis-male which is totally fair but I am definitely not. I identified as purely male for years but now I find myself sitting comfortably on the non-binary spectrum. Almost feels freeing just saying "idk" when people ask me my gender. I hate talking about gender with people in real life because I'm terrible at getting my words out and if someone if aggressively asking me questions I get flustered. I want to have calculated intelligent responses but I just get heated haha.

Guys at work used to ask me all the time "are u a boy or girl lol" but now they know I get sassy quick so they stay away from me. Even strangers on the street have approached me asking about my gender which gets scary considering it's always men. Some people think I'm a male and some think I'm a woman & I correct no one. It's complicated cause so many of my male family members work at the same place as me and everyone loves to talk ****. It's a strange existence not being able to reinforce male or neutral pronouns at work but most of them can't even handle the idea of a butch lesbian. So many lesbian jokes at work and they aren't even creative. If it was funny I could laugh but it's just old school ignorance.

tl;dr I'm non-binary and use he or they pronouns depending what's easiest for you. And I'm bisexual but I've known that for so long I don't even think much about it anymore. 

Thanks if you actually read all that lmao.


----------



## Theoneandonlymegan

I’m not entirely sure what I am because I might be bisexual but I’m still not sure. Like I know I like guys that’s not the issue, I’m just not sure if I’m attracted to girls or if I’m just admiring them because they are really pretty. And then I ask myself yeah but do you want to kiss them kinda thing or just be that pretty and I don’t really know. For now I just tell everyone I’m straight and have not actually said anything about this in real life


----------



## Marte

Finding a lot of comfort in this thread, you are all some brave souls my fellow LGBT+'s.♥

I'm one of the late bloomers. Went my whole teens thinking I was asexual, because the thought of being gay never really came to mind. All I knew was that males didn't strike my interest. It wasn't until my late teens that I actually was like… ah. At this point I had been attracted to girls for years, but I mistook the feelings for admiration. What I was worried about was my lack of attraction towards men. I thought something was wrong with me for sure, and even played with the thought of getting therapy as it was recommended to me after talking to several people about my lack of attraction towards my boyfriend at the time. Now I'm just like.. _what_? Therapy? What was I thinking? Did I seriously consider therapy before I realized I was gay?

Time went by, and I started to understand that I indeed was attracted to females. Just knowing that alone was a great comfort, but also a horrible feeling. I was still in the closet, and felt like I was hiding my true self. Which I was. As the years went the feeling got worse, and I didn't feel like anyone really knew me. I wish that wasn't something I felt, because after coming out I realized that you're still you. Nothing about you changes besides one little fact, and in my case that was my sexual preference. But still, you don't really feel free in your mind.

Last year, at the age of 23, I came out to my friends and family. And if I could use one sentence to describe the feeling of coming out, it would this sentence from the movie Love, Simon: _You get to exhale now. _I finally got to exhale the breath that I'd been holding in for years, hiding who I was. It was relief. The support from the people in my life was overwhelming, and I felt more loved that ever. Of course, I didn't expect everyone to accept me, but love won over hate. Some of the hate even came from me, as I struggled to accept myself for not being like the others. I didn't know anyone from the LGBT+ community and felt alone. This is something I still struggle with, which is a shame. But I know that it will get better with time. Coming out is something I have never regretted.

This turned into a long post… but this is a topic I don't really talk about, so it felt good to share.♥


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## xSuperMario64x

being ace in a society like this is so draining, almost excruciating.


----------



## Lothitine

I,, might come out to my family soon because I think I have my identity figured out
But for everyone online who I’ll come out to first~ 
*drumroll pleeease*

I am non-binary!I seriously thought I was a lesbian for a good 3 years tho


----------



## Rubombee

Lothitine said:


> I am non-binary!I seriously thought I was a lesbian for a good 3 years tho


Ayyy!! you can be both btw. but if you don't feel like a lesbian anymore that's also totally valid


----------



## frenchip

still not 100% sure what i am, though what i usually go back to is asexuality. i feel like i might be ace, but i've also never been in a relationship nor interested in having one, so i'm always second guessing myself. but then again, i'm only in my teens, maybe i am too young to know now. oh well, i suppose time will tell (and i'm not really in a rush to figure out my identities).


----------



## Lady Timpani

Just wanted to pop back in and say I'm glad this thread is thriving and that so many people are having such positive coming out experiences. After I graduated high school I didn't really have any LGBT friends, and I think that contributed to negative feelings I already had about my sexuality. I haven't really been able to talk about it with anybody in a long time, and I'm still kind of leery about it tbh, but it's always nice to come on here and see people doing well and being themselves. So thank you guys a lot for that.


----------



## Alienfish

Been sometime I posted here, but I've been reading thru a lot of your posts and sending hugs to you all <3

Also coming to a conclusion, so far, that I definitely feel/define more as bi rather than pan and stuff. By no means excluding anyone, more like people have been using me as their personal shrinks about LGBTQ+ issues and being rude about it also and yeah that's nothing I would want in a relationship. Listen and understanding is one thing but yeah constantly doing that, no.

Also I read back on the beyond/free of gender stuff and I can kinda relate to that in another way.. I feel kinda lonely but am I the only one feeling like it's okay to use any pronoun and stuff? Like I usually go by she cause I'm comfy these days with being a cis female but I don't mind/care if people use he/they etc. which has happened irl and online. By no means meaning to devalue anything or anyone that has to do with gender/pronouns, they are definitely important!


----------



## xSuperMario64x

sheilaa said:


> Also I read back on the beyond/free of gender stuff and I can kinda relate to that in another way.. I feel kinda lonely but am I the only one feeling like it's okay to use any pronoun and stuff? Like I usually go by she cause I'm comfy these days with being a cis female but I don't mind/care if people use he/they etc. which has happened irl and online. By no means meaning to devalue anything or anyone that has to do with gender/pronouns, they are definitely important!


I also don't really mind what pronouns people use for me. despite being a cis female I've had many people call me he/him and it honestly doesn't bother me. I actually think it's kinda funny/cute, like one time I had someone on this forum call me "mr mario" and I thought that was just great lol.


----------



## Alienfish

xSuperMario64x said:


> I also don't really mind what pronouns people use for me. despite being a cis female I've had many people call me he/him and it honestly doesn't bother me. I actually think it's kinda funny/cute, like one time I had someone on this forum call me "mr mario" and I thought that was just great lol.


Yeah I'm like the same way, I'm comfy with people doing both he, they or just she so I don't bother correct them. And yeah this was mostly when I had more neutral username because yeah sheila(a) is kinda giving it away lol but yeah i'm glad im not 100% lonely.

	Post automatically merged: Aug 10, 2020

Also if anyone wants to talk absolutely feel free to reach out here or on discord


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## Lothitine

I was the same way before I figured out I was nb 
It honestly made me happy when ppl ‘misgendered’ me-
I still don’t rlly care what pronouns ppl use tbh lmao


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## Alienfish

Lothitine said:


> I was the same way before I figured out I was nb
> It honestly made me happy when ppl ‘misgendered’ me-
> I still don’t rlly care what pronouns ppl use tbh lmao


Yeah, I don't feel nb or stuff but it's like, people can use what they want for me and I don't rly care and stuff. if they wanna use he or just my sheila username that is fine. (id rather not give away my real name bc it makes me uncomfy also)

and yeah i can kinda relate, not because nb but it was nice people did use he/they cause sometimes i had really giving away avatars tho neutral username and i dont want people stuck into one to use for me either.


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## saucySheep

Thank you for this. 

I believe I may be asexual, idk if that's part of the LGBTQ community officially, but sometimes I worry that someones gonna ask me on a date and i'll be all like asbdbaibd iwa what no pls no


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## Rubombee

egocentricHollybush said:


> I believe I may be asexual, idk if that's part of the LGBTQ community officially


It absolutely is! Those who believe otherwise are unnecessarily gatekeeping ;p


----------



## Lothitine

Rubombee said:


> It absolutely is! Those who believe otherwise are unnecessarily gatekeeping ;p




	Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020

So I was putting laundry up and remembered a tip from Instagram that the only safe way to do homemade-binders is 2 sports bras so I tried it while putting up laundry and had a little fashion show for my cat, who blinked happily at me and purred  it made me super happy!! 
But I had to take it off when I finished putting up clothes bc my siblings would IMMEDIATELY be nosy and figure it out :/but my cat thought i looked good so 

	Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020

*Also I feel like my lungs are about to ****ing DIE*


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## FrogslimeOfficial

Lothitine said:


> Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020
> 
> So I was putting laundry up and remembered a tip from Instagram that the only safe way to do homemade-binders is 2 sports bras so I tried it while putting up laundry and had a little fashion show for my cat, who blinked happily at me and purred  it made me super happy!!
> But I had to take it off when I finished putting up clothes bc my siblings would IMMEDIATELY be nosy and figure it out :/but my cat thought i looked good so
> 
> Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020
> 
> *Also I feel like my lungs are about to ****ing DIE*


Oh, please be careful when binding! I don’t have any personal experience but I even heard if it hurts maybe you should loosen a little.


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## Lothitine

FrogslimeOfficial said:


> Oh, please be careful when binding! I don’t have any personal experience but I even heard if it hurts maybe you should loosen a little.


Yeah I probably should’ve- I only was binding for like 10 minutes but it’s been kinda uncomfortable??


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## Alienfish

Lothitine said:


> *Also I feel like my lungs are about to ****ing DIE*


yeah, be careful and sorry about your lungs ;; hope you find a way to do it though!


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## oak

Lothitine said:


> Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020
> 
> So I was putting laundry up and remembered a tip from Instagram that the only safe way to do homemade-binders is 2 sports bras so I tried it while putting up laundry and had a little fashion show for my cat, who blinked happily at me and purred  it made me super happy!!
> But I had to take it off when I finished putting up clothes bc my siblings would IMMEDIATELY be nosy and figure it out :/but my cat thought i looked good so
> 
> Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020
> 
> *Also I feel like my lungs are about to ****ing DIE*


Be careful when binding! Torturing yourself is not a good plan for the long run. I understand wanting immediate results but I had to give up on my binder and move to 1 well fitted sports bra to relief a lingering ache in my ribs. Me and my partner have dealt with binding for over 9 years now.

It's hard to think about the future when you are only 13 but if you want to bind for years to come, don't force yourself to sit there in pain! Especially if you are going to be exercising or needing full lung capacity. Maybe consider wearing just 1 sports bra for most of the time unless you can get a proper binder designed to minimize damage to your chest.

Sorry for lecturing you lol! I tried not to sound like an old man but it happened anyways.


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## Lothitine

oak said:


> Be careful when binding! Torturing yourself is not a good plan for the long run. I understand wanting immediate results but I had to give up on my binder and move to 1 well fitted sports bra to relief a lingering ache in my ribs. Me and my partner have dealt with binding for over 9 years now.
> 
> It's hard to think about the future when you are only 13 but if you want to bind for years to come, don't force yourself to sit there in pain! Especially if you are going to be exercising or needing full lung capacity. Maybe consider wearing just 1 sports bra for most of the time unless you can get a proper binder designed to minimize damage to your chest.
> 
> Sorry for lecturing you lol! I tried not to sound like an old man but it happened anyways.


It’s fine! Yeah i was kinda stupid but now i know to be more careful from now on!! it’s more uncomfortable than hurting but I’ve been coughing and my mom got worried so _~maybe that wasn’t a good idea on my part™~_


----------



## saucySheep

Rubombee said:


> It absolutely is! Those who believe otherwise are unnecessarily gatekeeping ;p


ty


----------



## lawnClippings

*slides in and sits*
I need to go make supper now, but I'll probably post something more meaningful later.

Um... hi! Everyone doing okay?
Trans man here who likes other men (trans or otherwise).


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## Lothitine

lawnClippings said:


> *slides in and sits*
> I need to go make supper now, but I'll probably post something more meaningful later.
> 
> Um... hi! Everyone doing okay?
> Trans man here who likes other men (trans or otherwise).


Hello! I’m good, how are you?


----------



## lawnClippings

So now that I have eaten... to add further... I'm also on the demisexual side of things. 
I didn't grow up in an environment where the LGBTQIA+ community was discussed a lot and didn't really figure out that I was trans and that there was an actual word/definition for what I was going through until much, much later. I knew I identified as male in middle school (someone asked me why I always chose male characters in Pokemon games, and I just simply replied with "because I am a boy"), but I did not know there was an actual word for it until maybe... junior year of high school and even then I did not actually come out until my 20's because of how my family is. There are still family members who do not know...
So if anyone is going through something similar, I would not mind listening. I don't know how well I am at giving advice, but I can try? I just mostly listen and let people vent/cry if they need to...



Lothitine said:


> Hello! I’m good, how are you?



That's good to hear.
I'm doing a lot better now that I've eaten. I was developing a hunger headache, but now it's all good.


----------



## Lothitine

lawnClippings said:


> So now that I have eaten... to add further... I'm also on the demisexual side of things.
> I didn't grow up in an environment where the LGBTQIA+ community was discussed a lot and didn't really figure out that I was trans and that there was an actual word/definition for what I was going through until much, much later. I knew I identified as male in middle school (someone asked me why I always chose male characters in Pokemon games, and I just simply replied with "because I am a boy"), but I did not know there was an actual word for it until maybe... junior year of high school and even then I did not actually come out until my 20's because of how my family is. There are still family members who do not know...
> So if anyone is going through something similar, I would not mind listening. I don't know how well I am at giving advice, but I can try? I just mostly listen and let people vent/cry if they need to...
> 
> 
> 
> That's good to hear.
> I'm doing a lot better now that I've eaten. I was developing a hunger headache, but now it's all good.


That’s cool! 
I’m non-binary and I can definitely relate a bit-
LGBTQ Stuff wasn’t rlly talked about (my aunt is a lesbian but my parents didn’t really explain what it was we just knew she had a girlfriend) 
I’m still scared to come out, but at the same time I know I’m safe because my family is pretty accepting, I’m just scared they won’t understand,, yknow?
Super nice to meet you!!


----------



## lawnClippings

Lothitine said:


> That’s cool!
> I’m non-binary and I can definitely relate a bit-
> LGBTQ Stuff wasn’t rlly talked about (my aunt is a lesbian but my parents didn’t really explain what it was we just knew she had a girlfriend)
> I’m still scared to come out, but at the same time I know I’m safe because my family is pretty accepting, I’m just scared they won’t understand,, yknow?
> Super nice to meet you!!



(Is that one of those fuzzy, twisty finger worm things in your profile pic?)
I know how you feel.
I have people on my step dad's side who are part of the LBGTQIA+ community (they're* lesbians), but when it comes to the gender identity side of the community none of them think it's real or if they do, they think it's people with mental issues.
My mom's side of the family is religious and don't hide that they think it's a sin so there is that.
And I don't talk to my biological dad's side of family for multiple reasons.
My mom knows, but doesn't understand sometimes.
So totally understand where you are coming from with being worried they won't really understand.

Nice meeting you, too.

(small edit: "they're" not "their" blasted typos. I start typing fast and make simple mistakes)


----------



## xSuperMario64x

so this Sunday is National Coming Out Day and that reminds me... I haven't actually "come out" to my parents or friends irl. to be honest I've never really felt a need to do it before but now as an adult I would like to be taken seriously as a member of the LGBT+ community. 

the things is I have no clue how they will react. identifying as ace/apothi, I'll probably have to explain every single detail to them and that'll just make it extremely uncomfortable for me. but I feel like if they were aware of me being ace they (especially my mom) would be more accepting of the fact that I get really nervous/disgusted when talking about intimacy n stuff like that. my mom always came up with an excuse like "there is no reason at all to be embarrassed, it's a natural thing" and that honestly just makes me mad. if she knows that I'm ace/apothi maybe she will be more understanding and sensitive.

but idk, im afraid of coming out. theres no good time or good occasion or anything. I don't want it to be awkward.


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## Lothitine

xSuperMario64x said:


> so this Sunday is National Coming Out Day


holy **** it is??? 
also good luck! no matter how it goes remember ur super valid and amazing!


----------



## Corrie

Lothitine said:


> Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020
> 
> So I was putting laundry up and remembered a tip from Instagram that the only safe way to do homemade-binders is 2 sports bras so I tried it while putting up laundry and had a little fashion show for my cat, who blinked happily at me and purred  it made me super happy!!
> But I had to take it off when I finished putting up clothes bc my siblings would IMMEDIATELY be nosy and figure it out :/but my cat thought i looked good so
> 
> Post automatically merged: Aug 11, 2020
> 
> *Also I feel like my lungs are about to ****ing DIE*


I'm late to this but I've been following this Youtuber for many years. I know nothing about binding but I found this video to be pretty good on suggestions and safety.


----------



## Holla

I've only just recently realized that I'm asexual. I've definitely always been ace, I just never realized until recently that most people do experience sexual attraction, even though I don't/didn't. I'm 24 by the way. I do experience romantic attraction though which most people seem to misunderstand about aces. Sure some of us don't experience any sexual or romantic attraction, but you can definitely have one without the other like in my case.

I only figured out I was Ace from my most recent relationship. My partner was extremely sexual to the point I was pressured into things I did not want to do and I was uncomfortable/stressed in the relationship more than I was enjoying it. He tried to sound like he was fairly understanding when I told him I was ace, but he continued to push my boundaries and ultimately I don't think he believes in asexual being a true orientation. I broke it off about a month ago now and I've been feeling so much better. It's been like a huge wave of relief.

Thankfully my Mom has been really understanding since I've told her, especially since she's definitely not ace. I haven't told my Dad as I'm unsure how he'd respond to be honest, that and I don't really talk about real personal things like that with him normally.

I know people like to debate whether or not asexual should fall under LGBTQ+ but I try not to worry about that too much. I like to be accepted for who I am as an asexual. It doesn't have to be under a bigger community like LGBTQ+, though wider acceptance is always appreciated.

I recently read @Rosie Moon's post in this thread back in April about other people trying to "fix" her relationship as both her and her husband don't experience sexual attraction. It sucks that people feel the the need to butt into situations like this where they just don't understand. As a fellow asexual I can only dream of a relationship like hers. I'd be willing to compromise to an extent with someone who tries to be genuinely understanding and respectful of my boundaries, but the perfect scenario would definitely be to find someone who is also asexual. It would just relive all stress related to sexual related things in general.

Anyways enough about me, I'd like to say that I fully support anyone regardless of your sexual orientation or gender identity. I also won't pretend to understand how each of you feel because well I don't (unless you are also an asexual heteromantic person), but I will respect the way you feel and accept you for who you are.

Thanks for reading.


----------



## Corrie

Holla said:


> I've only just recently realized that I'm asexual. I've definitely always been ace, I just never realized until recently that most people do experience sexual attraction, even though I don't/didn't. I'm 24 by the way. I do experience romantic attraction though which most people seem to misunderstand about aces. Sure some of us don't experience any sexual or romantic attraction, but you can definitely have one without the other like in my case.
> 
> I only figured out I was Ace from my most recent relationship. My partner was extremely sexual to the point I was pressured into things I did not want to do and I was uncomfortable/stressed in the relationship more than I was enjoying it. He tried to sound like he was fairly understanding when I told him I was ace, but he continued to push my boundaries and ultimately I don't think he believes in asexual being a true orientation. I broke it off about a month ago now and I've been feeling so much better. It's been like a huge wave of relief.
> 
> Thankfully my Mom has been really understanding since I've told her, especially since she's definitely not ace. I haven't told my Dad as I'm unsure how he'd respond to be honest, that and I don't really talk about real personal things like that with him normally.
> 
> I know people like to debate whether or not asexual should fall under LGBTQ+ but I try not to worry about that too much. I like to be accepted for who I am as an asexual. It doesn't have to be under a bigger community like LGBTQ+, though wider acceptance is always appreciated.
> 
> I recently read @Rosie Moon's post in this thread back in April about other people trying to "fix" her relationship as both her and her husband don't experience sexual attraction. It sucks that people feel the the need to butt into situations like this where they just don't understand. As a fellow asexual I can only dream of a relationship like hers. I'd be willing to compromise to an extent with someone who tries to be genuinely understanding and respectful of my boundaries, but the perfect scenario would definitely be to find someone who is also asexual. It would just relive all stress related to sexual related things in general.
> 
> Anyways enough about me, I'd like to say that I fully support anyone regardless of your sexual orientation or gender identity. I also won't pretend to understand how each of you feel because well I don't (unless you are also an asexual heteromantic person), but I will respect the way you feel and accept you for who you are.
> 
> Thanks for reading.


I am so happy that you broke things off with your old partner. He definitely did not sound supportive at all and pressuring you into doing things you didn't want to do is so messed up. I'm not ace but I'm not as sexual as most people. My ex did the same thing, tried to guilt me into doing sexual things multiple times a week which was too much for me and then would sulk and make me feel guilty about not wanting to do it, instead making me do it that often just to please him. It was awful but I couldn't imagine your situation. Like you did, I ended things with him and have never felt more free. I'm glad you're feeling the same! 

You keep being you and I really hope you meet someone who respects you.


----------



## Hypno KK

xSuperMario64x said:


> so this Sunday is National Coming Out Day and that reminds me... I haven't actually "come out" to my parents or friends irl. to be honest I've never really felt a need to do it before but now as an adult I would like to be taken seriously as a member of the LGBT+ community.
> 
> the things is I have no clue how they will react. identifying as ace/apothi, I'll probably have to explain every single detail to them and that'll just make it extremely uncomfortable for me. but I feel like if they were aware of me being ace they (especially my mom) would be more accepting of the fact that I get really nervous/disgusted when talking about intimacy n stuff like that. my mom always came up with an excuse like "there is no reason at all to be embarrassed, it's a natural thing" and that honestly just makes me mad. if she knows that I'm ace/apothi maybe she will be more understanding and sensitive.
> 
> but idk, im afraid of coming out. theres no good time or good occasion or anything. I don't want it to be awkward.



I feel like I come out to people a lot less often as an adult? It's just something I don't think about very often and with people I don't already know I'm rarely in situations where it wouldn't be a random off-topic.

This said... maybe you could write them an email or something? That might make it easier to explain the terminology you're using and link them to resources to help them understand. You're right that if your parents are accepting, knowing this will probably make some of your interactions better.

Is there a reason why you're afraid? Do you think they'll take it badly?


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Hypno KK said:


> Is there a reason why you're afraid? Do you think they'll take it badly?


I just don't want it to turn into a 45 minute session where I have to try to make sense of being ace/apothi to my parents, whom are both straight. I don't think they would take it badly.


----------



## Hypno KK

xSuperMario64x said:


> I just don't want it to turn into a 45 minute session where I have to try to make sense of being ace/apothi to my parents, whom are both straight. I don't think they would take it badly.



I'm glad they'd probably take it well! I think that's always the hardest part of coming out. Personally, when I came out I didn't really mind explaining stuff but if this is stressful for you, I think a letter/email and some links or other resources could really help. Let us know how it goes if you decide to do it!


----------



## Alienfish

xSuperMario64x said:


> I just don't want it to turn into a 45 minute session where I have to try to make sense of being ace/apothi to my parents, whom are both straight. I don't think they would take it badly.


I don't think you owe them that either. I'd just explain to them what it means, and you can always try and answer their questions and/or ask them to read up themselves on the topic from proper sources  Best of luck whatever you decide on ❤


----------



## DinosaurDumpster

Well
time to officially come out as transgender on here (ftm)
This fall break i'm planning on starting transitioning. Planning on getting a male haircut and disguising it as a pixie cut so my mom will actually let me get it since she's a non-supporter and doesn't know i'm trans loll ;v;


----------



## ali.di.magix

xSuperMario64x said:


> -snip-


I wish you the best of luck, friendo! I hope your mum understands. I would stress to her that it is most definitely not a hormonal/physical/mental issue that can be "fixed", and maybe stress the definition of what a sex-repulsed ace is and hopefully that should explain to her why it's so uncomfortable talking about intimate things. I also feel that if I ever come out to anyone for that matter I'm going to have to be armed with information to the questions that will be asked lol.


Holla said:


> -snip-


I'm sorry that you had a bad experience in your past relationship </3 I'm happy for you that you broke it off, realising it wasn't right. I'm glad to hear that you're doing much better now 

--

Righto, this is my first time coming out to anyone for that matter so here we go I guess lol. I've been questioning for a long time now, but I finally feel like I've got a label that suits me. I'm an aromantic grey-ace, who is sex-positive. I very rarely experience any sort of romantic or sexual attraction, however I'm not indifferent to the idea of a romantic and/or sexual relationship. I think I have known deep down that I'm aro-ace for a long time, because in high school when everyone was going through that phase of rapidly developing crushes and/or relationships, I simply could not relate at all. To this day, I still cannot relate lol. Will I ever come out to anyone else...is another question altogether. Perhaps friends, but idk about family lol.

The only other thing that I'm questioning at the moment is when I feel attraction of any sort, who am I attracted to. I sorta fluctuate to feeling very straight, but also I feel that bi might suit me better at times   

Yeah my sexuality has now become confusing AF, but at least I feel comfortable with some labels that I feel that describe me well!


----------



## Lothitine

DinosaurDumpster said:


> Well
> time to officially come out as transgender on here (ftm)
> This fall break i'm planning on starting transitioning. Planning on getting a male haircut and disguising it as a pixie cut so my mom will actually let me get it since she's a non-supporter and doesn't know i'm trans loll ;v;


yay!! good luck!! ^^


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## moo_nieu

I've lurked this thread for a while, but never really felt comfortable posting.. I still don't tbh, but I'd like to be able to share how I feel with somebody. I don't really feel like I have any particular gender/sexuality; it's more of a changing thing for me (not one to the other, more like a spectrum). My family is very religious and pretty closed minded about gender/sexuality. I was raised to act like a "lady", although I never did (to my mother's dismay). Last December, I decided I wanted a really short hair cut, and my mom very hesitantly asked me if I was transitioning after I sent her a picture. I just wanted a badass haircut :c It made me feel so uncomfortable to think that I can't just have a simple change in style without such serious questioning. Maybe she was trying to be supportive, but her message seemed fearful, my parents aren't exactly thrilled about freedom of identity.. (I guess I'll never know for sure how that text was supposed to read). I've known that I've been attracted to multiple genders for around 8 years now, but I've never told my family (my friends and s/o know). I just don't want them to start treating me/thinking of me weirdly. Plus my mom is big on gossip. I'd rather just avoid being talked about to everyone about sensitive issues like this. I think my family sort of knows, but I haven't confirmed anything. They could have no idea, I'm really not sure. Anyways, it feels good to know that other people also experience changing feelings of identity. I sort of just shove my feelings aside and tell myself that I don't need to live based on my gender/sexuality, but I think I might just feel more comfortable hiding it (although it's not that comfortable i guess). Thanks for listening


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## xSuperMario64x

ace awareness week is coming up (Oct 25-31) and I'm really excited cause it's the first time I'll be celebrating it!

also still tossing around the idea of coming out to my mom ughugiufigu idk why I can't just do it lol
I guess she'll have to figure out in the coming week when I start wearing my ace flag pin all the time and I'm just chillin in my room ironing my ace flag bragging about how awesome it is to not experience attraction lmfao


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## Theoneandonlymegan

Theoneandonlymegan said:


> I’m not entirely sure what I am because I might be bisexual but I’m still not sure. Like I know I like guys that’s not the issue, I’m just not sure if I’m attracted to girls or if I’m just admiring them because they are really pretty. And then I ask myself yeah but do you want to kiss them kinda thing or just be that pretty and I don’t really know. For now I just tell everyone I’m straight and have not actually said anything about this in real life


Ok so it’s been a few months and there’s not even a doubt about it, I’m definitely bi. I ended up telling my friend group which already has another bi, a lesbian, and ace and also two straights so they were pretty chill. I’m kinda hardcore crushing on my friend (the other bi in the group) and we are currently trying to figure out how to approach things.


----------



## DaisyFan

Here I go...

I am aromantic asexual, aka aro-ace. I was in questioning for romantic orientation, whether I was biromantic or panromantic. Recently, I found out that I am aromantic, so I am not interested in having a partner. I've been ace for two years.

For gender, I am non-binary (agender) feminine. I maintain wearing feminine clothing, accessories, jewelry, and makeup (special occasions only), but I stay as genderless and enby.


----------



## Korichi

Hi everyone!! It’s so nice to meet everyone here!! ;7;

I’m proud to be asexual! I’m also demiromantic and panromantic! As for gender, I’m boyflux but also trans (ftm)!


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## Slaxmax

I'm proud to be a lesbian! Wish my girlfriend hadn't dumped me though haha xD

	Post automatically merged: Nov 21, 2020



Theoneandonlymegan said:


> Ok so it’s been a few months and there’s not even a doubt about it, I’m definitely bi. I ended up telling my friend group which already has another bi, a lesbian, and ace and also two straights so they were pretty chill. I’m kinda hardcore crushing on my friend (the other bi in the group) and we are currently trying to figure out how to approach things.


Congrats! Glad it went well. If you need/want to vent, you can always PM me about your situation with your friend


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## DinosaurDumpster

This week was trans awareness week. Since I didn't get my hair cut over fall break like I had hoped, I wanted to get a haircut this week because of trans awareness. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. Just got a bunch of donuts from my dad (i'm not complaining because it's free food, but still)
So I went with trying to lower my voice naturally since i'll be pre-T for a long time. Also been trying to gain more muscle but from the looks of it, it's not working ;v;

Also, it makes me so uncomfortable when my friends pat me on the head or use me as an armrest. It makes me feel super dysphoric because i'm so small and shaped like a girl. I've told them to stop so many times it's not even funny. They still do it, and i'm not sure what to do because i'm so small and defenseless. Another thing is, I have to go to an early-morning class before school that's all about Jesus because i'm being raised christian. The teacher showed us a video about LGBTQ+ rights or something... and I got so offended. It made me really upset that my parents were teaching me that being gay, lesbian, trans, was a sin. Another thing is, my mom thought my sister was lesbian and she got so offended because she thought my sister was. It infuriates me when people think like this. I've been counting the years ever since I was maybe 6 years old to move out of this house where I can't be my true self.


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## Slaxmax

DinosaurDumpster said:


> This week was trans awareness week. Since I didn't get my hair cut over fall break like I had hoped, I wanted to get a haircut this week because of trans awareness. Unfortunately, that didn't happen. Just got a bunch of donuts from my dad (i'm not complaining because it's free food, but still)
> So I went with trying to lower my voice naturally since i'll be pre-T for a long time. Also been trying to gain more muscle but from the looks of it, it's not working ;v;
> 
> Also, it makes me so uncomfortable when my friends pat me on the head or use me as an armrest. It makes me feel super dysphoric because i'm so small and shaped like a girl. I've told them to stop so many times it's not even funny. They still do it, and i'm not sure what to do because i'm so small and defenseless. Another thing is, I have to go to an early-morning class before school that's all about Jesus because i'm being raised christian. The teacher showed us a video about LGBTQ+ rights or something... and I got so offended. It made me really upset that my parents were teaching me that being gay, lesbian, trans, was a sin. Another thing is, my mom thought my sister was lesbian and she got so offended because she thought my sister was. It infuriates me when people think like this. I've been counting the years ever since I was maybe 6 years old to move out of this house where I can't be my true self.



Ugh. That really sucks. It's horrible to feel invalidated let alone having one's gender identity disregarded and hated. When I first came out, it was really difficult at home, too, and my parents made me feel so ashamed. I was seeing a therapist at the time, and I told him I liked girls and he tried to get me to like boys when my parents expressed concern. They thought it was a phase. But over time, hopefully people can change if given the chance. They're very accepting now, but often times don't understand certain things. So maybe you need to educate your peers and your parents about your feelings but also your experience overall. They might not understand and people fear what they can't understand. I'm really sorry you're going through this though.


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## Saylor

I realized I was a lesbian years ago but still go through periods where I feel intensely frustrated about it and I'm not sure why. When I figured out I liked girls I was so relieved and for the first time getting crushes on people made sense and felt good, but now oftentimes it just makes me upset. It's always been kind of an issue with my family, so that part hasn't changed, but sometimes it feels like it's getting harder for me to deal with this part of myself. I can't help but wonder what it'd be like to love a man and I try to force feelings whenever I meet one that I think maybe I could like. I've been reluctant in the past to tell people I'm gay because I was hanging onto the idea that maybe someday I won't be, and that makes me feel so guilty.

I think these feelings have really amplified in the past year so I'm hoping part of it is just quarantine kinda getting to me. Seeing lesbians who are out and seem happy and talking to other lgbt people when I was still on campus made me feel less isolated, and that helped a lot.


----------



## Slaxmax

Saylor said:


> I realized I was a lesbian years ago but still go through periods where I feel intensely frustrated about it and I'm not sure why. When I figured out I liked girls I was so relieved and for the first time getting crushes on people made sense and felt good, but now oftentimes it just makes me upset. It's always been kind of an issue with my family, so that part hasn't changed, but sometimes it feels like it's getting harder for me to deal with this part of myself. I can't help but wonder what it'd be like to love a man and I try to force feelings whenever I meet one that I think maybe I could like. I've been reluctant in the past to tell people I'm gay because I was hanging onto the idea that maybe someday I won't be, and that makes me feel so guilty.
> 
> I think these feelings have really amplified in the past year so I'm hoping part of it is just quarantine kinda getting to me. Seeing lesbians who are out and seem happy and talking to other lgbt people when I was still on campus made me feel less isolated, and that helped a lot.



Same here. I relate to literally everything you just said. It's really difficult to feel isolated as well as invalidated for your sexual orientation. I hate it too. I just wish that I could be straight sometimes so that dating would be "easier." I live in a pretty conservative area but my college is really liberal and a lot of people are queer. But the pandemic made everything virtual and I just transferred so it's been really difficult for me, too.  I'm sorry you're struggling, too.


----------



## Saylor

Slaxmax said:


> Same here. I relate to literally everything you just said. It's really difficult to feel isolated as well as invalidated for your sexual orientation. I hate it too. I just wish that I could be straight sometimes so that dating would be "easier." I live in a pretty conservative area but my college is really liberal and a lot of people are queer. But the pandemic made everything virtual and I just transferred so it's been really difficult for me, too.  I'm sorry you're struggling, too.


I feel that. It feels like such a big part of me now that it's weird to think about wanting to change myself, but whenever my friends talk about boys or a guy is interested in me I always end up wishing I could be straight so I wouldn't feel so different. I was always too scared to do anything about it when I had feelings for other girls, but quarantine has definitely made it even harder. It really sucks this is all happening after you just transferred too, I'm sorry it's been so difficult for you.  It already feels isolating and it's really hard not being able to be around people who might understand some of these things.


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## Slaxmax

Saylor said:


> I feel that. It feels like such a big part of me now that it's weird to think about wanting to change myself, but whenever my friends talk about boys or a guy is interested in me I always end up wishing I could be straight so I wouldn't feel so different. I was always too scared to do anything about it when I had feelings for other girls, but quarantine has definitely made it even harder. It really sucks this is all happening after you just transferred too, I'm sorry it's been so difficult for you.  It already feels isolating and it's really hard not being able to be around people who might understand some of these things.



Yea, me too. I couldn't imagine not being gay, but at the same time I wish that I was straight...also dating apps totally focus on straight coupling and that irritates me too xD I actually dated guys all throughout high school, but it was just me playing a part I thought my parents, especially my mom, wanted me to play.


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## MarshyMellow

Reading all of these posts makes me feel hopeful.
I'm scared to interact with people, online and off, because I don't look or sound very masculine, but more and more people have been calling  me he/him, and it has been boosting my confidence.
And the fact there are a tone of people like me posting here, makes me feel more safe to be me.


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## xSuperMario64x

ima go ahead and bump this:>

A few things:
1. I still haven't come out to my mom yet lmao. I really don't think she would understand how asexuality works (much less how being ace/apothi is even possible)
2. I'm in an awkward situation for the last few months where I've been questioning my gender identity. I've always identified as female but I honestly feel like I would be much more comfortable identifying as non-binary. I'm not opposed to people continuing to refer to me as she/her but I feel no true connection to a feminine identity, rather a gender-neutral or even more masculine identity.
3. I really want a binder! does anyone have recommendations on where I could get some for a reasonable price? or, is it possible to use a sports bra (or multiple) to achieve the same effect?


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## oak

xSuperMario64x said:


> 3. I really want a binder! does anyone have recommendations on where I could get some for a reasonable price? or, is it possible to use a sports bra (or multiple) to achieve the same effect?


Both mine and my boyfriend's binders came from underworks online store. They can be on the expensive side though. I'd suggest starting with a sports bra cause no matter how properly fitted your binder is, it's gonna cause the elasticity in your breast to sag. As a possible non-binary person, you might still want your breasts to stay the same shape long term so just something to think about.


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## xSuperMario64x

oak said:


> Both mine and my boyfriend's binders came from underworks online store. They can be on the expensive side though. I'd suggest starting with a sports bra cause no matter how properly fitted your binder is, it's gonna cause the elasticity in your breast to sag. As a possible non-binary person, you might still want your breasts to stay the same shape long term so just something to think about.


I appreciate the response 
I prob wouldn't wear it all the time, just days when I feel like I would be most comfortable wearing it (I already wear a bra 24/7 so idrc if I sag or whatever, I would honestly prob be happier if I could have them removed lol)


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## Balverine

xSuperMario64x said:


> -snip-



My best friend is in the same situation, they like being feminine/doing feminine things, but recently decided that they felt more comfortable using they/them pronouns and identifying as non-binary
They still feel really weird about it, but their fiancé is super cool about it and literally went 'ok cool' when they came out to him lol

They haven't mentioned anything to their family, however, they said they're just gonna start doing stuff they feel comfortable with and if someone asks about it, they'll explain it to them

as for me, my family is fairly unsupportive of anything other than cishet lol
I'm Demiromantic bisexual and haven't told any of my family (tbh, I don't feel like I owe anyone a 'coming out' but i understand that some people do feel that way) because I know how they'd react lol


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## SlEEPYTEARRS

so i learned i was full nonbinary a few months ago and my gf is trans (mtf, she told me about two years ago so about four years into our relationship) 

im just scared about how our parents will react if we even ever tell them. we live alone together so it isnt like we are around them much and also her and i's mom are rather accepting of things like that but its still scary


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## xSuperMario64x

so ig I basically came out to myself as non-binary last night and like? I already feel so much better???

for instance I've had long hair my whole life but for the last year or so I've toyed around with the idea of cutting it short with a perm like my brother did a year ago. I was always hesitant but now... like I feel like I really want to do it now! I'm also really excited to keep building my trans wardrobe (getting stuff like bow/ties, suits, binders, etc.)! 

not explicitly identifying as female anymore is super great, I've always kinda known that about myself but it took a 3am-woke-session to really figure it out I guess!


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## CyrusMoonside

Oh this wonder to finally have a forum for everyone!


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## Neb

After years of being insecure about my gender presentation, I’ve finally realized I was gender fluid. The joy I felt wearing dresses, the occasional discomfort from he/him pronouns, and the insecurity of not being “masculine enough” all pointed to it: About 60% of the time I feel like a boy, 10% I feel like a girl, and 30% like neither. Only one of my moms know. They’re both fairly accepting, but I think the concept would be too foreign for one of them. I have no intention of coming out offline. My part of Oregon isn’t exactly tolerant. If I went out with full makeup and a dress I would be harassed in minutes. I might experiment more once I live somewhere more progressive, but until then I’m stuck presenting as a boy.

All of you can still call me Benjamin or Neb and any pronouns work!


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## Croconaw

Thank you for this thread. I’m pretty sure I’m pan but I do lean more towards females. I’ve had an unfortunate experience and it sucks how people can be so hateful...

****TRIGGER WARNING (mentions of homophobia)****
A few years ago, I was walking to a shopping center down the street. There was a homeless guy in the parking lot, and we made eye contact. He asked me for change, but I wasn’t in the best position myself at the time and I never carry cash on me anyway, so I just shook my head and apologized. He then followed me and shouted homophobic slurs asking me if I was a boy or girl. I had to call an Uber back to my place because I didn’t want him following me home. He literally almost hit the driver’s car with a rock. It’s upsetting how anyone can be so hateful.

I haven’t really talked about this with anyone, but it really changed my perspective on giving to the homeless. I hate to be the person that lets one individual dislike an entire group of people, but this was a very scary situation for me. I was only 21 at the time of this incident.
**************


----------



## Corrie

xSuperMario64x said:


> ima go ahead and bump this:>
> 
> A few things:
> 1. I still haven't come out to my mom yet lmao. I really don't think she would understand how asexuality works (much less how being ace/apothi is even possible)
> 2. I'm in an awkward situation for the last few months where I've been questioning my gender identity. I've always identified as female but I honestly feel like I would be much more comfortable identifying as non-binary. I'm not opposed to people continuing to refer to me as she/her but I feel no true connection to a feminine identity, rather a gender-neutral or even more masculine identity.
> 3. I really want a binder! does anyone have recommendations on where I could get some for a reasonable price? or, is it possible to use a sports bra (or multiple) to achieve the same effect?


This might be late but hopefully this video helps. I love him and have been following him for years.


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## xhyloh

my boyfriend and i are both bisexual! it's great but can be a little frustrating when people assume we're both straight just because we're in a het relationship


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## sushicatlikesart

;


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## Stella-Io

Been thinking of identifying as somethin along the lines of non-binary or not gender conforming. Idrk which one I'm more inclined to. Possibly non-binary. I'm fine with she/her pronouns but I also want people to use they/them with me more.


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## Rubombee

Stella-Io said:


> Been thinking of identifying as somethin along the lines of non-binary or not gender conforming. Idrk which one I'm more inclined to. Possibly non-binary. I'm fine with she/her pronouns but I also want people to use they/them with me more.


I don't know much about Stella-Io, but I hope they have fun figuring out their gender identity! :D They can take all the time they need, and no matter what they find out, they'll be very valid as either non-binary or gender non-conforming – or even something else if they feel like it! I also hope that my use of third-person pronouns to answer them wasn't too awkward, and that maybe it made them feel at least a little happy :'D


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## Stella-Io

Rubombee said:


> I don't know much about Stella-Io, but I hope they have fun figuring out their gender identity! :D They can take all the time they need, and no matter what they find out, they'll be very valid as either non-binary or gender non-conforming – or even something else if they feel like it! I also hope that my use of third-person pronouns to answer them wasn't too awkward, and that maybe it made them feel at least a little happy :'D



Aw thank you do much this is so nice

Also I keep getting the words in gender non conforming switched around, maybe it's a sign that I lean more elsewhere lol


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## Marte

Been a while since I've visited this thread now.. and I have to say it makes me happy and warm to see so many people opening up on here. 

Also, I want to say this to those of you who can't come out yet.. or who struggles with it. It's okay, you're not alone. It's not a dance on roses. It's scary. And if you have yet to figure out your sexuality or identity, thats valid and 100% ok too! Exploring who you are is a natural part of coming out, and it's not suppose to come fast for everyone. And if you find out later that whatyou used to identify as is not longer who you are today, thats ok, no problem with that. I'm cheering for you and I support you, we all are in this thread and community! <3 

*WERE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER* *insert the High School Musical song here*


----------



## xSuperMario64x

gotta bump this again cause I'm having some trouble and I'm too scared to really confront my parents (or really any family/friends) about it so hopefully I can find sound advice here.


I'm seriously considering telling my mom about me being masc/non-binary because I've been dealing w this alone and I would love to have some emotional support in my life. on one hand I feel like she would prob be fine w it cause I've already cut my hair short and started talking abt wearing more masc clothes and she's perfectly fine with it (she's cis but she actually always has really short hair and wears men's clothes as well). but on the other hand, what bothers me is that she's a conservative and I've already encountered issues in which she seemingly... simply cannot accept a "lack of gender binary" (for instance one time she went on a rant about how calling someone they/them is ridiculous since it's "plural", and yes i called out her bs and explained that they/them can be singular too, in fact english uses it in common speech a lot). not only that but im almost 22 and I've identified as female my whole life so this would probably be super jarring for her.

ive considered talking to my uncle (my mom's oldest brother) first cause he's experienced a similar coming out scenario, being a closeted gay man for a big portion of his life. I feel like if anyone could be supportive it would be him. 

but idk I'm still terrified of saying anything, I just know that I need to tell someone so they can help me physically/emotionally transition and be more comfortable with myself ;w;


----------



## Foreverfox

xSuperMario64x said:


> gotta bump this again cause I'm having some trouble and I'm too scared to really confront my parents (or really any family/friends) about it so hopefully I can find sound advice here.
> 
> 
> I'm seriously considering telling my mom about me being masc/non-binary because I've been dealing w this alone and I would love to have some emotional support in my life. on one hand I feel like she would prob be fine w it cause I've already cut my hair short and started talking abt wearing more masc clothes and she's perfectly fine with it (she's cis but she actually always has really short hair and wears men's clothes as well). but on the other hand, what bothers me is that she's a conservative and I've already encountered issues in which she seemingly... simply cannot accept a "lack of gender binary" (for instance one time she went on a rant about how calling someone they/them is ridiculous since it's "plural", and yes i called out her bs and explained that they/them can be singular too, in fact english uses it in common speech a lot). not only that but im almost 22 and I've identified as female my whole life so this would probably be super jarring for her.
> 
> ive considered talking to my uncle (my mom's oldest brother) first cause he's experienced a similar coming out scenario, being a closeted gay man for a big portion of his life. I feel like if anyone could be supportive it would be him.
> 
> but idk I'm still terrified of saying anything, I just know that I need to tell someone so they can help me physically/emotionally transition and be more comfortable with myself ;w;


Do you think it would help to maybe talk to your uncle first, that way he can already be in your court if or when you decide to tell your mom? Or would your mom be more upset if she found out you told your uncle first? I'm sorry that you are going through this. Even if your mom doesn't agree with it in general, hopefully she will be supportive because you are her child. I know I would love and support my son no matter what (he's only 19 months old right now lol, but still). It's hard to imagine other mothers not doing the same. I'm here for you if you ever need someone. My inbox is always open!


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Foreverfox said:


> Do you think it would help to maybe talk to your uncle first, that way he can already be in your court if or when you decide to tell your mom? Or would your mom be more upset if she found out you told your uncle first? I'm sorry that you are going through this. Even if your mom doesn't agree with it in general, hopefully she will be supportive because you are her child. I know I would love and support my son no matter what (he's only 19 months old right now lol, but still). It's hard to imagine other mothers not doing the same. I'm here for you if you ever need someone. My inbox is always open!


first off tysm for the reply  

I think I would rather talk to my uncle first cause my mom has always told me in the past "if something is bothering [me], anything at all, then he would be the best person to talk to." I hadn't considered whether she would be upset about me talking to him first cause I really don't think she would be.

my biggest thing about my mom is that she has always told me and my brother that she would support us no matter what we were going though. I'm not too worried about her accepting me, I'm more-so worried about her actually understanding what I'm dealing with. this is the same reason why I haven't told her about me being apothi/ace-aro as well. I really don't want to have to explain myself, especially on the apothi/aro issue cause she's always acted like being sex-repulsed is highly unnatural and that I'm weird for feeling that way. In a similar way I feel like she might say something like "but you're clearly a woman so how are you just now thinking that you're 'non-binary'?" I shouldn't have to explain myself, I should be able to tell my mom who i really am and give a brief explanation and then have her be like "okay that's cool." (don't even get me started on talking to my dad, he'd be asking questions nonstop for the next 47 years lmao)

I also need her to understand that I really just need her to listen and help me feel validated (she's always trying to give me advice to make me feel better when I don't ask for it, largely when I'm dealing w really bad depressive episodes. tbh advice doesn't cut it during those times, it just makes me feel like I'm being lazy or selfish). 


I'll prob try to muster up the courage to send my uncle a message today. I really think I would be more comfortable if those who are close to me understood who I really am and actively/openly supported me.


----------



## Foreverfox

xSuperMario64x said:


> first off tysm for the reply
> 
> I think I would rather talk to my uncle first cause my mom has always told me in the past "if something is bothering [me], anything at all, then he would be the best person to talk to." I hadn't considered whether she would be upset about me talking to him first cause I really don't think she would be.
> 
> my biggest thing about my mom is that she has always told me and my brother that she would support us no matter what we were going though. I'm not too worried about her accepting me, I'm more-so worried about her actually understanding what I'm dealing with. this is the same reason why I haven't told her about me being apothi/ace-aro as well. I really don't want to have to explain myself, especially on the apothi/aro issue cause she's always acted like being sex-repulsed is highly unnatural and that I'm weird for feeling that way. In a similar way I feel like she might say something like "but you're clearly a woman so how are you just now thinking that you're 'non-binary'?" I shouldn't have to explain myself, I should be able to tell my mom who i really am and give a brief explanation and then have her be like "okay that's cool." (don't even get me started on talking to my dad, he'd be asking questions nonstop for the next 47 years lmao)
> 
> I also need her to understand that I really just need her to listen and help me feel validated (she's always trying to give me advice to make me feel better when I don't ask for it, largely when I'm dealing w really bad depressive episodes. tbh advice doesn't cut it during those times, it just makes me feel like I'm being lazy or selfish).
> 
> 
> I'll prob try to muster up the courage to send my uncle a message today. I really think I would be more comfortable if those who are close to me understood who I really am and actively/openly supported me.


You don't have to thank me, it's what friends are for!  if she's already said in the past that it'd be good to talk to your uncle first then I would do that, personally. Then if you think she doesn't understand, you can say, well uncle so and so said ______. And hopefully that will help. Although, she shouldn't need someone else to accept and support it for her to do so. And I totally understand, my dad would ask a ton of questions too. I'm cis and married, but if I were in the same boat, he would never accept it.

It is frustrating to just want support and to have that weight taken off your shoulders and then to just have to explain and answer and still feel heavy after it all, and like nothing got accomplished. I will definitely be thinking about you! I hope it all goes well ❤


----------



## Shawna

I am aro-ace towards real people, and bisexual towards fictional characters.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY OF VISIBILITY EVERYONE!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


​

I figured today would be a better day than any other to tell my uncle/mom about me being nb (considering non-binary folk fall under the transgender umbrella) so guess what. I ****ING DID IT. I TOLD THEM. AND I HAD TO CRY QUITE A BIT CAUSE I'M STRESSED AS ****.

but besides that, yeah everything went really well. I told my uncle first cause he would prob understand better than anyone else in my family, being LGBT himself. ofc he has some concerns for me, like he just wants to be sure that I'm absolutely sure about my identity since it's a relatively recent discovery (I realized only a few months ago). but he whole-heartedly supports me, asked me if I more closely identify as a boy or girl, asked me what my new pronouns are, asked me what name I would like to go by from now on, etc. I appreciate that kind of support so much  
he then asked me about my sexual/romantic orientation, and so ofc I told him I was ace (and that's not a thing I'm even slightly questioning, I'm like 173% positive I'm ace lol) and I think I might be aro though I think I could possibly still have a romantic attraction to someone? idk yet cause I don't think I've met the right person yet. but he's completely supportive of that too.

and the my mom honestly didn't even ask me any questions. I was like "oh btw mom I'm non-binary and also ace" and she asked what those things meant but then she was like "yeah okay that's fine." I think it's pretty obvious that I'm ace so I honestly prob didn't even need to tell her that, she's known how I feel about sexuality for years now.
but the thing I'm most excited about is exactly _how _supportive she is?? like I told her I wanted to get a chest binder and she's just like "yeah you can get two that way you can wear one and have the other washing" like omg?? that's one of the nicest and most accepting things I've ever heard her say and I'm literally crying over it  I also told her about be getting a tuxedo and she said "I have a tuxedo somewhere, you can try it on and see if it fits" like YES PLEASE MUM 
the only thing was that she told me it's weird to refer to someone as they/them cause she said it feels less personal to call someone that. but then she bounced right back and said "you know what, if people respect you they'll use the correct pronouns. I'll just call you 'my baby' from now on." like yall I literally cannot even I'm sobbing so muchshdfjshd


anyways I'm super tired and I have a bit of schoolwork to do before I go to bed but yeah!! now I can send my mom LGBT+/Ace memes all the time lmao


Spoiler: here's my favorite one btw, for my apothi/ace friends


----------



## Foreverfox

xSuperMario64x said:


> HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY OF VISIBILITY EVERYONE!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ​
> 
> I figured today would be a better day than any other to tell my uncle/mom about me being nb (considering non-binary folk fall under the transgender umbrella) so guess what. I ****ING DID IT. I TOLD THEM. AND I HAD TO CRY QUITE A BIT CAUSE I'M STRESSED AS ****.
> 
> but besides that, yeah everything went really well. I told my uncle first cause he would prob understand better than anyone else in my family, being LGBT himself. ofc he has some concerns for me, like he just wants to be sure that I'm absolutely sure about my identity since it's a relatively recent discovery (I realized only a few months ago). but he whole-heartedly supports me, asked me if I more closely identify as a boy or girl, asked me what my new pronouns are, asked me what name I would like to go by from now on, etc. I appreciate that kind of support so much
> he then asked me about my sexual/romantic orientation, and so ofc I told him I was ace (and that's not a thing I'm even slightly questioning, I'm like 173% positive I'm ace lol) and I think I might be aro though I think I could possibly still have a romantic attraction to someone? idk yet cause I don't think I've met the right person yet. but he's completely supportive of that too.
> 
> and the my mom honestly didn't even ask me any questions. I was like "oh btw mom I'm non-binary and also ace" and she asked what those things meant but then she was like "yeah okay that's fine." I think it's pretty obvious that I'm ace so I honestly prob didn't even need to tell her that, she's known how I feel about sexuality for years now.
> but the thing I'm most excited about is exactly _how _supportive she is?? like I told her I wanted to get a chest binder and she's just like "yeah you can get two that way you can wear one and have the other washing" like omg?? that's one of the nicest and most accepting things I've ever heard her say and I'm literally crying over it  I also told her about be getting a tuxedo and she said "I have a tuxedo somewhere, you can try it on and see if it fits" like YES PLEASE MUM
> the only thing was that she told me it's weird to refer to someone as they/them cause she said it feels less personal to call someone that. but then she bounced right back and said "you know what, if people respect you they'll use the correct pronouns. I'll just call you 'my baby' from now on." like yall I literally cannot even I'm sobbing so muchshdfjshd
> 
> 
> anyways I'm super tired and I have a bit of schoolwork to do before I go to bed but yeah!! now I can send my mom LGBT+/Ace memes all the time lmao
> 
> 
> Spoiler: here's my favorite one btw, for my apothi/ace friends


Ahhh!!! I'm literally over the moon happy for you and so proud of you!!! You did it!!  And I bet you feel a MILLION times better now. I'm so happy that your mom was so supportive and that your uncle was as well, but i know you weren't as concerned about him being supportive to begin with. Now you can switch gears and go from, "how do I get this out" to figuring out more about who you present yourself as to others. Thank you sooo much for sharing this great news, and you picked such a great day to do it!


----------



## Princess Mipha

Not sure if that counts to this thread, but I'm wondering if there are any other asexuals here and how they handle, well..
sexual things in a relationship? I never knew the term "asexual" and always thought it's totally normal to not have the need
for anything sexual until my boyfriend started to wonder if I might be asexual and yeah, seems like I am. 
Sexual things are gross to me and doing those things are usually uncomfortable to me, but after almost 7 years with my 
boyfriend I started to learn to be better around the topic. Still extremelly awkward tho and I don't like sexual scenes on 
any TV show or movie.. just kissing grosses me out, lol. 
Anyways, anyone else here that is really asexual (not the ones that say they are, just because they never actually did it or
what so ever) and in a relationship? How do you handle it with your partner? Is it frustrating for them? 

I remember my boyfriend being super frustrated at the beginning, which I can understand by now, but he was always
super supportive of it, even thought it was / still is really hard for him!


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Princess Mipha said:


> Not sure if that counts to this thread, but I'm wondering if there are any other asexuals here and how they handle, well..
> sexual things in a relationship? I never knew the term "asexual" and always thought it's totally normal to not have the need
> for anything sexual until my boyfriend started to wonder if I might be asexual and yeah, seems like I am.
> Sexual things are gross to me and doing those things are usually uncomfortable to me, but after almost 7 years with my
> boyfriend I started to learn to be better around the topic. Still extremelly awkward tho and I don't like sexual scenes on
> any TV show or movie.. just kissing grosses me out, lol.
> Anyways, anyone else here that is really asexual (not the ones that say they are, just because they never actually did it or
> what so ever) and in a relationship? How do you handle it with your partner? Is it frustrating for them?
> 
> I remember my boyfriend being super frustrated at the beginning, which I can understand by now, but he was always
> super supportive of it, even thought it was / still is really hard for him!


idk if you've seen my previous posts but I can definitely relate to this. I'm ace/apothisexual which basically means, not only do I not feel that kind of attraction, I'm also repulsed by it. I've never been in a relationship w someone mostly because I'm afraid that they won't accept me for who I am.

best thing I can say is that you should never feel obligated to give into your partners sexual desires. it is possible for someone to be ace and still do that but if you're not comfortable with it then you should never feel guilty about that, or feel obligated to give in. if they guilt you into giving in then that's highly disrespectful.

I would probably have a very difficult time finding a relationship because that's often a big part of it, and for me that sexual connection would be non-existent. I consider myself to be on the extreme end of being apothi/ace so if I was dating someone and they expected that from me in any way I would prob have to break up with them. I don't mind romantic relationships (except i dont like a lot of intimacy, simply hugging and holding hands and little kisses are fine but making out is a huge no) but the instant it becomes a sexual thing I have to draw the line. I've never asked anyone to date me cause I've yet to find someone who explicitly accepts me, and i don't want to burden them or suppress their sexuality. 

maybe you can relate to this, idk. I just figured I would share my personal experience.


----------



## Princess Mipha

xSuperMario64x said:


> idk if you've seen my previous posts but I can definitely relate to this. I'm ace/apothisexual which basically means, not only do I not feel that kind of attraction, I'm also repulsed by it. I've never been in a relationship w someone mostly because I'm afraid that they won't accept me for who I am.
> 
> best thing I can say is that you should never feel obligated to give into your partners sexual desires. it is possible for someone to be ace and still do that but if you're not comfortable with it then you should never feel guilty about that, or feel obligated to give in. if they guilt you into giving in then that's highly disrespectful.
> 
> I would probably have a very difficult time finding a relationship because that's often a big part of it, and for me that sexual connection would be non-existent. I consider myself to be on the extreme end of being apothi/ace so if I was dating someone and they expected that from me in any way I would prob have to break up with them. I don't mind romantic relationships (except i dont like a lot of intimacy, simply hugging and holding hands and little kisses are fine but making out is a huge no) but the instant it becomes a sexual thing I have to draw the line. I've never asked anyone to date me cause I've yet to find someone who explicitly accepts me, and i don't want to burden them or suppress their sexuality.
> 
> maybe you can relate to this, idk. I just figured I would share my personal experience.


Oh I can definitely relate to this!! I sadly didn't know that it was something unusual, or I would've definitely warned my boyfriend about it,
as I find it only fair that he knows about it before going into a relationship with me. But yeah, that sadly didn't turn out like this.. but hey,
he accepted me still how I am and if I don't want to do anything for a few weeks, he is able to accept it. Sure, frustrating for him sometimes,
but he can deal with it by now, luckily. 

I wish you good luck in finding someone who will accept you for who and how you are. It can be hard, but it's never impossible, that is for sure.  Also I totally know what you mean. Hugging, holding hands and small kisses? Totally fine! But turning it into making out? Naaah, I do not like that at all. From time to time, yeah. But I don't understand how people can do this pretty much daily, or even more than once a day. I just don't have the desire or wanting for such thing. Once a month is more than enough for me, haha.


----------



## Stella-Io

xSuperMario64x said:


> HAPPY TRANSGENDER DAY OF VISIBILITY EVERYONE!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ​
> 
> I figured today would be a better day than any other to tell my uncle/mom about me being nb (considering non-binary folk fall under the transgender umbrella) so guess what. I ****ING DID IT. I TOLD THEM. AND I HAD TO CRY QUITE A BIT CAUSE I'M STRESSED AS ****.
> 
> but besides that, yeah everything went really well. I told my uncle first cause he would prob understand better than anyone else in my family, being LGBT himself. ofc he has some concerns for me, like he just wants to be sure that I'm absolutely sure about my identity since it's a relatively recent discovery (I realized only a few months ago). but he whole-heartedly supports me, asked me if I more closely identify as a boy or girl, asked me what my new pronouns are, asked me what name I would like to go by from now on, etc. I appreciate that kind of support so much
> he then asked me about my sexual/romantic orientation, and so ofc I told him I was ace (and that's not a thing I'm even slightly questioning, I'm like 173% positive I'm ace lol) and I think I might be aro though I think I could possibly still have a romantic attraction to someone? idk yet cause I don't think I've met the right person yet. but he's completely supportive of that too.
> 
> and the my mom honestly didn't even ask me any questions. I was like "oh btw mom I'm non-binary and also ace" and she asked what those things meant but then she was like "yeah okay that's fine." I think it's pretty obvious that I'm ace so I honestly prob didn't even need to tell her that, she's known how I feel about sexuality for years now.
> but the thing I'm most excited about is exactly _how _supportive she is?? like I told her I wanted to get a chest binder and she's just like "yeah you can get two that way you can wear one and have the other washing" like omg?? that's one of the nicest and most accepting things I've ever heard her say and I'm literally crying over it  I also told her about be getting a tuxedo and she said "I have a tuxedo somewhere, you can try it on and see if it fits" like YES PLEASE MUM
> the only thing was that she told me it's weird to refer to someone as they/them cause she said it feels less personal to call someone that. but then she bounced right back and said "you know what, if people respect you they'll use the correct pronouns. I'll just call you 'my baby' from now on." like yall I literally cannot even I'm sobbing so muchshdfjshd
> 
> 
> anyways I'm super tired and I have a bit of schoolwork to do before I go to bed but yeah!! now I can send my mom LGBT+/Ace memes all the time lmao
> 
> 
> Spoiler: here's my favorite one btw, for my apothi/ace friends



I'm little late on this, just now saw it but yay! I'm so glad for you and how supportive your mom and uncle are! It's so good to have people in your life that can support you and you don't have to hide or dodge the topics. I know there's people online who support you but having people irl is def different somewhat. I'm glad they've been taking it so well, esp your mom!


----------



## Holla

So a bit of an update from me. I came out on here as asexual a while back which I came to realize after a previous bad relationship about a year ago.

I was on the fence as to whether or not I was fully asexual or just demi-sexual. I have been pretty positive that I am actually demi for a while now.

I decided to risk a new relationship with a guy I met online (but nearby) just under two months ago. Just today he mentioned that he remembered seeing demi sexual on my profile and he didn’t know what that meant so he looked it up. He also said that he believes that he is also demi too it’s just he didn’t know there was an actual term/classification for such a thing before.

I am just blown away right now. I was hoping to at least find someone who would respect my boundaries and be willing to compromise but I never thought I’d actually run into someone else who is also demi. He’s like the first person I’ve ever met who actually truly understands me.


----------



## Blueskyy

Holla said:


> So a bit of an update from me. I came out on here as asexual a while back which I came to realize after a previous bad relationship about a year ago.
> 
> I was on the fence as to whether or not I was fully asexual or just demi-sexual. I have been pretty positive that I am actually demi for a while now.
> 
> I decided to risk a new relationship with a guy I met online (but nearby) just under two months ago. Just today he mentioned that he remembered seeing demi sexual on my profile and he didn’t know what that meant so he looked it up. He also said that he believes that he is also demi too it’s just he didn’t know there was an actual term/classification for such a thing before.
> 
> I am just blown away right now. I was hoping to at least find someone who would respect my boundaries and be willing to compromise but I never thought I’d actually run into someone else who is also demi. He’s like the first person I’ve ever met who actually truly understands me.


That's so great! I wish I realized what all of this meant in 2009 when I was like 19. I have wasted so many years just finding meaningless experiences or being out of my own character. I realized now that I just want to feel happy. Nothing "sexual" (not sure if I can say that here), but just comfort. I probably am asexual but the way I've been in my 20s, I'd never be seen that way now. my brain, heart, and spirit have never aligned until now and I'm ashamed of myself for it.


----------



## 0ni

I'm asexual and non-binary - or as I like to call myself:



Spoiler: spoiler









It took a bit for my folks (and myself tbh) to understand it. I think they assumed I would "grow out of it" and eventually show some interest in dating/relationships. Eventually they were like, "ok nvm" about it all when they saw that it wasn't a phase lol. The non-binary thing was always there, but without a name. I'm not 'out' about it to anyone other than my parents - I think at this stage other people in my family just see me as I am and always have been. I remember watching Queer Eye with my mum, and in one episode Jonathan Van Ness referred to himself as a "non-binary fairy", and my mum was like, "that's you!" - it's now how I (and my mum) lovingly refer to my identity lol

I think the non-binary/asexual journey is a difficult one that doesn't sometimes get taken very seriously - even within some circles of LGBTQIA+. It's a difficult one to navigate, you don't feel (or I didn't feel) like you swing one way or another, so you don't feel like you fit in or have a place. It's also hard to find a name for it at the beginning (outside of just being told "it's a phase", or, "It's probably a hormone imbalance"). Took me a while to feel settled, but I'm in a better position now. Just wish I had gotten here a bit sooner - but better late than never I guess lol.


----------



## moo_nieu

i need to vent a little bit  so ive known for many years that im not straight or a woman, but ive always been hesitant to use labels since i just want to be known as Parker the individual. Over the past 2 years my self-esteem and awareness surrounding my identity has grown, and now i feel comfortable saying im nonbinary and pansexual. my boyfriend has been very supportive of this realization (weve known each other for 11 years and have been dating for almost 5) which is great because i dont feel comfortable telling my immediate family and its nice to have someone accept you. my family wouldnt accept me as they makes jokes about and are uncomfortable around people who arent very similar to themselves. i dont want to get in too far on the whole my childhood track though, so yes its nice to live with someone who actually accepts me and doesnt force me to be a lady. hooray! well the reason im typing all of this now isnt because of home, its because of work. my workplace is very small and doesnt care about covid safety or general respect for everyone. my boss and coworkers make offensive jokes and statements fairly regularly. it doesnt matter whats in the employee handbook as the boss doesnt even care. its actually ridiculous tbh.. i am trying to move cities this year, so it wont be my environment forever but boy is it crushing on the soul. at least i get to do graphic design. a n y w a y s the first week i worked there (this january) my coworker starts up the political talk (as usual) and long story short they end up refferring to gender as men, women, and "what the f-word". sooooo yeah. i dont exactly feel comfortable letting people know that im nonbinary. most days i wear mens shirts with womens work slacks (i even found some with pockets which was awesome. i feel like womens pants often dont get pockets). sometimes i will wear a womens shirt, but i dont prefer too as my boss has reacted in ways that make me extremely uncomfortable about wearing form fitting clothes.. anyways ive cut all my hair off, told my boss not to call me mamm or miss, and avoided all of the his telling me to take his card and go order womens shirts for me.. he still insists on referring to me as lady though :/ oh well. yesterday he sent an email about a women led event to the women only. its not an event exclusive to women, but it does focus on the perspectives of women in a male dominated industry. i wanted so badly to respond and say that im not a women and to not single me out for women events but i didnt want to as im afraid he will act all weird about it, come ask me about it in front of the whole office and ("what the -" coworker). the coworker who said wtf has already yelled at me, put me down, and made fun of me plenty of times already (yeah the boss doesnt care lmao) and i really dont want to be targetted for my gender identity too  its not a protected class where i live.. although that doesnt even matter apparently based on whats happened at this place. anyways today the boss came to me and told me to tell him what my shirt size is because he wants to order womens shirts for the office so that all of the women are in womens shirts and all of the men are in mens shirts... now its important to say that i am the only "non-man" (quotes because although most everyone has stated their identity i wont know if someone is hiding how they really feel) who wears the work polos at all. needless to say, i feel a bit singled out and offended. i told him that i dont need new shirts, im fine with the company branded polo shirts my boyfriend gave me (we work at same office and he had many shirts so he gave me some) and he says again about wanting me to tell him my womens shirt size so i wont need to wear mens shirts. i told him that i feel more comfortable in mens shirts because they are less form fitting. he finally backs off and says he will now order mens and womens shirts for us to all try on and find the size that fits. idk what made him change his mind about telling him our size, but now we have to group change in the office??? my clothes fit me. they arent too tight or too baggy, and i always have my polo tucked in. its been months of me wearing mens shirts but 1 week after i cut my hair its "we want women in womens shirts"???? no thank you. im okay with my gender being ambiguous to other people. i really dont want to out myself and put myself on the chopping block for cheap jokes, but im tired of this. im afraid hes going to straight up ask me "what i am" or say that people who walk in (usually just the mail deliverer once a day and sometimes one more random person) in need to be able to tell what gender the person at the reception desk is. i know thats a little unlikely, but i dont know what else to expect at this point. my boyfriend overheard all of this (its a very small office with only a few people so everyone hears everything) and came to check on me and make sure i was okay. that made me feel better 
anyways, my boyfriend is supportive, but hes never cared too much about what people say to him so its hard to talk to him about it. even if its just little things, having to live life enduring little thing after little thing becomes a lot... i feel a little better now. at least i know you all wont judge me


----------



## Rubombee

Moo_Nieu said:


> i need to vent a little bit  so ive known for many years that im not straight or a woman, but ive always been hesitant to use labels since i just want to be known as Parker the individual. Over the past 2 years my self-esteem and awareness surrounding my identity has grown, and now i feel comfortable saying im nonbinary and pansexual. my boyfriend has been very supportive of this realization (weve known each other for 11 years and have been dating for almost 5) which is great because i dont feel comfortable telling my immediate family and its nice to have someone accept you. my family wouldnt accept me as they makes jokes about and are uncomfortable around people who arent very similar to themselves. i dont want to get in too far on the whole my childhood track though, so yes its nice to live with someone who actually accepts me and doesnt force me to be a lady. hooray! well the reason im typing all of this now isnt because of home, its because of work. my workplace is very small and doesnt care about covid safety or general respect for everyone. my boss and coworkers make offensive jokes and statements fairly regularly. it doesnt matter whats in the employee handbook as the boss doesnt even care. its actually ridiculous tbh.. i am trying to move cities this year, so it wont be my environment forever but boy is it crushing on the soul. at least i get to do graphic design. a n y w a y s the first week i worked there (this january) my coworker starts up the political talk (as usual) and long story short they end up refferring to gender as men, women, and "what the f-word". sooooo yeah. i dont exactly feel comfortable letting people know that im nonbinary. most days i wear mens shirts with womens work slacks (i even found some with pockets which was awesome. i feel like womens pants often dont get pockets). sometimes i will wear a womens shirt, but i dont prefer too as my boss has reacted in ways that make me extremely uncomfortable about wearing form fitting clothes.. anyways ive cut all my hair off, told my boss not to call me mamm or miss, and avoided all of the his telling me to take his card and go order womens shirts for me.. he still insists on referring to me as lady though :/ oh well. yesterday he sent an email about a women led event to the women only. its not an event exclusive to women, but it does focus on the perspectives of women in a male dominated industry. i wanted so badly to respond and say that im not a women and to not single me out for women events but i didnt want to as im afraid he will act all weird about it, come ask me about it in front of the whole office and ("what the -" coworker). the coworker who said wtf has already yelled at me, put me down, and made fun of me plenty of times already (yeah the boss doesnt care lmao) and i really dont want to be targetted for my gender identity too  its not a protected class where i live.. although that doesnt even matter apparently based on whats happened at this place. anyways today the boss came to me and told me to tell him what my shirt size is because he wants to order womens shirts for the office so that all of the women are in womens shirts and all of the men are in mens shirts... now its important to say that i am the only "non-man" (quotes because although most everyone has stated their identity i wont know if someone is hiding how they really feel) who wears the work polos at all. needless to say, i feel a bit singled out and offended. i told him that i dont need new shirts, im fine with the company branded polo shirts my boyfriend gave me (we work at same office and he had many shirts so he gave me some) and he says again about wanting me to tell him my womens shirt size so i wont need to wear mens shirts. i told him that i feel more comfortable in mens shirts because they are less form fitting. he finally backs off and says he will now order mens and womens shirts for us to all try on and find the size that fits. idk what made him change his mind about telling him our size, but now we have to group change in the office??? my clothes fit me. they arent too tight or too baggy, and i always have my polo tucked in. its been months of me wearing mens shirts but 1 week after i cut my hair its "we want women in womens shirts"???? no thank you. im okay with my gender being ambiguous to other people. i really dont want to out myself and put myself on the chopping block for cheap jokes, but im tired of this. im afraid hes going to straight up ask me "what i am" or say that people who walk in (usually just the mail deliverer once a day and sometimes one more random person) in need to be able to tell what gender the person at the reception desk is. i know thats a little unlikely, but i dont know what else to expect at this point. my boyfriend overheard all of this (its a very small office with only a few people so everyone hears everything) and came to check on me and make sure i was okay. that made me feel better
> anyways, my boyfriend is supportive, but hes never cared too much about what people say to him so its hard to talk to him about it. even if its just little things, having to live life enduring little thing after little thing becomes a lot... i feel a little better now. at least i know you all wont judge me


Whaaaat that sounds awful?? I'm so sorry you have to go through this!! Hang in there!!!


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## Holla

0ni said:


> I remember watching Queer Eye with my mum, and in one episode Jonathan Van Ness referred to himself as a "non-binary fairy", and my mum was like, "that's you!" - it's now how I (and my mum) lovingly refer to my identity lol



Ok this is the sweetest/cutest thing I’ve heard in a long time. What a precious moment to cherish.

I’m glad that you are finally settling in with who you are as a person (or should I say unidentifiable meat? haha). It’s definitely not easy to accept yourself when you feel so different from the average “normal” person. The best thing you can do though is just be true to yourself no matter what anybody else thinks.


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## 0ni

Holla said:


> Ok this is the sweetest/cutest thing I’ve heard in a long time. What a precious moment to cherish.
> 
> I’m glad that you are finally settling in with who you are as a person (or should I say unidentifiable meat? haha). It’s definitely not easy to accept yourself when you feel so different from the average “normal” person. The best thing you can do though is just be true to yourself no matter what anybody else thinks.


Thank you so much, you're so kind taking the time to say that to me (and I appreciate it a lot)   

lol, I'm glad you got a kick out of the non-binary fairy moment - My mum seemed to get it quicker than my dad (or so I thought as he didn't seem to have an opinion one way or another), but one day when I was feeling particularly down about things, and myself, my dad said, "Anyone who knows you can see it" (referring to how I present quite androgynous and fluid) and, "I've known you your whole life and I see that it's real". I think he just doesn't quite have a grasp on the idea of labelling it as anything - he is very "you're just you - whatever form that takes". It was nice to hear him say those things, I remember it really settled my worries at the time.

But you're so right, it's a bumpy road for anyone out there questioning their orientation/ identity - you just got to find a way to live life in a way that rings true to how you feel. It's not easy, but it's worth it in the end.


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## xSuperMario64x

0ni said:


> I'm asexual and non-binary - or as I like to call myself:
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 366834
> 
> 
> 
> It took a bit for my folks (and myself tbh) to understand it. I think they assumed I would "grow out of it" and eventually show some interest in dating/relationships. Eventually they were like, "ok nvm" about it all when they saw that it wasn't a phase lol. The non-binary thing was always there, but without a name. I'm not 'out' about it to anyone other than my parents - I think at this stage other people in my family just see me as I am and always have been. I remember watching Queer Eye with my mum, and in one episode Jonathan Van Ness referred to himself as a "non-binary fairy", and my mum was like, "that's you!" - it's now how I (and my mum) lovingly refer to my identity lol
> 
> I think the non-binary/asexual journey is a difficult one that doesn't sometimes get taken very seriously - even within some circles of LGBTQIA+. It's a difficult one to navigate, you don't feel (or I didn't feel) like you swing one way or another, so you don't feel like you fit in or have a place. It's also hard to find a name for it at the beginning (outside of just being told "it's a phase", or, "It's probably a hormone imbalance"). Took me a while to feel settled, but I'm in a better position now. Just wish I had gotten here a bit sooner - but better late than never I guess lol.


brooo finally someone I can wholly relate to 
yeah it's really difficult to be non-binary as well as ace because, in terms of their prevalence to the LGBT community they're relatively new new realizations. I'm sure people may have felt non-binary or ace in the past but it hasn't come into public view until the last decade or so. In that sense it's really difficult for some people to understand how someone could be non-binary (since the gender binary is so prevalent in society) or ace (since being ace is literally the only sexuality with a lack of attraction lol)

I'm really glad to hear that you're coming to terms with yourself and accepting who you are. that's always really important especially if you identify in a way that isn't greatly understood by most people. I'm personally still trying to settle into being non-binary, since I just realized I was only a few months ago. it's been an awkward transition so far since so many people know the old me so well. but ultimately I think the best thing is for society to just learn to love and accept you, for who you are and secretly always have been 


(also that pic you posted is absolutely hilarious I'm dying--)


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## 0ni

xSuperMario64x said:


> brooo finally someone I can wholly relate to
> yeah it's really difficult to be non-binary as well as ace because, in terms of their prevalence to the LGBT community they're relatively new new realizations. I'm sure people may have felt non-binary or ace in the past but it hasn't come into public view until the last decade or so. In that sense it's really difficult for some people to understand how someone could be non-binary (since the gender binary is so prevalent in society) or ace (since being ace is literally the only sexuality with a lack of attraction lol)
> 
> I'm really glad to hear that you're coming to terms with yourself and accepting who you are. that's always really important especially if you identify in a way that isn't greatly understood by most people. I'm personally still trying to settle into being non-binary, since I just realized I was only a few months ago. it's been an awkward transition so far since so many people know the old me so well. but ultimately I think the best thing is for society to just learn to love and accept you, for who you are and secretly always have been
> 
> 
> (also that pic you posted is absolutely hilarious I'm dying--)


Sometimes there is nothing better than finding a kindred spirit lol - I'm so happy to see someone who relates to what I wrote   non-binary/ace can be a combination that can be quite difficult to navigate sometimes... so it's nice to find another person who understands~

Non-binary seems to finally be getting an upsurge in recognition in modern society, which is always great to see - and opens up discussions that may resonate with people that are feeling a bit lost right now. Gender non-conformists have existed throughout history (Indigenous North American 'Two-Spirit', or South Asia's 'Hijra') but for some reason they haven't been talked about much before now. It's all really interesting - gender has been a lot more fluid than we thought for so long, and yet we still come up against folks online acting like it's a 'fad', and something we will grow out of.

It's also sometimes a bit sad (from the "ace" side of things) to see people within the LGBT+ community try and exclude us (such as those who argue the 'A' in LGBTQIA stands for 'Ally'...). But I've definitely seen a shift to a more positive attitude towards Ace/Aro folks. 

It's awesome to hear that you've started making your transition into your non-binary identity - I totally relate to you saying it is a bit awkward, but you are showing a lot of strength by pushing through that and fighting for what you truly feel on the inside. I wish you all the luck  

(we just a couple of unidentifiable meats, floating through the cosmos lol)


----------



## Croconaw

I’m on the asexual spectrum. I’m honestly a very affectionate person in general, but sex just disgusts me. I’m 23 years old, and haven’t done anything. For me to experience sexual attraction, my emotional bond with that person has to be very strong.

I feel like some people have sex when they’re not ready or when they aren’t into it just because they feel pressured. I don’t understand the importance of sex in a relationship.

I also want to say that I really appreciate this thread and I’m glad it’s here.


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## ali.di.magix

Croconaw said:


> I’m on the asexual spectrum. I’m honestly a very affectionate person in general, but sex just disgusts me. I’m 23 years old, and haven’t done anything. For me to experience sexual attraction, my emotional bond with that person has to be very strong.


BRUH I have never related to a paragraph more than this lmao. I'm also 23, barely done anything, somewhat sex-repulsed, and I have to be very emotionally attached to someone to feel any sort of sexual attraction!


----------



## Holla

Croconaw said:


> I’m on the asexual spectrum. I’m honestly a very affectionate person in general, but sex just disgusts me. I’m 23 years old, and haven’t done anything. For me to experience sexual attraction, my emotional bond with that person has to be very strong.
> 
> I feel like some people have sex when they’re not ready or when they aren’t into it just because they feel pressured. I don’t understand the importance of sex in a relationship.
> 
> I also want to say that I really appreciate this thread and I’m glad it’s here.



I totally relate to this as well. I’m 25 and the only things I’ve done were because I was pressured/forced to do so and never would have otherwise (I was in a bad controlling type relationship in general but that’s thankfully in the past now).

Recently I’ve gotten into a new relationship with someone more like how I am and it really is nice to have someone who understands how you feel about it. He is almost 29 and hasn’t done anything either. We are both starting to experience attraction towards each other but are in no rush to act on it. We are prioritizing building a strong bond over anything else basically.

I know for a fact I have some lingering repulsion due to my bad past experience but maybe with time that will change. Hard to say right now.

I too am grateful for the support that can be found in this thread.


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## windloft

i feel kind of conflicted with my gender to be honest : my folks are very traditional in terms of gender norms, but they're understanding and want to embrace however i identify myself as. i was born a woman, but growing up i never felt really ... attached to my womanhood. it's just there. i'm just me : i never encountered problems with it and i never saw my interests as being masculine or feminine. it's not anything i lose sleep over, but my identity's just something i want to come to realize and embrace.


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## jiny

i feel v conflicted w my sexuality tbh,, ive been struggling w this for about 2 years now. i want to say that i’m bisexual but idk. i keep trying to convince myself i am straight (i mean i do like men too i have a bf lol but i’ve found myself attracted to girls in the past and have fantasized abt having a relationship w a girl) i don’t have any experience w other girls dating wise (irl atleast), but i’ve had crushes on girls in the past (i had a crush on my best friend in 2019) and ive dated girls but they were all online and didn’t last very long. my parents had found out in 2019 too, and basically lectured me telling me “how can you be bi if you’ve never dated a girl?!” and i didn’t want to tell them that i _have_, because that would probably have made them more upset. they basically shunned me in a way?  i got my phone taken away for abt 3 months and i wasn’t allowed to do anything outside of home :/ and my parents would barely talk to me when i’d get home from school and i dreaded going back home bc it’d be the same thing everyday.

where i’m going with this is, i would admit to myself i’m bi, but i’m so scared to have to go through the same thing with my parents again. that whole thing was kinda traumatizing in a way because idk it was just really bad and i didn’t want to tell anyone what i was going through because i didn’t know what my friends would say. the only person who knew was my best friend and she helped me throughout everything and i’m so thankful because it felt like she was the only one who stayed by me knowing what had happened. i think this went off topic lol, but anyway

tl;dr: i wanna admit to myself that i’m bi bc i’m 98% sure that i am but coming out to my parents scares me because they found out around 2 years ago when i was tryna ,,test the waters w girls online,,  and shunned me for like 3 months :/

also i did this sexual orientation test thingy and these were my results if they’re relevant in any way lol


Spoiler


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> I’m on the asexual spectrum. I’m honestly a very affectionate person in general, but sex just disgusts me. I’m 23 years old, and haven’t done anything. For me to experience sexual attraction, my emotional bond with that person has to be very strong.





ali.di.magix said:


> BRUH I have never related to a paragraph more than this lmao. I'm also 23, barely done anything, somewhat sex-repulsed, and I have to be very emotionally attached to someone to feel any sort of sexual attraction!


If you guys develop any sexual attraction after developing a close bond then you would be referred to as "demisexual." I unfortunately can't relate, I'm 100% apothi/ace lmao. I'm happy to see you guys are coming to terms with yourselves though!! 

edit: I took the same test someone mentioned above and I got this lmao



(I lean ever so slightly towards heterosexuality only because it asked about non-sexual romantic relationships and I have played with the idea of being in a quasi-platonic/somewhat romantic relationship with a guy.)


I also wanted to mention here, that I got my new binder in the mail on Tuesday and I love it so much I never want to take it off! (don't worry tho I've been taking necessary breaks!)


----------



## -Lumi-

syub said:


> i feel v conflicted w my sexuality tbh,, ive been struggling w this for about 2 years now. i want to say that i’m bisexual but idk. i keep trying to convince myself i am straight (i mean i do like men too i have a bf lol but i’ve found myself attracted to girls in the past and have fantasized abt having a relationship w a girl) i don’t have any experience w other girls dating wise (irl atleast), but i’ve had crushes on girls in the past (i had a crush on my best friend in 2019) and ive dated girls but they were all online and didn’t last very long. my parents had found out in 2019 too, and basically lectured me telling me “how can you be bi if you’ve never dated a girl?!” and i didn’t want to tell them that i _have_, because that would probably have made them more upset. they basically shunned me in a way?  i got my phone taken away for abt 3 months and i wasn’t allowed to do anything outside of home :/ and my parents would barely talk to me when i’d get home from school and i dreaded going back home bc it’d be the same thing everyday.
> 
> where i’m going with this is, i would admit to myself i’m bi, but i’m so scared to have to go through the same thing with my parents again. that whole thing was kinda traumatizing in a way because idk it was just really bad and i didn’t want to tell anyone what i was going through because i didn’t know what my friends would say. the only person who knew was my best friend and she helped me throughout everything and i’m so thankful because it felt like she was the only one who stayed by me knowing what had happened. i think this went off topic lol, but anyway
> 
> tl;dr: i wanna admit to myself that i’m bi bc i’m 98% sure that i am but coming out to my parents scares me because they found out around 2 years ago when i was tryna ,,test the waters w girls online,,  and shunned me for like 3 months :/



Aw hey. I'll try and jump in here because I've been in a similar spot before. Although I'm actually just 100% gay, lol. 

I am really, really sorry that you're having such a tough time with this. Figuring out your sexuality can be so hard and it's always much trickier when you're in a situation where you know family, friends, coworkers, or whatever it may be might not be supportive. The way that your parents reacted in 2019 was terrible and I'm so sorry that happened.  

I think it's important to note that you can admit to yourself that you're bisexual without having to tell your parents. If telling them puts your home life at risk (whether that be they might genuinely kick you out _or _just make your time remaining there unpleasant), then I wouldn't be in a rush to come out. Coming out is something that is personal and 100% up to you. You get to choose who you come out to and when. (In a perfect world, anyways! I know sometimes people are outed or other things happen). I'm a lesbian but I'm not out to everybody I meet because it's just not feasible. And that's okay. I'm not any less of a lesbian because I wasn't out to previous co-workers or because I'm not out to my entire family.

It can feel isolating not having them know, so I do sympathize with wanting to tell them. Just know that there isn't a rush to tell them and they don't automatically deserve to know your sexuality because they are your parents, same with your friends, and even your boyfriend. You get to tell them when you're ready and completely comfortable. I've known I was a lesbian since I was 15 or 16 but I didn't come out to anyone properly until I was around 21. 

In regards to the, "how can you know if you've never dated XYZ?" that argument is always completely ridiculous. Straight people can comfortably say they're straight and be secure in their sexuality without having dated/been with the opposite gender and the same goes for bisexual and gay people. 

I really hope that you're doing well though and that whenever you do choose to come out your parents, friends, and boyfriend are supportive.


----------



## jiny

-Lumi- said:


> Aw hey. I'll try and jump in here because I've been in a similar spot before. Although I'm actually just 100% gay, lol.
> 
> I am really, really sorry that you're having such a tough time with this. Figuring out your sexuality can be so hard and it's always much trickier when you're in a situation where you know family, friends, coworkers, or whatever it may be might not be supportive. The way that your parents reacted in 2019 was terrible and I'm so sorry that happened.
> 
> I think it's important to note that you can admit to yourself that you're bisexual without having to tell your parents. If telling them puts your home life at risk (whether that be they might genuinely kick you out _or _just make your time remaining there unpleasant), then I wouldn't be in a rush to come out. Coming out is something that is personal and 100% up to you. You get to choose who you come out to and when. (In a perfect world, anyways! I know sometimes people are outed or other things happen). I'm a lesbian but I'm not out to everybody I meet because it's just not feasible. And that's okay. I'm not any less of a lesbian because I wasn't out to previous co-workers or because I'm not out to my entire family.
> 
> It can feel isolating not having them know, so I do sympathize with wanting to tell them. Just know that there isn't a rush to tell them and they don't automatically deserve to know your sexuality because they are your parents, same with your friends, and even your boyfriend. You get to tell them when you're ready and completely comfortable. I've known I was a lesbian since I was 15 or 16 but I didn't come out to anyone properly until I was around 21.
> 
> In regards to the, "how can you know if you've never dated XYZ?" that argument is always completely ridiculous. Straight people can comfortably say they're straight and be secure in their sexuality without having dated/been with the opposite gender and the same goes for bisexual and gay people.
> 
> I really hope that you're doing well though and that whenever you do choose to come out your parents, friends, and boyfriend are supportive.


thank you so much!! this means a lot. i think i will just take some more time thinking about coming out to myself. i know the argument “how can u know if you’ve never dated x” is ridiculous, although i wish i could’ve tried things out w a girl to know how it feels but i’m super happy with my boyfriend so i don’t see that happening anytime soon.. but i am pretty sure i do like girls too, i don’t think i would really have to try something with a girl to know i like them. but that’s my parents logic. i feel like if i were to tell them while i’m with my boyfriend they’d be like, “how can you say you like girls if you have your boyfriend?” and they’ll probably guilt trip me or something. i really wish they’d be supportive :/ they literally told me “if you had tried things out with a girl and you liked it we would be more understanding” which is also why i brought up i haven’t dated a girl or anything. they thought i was just resorting to girls because guys weren’t talking to me at that time but that isn’t the case at all and i wish they didn’t think like that


----------



## -Lumi-

syub said:


> thank you so much!! this means a lot. i think i will just take some more time thinking about coming out to myself. i know the argument “how can u know if you’ve never dated x” is ridiculous, although i wish i could’ve tried things out w a girl to know how it feels but i’m super happy with my boyfriend so i don’t see that happening anytime soon.. but i am pretty sure i do like girls too, i don’t think i would really have to try something with a girl to know i like them. but that’s my parents logic. i feel like if i were to tell them while i’m with my boyfriend they’d be like, “how can you say you like girls if you have your boyfriend?” and they’ll probably guilt trip me or something. i really wish they’d be supportive :/ they literally told me “if you had tried things out with a girl and you liked it we would be more understanding” which is also why i brought up i haven’t dated a girl or anything. they thought i was just resorting to girls because guys weren’t talking to me at that time but that isn’t the case at all and i wish they didn’t think like that



Oh my goodness no problem at all! It can be so tricky trying to figure things out totally on your own. I'm glad that we have this thread here on The Bell Tree to help talk about things like this.  It took me a long time to come out to myself (I knew I was a lesbian around 15-16 but I didn't admit it properly for a while lol, and then it took even longer to come out to others!) but that's okay. Everybody moves at their own pace and coming out to yourself is a really important step.

Ugh, you'll always have people like that and it makes me roll my eyes. Before I started dating my girlfriend it was, "how do you know _for sure _you're gay if you've never been with a girl?" and now I'm getting the reverse of, "okay, but how do you know you're 100% gay if you've never been with a guy?" Like. Idk Sally how do _you _know you're straight? You've never been with a girl before. I just know, lmao. I have no desire to be with a man, I only want to date women. That's all there is to it for me. I don't personally need to test the waters to confirm that, although I completely understand the people that feel that way. Especially when they're basically pushed to thinking that with all the, "bUt HoW dO yOu KnOw" questions from other people  

It's a really gross way of thinking to insist that somebody doesn't know their own sexuality until they've proven it by somebody else's standards. Nobody's going around saying straight people who haven't dated before aren't actually straight so I don't know why that's an okay thing to say about gay people and bisexual people. I'm really sorry that your parents said that to you and I really wish they didn't think that way, either. I really hope that when you're able to come out that they're more understanding and supportive


----------



## xSuperMario64x

been struggling really badly with my identity the last few days. I keep asking myself "well if you don't identify as a male then why wouldn't you identify as female? if it's because of social expectations you have to remember that's not what defines being female, you as a biological female can be/do anything outside the social construct." but there's something about that logic that's flawed, and there's something in me that says "I'm really ****ing tired of identifying as female so I'm nb" but I don't know what that thing is so it makes it really difficult to explain to people why I don't identify as either gender, or specifically why I don't identify and female anymore even though biologically I am one???

like what is it about the prospect of femininity that pushes me away? I feel like it's the social expectations like being a mother, acting lady-like, wearing certain clothes, behaving a certain way. but technically doing none of those things doesn't makes you less of a female. so I can't pinpoint what it is that makes me more comfortable being nb and it is really irking me. I would like to be able to explain myself to my less-accepting conservative family members and friends.
(I think maybe I just resonate more closely with the idea of having a more masculine identity, though not explicitly male, idk)

I think this is just a case of me having really low self esteem and needing constant outside reassurance to feel validated. I just want to tell the whole world "hey I'm non-binary and this is my new name!" but that's so so difficult to do, especially this late in the school year and in my life (I'm almost 22, I've already established who I am to others, and I'm literally about to graduate in a month or so).


maybe someone here can give me some advice?


----------



## -Lumi-

xSuperMario64x said:


> been struggling really badly with my identity the last few days. I keep asking myself "well if you don't identify as a male then why wouldn't you identify as female? if it's because of social expectations you have to remember that's not what defines being female, you as a biological female can be/do anything outside the social construct." but there's something about that logic that's flawed, and there's something in me that says "I'm really ****ing tired of identifying as female so I'm nb" but I don't know what that thing is so it makes it really difficult to explain to people why I don't identify as either gender, or specifically why I don't identify and female anymore even though biologically I am one???
> 
> like what is it about the prospect of femininity that pushes me away? I feel like it's the social expectations like being a mother, acting lady-like, wearing certain clothes, behaving a certain way. but technically doing none of those things doesn't makes you less of a female. so I can't pinpoint what it is that makes me more comfortable being nb and it is really irking me. I would like to be able to explain myself to my less-accepting conservative family members and friends.
> (I think maybe I just resonate more closely with the idea of having a more masculine identity, though not explicitly male, idk)
> 
> I think this is just a case of me having really low self esteem and needing constant outside reassurance to feel validated. I just want to tell the whole world "hey I'm non-binary and this is my new name!" but that's so so difficult to do, especially this late in the school year and in my life (I'm almost 22, I've already established who I am to others, and I'm literally about to graduate in a month or so).
> 
> 
> maybe someone here can give me some advice?



I just want to start of with the disclaimer that I am cis woman and have always identified and been comfortable with being cis. I'm nowhere near the best person to reply to this _but _I have read a few of your posts lately where you've been struggling with this and it breaks my heart. I just want to reach out and let you know that even if I don't have the answers, I still hear you, yunno? You're not just shouting into the void or anything.  

I feel like being nonbinary is one of those things that is just innate. Like how being gay, bisexual, straight, or asexual is. It's one of those things that's hard to describe because _you just are. _You're not any more or less valid for how you present yourself, or how long it took you to come to terms with your identity, or anything like that. Being almost 22 does not in any way, shape, or form make your coming out journey any less than somebody who's known since they were 16 or 12, or 5 years old. Everybody's journey is different.

Yes, you've established yourself to others but the thing about life is as you live it you also grow and change. 12 year old me would've told you I was straight. 15 year old me would've insisted I was at least bisexual. Now here I am nearly 23 and I'm (mostly, I have my days though) comfortable with accepting that I am a lesbian. In the grand scheme of things you're still really young. Plenty of people don't figure out their sexuality or gender identity until they're older because our families, friends, home towns, schools, etc. can all play a really big role in how easy it is for us to learn these things about ourselves. 

I hear you though, in that the fact coming out at 22 does feel a lot harder than coming out at 15 or 16. I feel like both stages in life come with challenges. Coming out at 16 you get a lot of, "but you're so _young, _how can you know for sure?" and then if you wait it's the opposite of, "you're so _old _surely if this were true you would've said something sooner?". You can't please everybody, the best you can do is try and live a life that's comfortable for you. I think I've read somewhere else that you're staying with your uncle for the summer and he's part of the LGBT+ community and is positive about it? Could staying with him be an opportunity to try out a new name? You'd be in a new place and you might not feel the pressure of, "everybody here already knows me as _old name," _but moving somewhere new you get to introduce yourself as your new name. Hopefully that makes sense!

As a cis woman I can't really speak on being comfortable with masculinity over femininity but I don't think that plays a huge role in your gender. I think that being nonbinary is just your innate sense of self. You either are or you aren't. I'm a cis woman because hearing she/her pronouns, being referred to as a woman, and being seen as a woman is what makes me comfortable. The fact that I also happen to enjoy wearing skirts/dresses, enjoy painting my nails, doing my makeup, etc. aren't what make me a woman in the same vein that me not wanting to be a mother makes me less of a woman. 

There are also plenty of nonbinary people who exist beyond just being androgynous, too! There are nonbinary people who may present more closely with their AGAB or those who may reject their AGAB altogether and one isn't more nonbinary than the other. This is a similar thing we see in lesbian spaces, imo. Not the same, obviously! But feminine lesbians will sometimes get a bad rep for well... being feminine. Because that makes us look more like straight women so in some peoples eyes that means we _are _straight women. But that's ridiculous. How I dress has no barring on my sexuality in the same way that it doesn't affect my gender. Those two things are innate to who I am. Deciding to paint my nails pink doesn't change that. 

I hope that what I've said made sense and hopefully I wasn't overstepping by replying. If I did overstep then let me know and I will edit my post  Regardless I really hope that things get easier for you soon and hopefully some of our lovely nonbinary members will see this and be able to help!


----------



## Foreverfox

xSuperMario64x said:


> been struggling really badly with my identity the last few days. I keep asking myself "well if you don't identify as a male then why wouldn't you identify as female? if it's because of social expectations you have to remember that's not what defines being female, you as a biological female can be/do anything outside the social construct." but there's something about that logic that's flawed, and there's something in me that says "I'm really ****ing tired of identifying as female so I'm nb" but I don't know what that thing is so it makes it really difficult to explain to people why I don't identify as either gender, or specifically why I don't identify and female anymore even though biologically I am one???
> 
> like what is it about the prospect of femininity that pushes me away? I feel like it's the social expectations like being a mother, acting lady-like, wearing certain clothes, behaving a certain way. but technically doing none of those things doesn't makes you less of a female. so I can't pinpoint what it is that makes me more comfortable being nb and it is really irking me. I would like to be able to explain myself to my less-accepting conservative family members and friends.
> (I think maybe I just resonate more closely with the idea of having a more masculine identity, though not explicitly male, idk)
> 
> I think this is just a case of me having really low self esteem and needing constant outside reassurance to feel validated. I just want to tell the whole world "hey I'm non-binary and this is my new name!" but that's so so difficult to do, especially this late in the school year and in my life (I'm almost 22, I've already established who I am to others, and I'm literally about to graduate in a month or so).
> 
> 
> maybe someone here can give me some advice?


Hey! I'm sorry to hear that you're having a hard time. I know making so much progress in coming out to your mom and uncle felt really great, so I can imagine this feels like something you weren't necessarily expecting. I cannot speak to this exactly, as I'm a married cus woman, but I imagine that this is part of the process. Much like how grief has stages, I imagine coming out/fully accepting a new identity has stages too. This is probably one of those stages. You're doing some great critical thinking to figure it out though, and you should be proud of that! Why is bothers you to identify or not identify as female or male may be one of those things that doesn't reveal itself immediately. However, when you DO pinpoint what it is that makes you uncomfortable about identifying as either female or male, and you're able to articulate that in conversation to others, you will feel great, just as you felt after telling your mom and uncle! I hope this helps at least a little, but regardless, I support you and I'm here for you! ❤


----------



## xSuperMario64x

-Lumi- said:


> I just want to start of with the disclaimer that I am cis woman and have always identified and been comfortable with being cis. I'm nowhere near the best person to reply to this _but _I have read a few of your posts lately where you've been struggling with this and it breaks my heart. I just want to reach out and let you know that even if I don't have the answers, I still hear you, yunno? You're not just shouting into the void or anything.
> 
> I feel like being nonbinary is one of those things that is just innate. Like how being gay, bisexual, straight, or asexual is. It's one of those things that's hard to describe because _you just are. _You're not any more or less valid for how you present yourself, or how long it took you to come to terms with your identity, or anything like that. Being almost 22 does not in any way, shape, or form make your coming out journey any less than somebody who's known since they were 16 or 12, or 5 years old. Everybody's journey is different.
> 
> Yes, you've established yourself to others but the thing about life is as you live it you also grow and change. 12 year old me would've told you I was straight. 15 year old me would've insisted I was at least bisexual. Now here I am nearly 23 and I'm (mostly, I have my days though) comfortable with accepting that I am a lesbian. In the grand scheme of things you're still really young. Plenty of people don't figure out their sexuality or gender identity until they're older because our families, friends, home towns, schools, etc. can all play a really big role in how easy it is for us to learn these things about ourselves.
> 
> I hear you though, in that the fact coming out at 22 does feel a lot harder than coming out at 15 or 16. I feel like both stages in life come with challenges. Coming out at 16 you get a lot of, "but you're so _young, _how can you know for sure?" and then if you wait it's the opposite of, "you're so _old _surely if this were true you would've said something sooner?". You can't please everybody, the best you can do is try and live a life that's comfortable for you. I think I've read somewhere else that you're staying with your uncle for the summer and he's part of the LGBT+ community and is positive about it? Could staying with him be an opportunity to try out a new name? You'd be in a new place and you might not feel the pressure of, "everybody here already knows me as _old name," _but moving somewhere new you get to introduce yourself as your new name. Hopefully that makes sense!
> 
> As a cis woman I can't really speak on being comfortable with masculinity over femininity but I don't think that plays a huge role in your gender. I think that being nonbinary is just your innate sense of self. You either are or you aren't. I'm a cis woman because hearing she/her pronouns, being referred to as a woman, and being seen as a woman is what makes me comfortable. The fact that I also happen to enjoy wearing skirts/dresses, enjoy painting my nails, doing my makeup, etc. aren't what make me a woman in the same vein that me not wanting to be a mother makes me less of a woman.
> 
> There are also plenty of nonbinary people who exist beyond just being androgynous, too! There are nonbinary people who may present more closely with their AGAB or those who may reject their AGAB altogether and one isn't more nonbinary than the other. This is a similar thing we see in lesbian spaces, imo. Not the same, obviously! But feminine lesbians will sometimes get a bad rep for well... being feminine. Because that makes us look more like straight women so in some peoples eyes that means we _are _straight women. But that's ridiculous. How I dress has no barring on my sexuality in the same way that it doesn't affect my gender. Those two things are innate to who I am. Deciding to paint my nails pink doesn't change that.
> 
> I hope that what I've said made sense and hopefully I wasn't overstepping by replying. If I did overstep then let me know and I will edit my post  Regardless I really hope that things get easier for you soon and hopefully some of our lovely nonbinary members will see this and be able to help!


I really appreciate it, that's some sound advice. thinking of it as a innate part of me does offer some more insight into it. it's like if someone asked me why I'm non-binary I would prob say "well why are you straight/gay/bi/etc.?" like it's something that you can't completely explain, it's just a part of you. I'm mostly just worried about the fact that I've met so many people through my dad who are traditional conservatives, a lot of them 55+ years old (even my uncle, who is in fact LGBT, had to have me explain what "asexual" and "non-binary" meant lol). I don't want to have to explain it to them. it would be easier for me to tell them and they be like "okay that's cool/fine!" and then go along with it. even if it is just a phase (pretty positive it isn't but who honestly knows) it's always nice to have people be accepting no matter what. 

also yeah, I was thinking the exact same thing with going to Alabama to stay with my uncle. I figure, the only people I know there are my mom's family so it would give me a chance to try meeting new people and going by my preferred name as well as passing myself off as someone who isn't explicitly feminine. preferably I would like it if they never used she/her pronouns. maybe it'll end up working out for me, if so that would prob give me a huge boost of confidence.



Foreverfox said:


> Hey! I'm sorry to hear that you're having a hard time. I know making so much progress in coming out to your mom and uncle felt really great, so I can imagine this feels like something you weren't necessarily expecting. I cannot speak to this exactly, as I'm a married cus woman, but I imagine that this is part of the process. Much like how grief has stages, I imagine coming out/fully accepting a new identity has stages too. This is probably one of those stages. You're doing some great critical thinking to figure it out though, and you should be proud of that! Why is bothers you to identify or not identify as female or male may be one of those things that doesn't reveal itself immediately. However, when you DO pinpoint what it is that makes you uncomfortable about identifying as either female or male, and you're able to articulate that in conversation to others, you will feel great, just as you felt after telling your mom and uncle! I hope this helps at least a little, but regardless, I support you and I'm here for you! ❤


ty friend. coming out to my mom and uncle was really great cause they're so supportive, though it has been a bit tough because my mom has had some memory issues as of late and she occasionally forgets to not refer to me by my old name, or she calls me her (baby) girl. I mean you can't blame her, after calling me that for 21 years it is difficult to just suddenly change the way you talk lol.

I'm definitely working this out in stages. my main goal right now is trying to phase away from physical attributes that would make me appear explicitly female (like I mentioned before I just got my new binder recently and now I can't not wear it in public). I'm trying to find things that make me feel more empowered; one thing I really want to do is get my own suit (not a woman's suit, a man's suit ofc) cause I love dressing up in stuff like that. I just need to break the existing social views on me, and I'm sure as I mentioned previously that that will be much more easy to accomplish if I try to make a fresh start in a new place. 


I think a good way to go about this is for me to remember that gender really is just a social construct. I was just thinking about how my dog doesn't care (or even realize) that he's a boy, he's perfectly content just being who he is. people could take a lesson or two from dogs.


----------



## Chris

It is Lesbian Visibility Day! This day is for celebrating and supporting lesbian, bisexual, transgender, and queer women.

Does anyone have any favourite WLW media that is created by/for women rather than being designed to appeal to the male gaze? I'd personally recommend the TV series _Twenties_ created and written by Lena Waithe and staring Jonica T. Gibbs - both of whom are lesbian women of colour.


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## Rubombee

Vrisnem said:


> It is Lesbian Visibility Day! This day is for celebrating and supporting lesbian, bisexual, transgender, and queer women.
> 
> Does anyone have any favourite WLW media that is created by/for women rather than being designed to appeal to the male gaze? I'd personally recommend the TV series _Twenties_ created and written by Lena Waithe and staring Jonica T. Gibbs - both of whom are lesbian women of colour.


Noelle isn't a woman (nonbinary) but She-Ra is pretty gay :D


----------



## Chris

Rubombee said:


> Noelle isn't a woman (nonbinary) but She-Ra is pretty gay :D


 She-Ra has been on my list of shows to watch for a while but I didn't know this!


----------



## Rubombee

Vrisnem said:


> She-Ra has been on my list of shows to watch for a while but I didn't know this!


It may not be very obvious from the beginning, but I can guarantee there's nice gay in there ;p


----------



## Foreverfox

Rubombee said:


> It may not be very obvious from the beginning, but I can guarantee there's nice gay in there ;p


Yeah, it wasn't obvious to me from the beginning, but I agree, it is obvious later!


----------



## xSuperMario64x

ayyy everyone's favorite apothi/ace back for another ridiculous question because I'm never at ease with my LGBT+ status lmao

so how do you guys define a romantic attraction/relationship? I've been really struggling with defining my romantic orientation because I don't really know all the elements which encompass it, and there seem to be things which are often inherent in romantic relationships that I don't like, but it also seems like not all romantic relationships have those things.



Spoiler: info if anyone wants to help me lol



if it helps I'll describe some of the things I look for in a "romantic" relationship (now I've never been in a relationship like that so this is basically me just imagining things). I've never looked at someone and immediately thought "wow I want to date them." I usually develop some kind of feelings for them after I've grown close to them (leading me to believe I'm potentially demiromantic). I've only ever developed romantic-esque feelings for one friend, and he's a guy; I don't know if I'm interested in women, I'm leaning towards no but it's not out of the question. my idea of dating someone is going everywhere with them and eating with them and playing games and doing activities/hobbies that we both love to do together. I don't like the idea of being really intimate (absolutely not taking off clothes or getting really... touchy) and I don't feel comfortable kissing at all, but I might not object to holding them or curling up in a blanket with them. I would prob always do stuff for them to remind them of how much I adore them (since I can't say "I love you" without feeling awkward for some stupid reason, although I think if I really feel close to them I could normalize saying it).  I imagine myself having a kind of relationship that older married couples have, where they really just love each other unconditionally but they don't expect any intimacy.



basically I'm trying to think about what it is about a romantic relationship that separates it from a queer-platonic relationship. what makes people aromantic? how would I know if I'm aromantic or not? I thought I was but I also kinda love the idea of spending my life w someone in an emotionally close, somewhat intimate and completely non-sexualized relationship. 

someone pls send help ty


----------



## vanivon

Vrisnem said:


> It is Lesbian Visibility Day! This day is for celebrating and supporting lesbian, bisexual, transgender, and queer women.
> 
> Does anyone have any favourite WLW media that is created by/for women rather than being designed to appeal to the male gaze? I'd personally recommend the TV series _Twenties_ created and written by Lena Waithe and staring Jonica T. Gibbs - both of whom are lesbian women of colour.


would like to note that lesbian visibility day is, very specifically, for lesbians -- trans and nonbinary lesbians included, of course, which i'd like to clarify since trans women are mentioned in that listing as a separate entity, but it is very specifically for lesbians. am always happy to uplift and support fellow wlw, and solidarity between different wlw identities is important, but instead of clumping them together it's best to just celebrate them when their own days come by. bi visibility day is i believe september 23rd! and general TDOV for all trans people that aren't specifically the lesbians included in LVD is march 31st!

as for wlw media, i like the manga bloom into you by nio nakatani. it's also got an anime if people prefer to watch rather than read -- it's about a lesbian who doesn't Get romance because she expects feelings for boys to come to her like a big splashy shoujo manga-esque realization, and they don't. a member of student council comes across her turning down a confession and, thinking they're similar people, confesses to her in turn under the request that the MC doesn't actually fall for her. has several WLW characters, including a pair of adults who are seen as essentially role models for the younger ones, that are all taken very seriously. i believe one scene involving a character went viral at one point?


Spoiler: this scene of sayaka saeki, i believe?





__
		https://koito-yuu.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F180413976692
there's a trope known as "class S," or "lesbians until graduation," suggesting that f/f relationships are only temporary schoolgirl whims meant to prepare them for "real" relationships, and this scene was meant to dismantle that.



it's not wlw-specific (although there is a lesbian couple who are very good and important characters and their wedding is a major / main part and focus of the final volume), but i'd also recommend shimanami tasogare by yuhki kamatani. i think it's an incredibly good & important read; it's about a gay teenage boy who moves to the countryside and, feeling alone and suffocated by his inability to come out, stumbles upon a hobby construction company & lounge populated entirely by members of the LGBT community.


Spoiler: content warnings for it, though :




a bunch of slur usage
a lot of internalized homophobia by two main characters, & a lot of external homophobia from side characters
one character struggles from dysphoria they can't quite place and a lot of gender confusion, if that hits hard
a character who constantly misgenders someone (she is dealt with properly, but she does it a lot without batting an eye)
i believe there are mentions/ideations of suicide, but it's been a while since my last re-read so i can't remember correctly





really good read, though. do recommend. has gorgeous art and excellent characters + story.


----------



## Chris

vanivon said:


> would like to note that lesbian visibility day is, very specifically, for lesbians -- trans and nonbinary lesbians included, of course, which i'd like to clarify since trans women are mentioned in that listing as a separate entity, but it is very specifically for lesbians. am always happy to uplift and support fellow wlw, and solidarity between different wlw identities is important, but instead of clumping them together it's best to just celebrate them when their own days come by. bi visibility day is i believe september 23rd! and general TDOV for all trans people that aren't specifically the lesbians included in LVD is march 31st!


It's simply a quote from the Lesbian Visibility Week website.


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> —


I don’t think anything makes people aromantic, as with every other sexuality, we are simply born that way. Aesthetic attraction seems to get mistaken as a simple “I like you and want to be with you” attraction. You can like how someone looks without wanting a relationship with them. There are definitely some people I find attractive and it still confuses me on if I’d want something romantic with them or if I just want to be close friends with that person. I always wanted to experience cuddling or holding hands, simply because I haven’t done it before and it wasn’t due to a lack of wanting to. I was really never in a serious relationship. I have absolutely no clue if I’m aromantic, but I do know that I’m asexual. I don’t understand how some people want anything to do with the parts of our bodies in which we use to go to the bathroom. Honestly, I’m content with having a close friend, but I’m not sure if I’d want anything more than that.

To understand if you’re aromantic, I think you need to look at the type of attraction you’re actually feeling? Do you think the person looks cute and you like their aesthetic (aesthetic attraction) or do you desire a romantic relationship (romantic attraction) with them? You can love the idea of a lifelong friendship and wanting to spend the rest of your life with them as your friend. That’s definitely okay. You just have to figure out _how_ you want to spend your life with them. You don’t have to figure it out right now. It could take some time to come to terms with ourselves... and don’t put too much thought into labels. My problem with labels is that people put definitions on labels on what someone _should_ be, and people try fitting those labels or think negatively of themselves if they can’t fit into the label. Don’t stress yourself out too much wondering what you are. Just be yourself.


----------



## Mistreil

xSuperMario64x said:


> ayyy everyone's favorite apothi/ace back for another ridiculous question because I'm never at ease with my LGBT+ status lmao
> 
> so how do you guys define a romantic attraction/relationship? I've been really struggling with defining my romantic orientation because I don't really know all the elements which encompass it, and there seem to be things which are often inherent in romantic relationships that I don't like, but it also seems like not all romantic relationships have those things.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: info if anyone wants to help me lol
> 
> 
> 
> if it helps I'll describe some of the things I look for in a "romantic" relationship (now I've never been in a relationship like that so this is basically me just imagining things). I've never looked at someone and immediately thought "wow I want to date them." I usually develop some kind of feelings for them after I've grown close to them (leading me to believe I'm potentially demiromantic). I've only ever developed romantic-esque feelings for one friend, and he's a guy; I don't know if I'm interested in women, I'm leaning towards no but it's not out of the question. my idea of dating someone is going everywhere with them and eating with them and playing games and doing activities/hobbies that we both love to do together. I don't like the idea of being really intimate (absolutely not taking off clothes or getting really... touchy) and I don't feel comfortable kissing at all, but I might not object to holding them or curling up in a blanket with them. I would prob always do stuff for them to remind them of how much I adore them (since I can't say "I love you" without feeling awkward for some stupid reason, although I think if I really feel close to them I could normalize saying it).  I imagine myself having a kind of relationship that older married couples have, where they really just love each other unconditionally but they don't expect any intimacy.
> 
> 
> 
> basically I'm trying to think about what it is about a romantic relationship that separates it from a queer-platonic relationship. what makes people aromantic? how would I know if I'm aromantic or not? I thought I was but I also kinda love the idea of spending my life w someone in an emotionally close, somewhat intimate and completely non-sexualized relationship.
> 
> someone pls send help ty


speaking from an aro/ace perspective (with insights from past conversations with both aro and allo friends), i think this comes down to a lot of personal opinions and preference. the people in the relationship get to define whether it's romantic or queer platonic (and there may be disagreements on that within the relationship too, and that's for discussions to resolve.)

as a sort of example: some people are perfectly happy with cuddling with their friends, while others would only ever reserve that for their partner. the action of cuddling itself is neither romantic nor aromantic, but everyone has their own thoughts on what actions are special or reserved for people that are special to them.

i think it's very difficult to try to draw clear boundaries on what's considered romantic and what's not, especially as cultural differences play a part (some cultures being more open with physical contact than others, and vice versa). there's alloromantic people that are touch-averse (or indifferent or repulsed), and to some their relationships may seem more like queer platonic partnerships, but it's up to the individuals involved to make the call on whether their relationship is romantic or not. 

in a similar way, you get to make the decision on what label you feel most comfortable with (and this can change, too! people are fluid, their thoughts change, and so do relationships, the things they want from a relationship, etc.)

you can be aromantic and still desire a close emotional bond with others. if you're more comfortable using the aromantic label, then do so! you don't have to stick with one label for your entire life, and if you find something suits you better, then use that. just as people experience romantic relationships differently, people experience platonic relationships differently too, and queer-platonic ones.


----------



## -Lumi-

Can I just come here for a minute to vent to my fellow LGBT+ peeps about Rune Factory 5 (seemingly) not having same gender marriage in their game?  

It feels like such a petty thing to complain about and I've seen tons of people brush it off and say it's not a big deal but I dunno, it just stings a bit, as somebody who is gay. We saw the remake of Friends of Mineral Town include it, Pioneers of Olive Town includes in, but the game where some of the marriage candidates _aren't even fully human_ doesn't include it? There's just something really off putting about the thought process of, "same gender marriage is too immoral to include in our game but letting somebody marry a bachelor/bachelorette who's part wolf? Sounds good to me!" it just... I dunno. It makes me feel kind of gross, I guess. The game isn't _just _a dating sim and obviously there's more to it than the marriage elements but like... they're _there. _Marrying somebody is a fairly big part of the game and I'm just bitter that same gender marriages don't seem like they'll be included.

I was ready to buy the game day 1 (whenever they give us an English release date, at least) but now I'm not so sure. There hasn't been anything explicitly confirmed (to my knowledge, anyways) but it seems like they not only don't have same gender marriage but they also removed the gender sprite swap thing that Rune Factory 4 had. Which definitely wasn't my favourite thing either - I'm not keen on having to play as a guy for the start of my game, then get to _look _like a girl but still be referred to as a guy all in an effort to marry Forte.


----------



## cornimer

xSuperMario64x said:


> ayyy everyone's favorite apothi/ace back for another ridiculous question because I'm never at ease with my LGBT+ status lmao
> 
> so how do you guys define a romantic attraction/relationship? I've been really struggling with defining my romantic orientation because I don't really know all the elements which encompass it, and there seem to be things which are often inherent in romantic relationships that I don't like, but it also seems like not all romantic relationships have those things.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: info if anyone wants to help me lol
> 
> 
> 
> if it helps I'll describe some of the things I look for in a "romantic" relationship (now I've never been in a relationship like that so this is basically me just imagining things). I've never looked at someone and immediately thought "wow I want to date them." I usually develop some kind of feelings for them after I've grown close to them (leading me to believe I'm potentially demiromantic). I've only ever developed romantic-esque feelings for one friend, and he's a guy; I don't know if I'm interested in women, I'm leaning towards no but it's not out of the question. my idea of dating someone is going everywhere with them and eating with them and playing games and doing activities/hobbies that we both love to do together. I don't like the idea of being really intimate (absolutely not taking off clothes or getting really... touchy) and I don't feel comfortable kissing at all, but I might not object to holding them or curling up in a blanket with them. I would prob always do stuff for them to remind them of how much I adore them (since I can't say "I love you" without feeling awkward for some stupid reason, although I think if I really feel close to them I could normalize saying it).  I imagine myself having a kind of relationship that older married couples have, where they really just love each other unconditionally but they don't expect any intimacy.
> 
> 
> 
> basically I'm trying to think about what it is about a romantic relationship that separates it from a queer-platonic relationship. what makes people aromantic? how would I know if I'm aromantic or not? I thought I was but I also kinda love the idea of spending my life w someone in an emotionally close, somewhat intimate and completely non-sexualized relationship.
> 
> someone pls send help ty


I'm on the ace spectrum but not aromantic. It definitely took _a lot_ of self-reflection for me to be able to distinguish between a close friendship and a romantic interest, but ultimately I determined that the differences for me are:

Thinking about platonic physical intimacy (e.g. handholding and cuddling) a lot - I realized that I don't _crave_ platonic physical intimacy from normal friendships, but I do if I have romantic feelings for someone.
Wanting to be with someone all the time - if I don't talk to a regular friend for one day, I won't think much of it, but if I have romantic feelings for someone I'll continuously think about them/wish I was talking to them.
Imagining living with someone - I don't daydream about living with regular friends, but I do if I have romantic feelings for someone.
Anxiety - if I have romantic feelings for someone, my anxiety will be constantly acting up (e.g. having an anxiety attack if I think there's even a slight chance the person is mad at me); for a regular friend, I'd still be upset by this but the anxiety would be more manageable.
I definitely think these dividing lines would be different for everyone (e.g. some people might crave platonic physical intimacy from all their friends). It's just a matter of figuring out what are the differences in the ways YOU think about certain people, if there are any.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

cornimer said:


> I'm on the ace spectrum but not aromantic. It definitely took _a lot_ of self-reflection for me to be able to distinguish between a close friendship and a romantic interest, but ultimately I determined that the differences for me are:
> 
> Thinking about platonic physical intimacy (e.g. handholding and cuddling) a lot - I realized that I don't _crave_ platonic physical intimacy from normal friendships, but I do if I have romantic feelings for someone.
> Wanting to be with someone all the time - if I don't talk to a regular friend for one day, I won't think much of it, but if I have romantic feelings for someone I'll continuously think about them/wish I was talking to them.
> Imagining living with someone - I don't daydream about living with regular friends, but I do if I have romantic feelings for someone.
> Anxiety - if I have romantic feelings for someone, my anxiety will be constantly acting up (e.g. having an anxiety attack if I think there's even a slight chance the person is mad at me); for a regular friend, I'd still be upset by this but the anxiety would be more manageable.
> I definitely think these dividing lines would be different for everyone (e.g. some people might crave platonic physical intimacy from all their friends). It's just a matter of figuring out what are the differences in the ways YOU think about certain people, if there are any.


out of the replies I've gotten this one is the most helpful. I think the reason why I was so easily able to determine that I'm ace is that, at least to me, sexuality is a pretty cut-and-dry thing and it's clearly defined by certain characteristics. romantic attraction isn't so easy to decipher. it's even harder for me cause, as I (probably) mentioned before, I've never been in a romantic relationship w someone so I'm not even sure exactly where my limits lie. I think for now it would be best for me to leave a label off of my romantic orientation. I may end up never actually labeling it, but I'm okay with that. 

it's funny cause I seem to relate a lot of things you said to my friend whom I've mentioned multiple times in different posts on this forum. I'm too afraid to tell him anything (about how I feel, I never received a lot of affection from my dad so I've always been a bit weary around guys) so ofc we're just friends for now  but I relate to almost everything there. talking to him everyday and getting sad/upset when I don't talk to him for a day? check. imagining living with him? check. anxiety constantly acting up if I feel like he's upset about anything or upset at me? absolutely! only thing I don't really think about is the physical intimacy part, though tbh I'm that way with everyone. I've never really been a touchy-feely person, but I wonder if that would change if I got into an official relationship.

it's so wild cause I've never met him in person, but I've known him online for over four years and his grandma actually lives like 25 min away from my house. I haven't gone to visit yet cause school  I'm hoping to visit this summer though, I often think about all the fun stuff we could do together (cause we have a lot of shared interests). I guess I'll have to see how it goes in the coming months :x

	Post automatically merged: May 21, 2021



-Lumi- said:


> Can I just come here for a minute to vent to my fellow LGBT+ peeps about Rune Factory 5 (seemingly) not having same gender marriage in their game?
> 
> It feels like such a petty thing to complain about and I've seen tons of people brush it off and say it's not a big deal but I dunno, it just stings a bit, as somebody who is gay. We saw the remake of Friends of Mineral Town include it, Pioneers of Olive Town includes in, but the game where some of the marriage candidates _aren't even fully human_ doesn't include it? There's just something really off putting about the thought process of, "same gender marriage is too immoral to include in our game but letting somebody marry a bachelor/bachelorette who's part wolf? Sounds good to me!" it just... I dunno. It makes me feel kind of gross, I guess. The game isn't _just _a dating sim and obviously there's more to it than the marriage elements but like... they're _there. _Marrying somebody is a fairly big part of the game and I'm just bitter that same gender marriages don't seem like they'll be included.
> 
> I was ready to buy the game day 1 (whenever they give us an English release date, at least) but now I'm not so sure. There hasn't been anything explicitly confirmed (to my knowledge, anyways) but it seems like they not only don't have same gender marriage but they also removed the gender sprite swap thing that Rune Factory 4 had. Which definitely wasn't my favourite thing either - I'm not keen on having to play as a guy for the start of my game, then get to _look _like a girl but still be referred to as a guy all in an effort to marry Forte.


this isn't a bad thing at all, I think that the LGBT+ community doesn't get nearly as much attention in popular media as we should. 

I can relate to this too, I started playing Tomodachi Life back in like 2018-2019 and I remember being so upset that Miis who were the same sex/gender can't date or marry each other. there's a slight work around, but it's kinda odd. if you want two guys to date each other one of them has to be labeled as "female." I did this with one of my Miis, everything else (appearance, clothes, etc) were still as if he were a guy but his gender is put as female so he could date one of the other guys, kinda like what you mentioned above.

it's really awkward and it would've been so much easier if they had just given the option for who a particular Mii likes. like maybe on the option screen where it asks for their age/name/etc there could be an option that's like "who is this Mii interested in?" and then you could put men, women, both, or neither. that would be a great place to start. if Nintendo ever makes another Tomodachi Life game and they do that I'm buying it day one.


----------



## FrogslimeOfficial

Dunno if this is the right thread to ask or not, but does anyone have any personal advice on binding safely without a binder?
Last I tried it was a bit hard to breathe.


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## xSuperMario64x

FrogslimeOfficial said:


> Dunno if this is the right thread to ask or not, but does anyone have any personal advice on binding safely without a binder?
> Last I tried it was a bit hard to breathe.


so I went for a few months without a binder, ended up caving in and buying one bc they work reeeeally well. but before I got one I had some tight-fitting sports bras that I would layer on until my chest was as flat as i could get it. I even made them a bit tighter with safety pins but you have to be really careful cause they could suddenly open up. it won't be totally flat (at least, not as flat as a binder could make it) but this method worked okay for me.

I would advise against using an ace bandage since they're made to restrict movement. also don't bind for more than 6-8 hours at a time and also take breaks twice a week!

If you're wondering I got my binder from gc2b and it was a little pricey but totally worth the investment


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## FrogslimeOfficial

xSuperMario64x said:


> so I went for a few months without a binder, ended up caving in and buying one bc they work reeeeally well. but before I got one I had some tight-fitting sports bras that I would layer on until my chest was as flat as i could get it. I even made them a bit tighter with safety pins but you have to be really careful cause they could suddenly open up. it won't be totally flat (at least, not as flat as a binder could make it) but this method worked okay for me.
> 
> I would advise against using an ace bandage since they're made to restrict movement. also don't bind for more than 6-8 hours at a time and also take breaks twice a week!
> 
> If you're wondering I got my binder from gc2b and it was a little pricey but totally worth the investment


Thank you for the tips! I'll try the method, dunno how long it could be before I could by an actual binder lol


----------



## Lady Timpani

Does anybody have recommendations for good LGBT films? I've been getting into movies more in the past year or so and have been mentally compiling a list I'd like to watch, and with Pride month coming up I figured now was a good time to start (although I'll surely be watching them far past June lol I don't have a lot of time).

Some of what I currently have:
Moonlight
Rafiki
My Own Private Idaho
Portrait of a Lady on Fire
But I'm a Cheerleader
Booksmart

Also note "good" is subjective lmao it can be really corny/cheesy/trashy as long as you enjoyed it!


----------



## Chris

Lady Timpani said:


> Does anybody have recommendations for good LGBT films? I've been getting into movies more in the past year or so and have been mentally compiling a list I'd like to watch, and with Pride month coming up I figured now was a good time to start (although I'll surely be watching them far past June lol I don't have a lot of time).
> 
> Some of what I currently have:
> Moonlight
> Rafiki
> My Own Private Idaho
> Portrait of a Lady on Fire
> But I'm a Cheerleader
> Booksmart
> 
> Also note "good" is subjective lmao it can be really corny/cheesy/trashy as long as you enjoyed it!



I would recommend watching_ Pride._ It's based on a true story regarding the 'Lesbians and Gays Support the Miners' campaign (1984-85). _Handsome Devil_ is also a good watch.

I found _G.B.F_. and _Alex Strangelove _entertaining, but not quite as meaningful as the two above.


----------



## cornimer

So I've known I'm some sort of ace-spectrum + lesbian combo for a few years now, but last weekend, I figured out that I also identify as agender and I've felt really free ever since  I'd been reflecting a lot on sex vs gender for a while and came to realize just how much of a social construct gender is, and how I want nothing to do with it anymore


----------



## moonbyu

so.. on saturday, i _*kinda *_came out to my friends and im just really glad about that  we were all on the topic of our sexualities and like i just said "yeah.. to be honest, i can't really see myself with a dude. i discovered some stuff doing quarantine lololo" and they were super accepting of me so yeah, just a random happy vent!!


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## -Lumi-

I Googled pride month just to be sure it really is in June (I will forever doubt my memories lol) and there was a cute surprise! I just wanted to come post about it here because I thought it was a sweet little thing for Google to do.

Happy pride month, everybody! I’ll be keeping out my different coloured roses, prismatic egg, and the newest patch because it’s as close to a rainbow as I can make, lol. 



Spoiler: What happens when you Google Pride Month!










I know we’re still in the pandemic so places may not be able to host full on pride marches but they might still have online pride celebrations that are worth checking out. It’s not the same as an actual march but you’ll still get to celebrate and hear stories/experiences from other LGBT+ people which can be really helpful and reassuring.


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## Shellzilla_515

It seems like I haven't made a post here in this thread. I still identify myself as a straight male, but I just want to say happy pride month to all! I'm noticing more and more LGBT+ members in this forum and I thought now would be a great time to get a better understanding from the community. It looks like there's a lot for me to learn!

I really hope my post doesn't come off as insincere as I want to be supportive and not spread hate. I may come back here to post again so if there's something that might be offensive to the LGBT+ community, please let me know and I'll edit my posts and learn from there.


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## Foreverfox

To start out Pride month, I just want to say - if there is anyone out there whose parents don't accept their identity, I'm your mom now and please feel free to talk to me whenever. ❤ Everyone has the right and deserves to be loved, accepted, and respected, no matter who they are or who they love or don't love!


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## Croconaw

Has anyone ever dealt with insults relating to their sexual orientation just because you don’t agree with someone? It seems like people just resort to personal insults or attacks. I guess that’s part of the internet, but I don’t see why this happens so often online. I just block people like this, especially if they’re so close-minded to insult one’s sexual orientation. I’m working hard not to take things so personally though.


----------



## Chris

Croconaw said:


> Has anyone ever dealt with insults relating to their sexual orientation just because someone you don’t agree with someone? It seems like people just resort to personal insults or attacks. I guess that’s part of the internet, but I don’t see why this happens so often online. I just block people like this, especially if they’re so close-minded to insult one’s sexual orientation. I’m working hard not to take things so personally though.


Constantly. I work for a company that has an online forum and it is the first thing people will bring up against me when I have to take action they disagree with. I have to defer to someone higher up to deal with them each time it happens.

A number of people who behave this way online don't even care that much. They just know the right buttons to press to upset somebody. It's all about getting a reaction out of the other person. Report, block, and move on is the best way to deal with these people.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

cornimer said:


> So I've known I'm some sort of ace-spectrum + lesbian combo for a few years now, but last weekend, I figured out that I also identify as agender and I've felt really free ever since  I'd been reflecting a lot on sex vs gender for a while and came to realize just how much of a social construct gender is, and how I want nothing to do with it anymore


YOU GO FRIENDO, SHOW THAT GENDER SOCIAL CONSTRUCT WHO'S BOSS

also @Shellzilla we always appreciate our straight allies! 


I've been questioning my romantic orientation and while I don't feel I can truly put a label on it since it's in an awkward place between full-blown romantic and queer-platonic, I think I might be pan-romantic. I've never dated anyone before so I'm not 100% sure but I feel like if I met someone whom I get along with really well and love to be with then I wouldn't care at all what their gender identity is (as in, it wouldn't influence my decision). 
ofc it's always gonna be hard for me to find anyone who is willing to accept me as an ace/apothisexual person so I would honestly be happy with anyone who would accept me regardless of their gender/sex.

it would be funny if I ended up being pan-romantic bc pan and ace are like opposite ends of the spectrum (pan- being all inclusive attraction and a- being lack of attraction). being asexual and panromantic is quite an interesting match lol.


----------



## That Marshal Fangirl

cornimer said:


> So I've known I'm some sort of ace-spectrum + lesbian combo for a few years now, but last weekend, I figured out that I also identify as agender and I've felt really free ever since  I'd been reflecting a lot on sex vs gender for a while and came to realize just how much of a social construct gender is, and how I want nothing to do with it anymore



That's awesome!  I'm glad you've figured out something so important about yourself. What pronouns do you prefer so I can refer to you as such?


----------



## Mistreil

xSuperMario64x said:


> it would be funny if I ended up being pan-romantic bc pan and ace are like opposite ends of the spectrum (pan- being all inclusive attraction and a- being lack of attraction). being asexual and panromantic is quite an interesting match lol.


i feel like this might not actually be too uncommon, funny enough!

i initially had thoughts that maybe i was pan because it didn't seem like gender mattered to me at all -- and then i learned that being aro was a thing: i went from "maybe i like anyone and gender doesn't matter" to "i don't like anyone romantically and gender doesn't matter". i'm pretty sure there are people that go the opposite way too!


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## xSuperMario64x

Mistreil said:


> i feel like this might not actually be too uncommon, funny enough!
> 
> i initially had thoughts that maybe i was pan because it didn't seem like gender mattered to me at all -- and then i learned that being aro was a thing: i went from "maybe i like anyone and gender doesn't matter" to "i don't like anyone romantically and gender doesn't matter". i'm pretty sure there are people that go the opposite way too!


I've also considered that i may be aro but I'm pretty sure I'm not aro cause I do enjoy the idea of being in a relationship w someone (even tho I've never been in a rom relationship with anyone). I've had trouble defining what makes a romantic relationship which is why I say I fall into a weird grey area. idk I suppose I could try to put myself out there and see if anything sticks


----------



## Mistreil

xSuperMario64x said:


> I've also considered that i may be aro but I'm pretty sure I'm not aro cause I do enjoy the idea of being in a relationship w someone (even tho I've never been in a rom relationship with anyone). I've had trouble defining what makes a romantic relationship which is why I say I fall into a weird grey area. idk I suppose I could try to put myself out there and see if anything sticks


oh, oops, i totally misworded what i meant! i didn't mean to imply you might be aro, i just meant that if you feel you're panromantic + asexual, you shouldn't feel like that's uncommon!

this was coming from an aro/ace perspective, since i went from thinking i was panromantic to aromantic (but in both cases i still felt i was ace, even before knowing about the ace label)! so i think there's probably a bunch of people with a combination of (aromantic/panromantic) + (asexual/pansexual) -- particularly because there's similarities (i.e. "gender doesn't play in to whether i am (romantically/sexually) (attracted/unattracted) to someone")


----------



## Neb

For pride I decided to edit my profile picture with two flags! One represents my pansexuality and the other my gender fluidity. Hopefully the friend that drew the original pfp doesn’t mind!


----------



## Croconaw

This may end up being a long post, I don’t know. I’ve come to terms with being asexual. I just don’t see the appeal in playing with body parts in which we use to go to the bathroom. Sex never interested me. I’ve also never had sex, but I haven’t exactly been pushing for it either due to lack of interest. I can acknowledge when people are attractive, but it doesn’t do anything to me. I don’t want to be with them, they’re just good looking.

I also may be on the aromantic scale. I have no problems being affectionate but whenever I am, it is in the back of my mind that “I love you, you’re a good friend.” Whenever I feel affection towards another person, it’s on a friendship level and I really want to remain friends with that person. I don’t know if my desire will ever change, but I’ve felt strongly towards people and only wanted to be their best friend or good friends with them.

I’ve been questioning whether or not I may be aromantic, but I’m pretty confident that’s the case. It’s confusing as I do feel affection very strongly, but it stays on a best friend level. I’ve never been kissed, but I haven’t pushed for it either. The thought of being extremely good friends with someone intrigues me more than ever dating someone.


----------



## cornimer

That Marshal Fangirl said:


> That's awesome!  I'm glad you've figured out something so important about yourself. What pronouns do you prefer so I can refer to you as such?


Aw thank you so much for your support Marshal    I'm fine with either she or they pronouns, thanks for asking! Really I only feel weird when people start calling me a "woman" or "lady" haha.


----------



## deSPIRIA

I have been eyeing 👁 this thread since it was bumped and reformed by staff but ive never been sure of what to put here. Draft after draft of. Stuff. That just keeps changing. So i wont be surprised if what i say now evolves into something else later but now i am comfortable enough to talk about it. Last year i finally confronted buried feelings of "maybe i am Probably Not Really a girl exactly" which have been evident throughout my whole life, and over this year i have changed my name, hopefully legally as well one day and i plan on getting more done in the future. However while i like being referred to as masc terms being AFAB is still important to my identity. I dont think identifying solely as a man would fix my dilemma and neither would believing myself to be cis. A few years ago i remember telling myself "I would like it if ppl referred to me as a guy and i went by he/him but i also like being a girl. How does that make sense?" and i guess i cant expect everyone to understand that but it makes perfect sense to me. Pronouns dont inherently equal gender all that good stuff. There are probably specific labels for this out there but idk nonbinary works just fine.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Mistreil said:


> oh, oops, i totally misworded what i meant! i didn't mean to imply you might be aro, i just meant that if you feel you're panromantic + asexual, you shouldn't feel like that's uncommon!
> 
> this was coming from an aro/ace perspective, since i went from thinking i was panromantic to aromantic (but in both cases i still felt i was ace, even before knowing about the ace label)! so i think there's probably a bunch of people with a combination of (aromantic/panromantic) + (asexual/pansexual) -- particularly because there's similarities (i.e. "gender doesn't play in to whether i am (romantically/sexually) (attracted/unattracted) to someone")


oh yeah sorry, I knew what you meant but I was answering in a different way lol xDD 


tbh even if I am aro I prob won't really push that label for myself as much as I do the ace and nb/trans labels. i think some people interpret aromantic as not wanting a romantic relationship at all, and while that may be true for many I still like the idea of a relationship.

I think cupioromantic is the word for this, now that I think abt it I think I am cupioromantic. huzzah! I may finally have this figured out!!


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> oh yeah sorry, I knew what you meant but I was answering in a different way lol xDD
> 
> 
> tbh even if I am aro I prob won't really push that label for myself as much as I do the ace and nb/trans labels. i think some people interpret aromantic as not wanting a romantic relationship at all, and while that may be true for many I still like the idea of a relationship.
> 
> I think cupioromantic is the word for this, now that I think abt it I think I am cupioromantic. huzzah! I may finally have this figured out!!


I just looked up cupioromantic as I’ve never heard of that term being used before. I think it’s a common misconception that aromantic don’t want a relationship although some do fall into that category. They just don’t experience romantic attraction. I like learning about terms that I previously didn’t know about in this thread.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> I just looked up cupioromantic as I’ve never heard of that term being used before. I think it’s a common misconception that aromantic don’t want a relationship although some do fall into that category. They just don’t experience romantic attraction. I like learning about terms that I previously didn’t know about in this thread.


I did some research a while back and learned about the term. at the time I wasn't sure if it applied to me since I'm always holding out hope that I do have some kind of romantic attraction, but tbh I don't want to deny who I am. I've never actually experienced romantic attraction and I've never cared for dating anyone until really recently. after making that post last night I actually feel pretty great abt identifying as cupioromantic so I'm happy about that 

yeah there are always sub-categories within larger lgbt+ groups for more specialized things. like how I fall under asexuality but more specifically apothisexuality (which from my experience seems to be a nearly microscopic sub-group). it's good to learn and be informed about sub-groups so that people in those groups feel more understood/accepted.


----------



## Croconaw

I’ve been reading up on terms within the aromantic spectrum, and I came across this:

Lithromantic or *akoiromantic* people feel romantic attraction but don't want to have it returned. The attraction may also go away when someone does have feelings for them.

This kind of speaks to me, because I can be affectionate and feel love for my friends but not want it to grow past a friendship level. I do have a serious question though, not meaning to be disrespectful in any away so my apologies if it comes off as such.

If you identify under an umbrella term or a sub-category (in my case, akoiromantic under the aromantic spectrum) would it be disrespectful to own or use an aromantic flag? I know a few sub-categories have their own respective flag, so I’m not sure if using the original one would be disrespectful.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> I’ve been reading up on terms within the aromantic spectrum, and I came across this:
> 
> Lithromantic or *akoiromantic* people feel romantic attraction but don't want to have it returned. The attraction may also go away when someone does have feelings for them.
> 
> This kind of speaks to me, because I can be affectionate and feel love for my friends but not want it to grow past a friendship level. I do have a serious question though, not meaning to be disrespectful in any away so my apologies if it comes off as such.
> 
> If you identify under an umbrella term or a sub-category (in my case, akoiromantic under the aromantic spectrum) would it be disrespectful to own or wear an aromantic flag? I know a few sub-categories have their own respective flag, so I’m not sure if using the original one would be disrespectful.


it's absolutely not disrespectful since you're still a part of that umbrella group. people can choose whether they want to identify with the umbrella group or not (like how some non-binary people don't identify as trans even though nb falls under the trans umbrella group, I personally identify as both). it's like how I'm specifically apothisexual but I still identify as ace (I even have an ace flag in my room).

so yes you can still identify as aromantic even if you're specifically lithromantic


----------



## MiniPocketWorld

I want to share an incident that happened basically last year that I still can't get my head around. So I am a straight female that tends to not be super feminine. "Tom boy". So I joined a all women's class mostly of older women than myself last year in the church we have been attending after my husband encouraged me to try it out. I usually don't click well with other females. Any good friends I've ever had who were female were part of the lbgt community. We just did well together. Anywho, the incident that I ran into that puzzles me to this day, is that a few of the ladies there told me, That they were tom boys growing up and "It's ok, I didn't know how to talk to women for a while too. You will eventually." And I am like, huh? I am a woman, you are a woman, What the heck are you trying to say?" You have to "learn" how to talk to women even though you are a woman? Like, wut?
Like, does anyone "get" what is was all about or experienced something similar? Needless to say I haven't really gone back after the class ended. I just didn't see the point as I really didn't have much in common with them. Any interests I have are boring to them and I don't have kids or really like kids... and I am tried of being associated with certain things or expected to do or act just because I have V.


----------



## Croconaw

MiniPocketWorld said:


> I want to share an incident that happened basically last year that I still can't get my head around. So I am a straight female that tends to not be super feminine. "Tom boy". So I joined a all women's class mostly of older women than myself last year in the church we have been attending after my husband encouraged me to try it out. I usually don't click well with other females. Any good friends I've ever had who were female were part of the lbgt community. We just did well together. Anywho, the incident that I ran into that puzzles me to this day, is that a few of the ladies there told me, That they were tom boys growing up and "It's ok, I didn't know how to talk to women for a while too. You will eventually." And I am like, huh? I am a woman, you are a woman, What the heck are you trying to say?" You have to "learn" how to talk to women even though you are a woman? Like, wut?
> Like, does anyone "get" what is was all about or experienced something similar? Needless to say I haven't really gone back after the class ended. I just didn't see the point as I really didn't have much in common with them. Any interests I have are boring to them and I don't have kids or really like kids... and I am tried of being associated with certain things or expected to do or act just because I have V.


That sounds close-minded. I don’t understand what that girl was trying to say, but it comes off as very condescending. I’m glad you no longer surround yourself with those people. It seems like there are stereotypes you have to follow to be considered a girl, and obviously that’s not true. I have short hair and dress very much like a guy, and I sometimes get called derogatory names when people can’t have adult conversations and they resort to personal insults.


----------



## Chris

MiniPocketWorld said:


> I want to share an incident that happened basically last year that I still can't get my head around. So I am a straight female that tends to not be super feminine. "Tom boy". So I joined a all women's class mostly of older women than myself last year in the church we have been attending after my husband encouraged me to try it out. I usually don't click well with other females. Any good friends I've ever had who were female were part of the lbgt community. We just did well together. Anywho, the incident that I ran into that puzzles me to this day, is that a few of the ladies there told me, That they were tom boys growing up and "It's ok, I didn't know how to talk to women for a while too. You will eventually." And I am like, huh? I am a woman, you are a woman, What the heck are you trying to say?" You have to "learn" how to talk to women even though you are a woman? Like, wut?
> Like, does anyone "get" what is was all about or experienced something similar? Needless to say I haven't really gone back after the class ended. I just didn't see the point as I really didn't have much in common with them. Any interests I have are boring to them and I don't have kids or really like kids... and I am tried of being associated with certain things or expected to do or act just because I have V.


They're simply projecting. They struggled to find common ground with other women when they dressed or acted less traditionally feminine, so they are assuming that you have the same struggle. It's stereotyping.


----------



## MiniPocketWorld

Vrisnem said:


> They're simply projecting. They struggled to find common ground with other women when they dressed or acted less traditionally feminine, so they are assuming that you have the same struggle. It's stereotyping.


Maybe you are right but I feel at least today's time period is more accepting for females being more free in themselves than 40 years ago. I suppose it can be a complex topic and is worse with religion mixed in from a certain time period they may have been exposed to. I still find it boggling, but that's ok.

I want to thank both of you for replying. As a side note, I definitely feel, the older I get the more ridiculous people can get about gender rolls/gender social constructs. Or maybe it is just people in general pressing it on me more. There are other incidents but I don't feel like getting much into them right now simply because they are upsetting. (its not just from the same place)


----------



## Croconaw

I do find this generation to be a lot more accepting. Not to generalize, but usually the close-minded individuals tend to be older folks. I think that everyone will be more accepting in the coming years. There’s simply no place for hate.


----------



## Seastar

I'm not really sure what exactly is going on with me.
The one thing I'm sure about is I'm asexual (actually apothisexual as xSuperMario64x said).
But am I also aromantic? I've gone my whole life having no interest in ever dating someone. Probably partly because of my social anxiety, but also apparently I don't even think humans are attractive? 
But I've noticed I feel some sort of romantic attraction towards fictional characters, but _only_ fictional characters. This may be because there is no social interaction with fictional characters.


Spoiler



If you're wondering, at the moment it is mostly female characters from Splatoon, so perhaps I'm gay in some way.


So I don't know, am I really aromantic or not?


----------



## Chris

Seastar said:


> I'm not really sure what exactly is going on with me.
> The one thing I'm sure about is I'm asexual (actually apothisexual as xSuperMario64x said).
> But am I also aromantic? I've gone my whole life having no interest in ever dating someone. Probably partly because of my social anxiety, but also apparently I don't even think humans are attractive?
> But I've noticed I feel some sort of romantic attraction towards fictional characters, but _only_ fictional characters. This may be because there is no social interaction with fictional characters.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> If you're wondering, at the moment it is mostly female characters from Splatoon, so perhaps I'm gay in some way.
> 
> 
> So I don't know, am I really aromantic or not?


Have you heard of the term fictoromantic? It appears to align well with a lot of what you have said here. It could be worth reading into.


----------



## -Lumi-

I officially own some Pride items! I know that for big companies selling pride merch is  just marketing and what not but I am so happy. I’ve never owned anything pride related before and I am just over here in tears because @Saylor is the sweetest friend in the world. 

Disney released a Pride collection this year but shipping to Canada is a hassle. They ship from the States so I was nervous about the shipping cost and any extra duties or taxes they might tack on - I’ve never bought anything internationally before. Saylor is an absolute gem and went out of her way to not only buy me a Stitch pin but!! She snuck in the little lesbian pride pin as well. They’re so cute oh my goodness 

I wanted to come share it here in this thread because A.) I needed to give Saylor a shout out!!!
B.) This is my first Pride where I’m a little more out there and comfortable with myself but I don’t have a strong LGBT+ community in person at the moment. Covid has definitely put a damper on that so I wanted to come share about it here - the little LGBT+ community on TBT. I hope that’s okay.



Spoiler: The pins!!


----------



## Moritz

I know this will be a controversial take, but I think it still fits here.

I genuinely really hate pride.
Like, I just want to be treated and seen as a normal person. And for the most part I am.
But then pride comes along.

Its like a reminder of "hey, don't forget that you're different!"

I get why it exists and I can see why people like it.

But I never feel like an outcast for my sexuality, until society starts trying to remind me about it constantly.

Its kind of like, imagine people started saying how there is nothing wrong with your nose. You might have never even thought there was, but being reassured that something is fine can sometimes just make you feel that it must not be if you need to be told so many times.

And what really annoys me, is when people assume I must really love pride.
To some, being gay must automatically make you a fan of it.

People act like I should celebrate my sexuality but I just don't want to. Its a part of me but only a tiny part of me. It doesn't define me as a person. It's no more a part of me than the fact my hair is black or my eyes are hazel.
Its nothing of note to me. Its just a small part of me.
I'm defined by my thoughts, my actions, my hobbies and interests.

Ironically, pride is the one time of year that I'm not completely comfortable being me.

Sorry for my rant there


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Moritz said:


> I know this will be a controversial take, but I think it still fits here.
> 
> I genuinely really hate pride.
> Like, I just want to be treated and seen as a normal person. And for the most part I am.
> But then pride comes along.
> 
> Its like a reminder of "hey, don't forget that you're different!"
> 
> I get why it exists and I can see why people like it.
> 
> But I never feel like an outcast for my sexuality, until society starts trying to remind me about it constantly.
> 
> Its kind of like, imagine people started saying how there is nothing wrong with your nose. You might have never even thought there was, but being reassured that something is fine can sometimes just make you feel that it must not be if you need to be told so many times.
> 
> And what really annoys me, is when people assume I must really love pride.
> To some, being gay must automatically make you a fan of it.
> 
> People act like I should celebrate my sexuality but I just don't want to. Its a part of me but only a tiny part of me. It doesn't define me as a person. It's no more a part of me than the fact my hair is black or my eyes are hazel.
> Its nothing of note to me. Its just a small part of me.
> I'm defined by my thoughts, my actions, my hobbies and interests.
> 
> Ironically, pride is the one time of year that I'm not completely comfortable being me.
> 
> Sorry for my rant there


that's perfectly fine. I'm really happy that you've accepted your sexuality as simply part of your identity and nothing more. but for some of us we are treated terribly for just being who we are. 

I need pride because I'm still terrified to come out to my dad (and others) as a non-binary/trans person, and so I can't wholly be myself around him (and most people). 
I need pride because I spent my whole childhood believing something was really wrong with me, only to discover near my 20s that I was apothisexual and aromantic. 
I need pride because I shouldn't have to justify asexuality to anyone no matter how "difficult" it is for them to grasp.
I also need pride because part of me still believes that no one can ever truly be in a relationship w me because I'm aroace, lest I be a burden on them.

I think it's really awesome that you're comfortable not defining yourself by your LGBT+ status. I'm not being sarcastic either, I genuinely love that there are non-straight/cis people who don't need pride and can get by just fine. I'm personally not one of those people, pride gives me a sense of community and belonging where I otherwise feel like a complete outsider. pride isn't really about picking out people's differences, it's about celebrating people's differences and reminding them that they are awesome/loved regardless of how they identify.

it is unfortunate that people assume that if you're lgbt+ then you automatically participate in pride. I think it would be wonderful if people never assumed anything about anyone, but people will be who they are and that's that.


----------



## cornimer

Moritz said:


> I know this will be a controversial take, but I think it still fits here.
> 
> I genuinely really hate pride.
> Like, I just want to be treated and seen as a normal person. And for the most part I am.
> But then pride comes along.
> 
> Its like a reminder of "hey, don't forget that you're different!"
> 
> I get why it exists and I can see why people like it.
> 
> But I never feel like an outcast for my sexuality, until society starts trying to remind me about it constantly.
> 
> Its kind of like, imagine people started saying how there is nothing wrong with your nose. You might have never even thought there was, but being reassured that something is fine can sometimes just make you feel that it must not be if you need to be told so many times.
> 
> And what really annoys me, is when people assume I must really love pride.
> To some, being gay must automatically make you a fan of it.
> 
> People act like I should celebrate my sexuality but I just don't want to. Its a part of me but only a tiny part of me. It doesn't define me as a person. It's no more a part of me than the fact my hair is black or my eyes are hazel.
> Its nothing of note to me. Its just a small part of me.
> I'm defined by my thoughts, my actions, my hobbies and interests.
> 
> Ironically, pride is the one time of year that I'm not completely comfortable being me.
> 
> Sorry for my rant there


I definitely understand this point of view! I personally like Pride because since I know not everyone is accepting of LGBTQ2+ people, I appreciate a month of visibility, celebration and (hopefully) some education. I feel like the more people see something, the more likely they are to accept it.

BUT I've also experienced times when I just wanted to be treated 100% normal and for my sexuality to not be viewed as anything different. I really really hate the concept of "coming out" for this reason - if straight people don't have to come out then nobody else should either, in my opinion.

Also, I have a friend who likes to attribute interests etc. to sexual orientation (she identifies as queer herself so it's not that she's misguided, I think she's just still becoming comfortable with her identity) - for example if I send her a picture of my outfit, she'll be like "omg you're looking so gay today!" I imagine she (and probably others) may feel validated to hear that directed at her, but I always feel like "I'm just trying to dress like ME, not specifically highlight my sexuality, that's not relevant"  (P.S. why is there no gender-neutral shrug emoji on TBT )


----------



## Madeline63

The maleiest male to ever male


----------



## cornimer

-Lumi- said:


> I officially own some Pride items! I know that for big companies selling pride merch is  just marketing and what not but I am so happy. I’ve never owned anything pride related before and I am just over here in tears because @Saylor is the sweetest friend in the world.
> 
> Disney released a Pride collection this year but shipping to Canada is a hassle. They ship from the States so I was nervous about the shipping cost and any extra duties or taxes they might tack on - I’ve never bought anything internationally before. Saylor is an absolute gem and went out of her way to not only buy me a Stitch pin but!! She snuck in the little lesbian pride pin as well. They’re so cute oh my goodness
> 
> I wanted to come share it here in this thread because A.) I needed to give Saylor a shout out!!!
> B.) This is my first Pride where I’m a little more out there and comfortable with myself but I don’t have a strong LGBT+ community in person at the moment. Covid has definitely put a damper on that so I wanted to come share about it here - the little LGBT+ community on TBT. I hope that’s okay.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: The pins!!
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 379643


What lovely pins!! That was so kind of Saylor 

I feel you on TBT - I'm only out to a few people irl so I definitely like coming to this thread for a sense of community


----------



## Chris

Moritz said:


> I know this will be a controversial take, but I think it still fits here. <snip>


It's fantastic that you live in an environment where you can feel normal. We're not all that fortunate. What you have is what the rest of us are trying to achieve and LGBT Pride plays a role in our journey to get there.

You of course don't need to love pride. There are many things I dislike about it as well. I find it's easier to focus on the meaning behind why it exists, such as normalising LGBT identities and equal rights, rather than what is on the surface.

I have always been extremely guarded in what I will and won't say on this topic on TBT. I've been thinking recently that as a community leader, and as the person monitoring this thread, that perhaps it would be better if I speak more openly on it. What better time to do so that during pride month? So I've included a little about myself under the spoiler for whoever is interested.



Spoiler: NSFW/TW: mentions of sexual encounters, childhood sexual abuse, gay-bashing.



I've been out as non-cishet IRL for 15+ years. Graysexual and date all genders. I'm the sort of person who will take you for a passionate weekend away and then won't bear to let you touch me for the next six months - and usually my relationships won't last that 'recharge' period unless I force myself to partake anyway. I've become less inclined to do that as time goes on and usually I'll end the relationship instead - or won't bother even getting into one before hopping into bed so as to avoid the inevitable fallout. Call me every name under the sun for that one I've heard them all before. I was anally raped 23 years ago and while I'd say I'm "over it"—_in that I don't dwell on it and I don't experience PTSD_—I believe that it has likely shaped my unhealthy relationship with sex. Long-term relationships only work for me when the other person is okay with infrequent sexual contact and understands that my disinterest is not relative to their physical attractiveness.

I have not yet encountered a term I feel fits my gender identity. I use non-binary because it's vague while still being universally understood. I have alternated between presenting as stereotypically masculine or feminine several times in the past 15+ years, and also changed my name various times as well (I've not gone by my dead name since 2003). I'm finally legally changing my name to something gender-neutral this month after arguing with my mother about it for ~12 years. Working from home has had people suddenly reverting to using my dead name because it appears in both my work and university email addresses. No matter how I sign my email or how many times I have asked them not to call me by this name they still continue to do so. They will respect my request for a day or two, then they will go back to using the wrong name again. Then I look ignorant in meetings because I don't recognise this name as my own when it's said aloud because I haven't used it in 18 years. For example, when I have a dentist appointment I need to be actively listening to everything that is happening around me in the waiting room otherwise I won't hear it. I'm starting somewhere new this autumn and I want to go into it without having to deal with this nonsense anymore. My best friend of 25yrs (also a TBT member) has kindly said they'll be my witness.

I've been verbally and physically assaulted for being LGBT - the latter occurring as recently as May 8th of this year where two blokes attacked me in the street. One instance last year had no less than eight lads trapping me inside a train station shelter while hammering their fists against the glass and shouting - it was dark and I was alone.

I cut off my devout Catholic grandmother in December 2020 because after years of her publicly disrespecting me I had had enough of her behaviour - my father (her son) not only supported that decision but was also the one to propose it.

I've spent five years campaigning for LGBT rights in the context of student politics and even longer producing media containing LGBT representation. My target audience is typically men because I feel toxic masculinity plays a large role in LGBT intolerance. The majority of the abuse I receive is from men, anyway.  Change the world one uneducated fool at a time. 

In happier news, I'm getting a pride tattoo tomorrow. I was nervous to ask my tattoo artist about it, but I'm going to be in the studio for a larger piece so asked her a couple of days ago if we would have time to do it while I'm there. Her response? _"Of course I can squeeze that in, always time for a pride tattoo! ❤"_


----------



## Croconaw

I’m happy this thread exists. It’s nice reading through some of the replies. I’m glad we have an accepting space. For the past few years, I wasn’t really sure what my orientation was. I just knew it wasn’t straight. I was unaware of the umbrella terms that fall under the sexualities and that sexuality was a spectrum.

I identify as _lithromantic_ which basically means that I feel romantic attraction (in my case, it’s to a high extent) but I don’t want to have it returned. For a long time, I just thought I was weird. I’d get crushes on people and even become affectionate with them. I don’t mean kissing (I’ve never actually been kissed before), but hugging and other touching. I don’t mind being hugged or touched in return. That’s not the issue. It’s when _the person shows signs of actually liking me_ in a romantic way. Whenever the other person would show any signs of reciprocation, I’d freak out or even lose interest. I would show affection, but only want to remain friends or best friends.

I feel that being lithromantic is a struggle because sometimes we are misconceived as rude for showing affection for someone, and not wanting it returned or suddenly losing interest. I had no idea of this sexual orientation but after looking into it, it makes so much sense. I honestly wish that I wasn’t this way, but I’m starting to come to terms with it. I’m okay with showing affection, but it must remain on a friendship level.

I’m happy that I’m finally discovering and coming to terms with who I am. My full orientation is lithromantic-asexual. I’m one of the sex-repulsed aces. I hope everyone is okay this pride month!


----------



## Shellzilla_515

Croconaw said:


> I’m happy this thread exists. It’s nice reading through some of the replies. I’m glad we have an accepting space. For the past few years, I wasn’t really sure what my orientation was. I just knew it wasn’t straight. I was unaware of the umbrella terms that fall under the sexualities and that sexuality was a spectrum.
> 
> I identify as _lithromantic_ which basically means that I feel romantic attraction (in my case, it’s to a high extent) but I don’t want to have it returned. For a long time, I just thought I was weird. I’d get crushes on people and even become affectionate with them. I don’t mean kissing (I’ve never actually been kissed before), but hugging and other touching. I don’t mind being hugged or touched in return. That’s not the issue. It’s when _the person shows signs of actually liking me_ in a romantic way. Whenever the other person would show any signs of reciprocation, I’d freak out or even lose interest. I would show affection, but only want to remain friends or best friends.
> 
> I feel that being lithromantic is a struggle because sometimes we are misconceived as rude for showing affection for someone, and not wanting it returned or suddenly losing interest. I had no idea of this sexual orientation but after looking into it, it makes so much sense. I honestly wish that I wasn’t this way, but I’m starting to come to terms with it. I’m okay with showing affection, but it must remain on a friendship level.
> 
> I’m happy that I’m finally discovering and coming to terms with who I am. My full orientation is lithromantic-asexual. I’m one of the sex-repulsed aces. I hope everyone is okay this pride month!


I'm glad you feel happy in this thread and discovering who you are! I'll admit, I'm still learning the different terms which is one of the reasons why I'm in this thread. 



Spoiler: side note



On a side note, I don't get why some people hate others just because of their sexual orientation. It never really sits well with me, especially when my dad always seems to shed negative thoughts about them. My point being is, there's more to the person than how they identify themselves and that we should treat other human beings decently.


----------



## Chris

Had a very simple pride tattoo done today. Somehow this was more painful than the 2.5hrs spent on a thigh piece.



Spoiler: TW: Blood and swelling.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> I’m happy this thread exists. It’s nice reading through some of the replies. I’m glad we have an accepting space. For the past few years, I wasn’t really sure what my orientation was. I just knew it wasn’t straight. I was unaware of the umbrella terms that fall under the sexualities and that sexuality was a spectrum.
> 
> I identify as _lithromantic_ which basically means that I feel romantic attraction (in my case, it’s to a high extent) but I don’t want to have it returned. For a long time, I just thought I was weird. I’d get crushes on people and even become affectionate with them. I don’t mean kissing (I’ve never actually been kissed before), but hugging and other touching. I don’t mind being hugged or touched in return. That’s not the issue. It’s when _the person shows signs of actually liking me_ in a romantic way. Whenever the other person would show any signs of reciprocation, I’d freak out or even lose interest. I would show affection, but only want to remain friends or best friends.
> 
> I feel that being lithromantic is a struggle because sometimes we are misconceived as rude for showing affection for someone, and not wanting it returned or suddenly losing interest. I had no idea of this sexual orientation but after looking into it, it makes so much sense. I honestly wish that I wasn’t this way, but I’m starting to come to terms with it. I’m okay with showing affection, but it must remain on a friendship level.
> 
> I’m happy that I’m finally discovering and coming to terms with who I am. My full orientation is lithromantic-asexual. I’m one of the sex-repulsed aces. I hope everyone is okay this pride month!


yay I'm glad you got it figured out! (SO to all those who are still questioning, you guys rock too!)

also apothisexual squad unite


----------



## LadyDestani

So I've been following this thread for a while, but not sure whether to post or not. But something happened recently at work that's pushed me to do so.

We have a Diversity & Inclusion Committee and they sent out a voluntary survey requesting people to answer questions about how they identify so they could use the results to figure out how to make the most impact. The results would all be anonymous, of course, to respect everyone's privacy. The survey covered race, gender, sexuality, disabilities and so on.

I had no trouble answering any of the questions until it came to sexuality. I'm 41 years old, in a heterosexual marriage, have only been in heterosexual relationships, but I didn't feel comfortable marking myself as heterosexual because I have definitely felt attraction to people of other genders. I also didn't feel comfortable marking myself as bi or pan because I have no experience with non-hetero relationships and doubt I ever will at this point so to identify as such feels disingenuous. So I left the question blank.

I've never really thought much about labeling my sexuality. I am attracted to whoever I'm attracted to. I've only been with males mostly because I never initiate anything and only males have approached me. I also think I favor males from a romantic perspective because I am not overly feminine myself and I like being in a relationship with someone who shares similar qualities. So I've generally clicked more with males than females in both friendship and romance based on that, but that certainly doesn't exclude females if they had the traits I was looking for.

Having read through this thread and in particular some of the more recent posts, I've learned that romantic and sexual attraction can be separate. So in that regard, I think I'm equally attracted to other genders sexually, but it has just so happened that based on the people I've met I've been more romantically attracted to males.

I don't know. It's just something that's been on my mind lately due to that survey, but it doesn't keep me up at night. In the end, I'm still the same person. I just felt like I needed to get my thoughts out there and this felt like an appropriate place to do so.

Either way, I do want to state my support for all of you here. You're all wonderful and shouldn't need to explain or validate yourself to anyone. I hope one day we can live in a world like that.


----------



## Chris

@LadyDestani however you wish to identify is valid, regardless of whether or not you have the experience to 'back it up' per se. Please don't feel as if it is disingenuous to adopt a label if you feel it fits.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

LadyDestani said:


> snip


I'm personally really glad that questioning sexuality/romantic attraction/gender identity is becoming more apparent and accepted these days, I know we've still got a ways to go but I like to see that you've given it some thought even if you didn't really get anywhere with it.

one thing I can remark about is that, like you mentioned, sexual and romantic attraction are two different things. so you could possibly be straight but also be bi-romantic. also consider that you don't have to be equally attracted to two different genders to be bi, you could be 95% attracted to men and 5% attracted to women and you would still be bi. I suppose at this point it would be too late to think about it relationship-wise since you're already in a relationship with someone. but making a discovery related to LGBT+ is always great no matter what age you are  



I'm getting the feeling that I've helped quite a few people here with what I've posted recently. I'm really happy that I'm making an impact on people's lives. I'm considering joining a local LGBT+ group and maybe I could become a spokesperson/representative for them! I have a lot of passion for this kind of thing so I would probably love it


----------



## LadyDestani

@Vrisnem @xSuperMario64x 

Thank you both! I was really concerned that because of my particular situation I might come across as insincere, insensitive, or even disrespectful in some way. I know many have suffered hardships, harassment, and prejudice due to their sexuality, while I have never faced anything like that due to not really having to make it publicly known that I had these feelings. The only people who know are my husband and a very few close friends and it wasn't so much a 'coming out' to them as it just worked its way into normal conversations.



xSuperMario64x said:


> I'm getting the feeling that I've helped quite a few people here with what I've posted recently. I'm really happy that I'm making an impact on people's lives. I'm considering joining a local LGBT+ group and maybe I could become a spokesperson/representative for them! I have a lot of passion for this kind of thing so I would probably love it


Your posts have been very informative. If this is something you want to do and feel passionate about, I think you should go for it!


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> -


I really think you should go for it. You’d be great at it. Even helping one person makes it worthwhile, but you’ll change lots of lives. I find motivational speaking or public speaking very rewarding, especially if it makes you happy. If it’s something you want to do, go for it.


----------



## Stella-Io

Okay so I've known that I'm pansexual af since my junior year of high school (I know that can be seen as kinda 'late' to realize my sexuality but in my defense, I never gave dating and attraction preference alot of thought).

BUT in recent years, I've been wondering about my gender. I think I'm not exactly cis, and I think I fall under the non-binary umbrella. I thought I was fine with being seen as a girl for the most part, but highly gendered terms like ma'am make me uncomfortable. Whenever someone uses them to me I think 'ew' or 'I don't want to be seen as that' or 'please don't use that for me'. I don't want to be seen as girly as I am now. I would much rather people refer to me with more gender neutral terms or even some guy terms. Like dude and bro are fine for me cause I use them as a 'gender neutral' terms and use them casually. **This does not everyone else sees them that way as some people do see them as having gender to them so you shouldn't just call anyone dude or bro.**
I use they/them pronouns online too to avoid gendered pronouns (thou I know misgendering, whether by accident or on purpose, will happen).

For looks I'm all over the place. I want a more androgynous look, but some days I want to look typically masculine and some days I want to look really femme. The femme one doesn't happen often thou, I more so lean to the androgynous or masc looks. I don't want any surgery to reconstruct anythin either, I'm fine with what I have. I do like to wear a tighter sports bra thou that 'binds' my breasts a little more and makes them look smaller.

I kind of don't care about my gender but I kinda do in terms of appearance and what terms people refer to me as. I feel kinda bad thou cause I fill that stereotype of 'AFAB white who wants to look androgynous' and I don't want to feed into that stereotype cause it can make other people look bad. Not really sure what term fits me (pangender, non-binary, agender terms like that ect...) so atm I haven't been using any term, just gender-somethin.


----------



## Chris

Stella-Io said:


> Not really sure what term fits me (pangender, non-binary, agender terms like that ect...) so atm I haven't been using any term, just gender-somethin.


I can relate to this lack of certainty on terms. I've known since 2003 that I'm not cisgender, and I've gone back on forth and how I present over the years (to the point I've lived approx half my life presenting as male and the other half presenting as female), and yet I *still* cannot give you a specific label to say exactly _what_ I am. I say non-binary because it's a catch-all non-specific term, and I don't think I'm ever going to have a better word for it than that. And I've come to realise that that's okay. There doesn't need to be an exact word that fits. Or a label that feels like it fits today might not a year from now. You don't have to pick one if it doesn't feel right.

I don't know of the stereotype you're referring to, but I wouldn't recommend holding back from expressing your authentic self for this reason. It's not healthy to hide who you are for other people's sake.


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## Stella-Io

Vrisnem said:


> I can relate to this lack of certainty on terms. I've known since 2003 that I'm not cisgender, and I've gone back on forth and how I present over the years (to the point I've lived approx half my life presenting as male and the other half presenting as female), and yet I *still* cannot give you a specific label to say exactly _what_ I am. I say non-binary because it's a catch-all non-specific term, and I don't think I'm ever going to have a better word for it than that. And I've come to realise that that's okay. There doesn't need to be an exact word that fits. Or a label that fits like it fits today might not a year from now. You don't have to pick one if it doesn't feel right.
> 
> I don't know of the stereotype you're referring to, but I wouldn't recommend holding back from expressing your authentic self for this reason. It's not healthy to hide who you are for other people's sake.




Thanks for responding!

So far I've done small things for the look I want, such as getting my hair cut really short and shaved, a not so femme look. Like, a guy could have my style and it looks a little more androgynous. Also buying guys clothes like t-shirts and belts. I also really like some guys shoes but haven't found a pair that fit me, so I haven't bought any yet. I def do still look throu the section cause dang guys have some nice lookin boots. I have yet to do a full wardrobe change that I'd like, cause money, time, fitting rooms are still closed here, stuff like that.


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## xSuperMario64x

so my mom basically outed me to my dad and..... yeah it's going just as well as I expected it to  

I'm not really mad that she outed me. I didn't tell her that she could tell my dad but I was already gonna tell him right before I left for my trip so I don't really care. what really bothers me is how he took it.



Spoiler: message he sent my mom











he's basically treating this like:
1. this is something that they "brainwashed into me at school"
2. this is something that literally just came up and it's like a trend
3. it's abuse
4. it's something that I will deeply regret later in my life

I honestly have no words for this. I underestimated how ****ing ignorant and selfish he can be. if I become suicidal it'll be his fault and no one elses.


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## Alienfish

Moritz said:


> Its a part of me but only a tiny part of me. It doesn't define me as a person. It's no more a part of me than the fact my hair is black or my eyes are hazel.
> Its nothing of note to me. Its just a small part of me.
> I'm defined by my thoughts, my actions, my hobbies and interests.


Thank you for posting this, I feel exactly like this(bisexual) and I'm not that loud n proud (internet) person that cares to post it everywhere. It is what I am/like/love and, it's just me nothing I feel the need of placing everywhere. If people want to do so, go ahead but I think some parts of the community needs accept that there are people who are comfortable with things being like you posted. And yeah to clarify, I definitely don't have anything against Pride celebrations and stuff, heck I probably would have partaken if it was better done here.

	Post automatically merged: Jun 14, 2021

@xSuperMario64x Good lord ...I just.. read that text and I'm so sorry  I mean the least they could do is educate themselves and also not spill that bs everywhere.


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## oak

xSuperMario64x said:


> so my mom basically outed me to my dad and..... yeah it's going just as well as I expected it to
> 
> I'm not really mad that she outed me. I didn't tell her that she could tell my dad but I was already gonna tell him right before I left for my trip so I don't really care. what really bothers me is how he took it.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: message he sent my mom
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> he's basically treating this like:
> 1. this is something that they "brainwashed into me at school"
> 2. this is something that literally just came up and it's like a trend
> 3. it's abuse
> 4. it's something that I will deeply regret later in my life
> 
> I honestly have no words for this. I underestimated how ****ing ignorant and selfish he can be. if I become suicidal it'll be his fault and no one elses.


First reactions aren't always the best, although in this situation I know your dad has been terrible to you in the past. My mom was also upset and said I was going through a phase when I came out to her in 2012 but she's better about it now. She was never as close minded as your dad though so I'm sorry he talks this way to you & your mom.


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## moo_nieu

xSuperMario64x said:


> so my mom basically outed me to my dad and..... yeah it's going just as well as I expected it to
> 
> I'm not really mad that she outed me. I didn't tell her that she could tell my dad but I was already gonna tell him right before I left for my trip so I don't really care. what really bothers me is how he took it.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: message he sent my mom
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> he's basically treating this like:
> 1. this is something that they "brainwashed into me at school"
> 2. this is something that literally just came up and it's like a trend
> 3. it's abuse
> 4. it's something that I will deeply regret later in my life
> 
> I honestly have no words for this. I underestimated how ****ing ignorant and selfish he can be. if I become suicidal it'll be his fault and no one elses.


im so sorry. my parents say the same with additions of religion which is why i havent come out to them. i hope your dad drops this and accepts you the way you are. these comments make me so furious and i hate that its happening in your home :C god i am just so mad. i hope this doesnt continue for you. sending you virtual hugs   feel free to pm me if you want


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## Alienfish

Moo_Nieu said:


> these comments make me so furious and i hate that its happening in your home :C god i am just so mad. i hope this doesnt continue for you.


this...like.. i mean i know things are bad with your parents but this is just..even as a first reaction they shouldn't just don't this.. ugh  probably too common but, man just... ughh.

i really really hope things will get better soon for you, sending hugs as well


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## Shellzilla_515

xSuperMario64x said:


> snip


Dang... I don't like how your dad reacted to this. Instead of trying to understand you better, he does this and seemingly makes you look like a villain? I already know he doesn't react well to lgbt+ groups, but trying to point blame at you and your mother shouldn't be the way to go. I hope your mother doesn't change her views simply from your dad's text. 

Please don't think your sexuality would bring you down. You're more than that and I think you're a kind person. Please hang in there! If you need to talk, let any one of us know! I'm sending you virtual hugs.


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## xSuperMario64x

thank you, everyone, for your concern. I haven't talked to my dad yet, I told my mom if he wants to talk to me then he needs to approach me first. I'll give an update on what's going on.

so I talked to my mom this morning and she said that it's very likely that my dad wasn't intentionally being transphobic. which honestly, I'm inclined to believe because he doesn't know how to control his emotions and so he just blurts stuff out without any regard to people's feelings. what he said was still very hurtful to me though, and if we're gonna talk he needs to first and foremost apologize for what he said.

after talking with my mom for a while I kinda get where he's coming from. he grew up in eastern Ohio (which, in case you didn't know, is basically hillbilly territory, that's really close to West Virginia and Pennsylvania) and he was never exposed to LGBT+ ideas/people as a kid. he's only personally known one trans person (I and my mom also know them), and they have a lot of issues that has nothing to do with being trans and somehow the association has tainted my dad's view of trans people. not to mention he's a conservative republican and he's one of those people who has allowed biased conservative talk radio and news to absorb into his entire being, and as far as I know extreme conservatives often have nothing good to say about trans people.

but I told my mom that he needs to stop generalizing the trans community. just because one person has transitioned multiple times and claims it to be "child abuse" doesn't mean that I will have the same experience. and yeah I didn't realize I was nb until back in January but it was such a huge relief when I realized that I didn't actually identify as cisgender. basically my whole life from puberty until then had been building up to that moment. my dad needs to understand that I'm actually becoming comfortable with myself now. if he wants to know about my individual non-binary/trans experience then he needs to talk to _me_ about it and not look up some conservative bs he found somewhere on the internet.

I really just need his support, no advice. I hope he realizes that soon enough.


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## LadyDestani

@xSuperMario64x 

I'm so sorry you're going through this with your dad. It's not right for anyone to belittle you for who you are or the choices you make with your own body.

I know I've never been in your exact situation, but I had a very conservative father as well and we had a falling out when I was in high school due to his racism. He never completely changed, but he did mellow over time, especially when I moved away from home because that's when he realized he might truly never see me again.

I will be wishing for the best for you and sending you all my support.


----------



## Hat'

I've been struggling with my gender identity as of late. I'm sorry if I don't use the correct terms or anything like that, english isn't my first language so if use anything offensive or that has a negative connotation I'm sorry, please correct me.
I'm an amab and I'm gay but I'm a bit lost tbh.
I've always been fine with identifying as a man, and I never really questionned it until quite recently.
I remember how, when I was a kid, I've always wanted to be a girl. But eventually I moved on after being bullied for being too feminine during middle school, and I kinda stopped... well, being me.
Now that I live alone, I've been more able to express my feminity using cheap clothing sites such as Vinted or Shein (don't blame me please I'm poor and clothes are way too expensive). I remember ordering my first pair of heels and my first dress and let me tell you, I've never felt more at ease with my body than after that. It also made me feel really good that the dress had padding, not in a weird way, just seeing my body like this made me feel so happy.
So I know I absolutely love """""feminine""""""" (I hate saying this, it's literally just fabric...) and cute clothes but I would never ever dare go outside like this, at least not in my current mental state.
I've thought about me maybe being trans or nb but I really don't know... I just don't care about gender that much, I just want to be inbetween with no set gender "rules" but I don't feel... legitimate... (?) to be identifying as something other than cis.
I'm sorry if I overshared kgfjldms I just feel safe talking about those things here.


----------



## Foreverfox

Shellzilla said:


> I'm glad you feel happy in this thread and discovering who you are! I'll admit, I'm still learning the different terms which is one of the reasons why I'm in this thread.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: side note
> 
> 
> 
> On a side note, I don't get why some people hate others just because of their sexual orientation. It never really sits well with me, especially when my dad always seems to shed negative thoughts about them. My point being is, there's more to the person than how they identify themselves and that we should treat other human beings decently.


I'm still learning all of the terms too, but it's extremely important to me to support everyone - those who are discovering who they are or those who've known who they are for several years. We all need support. ❤


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## cornimer

Hat' said:


> I've been struggling with my gender identity as of late. I'm sorry if I don't use the correct terms or anything like that, english isn't my first language so if use anything offensive or that has a negative connotation I'm sorry, please correct me.
> I'm an amab and I'm gay but I'm a bit lost tbh.
> I've always been fine with identifying as a man, and I never really questionned it until quite recently.
> I remember how, when I was a kid, I've always wanted to be a girl. But eventually I moved on after being bullied for being too feminine during middle school, and I kinda stopped... well, being me.
> Now that I live alone, I've been more able to express my feminity using cheap clothing sites such as Vinted or Shein (don't blame me please I'm poor and clothes are way too expensive). I remember ordering my first pair of heels and my first dress and let me tell you, I've never felt more at ease with my body than after that. It also made me feel really good that the dress had padding, not in a weird way, just seeing my body like this made me feel so happy.
> So I know I absolutely love """""feminine""""""" (I hate saying this, it's literally just fabric...) and cute clothes but I would never ever dare go outside like this, at least not in my current mental state.
> I've thought about me maybe being trans or nb but I really don't know... I just don't care about gender that much, I just want to be inbetween with no set gender "rules" but I don't feel... legitimate... (?) to be identifying as something other than cis.
> I'm sorry if I overshared kgfjldms I just feel safe talking about those things here.


Just wanted to say whatever gender identity feels best to you is absolutely legitamate! You don't have any obligation to be cis nor do you need a special pass to identify as trans or nb, gender is just a social construct and you can identify whichever way is most authentic to you 

I really don't care about the concept of gender either which is why I ultimately decided that I feel best identifying as agender. I really just see myself as a person who likes what they like and doesn't need to be labelled.


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## Stella-Io

Hat' said:


> I've been struggling with my gender identity as of late. I'm sorry if I don't use the correct terms or anything like that, english isn't my first language so if use anything offensive or that has a negative connotation I'm sorry, please correct me.
> I'm an amab and I'm gay but I'm a bit lost tbh.
> I've always been fine with identifying as a man, and I never really questionned it until quite recently.
> I remember how, when I was a kid, I've always wanted to be a girl. But eventually I moved on after being bullied for being too feminine during middle school, and I kinda stopped... well, being me.
> Now that I live alone, I've been more able to express my feminity using cheap clothing sites such as Vinted or Shein (don't blame me please I'm poor and clothes are way too expensive). I remember ordering my first pair of heels and my first dress and let me tell you, I've never felt more at ease with my body than after that. It also made me feel really good that the dress had padding, not in a weird way, just seeing my body like this made me feel so happy.
> So I know I absolutely love """""feminine""""""" (I hate saying this, it's literally just fabric...) and cute clothes but I would never ever dare go outside like this, at least not in my current mental state.
> I've thought about me maybe being trans or nb but I really don't know... I just don't care about gender that much, I just want to be inbetween with no set gender "rules" but I don't feel... legitimate... (?) to be identifying as something other than cis.
> I'm sorry if I overshared kgfjldms I just feel safe talking about those things here.



I'm almost in the same exact situation you described (thou I'm afab and pansexual) but other than that alot you have said I feel to. And tbh I also don't have a legit answer on what term to use. I've been using non-binary as an umbrella term for now, since it can also be used like that. I also avoid using any terms for myself cause idk which one 'fits'.

But the last part you said, you def are legitimate enough to want to identify as somethin other than cis. It's more than okay that you're fine with being seen as male to others while still wanting and doing things that aren't the typical 'male' stuff, and even doing more feminine things (I use these terms just as what it typically associated with them, clothes have no gender to them and you can wear whatever you want).


----------



## Chris

Hat' said:


> I've been struggling with my gender identity as of late. I'm sorry if I don't use the correct terms or anything like that, english isn't my first language so if use anything offensive or that has a negative connotation I'm sorry, please correct me.
> I'm an amab and I'm gay but I'm a bit lost tbh.
> I've always been fine with identifying as a man, and I never really questionned it until quite recently.
> I remember how, when I was a kid, I've always wanted to be a girl. But eventually I moved on after being bullied for being too feminine during middle school, and I kinda stopped... well, being me.
> Now that I live alone, I've been more able to express my feminity using cheap clothing sites such as Vinted or Shein (don't blame me please I'm poor and clothes are way too expensive). I remember ordering my first pair of heels and my first dress and let me tell you, I've never felt more at ease with my body than after that. It also made me feel really good that the dress had padding, not in a weird way, just seeing my body like this made me feel so happy.
> So I know I absolutely love """""feminine""""""" (I hate saying this, it's literally just fabric...) and cute clothes but I would never ever dare go outside like this, at least not in my current mental state.
> I've thought about me maybe being trans or nb but I really don't know... I just don't care about gender that much, I just want to be inbetween with no set gender "rules" but I don't feel... legitimate... (?) to be identifying as something other than cis.
> I'm sorry if I overshared kgfjldms I just feel safe talking about those things here.


What you've described about not going out dressed in this way reminded me of someone I used to know. Two years ago I was involved with an incredibly sweet girl. A few months in she broke down crying one night and told me that she could only be a girl when she was with me; outside of what we had she lived an entirely different life as a seemingly cishet man and had a long-term girlfriend.  She wasn't comfortable coming out in the "real world" yet and had met me in a space where she felt safe to be herself. She had been upfront with me from day one about being trans (aggressively so, she outright told me to **** off if I wasn't 100% onboard), so that wasn't an issue, and I wasn't happy to learn that she had been cheating on her girlfriend with me - but I felt bad for her that she felt she couldn't come out, and I understood why she did what she did, so instead of getting angry I just held her. I stayed in her life as a friend after that so she still had someone she could be herself around. I don't know what became of her, because I ended contact with her when I started dating someone new, but I hope that she feels more comfortable presenting as her true self now than she did back when I knew her. If she doesn't then I hope she is at least at peace with it.

Do you know why I explained all of that? Only presenting as female when she was alone in her apartment, and later when she was around me, didn't invalidate her gender identity. She felt she was a woman, therefore she was a woman, even if she had to present as her AGAB in her day-to-day life. Like her, however you choose to identify is valid.

There are many genders out there besides male and female. Some are a blend of both and others are outside of the gender binary altogether. Figuring out exactly where you fall can take years, but that's fine, you don't need to figure this out quickly (although it sure would be a weight off if it did work that way). Just keep in mind that not knowing what you are, or not outwardly presenting that way outside of your own home, doesn't make your gender identity any less valid than anyone else's.


----------



## Hat'

Vrisnem said:


> What you've described about not going out dressed in this way reminded me of someone I used to know. Two years ago I was involved with an incredibly sweet girl. A few months in she broke down crying one night and told me that she could only be a girl when she was with me; outside of what we had she lived an entirely different life as a seemingly cishet man and had a long-term girlfriend.  She wasn't comfortable coming out in the "real world" yet and had met me in a space where she felt safe to be herself. She had been upfront with me from day one about being trans (aggressively so, she outright told me to **** off if I wasn't 100% onboard), so that wasn't an issue, and I wasn't happy to learn that she had been cheating on her girlfriend with me - but I felt bad for her that she felt she couldn't come out, and I understood why she did what she did, so instead of getting angry I just held her. I stayed in her life as a friend after that so she still had someone she could be herself around. I don't know what became of her, because I ended contact with her when I started dating someone new, but I hope that she feels more comfortable presenting as her true self now than she did back when I knew her. If she doesn't then I hope she is at least at peace with it.
> 
> Do you know why I explained all of that? Only presenting as female when she was alone in her apartment, and later when she was around me, didn't invalidate her gender identity. She felt she was a woman, therefore she was a woman, even if she had to present as her AGAB in her day-to-day life. Like her, however you choose to identify is valid.
> 
> There are many genders out there besides male and female. Some are a blend of both and others are outside of the gender binary altogether. Figuring out exactly where you fall can take years, but that's fine, you don't need to figure this out quickly (although it sure would be a weight off if it did work that way). Just keep in mind that not knowing what you are, or not outwardly presenting that way outside of your own home, doesn't make your gender identity any less valid than anyone else's.


Wow that was so powerful... it really touched me!!! I hope she's okay too!

Thank you so much for your answers  I understand that gender is such a diverse spectrum and I truly hope that one day I'll be able to fully express my identity to the world! I can only imagine how good that must feel. And of course that is what I wish to everybody in the same kind of situation!


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## Holla

Stella-Io said:


> Okay so I've known that I'm pansexual af since my junior year of high school (I know that can be seen as kinda 'late' to realize my sexuality but in my defense, I never gave dating and attraction preference alot of thought).



I don't think "figuring" out your sexuality is ever late. Only just last year (when I was 24) I found out I was asexual. I've always known I was different from "most" people, but I always just assumed I was Heterosexual as I still liked guys but it was never in a sexual way. Certain events made me question why I was so sex repulsed so that's why I landed on asexual. Fast forward to this year though and now that I'm 25 I know that I'm actually demisexual. I just needed to meet the right person basically. All past relationships I had I experienced zero attraction, but my most recent one has been different.

Safe to say you can "figure out/realize" your sexuality at any age and it's not ever late. It can always change in the future too as it's not always set in stone. All that matters is that you are true to you.


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## Alienfish

Holla said:


> Safe to say you can "figure out/realize" your sexuality at any age and it's not ever late. It can always change in the future too as it's not always set in stone. All that matters is that you are true to you.


This this this. I also want to emphasize that it can definitely change, I mean sometime you figure out things as time goes by and your experiences can apply to that as well. This definitely doesn't need to be set in stone like you said and even if you're born one way you can definitely change and it's fine as long as it's YOU. 

(From someone who took her time figuring out stuff but finally landed in bi).


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## Lady Timpani

Holla said:


> I don't think "figuring" out your sexuality is ever late. Only just last year (when I was 24) I found out I was asexual. I've always known I was different from "most" people, but I always just assumed I was Heterosexual as I still liked guys but it was never in a sexual way. Certain events made me question why I was so sex repulsed so that's why I landed on asexual. Fast forward to this year though and now that I'm 25 I know that I'm actually demisexual. I just needed to meet the right person basically. All past relationships I had I experienced zero attraction, but my most recent one has been different.
> 
> Safe to say you can "figure out/realize" your sexuality at any age and it's not ever late. It can always change in the future too as it's not always set in stone. All that matters is that you are true to you.


I'm 24 rn and starting to think I might be somewhere on the ace spectrum myself haha. Either way I definitely relate to a lot of those in here questioning. Based on what I've seen a lot of LGBT+ folks find new identifiers they're comfortable with over time, so never feel ashamed if you realize a certain label doesn't suit you anymore.


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## Chris

Lady Timpani said:


> Based on what I've seen a lot of LGBT+ folks find new identifiers they're comfortable with over time


This is absolutely true. I first knew I wasn't cishet in 2003 and came out in 2006. The terms I have identified with since then have changed a number of times. Even now I'm not 100% certain.


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## Croconaw

I think members of LGBT+ just realize they’re not cis-straight. I know that for a long time, I didn’t know what I was, but I knew I wasn’t straight. I finally came to terms with an identifier that resonates with me, but it’s absolutely okay if it takes some people a little longer. I usually just say I’m part of the rainbow, rather than using a specific term, since I too have realized that the members of the community change their identifiers overtime.


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## neoratz

edit SRRY i got too embarrassed about being vent-y. really appreciate the thread though. thank you everyone for sharing your experiences


----------



## tessa grace

xSuperMario64x said:


> so my mom basically outed me to my dad and..... yeah it's going just as well as I expected it to
> 
> I'm not really mad that she outed me. I didn't tell her that she could tell my dad but I was already gonna tell him right before I left for my trip so I don't really care. what really bothers me is how he took it.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: message he sent my mom
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> he's basically treating this like:
> 1. this is something that they "brainwashed into me at school"
> 2. this is something that literally just came up and it's like a trend
> 3. it's abuse
> 4. it's something that I will deeply regret later in my life
> 
> I honestly have no words for this. I underestimated how ****ing ignorant and selfish he can be. if I become suicidal it'll be his fault and no one elses.


This is heartbreaking, I'm so sorry to see that things like this happen to people. I hope you're doing okay. So many people on this thread love you and seriously, if you ever need to rant, I'm here.

I also wanted to say that as somebody who advocates for lgbtqia+ rights, I've been doing pride drawings often this month, and it's been a blast! Once I get on my phone later I'll post photos, but it's been so fun to draw my friends and just random sketches of different flags and such.


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## cornimer

Croconaw said:


> I think members of LGBT+ just realize they’re not cis-straight


This is definitely true for me at least. The only thing I've ever been 100% sure of is that I'm not attracted to men haha.


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## xSuperMario64x

I'm having a bit of a dilemma and I'd like advice.

I'm thinking of sharing info about myself with friends and family on Facebook. I've considered this ever since I came out to my mom, and the longer I have to live my old life the worse I feel. I want the new me to be out and about to everybody, so I don't have to hide myself and pretend to be someone I'm not.

only thing is I'm worried about the statistics that say that trans* people are much more likely to be assaulted or even killed than cis people. I doubt that anyone whom I know would assault me but I worry about other random people targeting me if I'm openly trans. 

of course I wouldn't make a big deal out of it, once I'm out to everyone and they all know my preferred name/pronouns I'll prob just be more comfortable with myself and not need to be so open about it. I just wonder if I should express that it's been a somewhat lonely/scary experience and I would love to find some support from friends/family (another reason why I want to tell them, most people im friends with have expressed that they would support me no matter what, not specifically with lgbt+ issues but in general).

idk I'm just afraid of being targeted by some random transphobes, I want to live my life and be comfortable with who I am and I don't want to be afraid. I also really want to tell people who I actually am, so that I can adjust to my true self more easily. I've been having lots of dysphoria for a while and I'd like to try to ease it. if people want to complain or unfriend me then that's their own issue, I have family who would love/protect me no matter what. 


so I guess I'm wondering, if I do make a post like that what kind of precautions should I take? should I put some words in there about requesting support from friends/family? I know im gonna have to leave a few people out of the post (as in hide it from their view) though they might find out another way. but I just want to stay safe while also letting people know what's going on.


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> —


Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t there a feature on Facebook that restricts your posts to friends only? There are lots of people on Facebook that don’t have the best intentions, and I think it’s not that uncommon to restrict who sees your posts and other information, such as your bio, workplace, etcetera. 

I think posting your personal experiences and coming out will help someone and encourage them to do the same. Maybe someone is thinking about coming out or questioning their identity, and reading about your experiences will help them. I don’t think it has to be this big, public thing, but someone you know may need to hear it. It may even give you a clearer understanding of yourself.


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## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t there a feature on Facebook that restricts your posts to friends only? There are lots of people on Facebook that don’t have the best intentions, and I think it’s not that uncommon to restrict who sees your posts and other information, such as your bio, workplace, etcetera.
> 
> I think posting your personal experiences and coming out will help someone and encourage them to do the same. Maybe someone is thinking about coming out or questioning their identity, and reading about your experiences will help them. I don’t think it has to be this big, public thing, but someone you know may need to hear it. It may even give you a clearer understanding of yourself.


I actually have my facebook profile set so that only my friends can see it anyways, so unless I manually make a post public no one can see it except those whom I'm friends with. I was referring to people whom I _am _friends with and prob still shouldn't see the post, mostly really old people who are very set in their ways and are irreparably transphobic. they will prob figure out eventually but if I know they prob won't support me then why should I tell them?

yeah it's not gonna be this big thing. I would just gently tell people "hey btw i'm a non-binary trans man, these are my pronouns, ask questions if needed", maybe ask for compassion/support, and leave it at that. I have a quote that I have lived by ever since I came out in April: "This is who I am, it's only a big deal if you make it a big deal." if they want to make a big deal about it then that's their own problem. those who care will still love me. I might also attach an article I found on being a good trans ally, for those who care.


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## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> I actually have my facebook profile set so that only my friends can see it anyways, so unless I manually make a post public no one can see it except those whom I'm friends with. I was referring to people whom I _am _friends with and prob still shouldn't see the post, mostly really old people who are very set in their ways and are irreparably transphobic. they will prob figure out eventually but if I know they prob won't support me then why should I tell them?
> 
> yeah it's not gonna be this big thing. I would just gently tell people "hey btw i'm a non-binary trans man, these are my pronouns, ask questions if needed", maybe ask for compassion/support, and leave it at that. I have a quote that I have lived by ever since I came out in April: "This is who I am, it's only a big deal if you make it a big deal." if they want to make a big deal about it then that's their own problem. those who care will still love me. I might also attach an article I found on being a good trans ally, for those who care.


If someone makes a rude comment about it or doesn’t like it, let them. It’s like the trash taking itself out. You don’t need to be surrounded by the negativity. Being family doesn’t justify someone being close minded and bigoted.

You can surround yourself with people that love and support you. If you want to post about it, I’d say to go for it.


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## cornimer

Does anyone have experience with or advice on getting coworkers to call you by a different name? I've been wanting to stop using my legal first name for months but every time I work up some courage to say something, I chicken out a few hours later. The people I work with are pretty open-minded, but I'm just worried about confusing them/stressing them out with the change (and I have social anxiety so I'm not sure if I have it in me to constantly be correcting them if they forget).


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## xSuperMario64x

cornimer said:


> Does anyone have experience with or advice on getting coworkers to call you by a different name? I've been wanting to stop using my legal first name for months but every time I work up some courage to say something, I chicken out a few hours later. The people I work with are pretty open-minded, but I'm just worried about confusing them/stressing them out with the change (and I have social anxiety so I'm not sure if I have it in me to constantly be correcting them if they forget).


ya know I had to tell my mom and a few others that I go by a different name, and it felt awkward to me bc I've gone by the same name basically my whole life  (although the name I go by now was supposed to be my original name, and it's my middle name so it's not too big a deal) but honestly everyone I've told so far hasn't made a big deal out of it. the only thing is it's easy to get frustrated if they forget or mess up; personally that only offends me if they don't apologize or realize that they said something wrong. so far the only person who is kinda making a big deal out of it in my life is my dad but I've kinda brushed that aside for now.

but yeah if theyre pretty open minded then it should be fine


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## Firesquids

cornimer said:


> Does anyone have experience with or advice on getting coworkers to call you by a different name? I've been wanting to stop using my legal first name for months but every time I work up some courage to say something, I chicken out a few hours later. The people I work with are pretty open-minded, but I'm just worried about confusing them/stressing them out with the change (and I have social anxiety so I'm not sure if I have it in me to constantly be correcting them if they forget).


I had a co-worker who is nonbinary who went though a similar thing. They talked to the manager who brought it up (very respectfully) at the next meeting to the whole staff that they use they/them pronouns, and no one had a problem with it. Not everybody really understood (especially those who spoke English as a second language) but they all made an effort to use the correct pronouns.
When you feel comfortable enough you should definitely go for it and ask to be called by your preferred name.


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## cornimer

^^ Thank you both so much for sharing, it made me feel better to hear about two pretty positive experiences! I finally got the confidence today to message my team in our group chat about it, and omg I got like 10 nice replies within 3 minutes! I'm really lucky to have such great colleagues


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## xSuperMario64x

I have a PSA to share with all my LGBT+ friends and allies:

_just because someone is aromantic absolutely does not mean that they're opposed to romance!! _

it simply means they do not experience romantic attraction. that's literally it. I keep seeing stereotypes, often perpetuated my aro people themselves, that being aromantic means that one does not feel romantic attraction and thus does not care for romantic relationships at all. which is not only often false, it's a very bad assumption that needs to be stopped.

there are plenty of aros out there who still want a romantic relationship without experiencing romantic attraction. I'm one of those people (cupioromantic). I'm afraid of telling potential partners that I'm aromantic because of the stereotype that all aro people dont want romance, leading them to believe that I'm uninterested. yeah some aros are uninterested but not all of us. it's harmful to generalize a whole community like that, there's a lot if diversity that needs to be celebrated!

(also this applies to asexuality as well!)


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## Moritz

xSuperMario64x said:


> I have a PSA to share with all my LGBT+ friends and allies:
> 
> _just because someone is aromantic absolutely does not mean that they're opposed to romance!! _
> 
> it simply means they do not experience romantic attraction. that's literally it. I keep seeing stereotypes, often perpetuated my aro people themselves, that being aromantic means that one does not feel romantic attraction and thus does not care for romantic relationships at all. which is not only often false, it's a very bad assumption that needs to be stopped.
> 
> there are plenty of aros out there who still want a romantic relationship without experiencing romantic attraction. I'm one of those people (cupioromantic). I'm afraid of telling potential partners that I'm aromantic because of the stereotype that all aro people dont want romance, leading them to believe that I'm uninterested. yeah some aros are uninterested but not all of us. it's harmful to generalize a whole community like that, there's a lot if diversity that needs to be celebrated!
> 
> (also this applies to asexuality as well!)


Personally I've never heard of that stereotype before. But I've also never heard of aromantic before either.

I don't mean to tell you what to do or how to feel, but I think the best course of action for potential partners when telling them would also be to explain what it means and how you fit in to it.
That way you've told them exactly how you identity and if they can't trust you on it that's on them and you deserve better. Even if you may be far from happy about it.


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## Lady Timpani

Vrisnem said:


> This is absolutely true. I first knew I wasn't cishet in 2003 and came out in 2006. The terms I have identified with since then have changed a number of times. Even now I'm not 100% certain.


This really makes me feel a lot better about my own path! I first recognized I was questioning in 2009 or so but then kind of repressed it until 2012, when I started identifying as a lesbian. I feel like I never really gave myself a period of actually trying to figure out if there's an identifier that suits me best, though, which is why I'm currently not trying to rush into anything. As a teen/early 20s I was hung up on looking like a fake or whatever for changing my identifier, but now I really don't care.


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## cornimer

cornimer said:


> ^^ Thank you both so much for sharing, it made me feel better to hear about two pretty positive experiences! I finally got the confidence today to message my team in our group chat about it, and omg I got like 10 nice replies within 3 minutes! I'm really lucky to have such great colleagues


WELL in what turned out to be a super eventful pride weekend, I (not really by choice) came out about sexuality to my mom today! Long story short my estranged father is apparently playing Nancy Drew and sent her an email about behaviours he noticed on my instagram (e.g. cutting my hair short) saying "the signs are all pointing somewhere" and asking if I've told her anything. So I told her that while his email is very inappropriate and based on stereotypes, yes, I do happen to like girls.....thankfully she was TOTALLY cool about it  and didn't give him any info in her reply to his email.

Long story short, my father is  but I'm relieved that my mom took it well and now I don't have to hide as much!


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## Shellzilla_515

I'd like to ask here, is there such thing as a correct way to call this community? Because sometimes, I see some people call it 'LGBTQ', 'LGBT+', 'LGBTQS2+', or something in between. I'm not trying to cause a fight here. I'm asking a genuine question, especially since there are a lot of terms I haven't previously known before.


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## Croconaw

I refer to the community as LGBT+. The “+” indicates all of the additional terms in the community.


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## cornimer

Shellzilla said:


> I'd like to ask here, is there such thing as a correct way to call this community? Because sometimes, I see some people call it 'LGBTQ', 'LGBT+', 'LGBTQS2+', or something in between. I'm not trying to cause a fight here. I'm asking a genuine question, especially since there are a lot of terms I haven't previously known before.



LGBTQ2S+ (or 2SLGBTQ+, or other variations) is more commonly used in Canada because the 2S is specific to Indigenous Peoples (correct me if I'm wrong non-Canadians, but I've yet to see an American use it). That's what I use and what we use at work too.

Otherwise, different people will have different preferences/use different variations. In my opinion, as long as you use the "+" I don't think most people will mind which variation, because the "+" represents letters not spelled out.


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## Envy

Hi everyone. Has anyone gone to Pride this year?

I was hesitant of the thought, even though I really wanted to go and have never been to the one in my city. Hesitant because of COVID, of course. I am vaccinated and have been for quite some time now, but you can never be too careful, especially when you don't know if your immune system can be trusted. But enough preamble! Literally a few days before Pride I reconnected with an old friend from university. She said she was coming into town and going to Pride and invited me. I couldn't say no in the end. I haven't seen her in a few years, and it was a prime opportunity. (I...um...kinda crushed on her in the past - she's not single, so it's irrelevant now, but still.)

We had lots of fun! A lot of the fun was reconnecting, but still Pride was great!

I finally got me a lesbian flag! I'm looking for a place to hang it up in my room. lol. We actually got really lucky with where we parked and we got to watch the parade from inside the car! The parade was full of churches and corporations, but that's okay. It was just so neat to be surrounded by LGBT people regardless. Like I've never actually had quite this experience before.


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## Chris

Just walked ten minutes from the train station to my house. In that time a teenager, walking in a large group, yelled out to me, _"Are you in the L, G, B, T, Q, or + box?" _(commas because he enunciated these really slowly as if he was reading off a list)

Not even wearing my usual pride pin and my tattoo wasn't visible. I mean I know I visibly fit the profile of what people think an LGBT+ person looks like but still that's just rude.


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## xSuperMario64x

Shellzilla said:


> I'd like to ask here, is there such thing as a correct way to call this community? Because sometimes, I see some people call it 'LGBTQ', 'LGBT+', 'LGBTQS2+', or something in between. I'm not trying to cause a fight here. I'm asking a genuine question, especially since there are a lot of terms I haven't previously known before.


the 2S refers to two-spirit. it's not used often in the US, I usually use lgbt+ personally. i've also seen it spelled as lgbtq+ and lgbtqia+.


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## Croconaw

Vrisnem said:


> Just walked ten minutes from the train station to my house. In that time a teenager, walking in a large group, yelled out to me, _"Are you in the L, G, B, T, Q, or + box?" _(commas because he enunciated these really slowly as if he was reading off a list)


He was most likely enunciating the letters in a mocking way. It’s best to ignore people like him. People like that are rude.


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## Chris

Croconaw said:


> He was most likely enunciating the letters in a mocking way. It’s best to ignore people like him. People like that are rude.


Oh, yes, I have no doubt he was mocking me! I was just venting that it even happened.


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## Stella-Io

Shellzilla said:


> I'd like to ask here, is there such thing as a correct way to call this community? Because sometimes, I see some people call it 'LGBTQ', 'LGBT+', 'LGBTQS2+', or something in between. I'm not trying to cause a fight here. I'm asking a genuine question, especially since there are a lot of terms I haven't previously known before.



Going off what cornimer said about the S2 thing, I'm in the United States and I have never seen/heard if it before.

I typically use LGBTQ+, sometimes LGBTQIA+ but people generally know what you mean when you add the +. I'm pan so I fit the +, and I've never really see the P added into the name.


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## Chris

Does anyone else who is NB find it difficult when people are... more accepting than you expected?

I've been put on the spot several times recently with people asking *very considerate* questions - but I'm just not in a place where I want to deal with them. My supervisor raised it today because she's writing me a reference for postgraduate study. When I said I'm not fussy on pronouns she kindly launched into an explanation of how it's okay to be more assertive about this. For the record I've been out to her for a long while, so this isn't new, but it's the first time it's being put in writing for someone outside of our team so she insisted she wanted to create the right impression for me in my potential new environment. I said to please use they/them, not out of preference but because it gives me more flexibility later. Likewise, a few days ago, I saw my best friend for the first time in 15 months and she said her partner (whom I've only met once because they started dating shortly before the pandemic hit) asked her to ask me about my pronouns -  and until then she'd never overthought it, but him asking had her questioning it. Last weekend, my mother called me "man" or "boy" a few times in a social situation then corrected herself with something more gender-neutral... and I had to explain, it's okay, I'm comfortable being referred to this way.

Do I sound crazy? Is anyone else as passive as I am on these things? I feel like I'm being forced to declare a preference when I don't have one.


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## Merielle

Vrisnem said:


> Does anyone else who is NB find it difficult when people are... more accepting than you expected?
> 
> I've been put on the spot several times recently with people asking *very considerate* questions - but I'm just not in a place where I want to deal with them. My supervisor raised it today because she's writing me a reference for postgraduate study. When I said I'm not fussy on pronouns she kindly launched into an explanation of how it's okay to be more assertive about this. For the record I've been out to her for a long while, so this isn't new, but it's the first time it's being put in writing for someone outside of our team so she insisted she wanted to create the right impression for me in my potential new environment. I said to please use they/them, not out of preference but because it gives me more flexibility later. Likewise, a few days ago, I saw my best friend for the first time in 15 months and she said her partner (whom I've only met once because they started dating shortly before the pandemic hit) asked her to ask me about my pronouns -  and until then she'd never overthought it, but him asking had her questioning it. Last weekend, my mother called me "man" or "boy" a few times in a social situation then corrected herself with something more gender-neutral... and I had to explain, it's okay, I'm comfortable being referred to this way.
> 
> Do I sound crazy? Is anyone else as passive as I am on these things? I feel like I'm being forced to declare a preference when I don't have one.


I understand what you mean; I feel pretty similarly.  I've also had people correct themselves after referring to me with gendered terms, and have also had to clarify that I don't actually mind them.  Likewise, as long as it's being done so respectfully, I'm pretty laid-back about whatever pronouns people use for me, and it's not in a "I don't want to inconvenience people" kind of way.  If anything, I feel weird about situations where I'm asked to specify or narrow it down; it feels kinda like I'm leaving information out, I guess?  (As an example, I feel a little odd about how Pinterest has implemented pronouns—limited to two sets from a drop-down list of several options, with no option for "any" or "indifferent".  I get that it's probably limited to try to prevent people from being jerks, but I'm not quite sure what to do with it.)


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## Chris

Merielle said:


> I understand what you mean; I feel pretty similarly.  I've also had people correct themselves after referring to me with gendered terms, and have also had to clarify that I don't actually mind them.  Likewise, as long as it's being done so respectfully, I'm pretty laid-back about whatever pronouns people use for me, and it's not in a "I don't want to inconvenience people" kind of way.  If anything, I feel weird about situations where I'm asked to specify or narrow it down; it feels kinda like I'm leaving information out, I guess?  (As an example, I feel a little odd about how Pinterest has implemented pronouns—limited to two sets from a drop-down list of several options, with no option for "any" or "indifferent".  I get that it's probably limited to try to prevent people from being jerks, but I'm not quite sure what to do with it.)


This is it exactly. I generally don't mind what people use as long as they're not purposely disrespecting me. I find that having to specify is more for the other person's comfort than my own. It's the same reason I list pronouns in my signature on here: to make others feel more confident about approaching or referring to me.

I legally changed my name last week. I had been wanting to do so since I stopped going by my birth name in the mid-2000s. After trialling various masculine and feminine names in the past ~15 years I finally settled on something neutral (Christian). This is what has led to people suddenly asking questions. Given I've been out for a long time, it makes me wonder if people have been tiptoeing around this for years and only just now seen an opportunity to directly ask. Or my cynical mind thinks people are only respecting my identity now that it's on a certificate. I'm trying to find a new job and get into postgrad study, so based on these reactions I'm now feeling like I have to make a more specific decision on pronouns ahead of the interview process even though I'd really rather not. I dread the thought that an interviewer might be put off because they feel uncertain when interacting with me.


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## cornimer

Vrisnem said:


> This is it exactly. I generally don't mind what people use as long as they're not purposely disrespecting me. I find that having to specify is more for the other person's comfort than my own. It's the same reason I list pronouns in my signature on here: to make others feel more confident about approaching or referring to me.
> 
> I legally changed my name last week. I had been wanting to do so since I stopped going by my birth name in the mid-2000s. After trialling various masculine and feminine names in the past ~15 years I finally settled on something neutral (Christian). This is what has led to people suddenly asking questions. Given I've been out for a long time, it makes me wonder if people have been tiptoeing around this for years and only just now seen an opportunity to directly ask. Or my cynical mind thinks people are only respecting my identity now that it's on a certificate. I'm trying to find a new job and get into postgrad study, so based on these reactions I'm now feeling like I have to make a more specific decision on pronouns ahead of the interview process even though I'd really rather not. I dread the thought that an interviewer might be put off because they feel uncertain when interacting with me.


It sucks that you have to decide on pronouns for other people's comfort. But I wanted to say congrats on changing your name legally!! I know how freeing/relieving/affirming it must feel, especially after such a long time.


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## xSuperMario64x

Vrisnem said:


> Does anyone else who is NB find it difficult when people are... more accepting than you expected?
> 
> I've been put on the spot several times recently with people asking *very considerate* questions - but I'm just not in a place where I want to deal with them. My supervisor raised it today because she's writing me a reference for postgraduate study. When I said I'm not fussy on pronouns she kindly launched into an explanation of how it's okay to be more assertive about this. For the record I've been out to her for a long while, so this isn't new, but it's the first time it's being put in writing for someone outside of our team so she insisted she wanted to create the right impression for me in my potential new environment. I said to please use they/them, not out of preference but because it gives me more flexibility later. Likewise, a few days ago, I saw my best friend for the first time in 15 months and she said her partner (whom I've only met once because they started dating shortly before the pandemic hit) asked her to ask me about my pronouns -  and until then she'd never overthought it, but him asking had her questioning it. Last weekend, my mother called me "man" or "boy" a few times in a social situation then corrected herself with something more gender-neutral... and I had to explain, it's okay, I'm comfortable being referred to this way.
> 
> Do I sound crazy? Is anyone else as passive as I am on these things? I feel like I'm being forced to declare a preference when I don't have one.


I get this a lot, I tell everyone that they can use they/them as well as he/him and as of late they've stuck with using he/him (even though that's partly for flexibility sake, I prefer they over he). I think it's because people are so used to referring to people by one set of pronouns, they're not really comfortable being given an option. I've also had multiple people give me the excuse that they/them is not singular and make a big deal out of it. 

personally I often just say "whatever" and brush it off cause they make a bigger hassle out of it than it's worth, though that won't stop me from continuing to challenge their comfort.


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## Croconaw

My pronouns are she/her, but I do dress very masculine. I often get mistaken as a young boy. I can’t be bothered to correct people, so I’ll just go along with it, especially if I’m never going to see said person again. I don’t think people mean to misgender, unless of course they do it in a demeaning way. I don’t want to assume someone is using the wrong pronouns on purpose. I feel comfortable using she/her pronouns even though I only have men’s articles of clothing and use men’s products. I also have a guy’s haircut and I wear hats most of the time.

I think a lot of emphasis is put on gender roles. I’ll say identify as you want to identify, and dress how you want to dress. Clothing or interests should never be gender specific. This isn’t 1960.


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## moo_nieu

tired of hearing people (mostly family) complain about gender neutral terms. why does the gender binary need to be protected so much d: maybe one day when family doesnt openly mock this, i will come out to them. im tired of keeping it secret though. its super lame and not fair that i should have to pretend to be someone im not. im not sure the freedom will be worth the negative comments though.. also i think its dumb that wanting to go by they/them is considered an annoyance/inconvenience at all :c


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## Croconaw

moo_nieu said:


> also i think its dumb that wanting to go by they/them is considered an annoyance/inconvenience at all :c


If someone thinks going by they/them is an inconvenience, someone simply doesn’t want to understand. I think close-minded people aren’t open to understanding beliefs that are different from their own. To any person with the least bit respect, I don’t think using someone’s desired pronouns would be a problem. It’s not an inconvenience to use a certain set of words to make someone feel comfortable.


----------



## Corrie

moo_nieu said:


> tired of hearing people (mostly family) complain about gender neutral terms. why does the gender binary need to be protected so much d: maybe one day when family doesnt openly mock this, i will come out to them. im tired of keeping it secret though. its super lame and not fair that i should have to pretend to be someone im not. im not sure the freedom will be worth the negative comments though.. also i think its dumb that wanting to go by they/them is considered an annoyance/inconvenience at all :c


In my opinion, those that care will use they/them and won't think it as an annoyance. For example, a friend of mine had recently told me to start referring to them as they/them and I did. It took a bit to get used to since I was so used to referring to them as she/her but everytime I caught myself, I'd fix it and now, I don't even blink an eye. It's not hard to do if you respect/care about that person.


----------



## AustinTEG06

I just had a very bad gender  dysphoria attack and i can’t do anything because of my transphobic homophobic parents I don’t know what to do if you have any advice please share.


----------



## Antonio

To be honest, I don't feel like I have a gender identify. I feel basically indifferent to any pronouns because I don't feel like I belong under he/him, she/her, or they/them. I feel like there isn't any sort of pronouns that describe my gender identify because I don't feel like I have a gender identify that describes me. I'm just me, ya know.

I don't know how to describe it, is there a term for this? I feel like this falls under non-binary but I don't feel like I fall under they/them pronouns anymore.


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## Firesquids

Antonio said:


> To be honest, I don't feel like I have a gender identify. I feel basically indifferent to any pronouns because I don't feel like I belong under he/him, she/her, or they/them. I feel like there isn't any sort of pronouns that describe my gender identify because I don't feel like I have a gender identify that describes me. I'm just me, ya know.
> 
> I don't know how to describe it, is there a term for this? I feel like this falls under non-binary but I don't feel like I fall under they/them pronouns anymore.


I can relate to this in that I'm "bi" but I could be with a gender neutral person too so "bi"sexual doesn't really describe how I feel, it's like a misnomer.


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## Antonio

Firesquids said:


> I can relate to this in that I'm "bi" but I could be with a gender neutral person too so "bi"sexual doesn't really describe how I feel, it's like a misnomer.


I feel ya on that like I'm not attractive to a particular gender but a personal attribute, like masculinity.


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## Foreverfox

Chris said:


> Does anyone else who is NB find it difficult when people are... more accepting than you expected?
> 
> I've been put on the spot several times recently with people asking *very considerate* questions - but I'm just not in a place where I want to deal with them. My supervisor raised it today because she's writing me a reference for postgraduate study. When I said I'm not fussy on pronouns she kindly launched into an explanation of how it's okay to be more assertive about this. For the record I've been out to her for a long while, so this isn't new, but it's the first time it's being put in writing for someone outside of our team so she insisted she wanted to create the right impression for me in my potential new environment. I said to please use they/them, not out of preference but because it gives me more flexibility later. Likewise, a few days ago, I saw my best friend for the first time in 15 months and she said her partner (whom I've only met once because they started dating shortly before the pandemic hit) asked her to ask me about my pronouns -  and until then she'd never overthought it, but him asking had her questioning it. Last weekend, my mother called me "man" or "boy" a few times in a social situation then corrected herself with something more gender-neutral... and I had to explain, it's okay, I'm comfortable being referred to this way.
> 
> Do I sound crazy? Is anyone else as passive as I am on these things? I feel like I'm being forced to declare a preference when I don't have one.


I know I'm a little late on the reply (for some reason I'm always days behind on a couple threads), but I don't think you sound crazy. My guess is that the people you're encountering who are being extra cautious are just overly sensitive to making sure they don't offend anyone by _not_ asking about pronouns. They would probably rather ask and be told what you're comfortable with than assume, and assume incorrectly. It probably hasn't occurred to them that asking is potentially uncomfortable. Or, they might be going off of their preference - for example, "I like when people ask what my pronouns are, so everyone else probably does too." - that type of thing.


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## xSuperMario64x

Antonio said:


> To be honest, I don't feel like I have a gender identify. I feel basically indifferent to any pronouns because I don't feel like I belong under he/him, she/her, or they/them. I feel like there isn't any sort of pronouns that describe my gender identify because I don't feel like I have a gender identify that describes me. I'm just me, ya know.
> 
> I don't know how to describe it, is there a term for this? I feel like this falls under non-binary but I don't feel like I fall under they/them pronouns anymore.


i believe that's called agender (aka lack of gender identity) 

	Post automatically merged: Jul 13, 2021



Firesquids said:


> I can relate to this in that I'm "bi" but I could be with a gender neutral person too so "bi"sexual doesn't really describe how I feel, it's like a misnomer.


and that sounds like omnisexuality, I don't know a whole lot abt it but it usually refers to having an attraction to 3 or more genders but not all (so not quite pansexuality).

(yes I learned a ton abt gender/sexuality identities during pride month)

	Post automatically merged: Jul 13, 2021

of course I'm not trying to force a label onto anyone, sometimes having no label and just being yourself is perfectly fine!! but also don't let yourself be fooled by people who say that having said labels is a bad thing.


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## cornimer

Antonio said:


> To be honest, I don't feel like I have a gender identify. I feel basically indifferent to any pronouns because I don't feel like I belong under he/him, she/her, or they/them. I feel like there isn't any sort of pronouns that describe my gender identify because I don't feel like I have a gender identify that describes me. I'm just me, ya know.
> 
> I don't know how to describe it, is there a term for this? I feel like this falls under non-binary but I don't feel like I fall under they/them pronouns anymore.


I feel the same way as you described, and I identify as agender  I'm just a _person_, I don't see why I have to have gender be a part of my identity at all! Here's a resource that really helped me put the words on what I was feeling: https://gender.wikia.org/wiki/Agender


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## Antonio

Agender does perfectly describe how I'm feeling, I can finally put it to words, thank you.


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## tessa grace

nvm, i think i'm straight. still supporting my friends community though


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## Merielle

thetessagrace said:


> I thought I would post this because I have been questioning my romantic orientation for a while now, and I need some help understanding.
> I feel that I might identify as Uranic/Nofemromantic. However, I've heard online that this is offensive towards people who are non-binary or fall under the agender spectrum. I don't have the intention of offending anyone, but I feel like I am attracted to people who aren't female or fall under that feminine category. And I've also heard that the term Uranic is usually used by enby people, and I'm female. Do I just identify as straight? It's such a small change, and I really don't want to offend people- It feels good to finally find something that works with me, but now I'm so confused because I don't want to offend others. I also hate labels. Personally, I don't want to feel tied to one sexuality. I hid my feelings and finally found out that Uranic exists, and I think thats what I am. I finally feel open about who I am, but I'm not sure if the term works- any advice??


Hi!  I did some research into the terms and in short, I think you're fine.  While it seems like uranic is more often used by nonbinary people, it wasn't meant to be an exclusive term and anyone can use it.  I definitely understand about not wanting to use terms that would hurt anybody, as I've had similar concerns in the past myself, but I wouldn't worry about it with these.  I'm nonbinary and I don't see anything wrong with uranic/nofem, and the complaints I did see about them seemed to be based on a misunderstanding of their definition.  I'm not sure if this was the same thing you saw, but I saw something that seemed to assume the terms were based on assigned gender at birth rather than gender identity, which doesn't seem the case to me at all.  In any case, there doesn't seem to be any widespread controversy over them, and we can't control the genders we're attracted to, or aren't.  I'd say if it works for you and either term makes you happy, go ahead and use it.

With that said, since you also said you hated labels, don't feel like you have to use either term just because they're a technical fit.  You can use broader umbrella terms if you feel like, or choose not to label yourself at all.  There's also a lot of people who consider themselves _mostly_ straight and are happy just going with that, but don't hold yourself back if other identities/not labelling yourself at all speaks to you more.  I called myself straight and cisgender for a good while because I was afraid of "overstepping", and uh... that wound up being incorrect in just about every way possible, ahaha.


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## tessa grace

Merielle said:


> Hi!  I did some research into the terms and in short, I think you're fine.  While it seems like uranic is more often used by nonbinary people, it wasn't meant to be an exclusive term and anyone can use it.  I definitely understand about not wanting to use terms that would hurt anybody, as I've had similar concerns in the past myself, but I wouldn't worry about it with these.  I'm nonbinary and I don't see anything wrong with uranic/nofem, and the complaints I did see about them seemed to be based on a misunderstanding of their definition.  I'm not sure if this was the same thing you saw, but I saw something that seemed to assume the terms were based on assigned gender at birth rather than gender identity, which doesn't seem the case to me at all.  In any case, there doesn't seem to be any widespread controversy over them, and we can't control the genders we're attracted to, or aren't.  I'd say if it works for you and either term makes you happy, go ahead and use it.
> 
> With that said, since you also said you hated labels, don't feel like you have to use either term just because they're a technical fit.  You can use broader umbrella terms if you feel like, or choose not to label yourself at all.  There's also a lot of people who consider themselves _mostly_ straight and are happy just going with that, but don't hold yourself back if other identities/not labelling yourself at all speaks to you more.  I called myself straight and cisgender for a good while because I was afraid of "overstepping", and uh... that wound up being incorrect in just about every way possible, ahaha.


thank you! i feel so validated. hopefully soon i can find out where i fit, this makes me feel so much better though


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## maria110

I bought a "no more hate" t-shirt.


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## Croconaw

It’s been a minute since I’ve last posted in this thread. I’ve been identifying as lithromantic because that term resonates with me. I’m not ready to openly talk about it with anyone in my real life because I haven’t gotten the best reactions. Lithromantic basically means you feel romantic attraction towards others and also enjoy being in romantic relationships but only in theory. When the feelings are reciprocated, I simply ignore it or run away because I don’t desire the returned affection.

I’ve been told that maybe it’s due to commitment issues or the inability to love yourself, and it’s _not_ a romantic orientation. After discovering this term, I can’t say I’ve resonated with a term more than this one. I honestly think that this is who I truly am. It’s just a struggle because I do feel affection strongly, but when those feelings become the least bit reciprocated, I’m over it. I honestly don’t know if it’s because I’m scared of messing things up, or if it’s my romantic orientation and I’m using the term to justify my being scared? I hope that makes sense. I’d _hate_ for that to be the case though, because I don’t want to use actual identities people have just to cover up insecurities. That wouldn’t be my intention at all. I’m not trying to rush into any identifiers either, and I’m not even looking for a relationship at the moment because I’m focusing on myself. The only thing I do know _for sure_ is I’m a sex-repulsed asexual. Thank you in advance if anyone has words of wisdom or advice!


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## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> I’ve been told that maybe it’s due to commitment issues or the inability to love yourself, and it’s _not_ a romantic orientation. After discovering this term, I can’t say I’ve resonated with a term more than this one. I honestly think that this is who I truly am. It’s just a struggle because I do feel affection strongly, but when those feelings become the least bit reciprocated, I’m over it. I honestly don’t know if it’s because I’m scared of messing things up, or if it’s my romantic orientation and I’m using the term to justify my being scared? I hope that makes sense. I’d _hate_ for that to be the case though, because I don’t want to use actual identities people have just to cover up insecurities. That wouldn’t be my intention at all. I’m not trying to rush into any identifiers either, and I’m not even looking for a relationship at the moment because I’m focusing on myself. The only thing I do know _for sure_ is I’m a sex-repulsed asexual. Thank you in advance if anyone has words of wisdom or advice!


anyone who tries to tell you that your romantic orientation doesn't actually exist is just trying to invalidate you. like when I told my uncle I was ace the first time and he could not wrap his mind around it _at all_, like he just could not understand how someone who is ace doesn't feel sexual attraction (he prob would've had a heart attack if I told him I was apothisexual lmao). but that doesn't make me any less ace, and likewise people saying you can't be lithromantic and/or that's it's just an excuse to validate your "fear" are just being ignorant. if you are happy identifying as lithromantic then absolutely embrace it!


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## Lady Timpani

This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.


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## xSuperMario64x

Lady Timpani said:


> This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.


the only time I've really gotten to meet other lgbt+ people is chatting on this forum lol. I'm not very open about my asexuality (cause it's a _lack_ of attraction so like what is there to embrace identity wise lol) and I just came out publicly as nb back in June so im somewhat new on the scene i guess. i have a few lgbt+ friends but I didn't meet them bc they were lgbt+, one of them I actually met by being assigned a dorm room w them.

other than that my only lgbt+ friends are my uncles in Alabama and you guys, kinda afraid to put myself out there bc rampant transphobia and a complete misunderstanding/disbelief of asexuality are things that exist


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## Chris

Lady Timpani said:


> This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.


Through hobbies and indulging in the nightlife, for the most part! Pre-COVID I went to a lot of gigs, drag shows, LGBT nights, pride events, etc. I also run an LGBT writers group and have met a number of openly LGBT people working in my field.


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## Croconaw

Lady Timpani said:


> This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.


This probably isn’t the most helpful answer, but I’ve met LGBT just by being out there. I frequently travel and I see a lot of people that are openly and/or visibly LGBT. I’ve met coworkers who are LGBT as well. I think it’s a matter of putting yourself out there and not necessarily go looking for other LGBT people. Although, I completely understand that it’s easy to coexist with those in the community.


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## Lady Timpani

Croconaw said:


> This probably isn’t the most helpful answer, but I’ve met LGBT just by being out there. I frequently travel and I see a lot of people that are openly and/or visibly LGBT. I’ve met coworkers who are LGBT as well. I think it’s a matter of putting yourself out there and not necessarily go looking for other LGBT people. Although, I completely understand that it’s easy to coexist with those in the community.


I get where you're coming from, but for me personally putting myself out there actually entails actively trying to meet other LGBT folks! Up until this point I haven't really been trying to do so, and I just haven't really met any LGBT people, so it seems to me that I should start trying.  

Thanks for your advice, guys! I'm hopeful that things will get better with COVID in the next year or so and I'll be able to go to local meetups. For now I might try joining some LGBT forums. There was one I used as a teen but unfortunately deleted my account because I thought my parents were gonna find out lmao


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## Croconaw

Lady Timpani said:


> I get where you're coming from, but for me personally putting myself out there actually entails actively trying to meet other LGBT folks! Up until this point I haven't really been trying to do so, and I just haven't really met any LGBT people, so it seems to me that I should start trying.
> 
> Thanks for your advice, guys! I'm hopeful that things will get better with COVID in the next year or so and I'll be able to go to local meetups. For now I might try joining some LGBT forums. There was one I used as a teen but unfortunately deleted my account because I thought my parents were gonna find out lmao


I hope there’s some LGBT forums that are active. It seems that forums are becoming less popular by the day. I was a member of another forum as a teen but it closed down, and another video game forum I was apart of also closed down. It sucks that everyone seems to be drifting to social media, because forums really are a safe space for most people. Social media can be extremely negative and toxic.


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## Lady Timpani

Croconaw said:


> I hope there’s some LGBT forums that are active. It seems that forums are becoming less popular by the day. I was a member of another forum as a teen but it closed down, and another video game forum I was apart of also closed down. It sucks that everyone seems to be drifting to social media, because forums really are a safe space for most people. Social media can be extremely negative and toxic.


Yeah I've thought about joining Twitter but I left in 2016 during the US Presidential election because of how bad it was getting, and from what I understand it's just gotten worse lol. I definitely prefer the forum format!


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## cornimer

Lady Timpani said:


> This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.


I was also too shy in university to seek out LGBTQ2S+ groups (or_ any_ groups for that matter). However, while I was in university both of my childhood best friends (and myself) came out as LGBTQ2S+. So now we always joke about how we unconsciously attracted each other haha.

I would love to join a group and meet more people one day though!


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## moo_nieu

really frustrated with everything i see online and hear about from family about gender identities and pronouns. the world isnt ending and we arent ruining society just because some people dont want to enforce gender roles on themselves. i just want to scream and say who cares how people identify as long as they are kind towards others and feel secure about themselves. im not ruining gods plan or society. i just want to be happy and be myself. im moving across the country next week and thinking of just messaging my and my s/os families and saying btw please use they/them since im nonbinary. i know his family would likely gossip and mine would send me really sad faces and messages asking why and my mom would probably cry. they would likely send me materials to change my mind.. i say this bc they already send me this stuff not knowing how i feel. they just think challenging gender norms is absolutely devastating to society or some crazy brainwashing thing. 

anyways i really shouldnt have read those youtube comments when the video was just a skit making gender identity out to be stupid and demanding :c


----------



## Croconaw

moo_nieu said:


> really frustrated with everything i see online and hear about from family about gender identities and pronouns. the world isnt ending and we arent ruining society just because some people dont want to enforce gender roles on themselves. i just want to scream and say who cares how people identify as long as they are kind towards others and feel secure about themselves. im not ruining gods plan or society. i just want to be happy and be myself. im moving across the country next week and thinking of just messaging my and my s/os families and saying btw please use they/them since im nonbinary. i know his family would likely gossip and mine would send me really sad faces and messages asking why and my mom would probably cry. they would likely send me materials to change my mind.. i say this bc they already send me this stuff not knowing how i feel. they just think challenging gender norms is absolutely devastating to society or some crazy brainwashing thing.
> 
> anyways i really shouldnt have read those youtube comments when the video was just a skit making gender identity out to be stupid and demanding :c


Nobody is harming anyone by having a gender preference when dating or desiring certain pronouns. Honestly, who cares about gender norms? This isn’t 1950, and we are basically removed from that. People really need to mind their own business. I think free-choice should be normalized. Let people do what they want, so long as they’re not harming anyone in the process. I don’t believe being gay or non-binary is harming anybody.

I’m sorry your family hasn’t been supportive. I wouldn’t message them though. That would be just adding fuel to the fire. I’d recommend just being the bigger person. I think it’s dumb how most people who say “God’s plan” are the same people who pick and choose parts of the Bible. If you want to follow the Bible, follow the whole thing, not just parts you want.

I’m not sure of the full details of your situation, so my deepest apologies if I’m wrong, but is your family sending you things unaware they hurt your feelings? Or are they doing it completely aware of how it makes you feel? I think some people really are oblivious of how their actions affect other people and they’re really not terrible people. You said your family isn’t aware of how it makes you feel. Did you consider explaining them how it effects you? Explaining it in a way that shows how it affects you may help as opposed to telling them it upsets you or that they’re wrong. Sometimes people do just need to be enlightened.


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## moo_nieu

Croconaw said:


> Nobody is harming anyone by having a gender preference when dating or desiring certain pronouns. Honestly, who cares about gender norms? This isn’t 1950, and we are basically removed from that. People really need to mind their own business. I think free-choice should be normalized. Let people do what they want, so long as they’re not harming anyone in the process. I don’t believe being gay or non-binary is harming anybody.
> 
> I’m sorry your family hasn’t been supportive. I wouldn’t message them though. That would be just adding fuel to the fire. I’d recommend just being the bigger person. I think it’s dumb how most people who say “God’s plan” are the same people who pick and choose parts of the Bible. If you want to follow the Bible, follow the whole thing, not just parts you want.
> 
> I’m not sure of the full details of your situation, so my deepest apologies if I’m wrong, but is your family sending you things unaware they hurt your feelings? Or are they doing it completely aware of how it makes you feel? I think some people really are oblivious of how their actions affect other people and they’re really not terrible people. You said your family isn’t aware of how it makes you feel. Did you consider explaining them how it effects you? Explaining it in a way that shows how it affects you may help as opposed to telling them it upsets you or that they’re wrong. Sometimes people do just need to be enlightened.


thanks for your message. youre right i should probably not try to make things worse by telling them how i identify. i have explained how i feel about gender neutral terms and defended it, but i havent told them that i am nonbinary. my family sort of blurts things out so they dont tell me these things to hurt me, they just say things that pop in their head and forward me "shocking" news about some gender neutral term or bathrooms or sports competitors or people who once identified as trans but then regretted it. i try not to just tell them they are wrong bc that wouldnt really do anything but it probably comes off that way with how passionate i can get trying to explain why i think these things are beneficial for individuals and society. the thing is they say some of their views are backed up by their religion so i try to be respectful of that and cant really do much except say i dont want to continue the conversation or try to lean on the aspects of their beliefs that speak of loving others.

idk im just sick of hearing so much negativity about it from family and online. i dont get why people want to protect binary gender so much and im sick of hiding and hearing the wrong pronouns. i really dont want to be pushy or impatient though so i try not to correct people except maybe every once in a while as a gentle reminder prefacing with "im not mad".

idk theres not really much of a solution here unless i come out but i should probably do that when i am comfortable and not because im upset. i just want to live my life tbh i wish it wasnt a big deal how i feel. im just a person. honestly i think the only true solution is to find security in myself and let go of my attachment to wanting my family to love and be proud of me. im just a sensitive person so i find it hard to ignore that kind of negativity, but i guess i need to figure out a way or else ill keep struggling


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## Envy

Lady Timpani said:


> This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.



You were able to meet other gay people in marching band in high school? I guess you must be younger than me. (but if not, wow). These things just weren't talked about back then (in the mid-2000s). They were just rumors whispered around. Ugh.

But the funny thing is that now a good 90% of my closer friend circle is LGBT+ in some way. This includes old friends all of the way from back in high school/marching band. I didn't work to make it happen this way for the most part, most of them I met for separate reasons and then they came out later. They say we subconsciously group together, and it looks like that is what happened with me.


----------



## leximo

Lady Timpani said:


> This is so dumb but I'm gonna post it anyway... how have you guys been able to meet fellow LGBT folks once you left school? When I was in high school I did marching band which is pretty much where I met all my gay friends, but in college I was too shy/ashamed of my sexuality to go to the on-campus LGBT group, and aside from some very visibly LGBT people in my classes I never really met any. One of my coworkers recently came out to me and even though I haven't explicitly told them I'm gay myself I've confirmed their suspicions, and I'd forgotten how nice it is to just openly exist around other LGBT people.



See, it was different for me. Only a very few of my close friends knew I was a lesbian in High School and I suppose I never properly came out and was comfortable with everyone knowing my sexuality until I left school and started working. I think the pressure purely comes from ourselves trying to hide our sexuality and I know not everyone has an easy ride with it, but the majority of people probably really won't give a damn you're gay, you know? I just openly talk about my girlfriend to my colleagues at work and I work in a call centre so it's a mixed bag of people anyways so I'm friends with quite a few other people apart of the LGBT.


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## -Lumi-

I just want to vent for a minute and since this is a support thread hopefully it’s okay to vent here.

I was just on Facebook (I know, I know. But it’s how I keep up with family and some friends who are far away) and my dad liked a post. Some stupid thing about how, “man I feel bad for parents nowadays who have to explain the birds and the bees for the different sexualities and such” it was really dumb.

He commented saying that this whole “gay and transgender thing” is the result of a liberal brainwashing experiment. I just. _What_?

I thought he was getting a little better with acceptance but I guess not.


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## Shellzilla_515

-Lumi- said:


> I just want to vent for a minute and since this is a support thread hopefully it’s okay to vent here.
> 
> I was just on Facebook (I know, I know. But it’s how I keep up with family and some friends who are far away) and my dad liked a post. Some stupid thing about how, “man I feel bad for parents nowadays who have to explain the birds and the bees for the different sexualities and such” it was really dumb.
> 
> He commented saying that this whole “gay and transgender thing” is the result of a liberal brainwashing experiment. I just. _What_?
> 
> I thought he was getting a little better with acceptance but I guess not.


This is always tough to hear. My dad also has a thing or two against the LGBTQ+ community for some reason and brings this up a fair amount of times when eating breakfast, lunch, or dinner. I don't want to hear those conversations every time I eat cause it'll only make me mad on the inside. Like c'mon, people just want to be respected for who they are and live their lives like normal. It doesn't help when he keeps repeating the same things over and over again as if it makes his views justifiable.  I've also been noticing for quite a while that my dad has been listening to podcasts or whatnot that fits his perspective. And with vaccines too but that's another story.

So long as we respect one another, I'm totally fine interacting with not just the LGBTQ+ community, but with anyone else as well. There's no need to get your pants in a twist just because they have a different sexual orientation and gender identity. My gut feeling tells me that having a better understanding will help eradicate the hate. And if your dad has an open mind to do that, I think things would end on a more positive note. Sorry to hear that, Lumi. Feel free to talk to anyone of us if you're feeling down.

I really hope my post doesn't come off as disingenuous or something like that. I didn't want to just stand there and do nothing.


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## Lady Timpani

Envy said:


> You were able to meet other gay people in marching band in high school? I guess you must be younger than me. (but if not, wow). These things just weren't talked about back then (in the mid-2000s). They were just rumors whispered around. Ugh.
> 
> But the funny thing is that now a good 90% of my closer friend circle is LGBT+ in some way. This includes old friends all of the way from back in high school/marching band. I didn't work to make it happen this way for the most part, most of them I met for separate reasons and then they came out later. They say we subconsciously group together, and it looks like that is what happened with me.


I was in high school from 2011-2015, so yeah, a bit of an age difference between us! My school as a whole wasn't the greatest when it came to LGBT students, but we did have a GSA after my junior year, and all of us gay kids were able to find each other and stick together, for the most part.



Spoiler: this is kind of a tangent but tw for homophobia and bullying I guess



But yeah my friend was bullied in middle school for going into a room with his boyfriend (people spread rumors about what exactly they were doing in there alone), and before I had ever even come out in eighth grade I guess I gave off vibes, or these girls just didn't like me and decided the most harmful thing they could do was tell people I was gay, because they would make comments about me going into the bathroom with my best friend, and what _we_ were doing in there together (using the bathroom!), and yell "there goes the gay!"... a lot of it was pretty dumb and juvenile looking back, but when you're 13 it sucks lol.


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## Croconaw

I put this in a spoiler as there’s mentions of strong homophobia, but I wanted to share my experience when I was in high school. I think this is why it’s important to be accepting of everyone if you’re going to be in a position of power…



Spoiler: tw: mentions of strong homophobia



I’ve graduated from high school but I had a strong gut feeling the school therapist was homophobic. First, we had this prom coming up, and I expressed to her that I didn’t want to go multiple times after her constantly bringing it up. She told me that if I didn’t go, then someone else wouldn’t get to go and that should make me feel bad. I told her I’d feel uncomfortable wearing a dress, and when I showed up to the prom wearing a suit, she said it wasn’t gender appropriate and made me change immediately into this purple dress.

She got several bad reviews from parents and she was moved to a different school for a change of scenery, but honestly, I don’t think she was at all qualified to be a therapist. I don’t know what happened to her since being transferred, but I’d be surprised if she still has a counseling job at this point. This is very unacceptable, in my opinion.


----------



## Chris

I posted in here previously about legally changing my name and title in June. Today I received this gift from my parents. They said they wanted to do something to show their support.







Spoiler: worn









I dropped my birth name 10+ years ago (and hadn't gone by it for a good 6-7 years before that) and they were never cooperative with me on it - which is why it took so long for me to take the steps to legally change it. This time I didn't even tell them what I was changing my name, or what to, before the paperwork was already in progress - so I'm amazed at the quick effort they have made to adjust. Kind of sucks that I had to go the legal route before they respected the decision, but it's progress and this was such a lovely way of showing it.

Also, I got hollered at by drunks for kissing someone outside a pub the other week. Doubt that would have happened if we were straight.


----------



## Metal Scorpion

Lately I've been having trouble understanding my sexual orientation. I'm somewhere between grey-ace and ace, and unsure if I'm demi, bi or panromantic. It's so confusing that I don't understand where exactly I am.


----------



## Croconaw

Metal Scorpion said:


> Lately I've been having trouble understanding my sexual orientation. I'm somewhere between grey-ace and ace, and unsure if I'm demi, bi or panromantic. It's so confusing that I don't understand where exactly I am.


Hi there! Don’t feel like you need to put a label on yourself. It’s difficult not knowing exactly where you fall, but remember, sexuality is a spectrum. It doesn’t make your feelings any more or less valid. It’s definitely okay if your label changes over the years. You are not limited to just one label and you’re forced to stick with it. It doesn’t work like that. There was a point in time where I identified as a lesbian, but I don’t think that’s me. It was a learning experience. If a term you identify with doesn’t seem right anymore, there’s no problem changing. Eventually, you’ll find a term that suits you and one you are happy with. There’s no rush.


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## Metal Scorpion

I agree - it's good to know that sexuality is a spectrum, and also good to know that once a label doesn't fit anymore, you can easily find one that fits. It's good that I'm re-learning things because I have a feeling mine has changed over the years recently. The problem is my habit of rushing decisions, which makes it more difficult.


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## xSuperMario64x

I have a minor problem and I would like some advice.

so as stated in my signature, my pronouns are they/them and he/him. I'm okay with either. what I'm not okay with, however, is when people refer to me as she/her. my problem is that even though I'm androgynous-presenting I've only been referred to by my preferred pronouns once or twice in public in the last two months. basically everyone calls me she/her, mostly people who don't know me but even my parents do it (still). as of now I haven't made a big deal about it cause, hey, the people referring to me as she/her don't know me and they're just politely assuming. 
but I wish there was a way to get people to be more inclined to use my preferred pronouns. I have pronoun pins but idk if that kind of thing is necessarily appropriate to wear all the time. would it be rude or awkward if i corrected them and told them I'm not a girl? I know it's really difficult for me to make it happen naturally because even though I have short hair and often wear masculine clothes, I still have a relatively high voice and a more rounded feminine face, as well as stud earrings (though I personally don't see that as a strictly feminine thing). there's a reason why I don't explicitly identify as a trans-man, it's because I'm non-binary, I'm not a "guy" per se. but me trying to be myself just leads to people assuming I'm a girl and calling me by the wrong pronouns. 

I actually have another smaller thing I would like advice for. I would like to start "cracking down" on my parents regarding using the proper name and pronouns. my dad;s made a big to-do abt it because my dead name, which he gave me, was his great grandmother's name. the name I go by now is the one my mom originally gave me so she's had no issue with it. however I get really frustrated every time my dad calls me by my dead name. he and my mom also still have a habit of referring to me as she/her around people in public, which makes things complicated bc I've been introducing myself to new people as he/him and if my parents talk to them and refer to me the wrong way things could get awkward fast. I'm thinking specifically of, if at any point, my dad talks to the director of the symphony I will soon intern for and refers to me as she/her whereas the director knows me as he/him. 
what should I do to get them to say the right name and pronouns in public? maybe I should tell them to just not talk about me? should I correct them? should I ignore them if they use my dead name? I have no clue how to deal w this without them seeing me as rude (which they love to do).


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## daringred_

xSuperMario64x said:


> I have a minor problem and I would like some advice.
> 
> so as stated in my signature, my pronouns are they/them and he/him. I'm okay with either. what I'm not okay with, however, is when people refer to me as she/her. my problem is that even though I'm androgynous-presenting I've only been referred to by my preferred pronouns once or twice in public in the last two months. basically everyone calls me she/her, mostly people who don't know me but even my parents do it (still). as of now I haven't made a big deal about it cause, hey, the people referring to me as she/her don't know me and they're just politely assuming.
> but I wish there was a way to get people to be more inclined to use my preferred pronouns. I have pronoun pins but idk if that kind of thing is necessarily appropriate to wear all the time. would it be rude or awkward if i corrected them and told them I'm not a girl? I know it's really difficult for me to make it happen naturally because even though I have short hair and often wear masculine clothes, I still have a relatively high voice and a more rounded feminine face, as well as stud earrings (though I personally don't see that as a strictly feminine thing). there's a reason why I don't explicitly identify as a trans-man, it's because I'm non-binary, I'm not a "guy" per se. but me trying to be myself just leads to people assuming I'm a girl and calling me by the wrong pronouns.
> 
> I actually have another smaller thing I would like advice for. I would like to start "cracking down" on my parents regarding using the proper name and pronouns. my dad;s made a big to-do abt it because my dead name, which he gave me, was his great grandmother's name. the name I go by now is the one my mom originally gave me so she's had no issue with it. however I get really frustrated every time my dad calls me by my dead name. he and my mom also still have a habit of referring to me as she/her around people in public, which makes things complicated bc I've been introducing myself to new people as he/him and if my parents talk to them and refer to me the wrong way things could get awkward fast. I'm thinking specifically of, if at any point, my dad talks to the director of the symphony I will soon intern for and refers to me as she/her whereas the director knows me as he/him.
> what should I do to get them to say the right name and pronouns in public? maybe I should tell them to just not talk about me? should I correct them? should I ignore them if they use my dead name? I have no clue how to deal w this without them seeing me as rude (which they love to do).



hey, i know this isn't really the _same _situation, but a few years ago when i first started seeing my girlfriend, my nan all but refused to refer to her as such. it was always, "when will you see your friend again?" "how's your friend doing?" "did you have a nice time with your friend?" every time, i would deliberately and pointedly reply with an emphasis on "my *girlfriend*". eventually, i think she got the hint because she hasn't done it since those first few months. i know it's hard, but sometimes clear defiance and being 'rude' is the only way to go about it, especially if asking nicely/politely repeatedly hasn't worked in the past. we as a community didn't get to where we are strictly through peaceful protests and asking nicely after all. although please *only do this if your environment is safe. *i know that's probably common sense, but i feel like i should say it anyway. if they refer to you by your dead-name or the wrong pronouns, ignore them. if they call you rude, point out how it's rude to refer to you as someone you're not. if they do the same when talking about you to other people, openly correct them to that person. they're less likely to make a fuss about it in front of others. (at least in my experience.) if there's anyone in your life that openly supports you, encourage them to respond the same way because that might help reinforce the idea that their behavior is unacceptable. that being said, your safety should always be top priority. if you're going to be punished for being defiant or at risk of being kicked out etc. it's probably just best to grin and bear it until you're in a position where you won't be effected by those repercussions. idk if any of this helps but, yeah. good luck, and keep your head up!


----------



## tomatospooks666

xSuperMario64x said:


> I actually have another smaller thing I would like advice for. I would like to start "cracking down" on my parents regarding using the proper name and pronouns. my dad;s made a big to-do abt it because my dead name, which he gave me, was his great grandmother's name. the name I go by now is the one my mom originally gave me so she's had no issue with it. however I get really frustrated every time my dad calls me by my dead name. he and my mom also still have a habit of referring to me as she/her around people in public, which makes things complicated bc I've been introducing myself to new people as he/him and if my parents talk to them and refer to me the wrong way things could get awkward fast. I'm thinking specifically of, if at any point, my dad talks to the director of the symphony I will soon intern for and refers to me as she/her whereas the director knows me as he/him.
> what should I do to get them to say the right name and pronouns in public? maybe I should tell them to just not talk about me? should I correct them? should I ignore them if they use my dead name? I have no clue how to deal w this without them seeing me as rude (which they love to do).



honestly, forget trying to be polite about this. the way i got my parents to stop misgendering me was to stick with my guns and keep correcting and correcting even when they felt the need to argue and get ****ty about it. i made it clear that i wasn't going to just sit quietly while they misgendered me and eventually they realized i wasn't backing down about it and now use my correct pronouns and name most of the time.

in terms of what to do, just keep correcting them everytime it happens. in public, in private, anytime you notice misgendering happens correct it. and if you can, def try ignoring them if they insist on reffering to you incorrectly. hope for the best!


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## xSuperMario64x

it's so weird to think that even tho I'm aro/ace I still kinds consider myself bi/pan. I'm not one of those aros who despises romantic relationships, I would actually quite like to be in one, and I would honestly be content to date anyone regardless of gender (though I do prefer men) leading me to believe that I'm aroace but I'm also pan lol.

is anyone else this perplexing?? or is it just my crazy ***


----------



## cornimer

xSuperMario64x said:


> it's so weird to think that even tho I'm aro/ace I still kinds consider myself bi/pan. I'm not one of those aros who despises romantic relationships, I would actually quite like to be in one, and I would honestly be content to date anyone regardless of gender (though I do prefer men) leading me to believe that I'm aroace but I'm also pan lol.
> 
> is anyone else this perplexing?? or is it just my crazy ***


I'm ace but also a lesbian but also that's kind of a gendered term and I'm agender so to answer your question, *yes* lol


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## ali.di.magix

xSuperMario64x said:


> it's so weird to think that even tho I'm aro/ace I still kinds consider myself bi/pan. I'm not one of those aros who despises romantic relationships, I would actually quite like to be in one, and I would honestly be content to date anyone regardless of gender (though I do prefer men) leading me to believe that I'm aroace but I'm also pan lol.
> 
> is anyone else this perplexing?? or is it just my crazy ***


I've never related to something so hard in my life lmao. I consider myself to be aroace but I'd date someone of any gender if I felt there was some sort of connection. I'm in a constant battle with myself if I'm aroace are maybe just a picky bisexual lol


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## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> it's so weird to think that even tho I'm aro/ace I still kinds consider myself bi/pan. I'm not one of those aros who despises romantic relationships, I would actually quite like to be in one, and I would honestly be content to date anyone regardless of gender (though I do prefer men) leading me to believe that I'm aroace but I'm also pan lol.
> 
> is anyone else this perplexing?? or is it just my crazy ***


Ugh, same. I really don’t desire a relationship. I’m lithromantic and get crushes, but I never expect anything to come from those crushes. If my feelings are reciprocated, I immediately lose feelings and get uncomfortable. I don’t really want to complicate things with a term. I typically just say that I’m not into relationships and leave it at that, without actually identifying   with a term. I’m also a sex-repulsed asexual, so I just find it easier to say that I’m only looking for friendships. It seems less complicated that way.


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## Corrie

ali.di.magix said:


> I've never related to something so hard in my life lmao. I consider myself to be aroace but I'd date someone of any gender if I felt there was some sort of connection. I'm in a constant battle with myself if I'm aroace are maybe just a picky bisexual lol


Maybe you're demiromantic/demisexual?


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## pottercrossing

I know for sure I'm pansexual and demisexual, but I'm still trying to figure out if I'm genderfluid, bigender, or non-binary. All I know is I'm not cisgender.
Sadly, my stepmom doesn't believe in bi/pansexuality. She once said, and I quote:
_"Bisexuality is a myth. In my opinion, people have to be either straight or gay. People who say they're bi/pansexual are just too afraid to be openly gay." _


----------



## tessa grace

I'm coming here to rant-ish (sorry if this is the wrong place to post) cause honestly I'm so tired of my dad. He's a respectful person on most LGBTQIA+ aspects but istg he has to villainize transgender women.
He got all mad about Caitlyn Jenner today in a discussion we were having about woman of the year. He said she "took away our hard work" and such as if she wasn't a girl. As a woman I have no issue with Caitlyn winning and I don't understand why people get so mad over the smallest things. I feel like he points out all the bad things transgender people have done when obviously women and men and all genders make mistakes because we're HUMAN. not because of our gender!!!
Anyway im asking for help- how the heck can i help my dad understand through my eyes?


----------



## moonbyu

Spoiler: rant kinda



just found out that not one but two of my friends are transphobic and homophobic!! awesome! /s
they will be so happy when i tell them i use all pronouns and that i'm enby (probably, still thinking it out lmao)!
bahhh... i keep meeting weird homophobic people but it seems my other friends have almost no problem with finding lgbtq friends or just people who.. don't hate the lgbtq community? it sucks over here y'all ;(


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## tessa grace

moonbyu said:


> Spoiler: rant kinda
> 
> 
> 
> just found out that not one but two of my friends are transphobic and homophobic!! awesome! /s
> they will be so happy when i tell them i use all pronouns and that i'm enby (probably, still thinking it out lmao)!
> bahhh... i keep meeting weird homophobic people but it seems my other friends have almost no problem with finding lgbtq friends or just people who.. don't hate the lgbtq community? it sucks over here y'all ;(


I'm so sorry. I hope you can find people who support your actions and way of living


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## Croconaw

tessa. said:


> -snip-


You’re asking how you can help your dad understand through your eyes, but the answer is simple. You don’t. I know that’s not what you want to hear, but I’ve learned that you can’t make someone believe a certain way. I say this with beliefs regarding anything, that most people are set in their ways and will simply _not_ see it from another perspective. Whether it’s right or wrong, or neither, you’ll just have to accept it. I think we can all benefit from seeing perspectives other than or own, but unfortunately, it seems to be difficult thing for some people. I understand it must be hard to listen to comments like that from family or people you’re close to, but it’s inevitable and something we have to deal with. Typically people are dead set in their ways regarding controversial topics or touchy subjects such as the one you mentioned. Venting about it definitely helps, but don’t try to change his thoughts on this, because trust me, you cannot. Nobody can, and attempting to do so will be a waste of not only your time but his time, as well. Again, I’m really sorry you have to deal with this.


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## chicken soup

hiya! not too many of my friends know that im pan... or go by she/they (besides @tessa. and some others) but yea.. I just want a place where we can feel safe and supported. It took me a while to figure out what my sexuality is and i still sometimes think that i might be bi or something else.. anyways thanks for making this thread! i feel like its a good idea to have a safe place for all the LGBTQIA+ people in this community!


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## xSuperMario64x

tessa. said:


> I'm coming here to rant-ish (sorry if this is the wrong place to post) cause honestly I'm so tired of my dad. He's a respectful person on most LGBTQIA+ aspects but istg he has to villainize transgender women.
> He got all mad about Caitlyn Jenner today in a discussion we were having about woman of the year. He said she "took away our hard work" and such as if she wasn't a girl. As a woman I have no issue with Caitlyn winning and I don't understand why people get so mad over the smallest things.


this reminds me of a recent post that a family member of mine (my mom's cousin) shared on facebook. the post talked about how Mj Rodriguez became the first transgender woman (she's also a POC) to win a Golden Globe, for Best Actress in Drama. first of all, the title of the article was super insensitive by saying "the winner of the best actress golden globe is actually a biological man" and ofc my cousin had to add on "haha, I guess men won in the end. and it was the crazy liberals who did it." would it be wrong of me to point out that my cousin is also middle-aged, white, and straight? 

like I honestly like my cousin a lot, he can be a good guy. but if he's gonna act transphobic like this (also this isn't the first time he's shown his transphobic side on facebook) then how can I reasonably expect him to treat me with any kind of respect? I already have to deal with transphoic garbage from my dad, who consistently calls me by my deadname and incorrect pronouns (it's funny how I literally have _two _sets of pronouns that he could call me by but he still uses the one incorrect pronoun set), and it's really disheartening to see other family members act the same way. it's shameful, really.

	Post automatically merged: Jan 19, 2022



Croconaw said:


> You’re asking how you can help your dad understand through your eyes, but the answer is simple. You don’t. I know that’s not what you want to hear, but I’ve learned that you can’t make someone believe a certain way. I say this with beliefs regarding anything, that most people are set in their ways and will simply _not_ see it from another perspective. Whether it’s right or wrong, or neither, you’ll just have to accept it. I think we can all benefit from seeing perspectives other than or own, but unfortunately, it seems to be difficult thing for some people. I understand it must be hard to listen to comments like that from family or people you’re close to, but it’s inevitable and something we have to deal with. Typically people are dead set in their ways regarding controversial topics or touchy subjects such as the one you mentioned. Venting about it definitely helps, but don’t try to change his thoughts on this, because trust me, you cannot. Nobody can, and attempting to do so will be a waste of not only your time but his time, as well. Again, I’m really sorry you have to deal with this.


you know what I say to this? if someone isn't willing to love you for who you are then they don't deserve to be a part of your life. I still live with my parents but I've basically cut my dad out of my life as much as possible, and you can bet that when I move out I'll prob never talk to my dad again (not only bc of transphobia but also bc he has verbally/emotionally abused me and my mom and brother). don't waste time trying to hold onto something that can never be. cut that negativity bs out of your life and you'll feel much better.


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## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> -snip-


Yes, of course. There’s nothing wrong with cutting people out of your life. There are a few people in my family I no longer speak to and I avoid them at all costs. Still, I think cutting people out of your life completely is a much better decision than trying to change someone’s mind. It’s easier for the both of you.


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## Shoutarous

I feel like this is the best place to talk about this,
So I'm a trans-man who's been out for about 2 years now. I keep asking my mom to go on testosterone and I've given her lots of time to think on it. It's not like we can't afford it, but I think she just wants me to detransition. She's stated multiple times that she thinks this is all just something that I feel inside and I don't need to do anything to "change myself" and I'm "pretty the way I am"
Does anyone have any advice on how I can bring up the subject with her? I'm currently talking to a counciler to see if he can help out but its been bothering me for a while


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## Croconaw

Shoutarous said:


> -snip-


Hi! From your mom’s perspective, I think she just doesn’t want you to do something you’ll regret. There are some incidents where people do regret transitioning, but for some, it’s the best thing they’ve done. I don’t think your mom is a bad person or is trying to prevent you from testosterone. However, if she’s actually saying that it’s just something you feel inside that’s a little close-minded and I’m sorry you have to deal with that. I don’t know how old you are but you said you’ve been out for two years and that’s a good bit of time. I don’t think you’d feel this way for two or more years if it was a phase, so clearly it’s not. Also, if you’re an adult would it be possible to just get it done yourself, or do you need her for financial help? Unfortunately if it’s coming from her pockets I don’t think there’s much you can do. If it’s 100% your money though, I say you can do what you want with it and you should transition if you feel in your heart that’s what’s right. The first problem here is that you’re asking permission to transition. It’s up to you and not her or anyone else. I don’t know if this helps, but just my take on things.


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## Shoutarous

Thanks a lot for your advice ^^


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## iiyyja

Croconaw said:


> Hi! From your mom’s perspective, I think she just doesn’t want you to do something you’ll regret. There are some incidents where people do regret transitioning, but for some, it’s the best thing they’ve done. I don’t think your mom is a bad person or is trying to prevent you from testosterone. However, if she’s actually saying that it’s just something you feel inside that’s a little close-minded and I’m sorry you have to deal with that. I don’t know how old you are but you said you’ve been out for two years and that’s a good bit of time. I don’t think you’d feel this way for two or more years if it was a phase, so clearly it’s not. Also, if you’re an adult would it be possible to just get it done yourself, or do you need her for financial help? Unfortunately if it’s coming from her pockets I don’t think there’s much you can do. If it’s 100% your money though, I say you can do what you want with it and you should transition if you feel in your heart that’s what’s right. The first problem here is that you’re asking permission to transition. It’s up to you and not her or anyone else. I don’t know if this helps, but just my take on things.


 He's still a minor. You have to be at least 18 years old to take t without parental consent. There's only so much you can do when you're financially dependant on your parents 





Croconaw said:


> There are some incidents where people do regret transitioning


 Important to note the rate of detransitioning is less than 1 percent. And of that 1 percent, most chose to detransition because they couldn't bear the social stigma attached to being trans. What you have in mind is very uncommon 





Shoutarous said:


> I feel like this is the best place to talk about this,
> So I'm a trans-man who's been out for about 2 years now. I keep asking my mom to go on testosterone and I've given her lots of time to think on it. It's not like we can't afford it, but I think she just wants me to detransition. She's stated multiple times that she thinks this is all just something that I feel inside and I don't need to do anything to "change myself" and I'm "pretty the way I am"
> Does anyone have any advice on how I can bring up the subject with her? I'm currently talking to a counselor to see if he can help out but its been bothering me for a while


 Has your mom tried to reach out to other parents going through the same thing with their kid? It could help her come to terms with your transition


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## Shoutarous

I don't think she's done looking into much of the subject at all unfortunately. I've done my best to explain things to her but I could try to ask her!


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## daringred_

Shoutarous said:


> I don't think she's done looking into much of the subject at all unfortunately. I've done my best to explain things to her but I could try to ask her!



i had a similar issue with my nan repeatedly telling me that being a lesbian was "just a phase" and referring to my girlfriend as just my 'friend' despite multiple people correcting her multiple times, including myself. thankfully, it only lasted a few months. i don't think she ever had any malicious intent in the first place, but i'm glad she now recognizes both my sexuality and my relationship. if you're confident that your mother is accepting and won't ridicule or punish you etc. you could try pushing the topic harder and being more adamant about it. sometimes you have to be confrontational to see change, unfortunately. otherwise, you could take the initiative and, say, print out some documents on the subject and/or comments from parents of other trans kids across the world and give them to her. similarly, if you know anyone who's also trans, you could see if their parent(s) might reach out to her and broach the topic. you mentioned that you're trying to get your counselor to help, but you could also enlist your doctor's aid. (if you're seeing one.) they might be able to call your mom and talk to her about transitioning etc. and put any issues/worries she has at ease.


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## Croconaw

iiyyja said:


> Important to note the rate of detransitioning is less than 1 percent. And of that 1 percent, most chose to detransition because they couldn't bear the social stigma. What you have in mind is very uncommon


Just thought I’d clarify that I was trying to see from their mom’s perspective. It is uncommon, for sure, but it still happens. That doesn’t necessarily mean that I have this in mind for this particular situation. I don’t see that being the case here, though, since he said he’s been feeling this way for over two years.


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## ZeldaCrossing64

I love this thread!! Now I feel like I have a place to talk about these kind of things. ^^

I just came out as non-binary recently, and my friends were kind enough to help me with a new name, which I'm still deciding. My concern is telling my family about it. I'm sure it would affect them and I'm scared that they won't accept me. For example I wouldn't want them to refer to me as their sister, daughter, grand-daughter, niece, etc. and I would prefer the gender-neutral terms instead. Like I said, I'm scared that they won't accept me and that they'll still use my dead name and all that.

What I'm worried about the most with my family is my brother, since he's against LGBTQ+ in general and doesn't like the fact that I'm bisexual, so having to use new words would be too daunting and he most likely won't do it. And also my older family members, specifically my grand-parents. I don't think they would understand the concept, but they were born in a different era so it's not necessarily their fault. I also want to cut my hair, but I don't think anybody in my family is skilled with that, and it would be pretty pricey to get it done professionally. And obviously I can't do it myself. And besides, I would get many comments like "oh but your hair is so beautiful, don't cut it"

Sorry if this post is long and rant-y. T-T


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## Croconaw

ZeldaCrossing64 said:


> And besides, I would get many comments like "oh but your hair is so beautiful, don't cut it"


I’m cis, but yeah, I get that. I have short hair. I didn’t like it being long. I actually cut my own hair and style it myself. I didn’t get any comments from my dad or anything, but others in my secondary family wouldn’t have approved of my hair or the way I dress, lmao. I’m happy I did it, though. I recommend cutting your hair if that’s what you want to do. I like it so much better now that it is short. I look like a completely different person now, lol.


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## xSuperMario64x

I cut my hair really short almost a year ago and I love it now. everyone told me my long hair was beautiful but it was way too much of a hassle to keep it looking nice and most of the time it didn't actually look that good. I have ocd so I had an incessant need to make my hair look exactly one way and it was driving me mad. now that my hair is short it's way easier to care for (except that I have to have it trimmed every 6 or so weeks bc it grows so fast lol) and it doesn't get in the way anymore


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## moo_nieu

trying to help explain to my mother about misgendering and even sent a nice resource meant to help parents understand a little more about what it means to come out as nonbinary, but its really a struggle. she just cant "ignore the facts" that im female and so i should be rightfully and truthfully called her daughter... bruh.. i told her to do some research or just refer to me with gender-neutral terms to appease me because idc i just cant take anymore discrimination from my loved ones .-. i mean i get not understanding or even having reservations about it (if you were raised with a hardcore mindset that being gay is bad), but doesnt she realize that if she wants a relationship with me shes going to have to respect that?

i know many of us have had struggles with our families about identity and sexuality.. has anyone come out on the good side of this with having your family accept you and treat you with respect? alternatively, anyone whos decided to cut ties due to discrimination, when do you decide to do that and how did you cope with moving on?

edit: to be more clear, i still currently have hope my family will accept me and refer to me how i would like, but hearing other peoples experience or advice would be nice


----------



## Shawna

A week and a half ago, I came out to my mom as aro-ace (towards real people).   

She is supportive!


----------



## Croconaw

I’m going back and forth on what my sexuality is, lol. All I know is I’m asexual. Could be aromantic, but maybe another term on that spectrum because I don’t want the label of a relationship, but I truly don’t mind being affectionate with close friends. I have love for people but I don’t think it’s, like, relationship love. It’s “I love you as a person and I’ll be affectionate with you, but it doesn’t mean anything more.” I can’t really explain it, but hoping someone else relates or feels the same way. And yeah, I do get crushes sometimes, but those crushes could never progress into something more than a very close friendship for me. Can anyone relate?


----------



## Rubombee

Croconaw said:


> I’m going back and forth on what my sexuality is, lol. All I know is I’m asexual. Could be aromantic, but maybe another term on that spectrum because I don’t want the label of a relationship, but I truly don’t mind being affectionate with close friends. I have love for people but I don’t think it’s, like, relationship love. It’s “I love you as a person and I’ll be affectionate with you, but it doesn’t mean anything more.” I can’t really explain it, but hoping someone else relates or feels the same way. And yeah, I do get crushes sometimes, but those crushes could never progress into something more than a very close friendship for me. Can anyone relate?


Well, as far as I know aromantic means you don't have romantic attraction, it doesn't "interfere" with platonic love at all! So you could be aromantic.


----------



## Croconaw

Rubombee said:


> Well, as far as I know aromantic leans you don't have romantic attraction, it doesn't "interfere" with platonic love at all! So you could be aromantic.


Huh, maybe. I could vibe with that term. It was something that I was looking into, including it’s “umbrella terms.” I did relate to most of the aromantic things, though.


----------



## ZeldaCrossing64

moo_nieu said:


> trying to help explain to my mother about misgendering and even sent a nice resource meant to help parents understand a little more about what it means to come out as nonbinary, but its really a struggle. she just cant "ignore the facts" that im female and so i should be rightfully and truthfully called her daughter... bruh.. i told her to do some research or just refer to me with gender-neutral terms to appease me because idc i just cant take anymore discrimination from my loved ones .-. i mean i get not understanding or even having reservations about it (if you were raised with a hardcore mindset that being gay is bad), but doesnt she realize that if she wants a relationship with me shes going to have to respect that?
> 
> i know many of us have had struggles with our families about identity and sexuality.. has anyone come out on the good side of this with having your family accept you and treat you with respect? alternatively, anyone whos decided to cut ties due to discrimination, when do you decide to do that and how did you cope with moving on?
> 
> edit: to be more clear, i still currently have hope my family will accept me and refer to me how i would like, but hearing other peoples experience or advice would be nice


I'm sorry that you have to go through that, I'm facing the same thing. My parents are okay with it (I think), but my brother is being the least bit supportive (code for _not at all_). I hope your mother + other family members will accept you for who you are, and remember that things will get better! <3


----------



## xSuperMario64x

guys I really need some trans positivity right now, one of my family members on fb is basically just arguing bs and not trying to admit that he and his friends are super transphobic (he even tried to open the convo by suggesting that transphobia means "fear" of trans people and not also hatred/discrimination, I suppose suggesting that transphobia either doesn't exist or is a stupid thing to believe exists).

I get that fb is literally the worst possible place to post stuff about lgbt+ things because everyone on there is basically a boomer who has no respect for lgbt people. but I'm kinda feeling down about it and I really need some trans positivity and love rn


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> guys I really need some trans positivity right now, one of my family members on fb is basically just arguing bs and not trying to admit that he and his friends are super transphobic (he even tried to open the convo by suggesting that transphobia means "fear" of trans people and not also hatred/discrimination, I suppose suggesting that transphobia either doesn't exist or is a stupid thing to believe exists).
> 
> I get that fb is literally the worst possible place to post stuff about lgbt+ things because everyone on there is basically a boomer who has no respect for lgbt people. but I'm kinda feeling down about it and I really need some trans positivity and love rn


Ugh, I’m sorry. Facebook is literally the worst place for anything lgbt, trans or not trans. It kind of sucks because if you’re openly lgbt, that’s what they target you for. I’ve gotten called the four letter “d” word before for presenting as a more masculine female. I just deleted my Facebook and I honestly haven’t looked back. Even if it’s not discriminating, Facebook is just full of trolls and rude people. The environment of forums are just so much better. Also, you don’t have to be friends with all your family on Facebook. There are some people in my family that I don’t even talk to anymore. Especially since you’re an adult, just cut them off and leave it at that. I understand that’s not always possible, but it’s an option.


----------



## LadyDestani

xSuperMario64x said:


> guys I really need some trans positivity right now, one of my family members on fb is basically just arguing bs and not trying to admit that he and his friends are super transphobic (he even tried to open the convo by suggesting that transphobia means "fear" of trans people and not also hatred/discrimination, I suppose suggesting that transphobia either doesn't exist or is a stupid thing to believe exists).
> 
> I get that fb is literally the worst possible place to post stuff about lgbt+ things because everyone on there is basically a boomer who has no respect for lgbt people. but I'm kinda feeling down about it and I really need some trans positivity and love rn


I'm so sorry you're having to go through that. I know nothing I can say can really make things better, and nothing you can say will probably change their minds, but just know that there are people who support you.

I second what @Croconaw said too about possibly cutting them out of your life if they are just going to bring you down. I did that in high school with some of my extended family who did not support my relationship with someone of a different race and I felt so much better for it. If they are close family and you love them, you can try to find a common ground, but if nothing is working sometimes letting them go is the best option.


----------



## Chris

xSuperMario64x said:


> guys I really need some trans positivity right now, one of my family members on fb is basically just arguing bs and not trying to admit that he and his friends are super transphobic (he even tried to open the convo by suggesting that transphobia means "fear" of trans people and not also hatred/discrimination, I suppose suggesting that transphobia either doesn't exist or is a stupid thing to believe exists).
> 
> I get that fb is literally the worst possible place to post stuff about lgbt+ things because everyone on there is basically a boomer who has no respect for lgbt people. but I'm kinda feeling down about it and I really need some trans positivity and love rn


There's no point in trying to educate people like that. They're not willing to listen. I cut contact with my grandmother over her homo/transphobic behaviours. When my other grandmother died last year, it made me consider if I had done the wrong thing and if I might regret my decision once she's also gone, and as cruel as it sounds I came to the conclusion that I won't. Life's too short to put up with people like that, even if they're family. 

In unrelated news, I've a date today with someone new.


----------



## Croconaw

Anywayyyy, I’m finally coming to terms that I’m asexual and _somewhere_ on the aromantic spectrum. It kind of feels nice to have a word for it. And “somewhere,” meaning that I _definitely_ feel romantic attraction but I can never let it progress into anything further… Kind of like “I love you so much and you’re a really great friend, but still wouldn’t mind being affectionate with you.” 



Chris said:


> In unrelated news, I've a date today with someone new.


Congratulations on the date!! I hope it went well!


----------



## BrokenSanity

I feel so ticked off,
My straight-cisgender parents can't seem to comprehend what gender identity is no matter how hard I try to explain, no use telling my parents I'm Non-binary and Agender since they will never understand what that even is, I told my mom I use them/they and it's not that she's being unsupportive it's that she isn't gonna really accept it either, she just says that using them/they is different and she's never heard that before, "It must be new" yeah people have used them/they as a singular noun since 1375 good grief... 
I thought if my parents think it's "so weird" I use them/they then I thought that they were gonna be way more accepting I'm asexual(Aro-ace. but you get the point) I know it's hard for parents to see their children coming out as like transgender or gay or something but I feel like it should be perfectly acceptable to see someone come out as asexual(I've been asexual for almost six years It's nothing new) not everyone wants to have sex okay? Why is that so wrong, my father was having a stupid argument with my mother because he's mad she won't sleep with him and my mother says she hates having sex, and my father is all like "it's the circle of life, everyone does it, it's not a personal choice blah blah blah" are you freaking kidding me? Your just gonna say that and pretend like what, 11% of the world's population is asexual? You think people aren't aloud to deny sleeping with someone? Oh boy wait until you hear I'm never sleeping with anyone ever, what are you going to do about it? I know my mother doesn't understand LBGTQIA+ terms but not that she needs to identify as this if she doesn't want to of course but she either seems to be asexual or at least grey-asexual(I don't think she knows I'm asexual) I wish that if we share a sex repulsive trait in common then she would be more respectful towards my pronouns because I asked her to use them/they and she doesn't even care... And what is my father supposed to do when he thinks I'm gonna sleep with someone and I'm gonna deny everyone


----------



## Croconaw

BrokenSanity said:


> -snip-


First of all, I’m sorry your parents aren’t supportive. They/them is gender neutral and I typically default to those terms if I’m unsure of someone’s gender. Also, you don’t have to come out. People don’t come out as straight, so why should anyone else have to come out? Asexuals/Aromantic (both) can usually pass as straight if they’re not interested in dating. Like, just say you’re not into dating anyone. I understand it’s nice to have a label, though. As for “passing as straight,” it doesn’t necessarily sit well with me because it puts a negative energy on people that aren’t straight. 

I’m also sex repulsed. I don’t understand the appeal of touching the parts we use to go to the bathroom…  Anyway, you can’t force someone to use certain words no matter how right or wrong it is. The more you push it the more reluctant she’ll be to use gender neutral terms. I’m a female, and the whole sex-repulsed thing is usually more negatively seen with us that we don’t want kids or don’t want to “continue the family name.” Especially since I’m also an only child. I’m sorry they’re not accepting your pronouns. 

Anyway, it reminds me of something my mom said: “if you’re not having sex, you’re just friends.” You can date without sex. You can have sex without dating. It’s literally unreal that she’d even say this?? What an absurd viewpoint.


----------



## BrokenSanity

Croconaw said:


> First of all, I’m sorry your parents aren’t supportive. They/them is gender neutral and I typically default to those terms if I’m unsure of someone’s gender. Also, you don’t have to come out. People don’t come out as straight, so why should anyone else have to come out? Asexuals/Aromantic (both) can usually pass as straight if they’re not interested in dating. Like, just say you’re not into dating anyone. I understand it’s nice to have a label, though. As for “passing as straight,” it doesn’t necessarily sit well with me because it puts a negative energy on people that aren’t straight.
> 
> I’m also sex repulsed. I don’t understand the appeal of touching the parts we use to go to the bathroom…  Anyway, you can’t force someone to use certain words no matter how right or wrong it is. The more you push it the more reluctant she’ll be to use gender neutral terms. I’m a female, and the whole sex-repulsed thing is usually more negatively seen with us that we don’t want kids or don’t want to “continue the family name.” Especially since I’m also an only child. I’m sorry they’re not accepting your pronouns.


Thank you for the support Croconaw. I'm just disappointed since my mother doesn't understand LGBTQIA+ stuff she is unintentionally very disrespectful to LGBTQIA+ in public with her not using correct pronouns and not understanding concepts such as not everyone is happy with their birth sex and transgender people exist, I was at a glasses shop once at Walmart getting new glasses and there was this MTF person(sorry don't want to assume their trans since they might be something else) and my mom was giving them a rude stare seeing a man present as a woman and made them feel so uncomfortable they actually left the glasses shop because they were nervous with how she was acting, I don't have to come out and she doesn't have to understand but she needs to be respectful of other people's pronouns and she needs to accept that people are allowed to change their gender identity even if she doesn't understand, she just says if your not happy with what your born as why don't you just be cis-gender and just present the other way and not care about what others think, I wish she wouldn't always harass transgender people for "changing their gender" and that it's so creepy and they shouldn't do that? She doesn't need to understand but she can still be respectful and you can't tell people who they are supposed to be. 

If my father ever brings me into a situation where he thinks I'm getting a partner I can just say I'm not dating anyone, again I can't force  him to understand anything and I shouldn't force him to understand but when I mean I'm not gonna date anyone I mean both I'm not gonna sleep with anyone and I'm also not going to engage in physical affection and romantic stuff. Guess It doesn't matter if he gets it or not because I don't see how he is suppose to force me into getting a partner. 

I actually have three sets of pronouns in no preference people can use for me: It/Its or Them/They or He/Him. On here and at my online school I tell people all three of my pronoun sets since both the friend group I'm in at school and TBT forums are a LGBTQIA+ safe place but at home I only told my mother I use Them/They since I'm assuming she's going to have a worse reaction when she hears  I use "It" or "He" but she just told me she doesn't mind what pronouns I use(anywhere) but I don't think she's ever gonna use my pronouns, at least she's not mad but I don't like hearing her call Them/They a weird pronoun set to use as singular pronouns, oh well at least I have other people who use my pronouns. I'm feeling better after reading what you wrote, I'm hoping soon I can forget my father's offensive comment.


----------



## Croconaw

BrokenSanity said:


> -snip-


Yeah, I understand! I don’t think we can really assume someone’s gender or if someone’s trans or not. Like, I present more masculine and tbh if it wasn’t for my chest, I’d likely pass as a guy, but I do use female pronouns and still identify as female. It’s inevitable that we’re going to notice someone who _could_ be transgender or a feminine guy/masculine female because it’s different to what we normally come across. You can choose to let them be though, and even though my attention is drawn to them I’ll just let them be and not treat them any differently. I’m sorry that your mom doesn’t seem to understand that people can literally be what they want. It’s not 1950 anymore, geez.


----------



## Chris

Croconaw said:


> Congratulations on the date!! I hope it went well!


It went _incredibly_ well. It was only intended to be a coffee date on a Saturday afternoon. We didn't part ways until Monday morning, and that was only because I had to go to work. Since then we've been on the phone talking every day. I'm being introduced to their 4-year-old son tomorrow and I'm equal parts nervous and excited for this step. Everything feels as if it's on fast forward but at the same time it feels so right.



BrokenSanity said:


> I feel so ticked off,
> My straight-cisgender parents can't seem to comprehend what gender identity is no matter how hard I try to explain, no use telling my parents I'm Non-binary and Agender since they will never understand what that even is, I told my mom I use them/they and it's not that she's being unsupportive it's that she isn't gonna really accept it either, she just says that using them/they is different and she's never heard that before, "It must be new" yeah people have used them/they as a singular noun since 1375 good grief... <snip>


I've a few choice words for your father, but when the person who needs to hear it isn't here there's little point in going into it. As for your mother, give her time. This is new to her and it is going to feel very confusing. She may come around as she becomes more familiar with gender identity as a concept. If you push too hard too fast or lecture her then you are going to back her into a corner where she will feel a need to double down and defend her current stance. Kindly-worded, but firm, reminders and encouragement are more likely to help her to understand. e.g. in that situation where you talked about encountering someone non-cisgender in a shop, you could have quietly pointed out that she was staring, and then this might have opened up a dialogue on how that person was presenting. I'd advise patience and understanding while you are still living under her roof. It's a frustrating and long process, but many people cannot change their world view overnight. However, your father sounds like a lost cause and probably won't ever be open to budging an inch. He is also owed no information about your sex life (or lack thereof).


----------



## ZeldaCrossing64

When I tell people that I'm non-binary, they completely ignore me. But when I tell people that I'm bisexual, they're like: "Oh my god, you like girls??" That's why I don't tell people about it anymore, why can't I just be accepted? :/
Not sure if this is supposed to be in the "What's Bothering You?" thread instead.


----------



## Croconaw

ZeldaCrossing64 said:


> When I tell people that I'm non-binary, they completely ignore me. But when I tell people that I'm bisexual, they're like: "Oh my god, you like girls??" That's why I don't tell people about it anymore, why can't I just be accepted? :/
> Not sure if this is supposed to be in the "What's Bothering You?" thread instead.


Those seem like typical reactions of young teenagers, and I assume that they are, given that you are very young yourself. I’m going to just come out and say that this doesn’t necessarily mean they are against it. They might just not know how to react. 

However, I’m not aware of the complete details of the non-binary situation. Did you tell them because you want them to use a particular set of pronouns? If so, how they react to that tidbit will tell you a lot more. By ignoring, are they ignoring your preferred pronouns or just unaware of how to react to the fact that you are non-binary?


----------



## xSuperMario64x

BrokenSanity said:


> You think people aren't aloud to deny sleeping with someone? Oh boy wait until you hear I'm never sleeping with anyone ever, what are you going to do about it?


this is actually the biggest mood of all time lol

fr though I'm sorry you have to deal w that. regarding the ace thing it's good to just be persistent abt it. I've known I was ace since before I knew there was a term for it, and my mom still thinks I might "change [my] mind" like okay you wanna bet on that?


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> this is actually the biggest mood of all time lol
> 
> fr though I'm sorry you have to deal w that. regarding the ace thing it's good to just be persistent abt it. I've known I was ace since before I knew there was a term for it, and my mom still thinks I might "change [my] mind" like okay you wanna bet on that?


Honestly, throughout going back and forth on my romantic orientation, the only thing that has remained consistent is my being absolutely sex repulsed.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> Honestly, throughout going back and forth on my romantic orientation, the only thing that has remained consistent is my being absolutely sex repulsed.


apothisexuals unite


----------



## -Lumi-

It's lesbian visibility week!!  In honor of this week I hope that all my fellow lesbians have an extra special week full of good things and happiness  I hope everyone else has a wonderful week, too!!


----------



## Neb

I think I might have posted about this on here a while ago, but it’s still an issue.

I don’t like being closeted as a gender fluid person. No one in my family knows about it aside from my other mom. She’s very supportive, but the rest of my family isn’t. My birth mom (who is a lesbian) is tolerant towards different sexualities. The exception believe non-binary or genderfluid people exist. If I told her she’d say “whatever” and never mention it again. I don’t really need advice on that since I don’t mind not telling her.

My problem is I want to be out publicly. I’d like to wear more feminine clothing on my feminine days. I wore a dress to a pride parade once and got harassed by both attendees and people at a restaurant. This was in a progressive city no less. I have multiple dresses I’d like to wear, but I’m afraid of being treated poorly again. Is there a way to avoid this from happening?


----------



## Croconaw

Neb said:


> Is there a way to avoid this from happening?


You don’t want to make the mistake of thinking you can change how someone treats you. They are either a nice and tolerant person or they’re not. I hope this doesn’t come off as insensitive, but I think the best way is just not caring what other people think. If people are rolling eyes at you, let them. People will be intolerant. However, if they’re harassing you to your face, they are just not worth your time and it’s best to walk away. You don’t have to give people like that the time of day.


----------



## xSuperMario64x

Neb said:


> I think I might have posted about this on here a while ago, but it’s still an issue.
> 
> I don’t like being closeted as a gender fluid person. No one in my family knows about it aside from my other mom. She’s very supportive, but the rest of my family isn’t. My birth mom (who is a lesbian) is tolerant towards different sexualities. The exception believe non-binary or genderfluid people exist. If I told her she’d say “whatever” and never mention it again. I don’t really need advice on that since I don’t mind not telling her.
> 
> My problem is I want to be out publicly. I’d like to wear more feminine clothing on my feminine days. I wore a dress to a pride parade once and got harassed by both attendees and people at a restaurant. This was in a progressive city no less. I have multiple dresses I’d like to wear, but I’m afraid of being treated poorly again. Is there a way to avoid this from happening?


you can't prevent it, all you can really do is have confidence in yourself. brush it off and make it seem like they're the fools for trying to make you feel bad abt yourself. I know having confidence can be difficult, especially in public, so I would suggest focusing on yourself for now and getting to know/like/appreciate who you are. the more you like yourself the more confidence you'll naturally have.


----------



## Chris

Neb said:


> I think I might have posted about this on here a while ago, but it’s still an issue.
> 
> I don’t like being closeted as a gender fluid person. No one in my family knows about it aside from my other mom. She’s very supportive, but the rest of my family isn’t. My birth mom (who is a lesbian) is tolerant towards different sexualities. The exception believe non-binary or genderfluid people exist. If I told her she’d say “whatever” and never mention it again. I don’t really need advice on that since I don’t mind not telling her.
> 
> My problem is I want to be out publicly. I’d like to wear more feminine clothing on my feminine days. I wore a dress to a pride parade once and got harassed by both attendees and people at a restaurant. This was in a progressive city no less. I have multiple dresses I’d like to wear, but I’m afraid of being treated poorly again. Is there a way to avoid this from happening?


It's unfortunately just one of those things that happens. I'm somewhere in the realm of NB/GF and, ironically, I am harassed more often when I present as my AGAB than when I don't. Especially when out on dates - I'm gay and people only seem to notice/care when I present similarly to the person I'm out with. I wish there was a solution to this one, but there isn't really. I tend to just pretend I didn't hear them. Otherwise I tell them to piss off (would not advise, really, especially if you fear they'll be physical). If it happens in a restaurant, like your example above, you could always discretely tell the staff there that someone is giving you trouble if it's making you feel unsafe.


----------



## moo_nieu

Neb said:


> I think I might have posted about this on here a while ago, but it’s still an issue.
> 
> I don’t like being closeted as a gender fluid person. No one in my family knows about it aside from my other mom. She’s very supportive, but the rest of my family isn’t. My birth mom (who is a lesbian) is tolerant towards different sexualities. The exception believe non-binary or genderfluid people exist. If I told her she’d say “whatever” and never mention it again. I don’t really need advice on that since I don’t mind not telling her.
> 
> My problem is I want to be out publicly. I’d like to wear more feminine clothing on my feminine days. I wore a dress to a pride parade once and got harassed by both attendees and people at a restaurant. This was in a progressive city no less. I have multiple dresses I’d like to wear, but I’m afraid of being treated poorly again. Is there a way to avoid this from happening?


not sure if you can avoid all that happening bc other people discriminating against you is not something you can control, but i think its important to remind yourself that your identity and expression are valid (having friends who support my identity is a helpful affirmation for me so maybe reach out to a few friends for support if you can). wearing a dress can really make you feel super confident and free but the confidence a lot of times has to first come from yourself. yeah until society moves on from prejudice there will still be  people who are rude to you just because they think you should live differently. its not their business of course but it can be really hurtful for sure. 

i think self confidence and reaching out to people for support are good ways to help mediate it but it cant be outright avoided. on days where you want to express your fluidity more but maybe dont feel confident enough to wear a dress, you could try expressing yourself with accessories maybe? theres still the chance of people being total jerks but it would be a little less noticeable i think and really its all to make you feel good and confident. 

i guess my advice overall would be to try to keep up your self confidence, reach out to friends for support, and keep experimenting with ways you can express yourself that make you feel happy. im sorry your mom isnt understanding. it can be hard to live with secrets like this for sure. just remember your identity is absolutely valid even if there are lots of people who arent seeking to understand it. im sorry you had all those rude comments when you just wanted to wear a dress  thats so horrible


----------



## Neb

Is it weird that I don’t think about my gender identity too often? I’m technically trans and nonbinary, but it’s not necessarily something that’s on my mind 24/7. When I do think about it though I have boy days, girl days, and neither days. I don’t typically talk about it irl either unless someone brings it up (which is almost never since I still present as a cis boy). I don’t know, it just kinda bothers me a little since I don’t really feel out unless it’s pride month.


----------



## Croconaw

Neb said:


> Is it weird that I don’t think about my gender identity too often? I’m technically trans and nonbinary, but it’s not necessarily something that’s on my mind 24/7. When I do think about it though I have boy days, girl days, and neither days. I don’t typically talk about it irl either unless someone brings it up (which is almost never since I still present as a cis boy). I don’t know, it just kinda bothers me a little since I don’t really feel out unless it’s pride month.


I think it’s actually a good thing to not be thinking about gender identity or sexuality. Just be yourself and not let things like these be your whole identity. It can be part of you but not all of you, if you catch my drift. I’m not open about my sexuality at all unless someone asks, although, it is pretty obvious, I’ll admit that. I’m just not a huge fan of people who let it consume them and that’s the entirety of who (they think) they are. 

Note: I’ve realized that my previous statement makes it sound like I’m calling it a phase, and it may or may not be, but that wasn’t the intention. I meant it in the sense that they think it’s 100% who they are as opposed to only a small part. I’m into girls, but I’m also a person who travels. I’m a person who’s very much into sports. I also own a dog. You get the point.

It’s okay to be proud of what makes you different, though. Don’t let my opinion stop you, just my two cents.


----------



## Chris

Neb said:


> Is it weird that I don’t think about my gender identity too often? I’m technically trans and nonbinary, but it’s not necessarily something that’s on my mind 24/7. When I do think about it though I have boy days, girl days, and neither days. I don’t typically talk about it irl either unless someone brings it up (which is almost never since I still present as a cis boy). I don’t know, it just kinda bothers me a little since I don’t really feel out unless it’s pride month.



I don't think it's weird. I mean, being NB is not something I constantly think about - much in the same way that I don't think all that much about being gay, disabled, or anything else along these lines that is outside of my control. They're just normal everyday things that aren't all that exciting to talk or think about until they're relevant in that moment. I've found other people tend to stress over my gender identity and how to refer to me more than I do. e.g. before my new boss met me she asked a mutual contact my pronouns, felt that person got it wrong, so proceeded to ask me the second I sat down at our first meeting. Both of them were correct, so I told her I don't mind either.

Is it possible you're still not fully comfortable with your identity?


----------



## Rubombee

Neb said:


> Is it weird that I don’t think about my gender identity too often? I’m technically trans and nonbinary, but it’s not necessarily something that’s on my mind 24/7. When I do think about it though I have boy days, girl days, and neither days. I don’t typically talk about it irl either unless someone brings it up (which is almost never since I still present as a cis boy). I don’t know, it just kinda bothers me a little since I don’t really feel out unless it’s pride month.


mine's a big mess that i've stopped trying to figure out, so yeah, i only think about it when it's relevant/brought up in some way haha

like yeah, i know i'm nb by now, i don't need to think more about it, and it's easy to tell people that i am. but what i DO fret more about is stuff like my chosen name — like what middles i want to have (because i am _not_ keeping my current ones if i eventually change it for real), or whether i should tell more people about it because it feels much more of a big deal to think about irl people using it… so that's a part i'm gonna take a long time to settle i think :'D

oh and i constantly wear both an ace and nb pins attached to my glasses so i guess it kinda fills the "not feeling out" niche you mentioned? since with them i'm p much instantly out to those who know


----------



## moo_nieu

Neb said:


> Is it weird that I don’t think about my gender identity too often? I’m technically trans and nonbinary, but it’s not necessarily something that’s on my mind 24/7. When I do think about it though I have boy days, girl days, and neither days. I don’t typically talk about it irl either unless someone brings it up (which is almost never since I still present as a cis boy). I don’t know, it just kinda bothers me a little since I don’t really feel out unless it’s pride month.


gender identity is something thats been really important in my life the past two years: trying to figure myself out, establishing pronouns, and defending from/explaining to "loved" ones. even though i feel its an important part of my experience in life, i dont think about my gender identity all the time. i just live and sometimes it crosses my mind.

i think its absolutely okay for you to recognize your identity but not think about it much. you said it bothers you to not be out though so that does seem like something to try and figure out.. i agree pronoun pins are a very clear and visible way to be out. personally, i like to find supportive lgbt+ media and enjoy that. it helps me feel more secure and happy about myself and like its actually okay to be me which i guess allows me to feel more connected to myself? idk if something like that is what youre looking for though. or maybe you could get some pride merch to keep around yourself to feel more connected and accepted? i got a little sappho mug, and its made me really happy to just see it around. sorry if im misunderstanding how its bothering you. i guess its just up to you and how you want to express yourself. maybe little affirmation notes around your personal spaces like bedside table or bathroom mirror could help some? or maybe you could take a few minutes to meditate in the morning to recognize and affirm your feelings and identity each day. im not really sure tbh bc most of my problems related to indentity are from other peoples words and actions and not myself. i hope some of these could help though. if not, well just know that your identity is valid no matter how much attention or importance you place on it. youre you and thats cool


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## xSuperMario64x

so I'm obv aro-ace but I'm not opposed to being in a romantic/quasi-platonic relationship so I've been trying to find what kind of label might match me (not necessarily bc it's important at all, but because it's fun for me to learn about all the different romantic orientations out there and seeing where I fit in). I'm mainly interested in guys but I don't like to use the term gay to refer to myself since I'm NB (trans-masc) so I think the term achillean is closer to how I feel.

for anyone who doesn't know, "achillean" is like a much more broad version of mlm, basically referring to men or people who are nb and more masculine, being attracted to people who are men or nb/trans-masc. 
the feminine equivalent is "sapphic" and that's how I first came to discover this word.

I'm pretty comfortable w this label, because while I wouldn't be opposed to dating a woman (or nb/trans-fem person) or even an agender/gender-fluid person, I've always found myself to be more interested in men/masc ppl. which kinda interesting considering I'm aro-ace so like, why should that even matter lol.


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## xSuperMario64x

I have some woes I need to get off my chest. it's only fitting since it's now officially pride month.


it seems like every time I develop a crush it's with someone who doesn't seem to be interested in someone like myself. my first crush was a friend of mine, who's a cis guy and interested in girls (I'm nb/trans-masc and ace soooo haha). every person I've had a crush on since has been a guy who isn't gay/mlm/bi/etc or is already in a relationship/interested in someone else. I can usually accept it but I have a difficult time moving on because I always feel like I won't find someone that special again.

has anyone else ever felt this way? and if you have, how do you deal with it?




also wish I could apologize to everyone whom I've potentially friendzoned over the years. I'm a useless aroace who is totally blind to that kinda stuff lol.


----------



## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> -snip-



I don’t have any advice, but I’ve had quite a few crushes, and I’ve always eventually found someone else. Relationships aren’t really my thing, and my crushes almost never progress from anything more than a crush. On a few occasions, I do become friends with the person but they aren’t aware of my crush on them, lol.

I move on pretty quickly compared to most people. I’m not sure how, but I don’t let the sadness overwhelm me. I’m sad for a bit, but I move on pretty quickly and forget the crush. I’m not actively looking for a relationship either. If one happens, it happens, but I’m not going out of my way to find one, especially if I’m ever in Pennsylvania where I’m trying to move AWAY from. Like, there’s no point if I’m not going to be there long term.


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## Neb

xSuperMario64x said:


> -snip-


I’ve had a ton of one sided crushes too. One ended up leading me to a toxic relationship where I was just an “in-between person” (which was what they called it after cutting contact). Usually the crushes are intense and brief. I used to feel obligated to tell the other person, but that habit went away. In most cases just letting the feelings pass was what I found useful. When the urge to tell the person came up I’d just give myself some space until I was ready to talk again. It’s hard, but ultimately the unrequited feelings do pass.


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## -Lumi-

Happy pride month everybody!! 

I just wanted to share a really sweet experience I've had. The child care centre I work at is attached to an elementary/middle school and theyve actually been celebrating pride month. It is _so sweet*. *_

When I was in elementary and middle school the only time I heard the word gay was when it was being used as an insult. 

Here though, the classroom doors have been decorated for pride, the teachers are all wearing rainbows of some kind (at the very least a pin), and they're having fun little celebration days. I know there's still bullying and bad people in school - I'm not saying everything is perfect now or that this is the standard across all schools. But it is so sweet and such a big difference to see. Made me really happy


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## Neb

I had a fun question idea for this thread! What is the best pride merch you have?


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## Croconaw

Neb said:


> I had a fun question idea for this thread! What is the best pride merch you have?


I don’t have any. That’s probably not the most interesting answer, but I did want to get a flag at some point. Although, that won’t be until after I move.


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## xSuperMario64x

scratch what I said before. I may have made a new self discovery today! I believe I am omni! 

I always wondered if the term pan would fit, but despite me being willing to date all genders I do tend to have preferences. I thought I was mainly into men/nb trans-masc ppl but honestly I'm willing to date women and trans-fem nbs as well as agender/genderfluid/etc people. so in a way I am interested in anyone with a slight preference for men/trans-masc ppl, and I think the definition of omni fits that pretty well 

so yeah, I'm basically aro-ace-omni


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## Franny

Neb said:


> I had a fun question idea for this thread! What is the best pride merch you have?


i have a bi-colored bandana. i also have a BTDQ shirt if you consider that pride merch.


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## Alienfish

Neb said:


> I had a fun question idea for this thread! What is the best pride merch you have?


I have a smaller pride flag that I hung over an ugly photo-copy painting and a pride flag keychain  (Both are rainbow flag).

Used to have a tote bag as well but it now rests in peace cause I had to use it not to start a fire and cover a frying pan since it was the only cloth/cover thing we available at that point.

And I also have a 8 colours/og rainbow flag pattern iphone 6,7,8,SE case I bought a couple years ago that I can now use again


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## LadyDestani

I think I've finally found a label that feels right for me! I am polysexual!

I kept debating about whether I was bi or pan, but neither felt like a perfect fit. So after doing some research I came across polysexual and it just clicked.

I'm attracted to multiple genders but not necessarily all of them. I have a definite preference for males or masc-presenting people when it comes to romantic attraction, but I wouldn't rule out females, agender, or genderfluid people. I actually have a slight preference for females when it comes to sexual attraction, but can really go multiple ways.

After a little over a year of seriously questioning where I fit in, it feels good to finally have a term for it!


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## ZeldaCrossing64

I'm not sure if I should label myself as bi anymore. I feel like I have to live up to that name, y'know? If I'm crushing on a guy, people will think I'm straight. If I'm crushing on a girl, people will think I'm lesbian. (Neither of those terms actually fit me 'cause I'm non-binary, haha.) I feel romantic + sexual attraction for both genders, but I wouldn't mind dating someone who's non-binary. I dunno, I just say I'm bi for simplicity's sake, even if it's technically untrue.

Still confused about my whole non-binary situation as well. I tried telling people about it at school and all I got in return were strange looks. I also have a new name, which I'm having trouble telling others about it. I haven't even told my family about it yet, so I'm still being called by my dead-name. I don't even wanna change the name of my Mii, 'cause they'll see it and question me about it. (I did do it in Tomodachi Life, but by then I try my best to avoid my look-alike when my brother is watching me play.)

I just wish I was 100% certain about who I am in terms of sexual orientation and gender identity, so I won't be up all night thinking about it. It'd be a pretty heavy weight off my shoulders.

I also wish my brother wasn't homophobic in general about LGBTQ+. It's hard being myself when I'm around him. He always says "you're my favorite sister" and it makes me... I can't even find the right word here. I have told him numerous times to refer to me as his sibling, and he did once, but not in the way I was expecting. "You're my favorite... Sibling..." And he has the nerve to audibly shudder and look at me weirdly. It just made me feel worse.

Sorry for the super long text, haha. I didn't expect it to turn into a rant, I guess I just needed to talk about it. XP


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## moo_nieu

ZeldaCrossing64 said:


> I'm not sure if I should label myself as bi anymore. I feel like I have to live up to that name, y'know? If I'm crushing on a guy, people will think I'm straight. If I'm crushing on a girl, people will think I'm lesbian. (Neither of those terms actually fit me 'cause I'm non-binary, haha.) I feel romantic + sexual attraction for both genders, but I wouldn't mind dating someone who's non-binary. I dunno, I just say I'm bi for simplicity's sake, even if it's technically untrue.


if you feel the label fits you then you can absolutely be non binary and bi. im a non binary lesbian. i think labels are generally supposed to be helpful for you rather than cause you stress. its okay to not label yourself. its also okay for your sexuality and identity to be something thats fluid and/or something you realize over time and for your labels to change as you try to discover whats most comfortable/feels right for you. there is a lot of invalidation out there around bisexuality specifically, but it is absolutely a valid identity and also an identity that can belong to nonbinary people and people attracted to non binary people. it sounds like youre surrounded by people who invalidate you, and im so sorry youre going through that. its horrible that people try to make us ashamed of ourselves for just trying to exist authentically


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## Croconaw

ZeldaCrossing64 said:


> -snip-


My issue with labels is that people try so hard to _fit_ different labels. Yeah, labels are adjectives to describe you as a person but the problem comes when people say they can’t do certain things or be a certain way because they are supposed to be “this label.” I think labels are good, though. They help people understand themselves and others better. I don’t use labels personally because they change and you don’t necessarily have to stick to one label. I used to struggle with whether I was lesbian, pan, or something else entirely. I came to the point where I stopped trying to find a label and just be myself. If I like someone, I like them. So when people ask, I just say I’m me.  It’s better than thinking “oh I can’t be lesbian because I think this guy is attractive” or something.

Besides, labels do change overtime. Remember that sexuality is a spectrum. You aren’t stuck with one label for the rest of your life, and don’t feel ashamed for changing it.


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## Croconaw

My apologies for the double posting, but:



Spoiler: anti-ace, tiny rant



My mom is just so weird? Now it’s not that I get along with her anyway and we don’t talk at all except for the “happy birthday” text I receive from her once a year. She’s actually supportive of same sex relationships and doesn’t care at all about gender identity, but she’s anti-ace? She tells me all the time it’s not a relationship unless you’re having sex because that’s just a friendship. She even went as far to say that you aren’t really an adult unless you’re sexually actively. There’s so many things wrong with this… I’m actually a virgin and I don’t plan on changing that anytime soon at least. I just don’t understand why she’s putting so much importance on sex when there are literally friendships with sex and relationships without sex. It doesn’t define what two people are. I feel like she’ll accept anyone for who they are so long as they’re having sex eventually.


----------



## BrokenSanity

Croconaw said:


> -snip-


As an Asexual who is also sex-repulsed I get this a lot
A-spec exclusionists really suck I don't know what else to do except ignore people who don't understand aces or people who say aces(or aroaces) can't feel love or be in a relationship because they don't want sex(or romance) 
I'll never understand these people who have problems with people who don't like sex/romance like what how does that affect you lol


----------



## ZeldaCrossing64

My parents want to name one of the puppies Charlie, which is my current name. How am I supposed to tell my family that they shouldn't because it's my new name and I feel weird about giving the same name to a puppy, and also telling them that the name they've been calling me for the past 15-and-a-half years is now obsolete? I don't think they'd take it too well, honestly. I think I'll just keep quiet for now.


----------



## tumut

I've been really sick of the racism in the LGBT community recently -_-

A lot of people don't realize how important intersectionality is or take it for granted but me hearing "oh you're not like them" because I'm a somewhat white-passing Hispanic who is pretty well assimilated into U.S. culture is quite frankly really off putting and disgusting

It's made me want to avoid very white spaces at least where I live unfortunately

It's generally very accepted where I live but I also I definitely understand why a lot of LGBT leave for bigger cities. I've been considering leaving my city now for a while just to be in a place where there's a broader range of communities and subcultures


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## Croconaw

ZeldaCrossing64 said:


> My parents want to name one of the puppies Charlie, which is my current name. How am I supposed to tell my family that they shouldn't because it's my new name and *I feel weird about giving the same name to a puppy, and also telling them that the name they've been calling me for the past 15-and-a-half years is now obsolete?* I don't think they'd take it too well, honestly. I think I'll just keep quiet for now.


Do they know about your current name? It seems that they don’t, based on the part of your post that I put in bold. It might just be a strange coincidence, but I can understand how weird this would be.


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## ZeldaCrossing64

Croconaw said:


> Do they know about your current name? It seems that they don’t, based on the part of your post that I put in bold. It might just be a strange coincidence, but I can understand how weird this would be.


They do not, I've been sort of procrastinating telling them . . . I think I had my new name since April or May actually, so that sort of gives you an idea of how long I've been waiting to do so.
I kind of . . . Don't want to, if that makes sense. But yeah, it's definitely a weird experience sharing the same name as a puppy without my family even knowing it.


----------



## Croconaw

ZeldaCrossing64 said:


> They do not, I've been sort of procrastinating telling them . . . I think I had my new name since April or May actually, so that sort of gives you an idea of how long I've been waiting to do so.
> I kind of . . . Don't want to, if that makes sense. But yeah, it's definitely a weird experience sharing the same name as a puppy without my family even knowing it.


Is it because you don’t feel like they would be accepting of it, or because you think changing your current name would upset them in a way? 

I’m not really a fan of my birth name either. Like, I wish it was more androgynous. My reluctance comes from my parents (well, dad) feeling bad because I was actually named after one of the female leads in one of his favorite movies. Still, I’m more indifferent about it than “I _must_ change my name NOW.”


----------



## ZeldaCrossing64

Croconaw said:


> Is it because you don’t feel like they would be accepting of it, or because you think changing your current name would upset them in a way?
> 
> I’m not really a fan of my birth name either. Like, I wish it was more androgynous. My reluctance comes from my parents (well, dad) feeling bad because I was actually named after one of the female leads in one of his favorite movies. Still, I’m more indifferent about it than “I _must_ change my name NOW.”


A bit of both, really. I remember telling my mom once that I wanted to change my name to Zelda, in which she responded with: "I'm still gonna call you [dead-name] no matter what!" So . . .
My family likes my dead-name (even if I do not), so me changing it would at least result in a comment like: "Oh, but your old name was so beautiful! I don't see why you changed it."
If I'm being honest, I'd rather keep quiet about it to my family and only let friends and new people I meet know about my new name. Whether I want to legally change it when I'm older is yet to be decided, but I have quite a bit of time to think about it from now until later.


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## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> I’m not really a fan of my birth name either. Like, I wish it was more androgynous. My reluctance comes from my parents (well, dad) feeling bad because I was actually named after one of the female leads in one of his favorite movies. Still, I’m more indifferent about it than “I _must_ change my name NOW.”


better than my case, my dad named me after my great great grandmother and it's a strictly feminine name. I did choose to start going by my middle name instead bc it's androgynous, but he's so ticked off abt it. it's not even like I legally changed my name (I wouldn't dare do that until I'm no longer living under his roof), I'm just going by a different name now. he thinks I'm disrespecting her by not going by that name anymore. like I get it, it means a lot to him, but parents should be more concerned about their child's wellbeing than some name.


----------



## BrokenSanity

Spoiler: Lost, confused... kind of questioning...



I've been wanting to post here for quite a while about my identity
not sure how I want to type this out in words

Ever since early childhood I knew I was different, I knew I felt I never belonged in female sociality nor in male sociality
I've always been myself doing my own thing and not letting others define me saying I don't act like my birth sex and the opposite sex saying I'm not really like them either
I knew early on I was aroace
I already made up my mind years ago I would never marry or have kids and I would never sleep with anyone
I disregarded importance for my organs long ago
and felt like me being aroace has a connection to my identity
I never felt like I had a gender I felt like it was sociality or nature trying to force it onto me when I knew this wasn't me
I'm not a male or a female I'm just a person I'm just me I'm genderless

I didn't think this was normal for me to feel different about my gender like this but then I figured out other people feel like this too and everyone has their own gender identity
I started exploring what pronouns I wanted to be called and by age 11 I figured out I wanted to be called them/they
I was 12 or 13 when I found the term "Agender" and it just clicked from then on I finally figured out who I was

I've identified as Agender for at least almost three years now and I feel happy knowing who I am and what I'm not
but now I find myself questioning my identity once more
I know I don't fit in with females I've always gotten along better with males but I don't feel like this is where I belong either
I know I don't feel happy being feminine but I don't quite feel that happy being masculine either
I feel erased from humanity like I don't belong anywhere
I have a hard time explaining to people my identity because Agender isn't quite that common and people find it hard to understand what it means when I say I just feel like a person not a male or female

I don't know I just feel like nobody
I just feel like now what? I know I'm not these things so now where do I belong?
I try and explain my own identity to myself and it makes no sense
I try and say I don't care about my gender identity but that's a lie I know I do care about it
I'm wondering if I really like feeling like this like I'm stuck in a void or something

I'm wondering if maybe I might be xenogender since it's an umbrella term under non-binary
it's when gender cannot be explained with terms like masculine and feminine and they are explained or compared to other things like concepts and feelings etc..
but there are many kinds of xenogender and I don't even know what my gender feels like or what it's suppose to be

I just feel so lost and confused...
*Sorry I know this 5-paragraph essay makes no sense, it doesn't make much sense to me either I suck at explaining things and trying to get my thoughts and feelings out of my head*


----------



## moo_nieu

i found out theres a more descriptive term for my identity: demigirl and demifemme. im not sure exactly how to describe my gender but i strongly identify as non binary while also feeling not entirely separate from womanhood and i didnt realize there was a more descriptive term for it. it feels really validating to know that many other people have similar feelings. obviously i dont need to prove my identity/sexuality to anyone but i kind of feel insecure about people who invalidate nb identities and also nbs validity as lesbians. its just nice to have a term that helps to explain how i feel a little better and also makes me feel more empowered to call myself a lesbian. ofc theres always people who will try to gatekeep, but it made me feel more empowered to find out the demigirl/femme label and i wanted to share


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## xSuperMario64x

moo_nieu said:


> i found out theres a more descriptive term for my identity: demigirl and demifemme. im not sure exactly how to describe my gender but i strongly identify as non binary while also feeling not entirely separate from womanhood and i didnt realize there was a more descriptive term for it. it feels really validating to know that many other people have similar feelings. obviously i dont need to prove my identity/sexuality to anyone but i kind of feel insecure about people who invalidate nb identities and also nbs validity as lesbians. its just nice to have a term that helps to explain how i feel a little better and also makes me feel more empowered to call myself a lesbian. ofc theres always people who will try to gatekeep, but it made me feel more empowered to find out the demigirl/femme label and i wanted to share


yay demi friend!! I'm demiboy meaning I'm non-binary but I'm also somewhat connected to masculinity/manhood, so because I'm nb and trans-masc I am demiboy. I'm so glad to see that you've found an identity that fits you


----------



## Croconaw

I only recently discovered the demi terms on a random discord server I’m in, of all places. I think I might look into some of the gender terms, if anything to shed some light. I identify _strongly masculine._ My grandma doesn’t even know that I’m into girls, but I feel like she’s just in denial at this point because someone can visibly look at me and see that I’m clearly not straight. I know first-hand you can’t judge someone based on their appearance, but I mean, come on.


----------



## Drawdler

I did not realise we have this thread. Do any other bisexual/biromantic users here have massive pendulum swings of what you’re interested in? I swear sometimes it feels like I’m becoming a lesbian but I honestly know I’m not, and other times it’s the opposite, I wonder if I really like girls at all but I ultimately know I do.

I think I mentioned this once- but for a little bit of time, I thought I was a biromantic homosexual because men down here dress and groom themselves horribly, which is extremely unattractive. Turns out it was that the men around me were unattractive, but I still think about that. It’s a strange feeling to be equally attracted to the people of each sex I do find attractive, but very rarely finding people in one sex who I find attractive. Like, take a man and a woman I find attractive, I’ll like both equally. Heck, I’ll probably like the man more. But finding that man under all the others? Nightmare. THIS is why I’ve never been the one to make the first move.

My gender is getting more confused to be honest. I kind of hate being a short girl because I want to present differently. I wanna be a cool boy. I don’t know how to explain what I mean. I mean, I want to present in a lot of different ways… Right now I keep thinking, “I wish I was Yoshida”.

I wanna be taller than this but not more than 6’ kinda tall. I wanna be strong and toned but not ripped. I wanna be able to be physically strong like a boy. But I still think of myself as a girl sometimes and I wouldn’t want to give up having that side of my identity. I want to be more “cool” instead of cute and not fight to present myself that way or be taken seriously, as such a short woman I can’t help it. People think I’m “cute” and I don’t like that because it makes me feel more dependent or pitied and I have bad experiences with people just… not taking me seriously. It’s cool if I surprise people sometimes, but it feels constant. It’s exhausting. I’d like to be pretty but not in such a girly way,

What’s worse is that I love love love having long hair. Like, it goes down to my thighs kinda long. I wouldn’t give that up, at least in this body and I don’t really think I look good or at least in this body, nor do I feel right with short hair. It probably looks best at my waist. But you have long hair and people see it as feminine. Lame.

If gender is a spectrum I feel like a boy with a woman’s side if that makes sense. I really should just declare myself bigender. I talked about being bigender offhandedly on another topic, but the more I think about it since, I feel better thinking of myself as a man. I named myself “Lesbian King” on some Discord servers which just seems like a joke to others there, ‘cause they aren’t in on all of this. But to be honest, there’s a lot of truth in that nickname, as tongue-in-cheek as it is, as much of a joker as I am. I love how oxymoronic it is, I’m not even lesbian, but it fits some of my chaotic gender confused amorphous energy.

I spoke about this to my partner a bit but they don’t really know anything about gender, they’re just supportive, but they can’t really solve more for me and aren’t sure what to ask or do. I spoke to them about how I don’t like being a girl and the feeling that I can’t feel as secure as I want doing things on my own and I think that really made my partner feel down. They wouldn’t really say more to me but they told me they were sick (which they have been, but they stopped speaking so suddenly after that). Feels like more was wrong. Sometimes talking to my partner is just too hard or I feel guilty over it.

But hey, when I do think of myself as a man I have a name for that. Emile. Fits my ingame name too. I wouldn’t even have to change my name from Emmy if I ever decided to transition. It’s even more confusing because I don’t feel like I want to transition. To be honest, I think my physical body is never going to be what I want. And even I find it cute, but that’s just not who I want to be physically. I’ve even gone trying to be fit, I had abs, I eat good. After that I ended up anemic and realised how physically weak I am.


----------



## Croconaw

@Drawdler - I’m definitely not bisexual so I can’t comment on the first part, but I can understand what you mean about your gender. 

For me, I kind of feel like a female (I think?) with a 99% masculine side, so much that if I’m mistaken as a male (which happens all too often) I feel good about it. I’m strictly using she pronouns on here, according to my profile, but I’m honestly fine with being referred to as “they/them.” 

The more I’m mistaken as a male, and feeling the way it makes me feel when someone calls me a male, it makes me question a bit. I don’t want to go as far to transition, but I keep wishing my name was more gender-neutral.

Currently, my real name is only a female name and can’t be used for males. I’d prefer something more androgynous. I don’t want to go way back and forth on my gender though, especially online, because I don’t want to confuse people. It’s definitely something I’m thinking about, though. 

Changing my name is something I feel very strongly about, though. I even have a name that feels more me, I guess. I haven’t told anyone. I kept it to myself.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your hair. Hair length doesn’t determine gender. It’s not the 1950s. My aunt actually had me convinced that Michael Jackson was a girl for the longest time because he had long hair. She was a bit, delusional, to say the least. Of course, I was young and wasn’t thinking for myself at the time. Thinking for myself was something that I did struggle to do, but I’m getting better at it.


----------



## Croconaw

My apologies for the double post, but I’ve been really digging deep into some gender terms. There seems to be a lot, but this is the one I’m resonating with:

*Paragender* is the feeling very near one gender and partially something else which keeps you from feeling fully that gender.

Paraboy, paraman, paramasculine – a person who identifies mostly as a boy, man, or an otherwise masculine gender, but not entirely. The masculine part makes up 51-99% of their gender.

I’ve been sort of thinking about this, and _paramasculine_ is the sub-term I have been resonating with. I’ve been holding off posting here until I was more confident with this term. 

The thing I’m not 100% on is the pronouns, but I guess I’m cool with either. I guess they/them is the more _neutral_ term and wise to avoid going back and forth until I am 100% I guess, like I stated in my post above. I didn’t even touch the pronouns field on my profile in the longest time.

This sounds more like a blog post which wasn’t my intention, so I’ll just stop it right here, lol. I just wanted to give an update on where I’m at basically.


----------



## Drawdler

Tbh I just want to make a small post and give a shoutout to Testament from Guilty Gear. I feel like not a lot of people here would be into Guilty Gear but Testament is canon enby who uses they pronouns

I already had a certain attachment to this character for unrelated reasons but the more I questioned my own identity and just went through certain things it deepened my appreciation for them






Bridget and Haehyun have some themes of gender (not the same but feel free to look into them more if you’re curious) and iirc Venom is canonically gay (if not, it’s VERY VERY strongly implied that he is, I think the Wiki said it was confirmed im too tired lol)


----------



## pottercrossing

I know I posted on this thread a while ago about my gender/sexuality, but here’s an update as to how I identify now.    Firstly, I feel like I’m a mix of bisexual and  pansexual. I’m pansexual in the sense that I’m attracted to all genders, but I’m bisexual in the sense that I have a preference to a specific gender. It’s always a job explaining that to people. Second, in terms of gender, I identify as demigirl, meaning I sometimes identify as female and sometimes as genderless. And no, it’s not the same thing as being genderfluid. Being genderfluid means that you transition between all genders not just two. I haven’t come out to my family yet because I’m literally the only LGBTQ+ person in my family, isn’t that nice? And like half the family seems to have a problem with the LGBTQ+ community, and even though it’s mainly about me reading books about the subject (I’m 16 for crying out loud, half my friends are LGBTQ+, you think I haven’t been plenty exposed to this already?!), and not about the people, I still can’t be too sure. The only people who know are a few of my besties and now, the TBT community. I don’t think I’ll tell them until I’m an adult and free from their control.


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## xSuperMario64x

pottercrossing said:


> I know I posted on this thread a while ago about my gender/sexuality, but here’s an update as to how I identify now.    Firstly, I feel like I’m a mix of bisexual and  pansexual. I’m pansexual in the sense that I’m attracted to all genders, but I’m bisexual in the sense that I have a preference to a specific gender. It’s always a job explaining that to people. Second, in terms of gender, I identify as demigirl, meaning I sometimes identify as female and sometimes as genderless. And no, it’s not the same thing as being genderfluid. Being genderfluid means that you transition between all genders not just two. I haven’t come out to my family yet because I’m literally the only LGBTQ+ person in my family, isn’t that nice? And like half the family seems to have a problem with the LGBTQ+ community, and even though it’s mainly about me reading books about the subject (I’m 16 for crying out loud, half my friends are LGBTQ+, you think I haven’t been plenty exposed to this already?!), and not about the people, I still can’t be too sure. The only people who know are a few of my besties and now, the TBT community. I don’t think I’ll tell them until I’m an adult and free from their control.


have you considered the term omnisexual? it's basically the same as pan except it's not "gender blind", aka gender does somewhat play a role in preferences even though you're technically attracted to all genders. 
also as for your gender identity, that sounds a lot like bigender (aka fluctuating between two different gender identities). whether these labels are correct or not is up to you to decide, but I figured I would throw them out there since that sounds like what you're describing 

regardless of how you identify, I'm always happy to see people making self discoveries on their LGBT+ status 



as for how my life has been going. it's heckin great yall. I've been in a relationship for almost a week now and this person is so near and dear to me. something I really really appreciate about him is that he's also ace (though not sex repulsed like I am, but he's really not into that so yay). I've always kinda been afraid to be in a relationship since it would have to be strictly be quasi-platonic or romantic and as msot of you prob know, ace people are few and far in between. I'm so grateful that I found someone who is also ace so that expectation will never be there.
also so my SO is a trans guy, and honestly I feel really comfortable w that because we're basically both trans-masc so we can really relate in that way, plus we deal with similar issues and so we better understand each other. he's also very accepting of the fact that I'm aro and I'm not as openly lovey dovey as he is, and I appreciate that so much. I did have to explain what cupioromantic meant (not feeling romantic attraction but wanting to be in a romantic relationship) but he was totally fine w it after that. I really do hope our relationship ends up working out in the long term


----------



## Drawdler

Dang, I just came back, I got beaten to saying “omnisexual” lol. I might fall under that too, but I can’t say I have enough experience with enbies to know. As it is, I extremely rarely experience attraction to cis people, so I’d be overthinking and very, very heavily theorising. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Theoretically speaking- I don’t see why I would be unattracted to someone for being enby. I’m not cisgender myself. As for preferred gender? It shifts a lot with the day. But there’s a consistent bias to masc. I don’t even have experience dating girls… There’s probably a term for fluid attraction but this kinda just seems like normal bisexual confusion/shifts, I think it’s really common for that orientation. My real preference is like- prettyboys, I guess? Like men who just put in some effort to look good… also, suits and ties, suits and ties are extremely attractive. Yet when someone is just masc, that feels “plain” and more boring to me? I don’t want to sound judgemental, but eh. I know I’m more drawn to men, but not men who are outright rough/stoic and I find a lot of “attractive men” unattractive to me personally, it’s just that the kind of man I want is like finding a needle in a haystack…
To be fair, the omnisexual flag also goes really hard and I’ve never been completely satisfied with the shades on the bigender flag lol (pink, purple, blue is totally the right choice and even fits my aesthetic, but there’s something about the particular shades they used… especially the purple). That’s just more funny for me than anything though. I say I’m bisexual because it’s easiest and I’m happy leaving it at that, any other tags feel like fun theory for me. Not saying they’re invalid or anything, I just don’t need them for myself. I think I fit omnisexual, but I say bisexual because some people use bisexual as an umbrella term anyway, and more people know what it means.

I don’t feel like I need a term for this persay- but is there one for, well, needing a certain context, enough effort, etc. to experience attraction to someone?
As time goes on, I’ve always thought this, but I’m definitely demiromantic+demisexual. 100% at this point. I‘m only really physically attracted to someone with romantic attraction, and I’m only romantically attracted if I know someone and we have some history and context and special moments you know?
But even then it feels like I still need that to be kept up. I need buildup and anticipation to really feel attraction. I need to really feel a connection, some way or another. Libido isn’t the same as attraction, when I’m desperate I might get libido but it doesn’t change how finicky my attraction is. As long as I don’t go blaming partners or anything, it’s just a problem for me lol.

I also might be sapioromantic/sapiosexual, but it’s more about someone being able to articulate themselves than intellect, smarts, etc. I don’t think I feel attracted because I’m impressed at what someone knows, but instead, if they’re good at describing, solving, philosophy, introspection, etc.
It’s really sad but- my partner can’t articulate themselves well at all, I’m really trying to be patient and help them, but that... just makes it feel like a friendship instead of a relationship. If I can’t express myself intellectually with some real conversation and hear from them, it isn’t working for me. I don’t need them to find solutions for everything but… whenever we try to voice chat my partner ends up stammering and confused and more upset and stuff, it’s like trying to have those conversations makes it worse. I can’t help but feel at this point that if I don’t amicably end the relationship it’s going to end up with me bottled up and bitter. It isn’t fair for either of us. I am on a different page from my partner, it isn’t even like I move on by the time they catch up, they just don’t seem to catch up to where I was. Oversharing woo.

All of this sounds fairly theoretical. Woop


----------



## Croconaw

I’m still not close to finding a term for my sexuality. I’m perfectly fine with not having a label for it, but it seems I’ve gone back and forth a bit on it, lol. Only thing I know for sure is that I’m sex-repulsed, lol. This in itself makes finding someone difficult because most people just can’t live without it, if you catch my drift.

Also, I might be demi of some sort because it’s very rare I feel romantic attraction to a person unless we are really close. I’m not openly seeking any relationship either and I have no desire to be in one but I do experience and enjoy romantic attraction, at least in theory. As someone who hasn’t done anything or even been kissed, it’s kind of hard to say. It feels a bit weird saying that but it’s true. It’s like a taboo topic for me because I’m afraid people will think differently of me. Not on here, obviously, but just people in general. This forum seems pretty open minded from my experience.

Edit: Just fixing a typo.


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## xSuperMario64x

so uhhhh more self discovery is being made! 

I think I may be demiromantic (big shocker I know). for anyone who doesn't know, someone who is demiromantic only experiences romantic attraction to another person after a strong bond has been formed. the longer I'm with my SO the more I find myself succumbing to romantic feelings which I don't experience with anyone else. I think maybe the phrase Cupioromantic still kinda describes how I feel, but I never really feel super vulnerable around anyone except for my SO (and maybe my mom ofc) and I would be totally happy holding hands in public and hugging (though the whole kissing thing is still a little  to me lol, a cheek or forehead kiss would be fine).

besides that I am still firm in my belief, or better yet knowledge, that I am apothisexual. I have a feeling that's not gonna change at all. and I'm so glad I'm with someone who totally respects that


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## QueenCobra

Personally I don’t know how much I want to share (anyone who saw my AT&T post might know) but I’m glad this thread exists!
I pass as straight since I like men more than women, but that doesn’t mean I don’t like women! 

I am a very feminine lady. I don’t say that in a mean or catty way, but gravitate toward a lot of “traditionally feminine” things. So I never had any issues with gender identity.

I like bigger guys. Not necessarily tall, but strong, yet soft around the middle (maybe a dad bod?). I also like chubby and fat men, and find some sumo wrestlers attractive. A lot of the guys I like tend to be older, but I like that. I’ve always been insecure about this preference. Some “friends” in school told me that a guy I liked was fat and looked like a pig in a wig. (Rude.)

I think my tastes in women are similar. I like women who are bigger than me in some way— not fat, but curvy. So a lot of them are older than me as well. I’m different in the sense, that I like a soft belly. I didn’t tell anyone about this when I was younger, but I think my “friends” still would have roasted it. Whatever. Though we still have a lot of progress to make, times are steadily changing.


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## Drawdler

Honestly, if we’re talking physical attraction, I’d love to date a guy as short as me (give or take 2 or 3 ”). But, I’m 5’2” so that’s a really rare thing /:

I really have trouble describing what I find physically pleasing (I say pleasing instead of attractive because I’m very demi)- good head of hair on anyone (there’s probably no wiggle room there unfortunately), I like men with some feminine energy ngl (“prettyboys” I guess), maybe I’d like a women a couple inches taller than me (never dated a girl, can’t say, just a hunch because I feel like I’d want to hug into another woman more than hold her- maybe I’m just going that way with men too but I can’t resist the image of holding a cute guy into me). Leaner body types are more my thing and facial hair is usually a miss (but, sometimes it’s seriously killer). Dating is strictly within 2-3 years of me in either direction.

As long as they stay clean and have some fashion without high maintenance, and they have an aesthetic I‘m into (business attire and musician are some good ones), then I guess I’m fairly open to different faces.

Voice matters a lot, I never think about it until I‘m listening, my current partner’s voice is kind of calming for me. Can’t really explain what voices I like, plus it should suit the person, like my partner’s voice suits them. I guess I like calming but not really soft voices.

This guy is way older than me but haha the singer from MGMT is a sort-of crush (maybe more like a squish or some sort of admiration or idol of aesthetics) so yeahhh that goes to show how little some of this means. He looks pretty young but I still wouldn’t date someone in their 30s at my current age. I grew up with my sister being several years older than me, it highlights the generational difference, I’m not open to that.





And y’know since I’m demi if I met people who looked how I want- and the rare times I have in the past- it was more a feeling of being excited they exist then getting any ideas about them, ‘cause they’re passersby. More like “yay, I was right!”, not developing a crush based on that. LOL.

Reflecting on my only big crush made me sure I’m demi… it’s a pretty lonely orientation knowing I have a feeling that COULD be met or awakened, even thinking i had it once and it never works out that way with my actual relationships.


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## Croconaw

With the people I have dated, and keep in mind these were all long-distance relationships, I haven’t had a preference. The people all looked decently different from each other but not too similar. I haven’t dated in a very long time and I don’t exactly have a desire to do so.

I have to say personality matters the most for me, but I’m just not that into dating, so what do I know?


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## QueenCobra

I’ve never been in a romantic relationship, but I wouldn’t call myself asexual or aromantic. I’ve always liked the idea of it, but I’m kind of a prude, honestly. I’ve reached the point in my life where I’m not ashamed to admit it. Sometimes I feel sinful, though logically I know my feelings are normal. Like I’m worried that since what I like is “outside the norm” I’m somehow wrong and deserve to be attacked. When I was younger, I had a lot of internalized biphobia, but I’ve improved. That being said, I’m still a work in progress.
As I said, I’m fascinated by the idea of it, but honestly I was a “late bloomer” when it came to even liking someone “that way” so who knows. (I have Asperger’s and anxiety as well.) I’m also quite sensitive and afraid of heartbreak. I used to think I was too ugly to love and this tried to work on my other traits— but this mindset wore me down. My confidence has improved since then, but personally, I don’t care if I ever find that “someone”. Either way, I’m fine.


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## Captain Jigglypuff

I’m truly gender neutral but I mark the male box on forms because it’s easier than trying to explain my views on gender. I’m attracted to men.


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## Drawdler

Huh. I was reading somewhere else to someone, that being agender meant they didn’t really think much about their gender. I know it’s subjective, I don’t really feel the same about my own, so that kinda settles for me that I am bigender. It really put in perspective how… agender isn’t exactly me. I just identify with both male and female, I do think/feel for both a lot, that’s it.

My partner called me king unprompted yesterday which made me happy


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## Captain Jigglypuff

I like to refer to myself as being gender neutral because I don’t feel like I’m non-binary or genderfluid as I don’t feel or see myself as any one particular gender and actually just see myself as a person. It’s really hard to explain. I only dress like a male because it’s easier to do and I just wear clothes that are comfortable that either gender could wear. I don’t switch between genders and the only time I dress like a female is if I’m doing drag.


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## xSuperMario64x

day 397 of being openly trans-masc:

I was at a thrift store today and I got a pretty nice petticoat for $6, so ofc as soon as I got home I tried it on with one of my dresses that I haven't worn in a long time. when I was younger I didn't like dresses, but it seems like ever since I realized I'm not cisgender I've become a lot more confident in what I wear. well anyways so I'm walking around the house in this poofy green dress, living my best life. I've wanted a petticoat for a long time and this one isn't really fluffy bc it's pretty long, but it works!

when I went to show it to my mom, she was like "so you're a guy... wearing a dress?" and I just said " yeah?" there's nothing wrong w that. I love poofy dresses! if I had my own ballroom gown you bet I would be wearing it every weekend! just bc I'm nb/trans-masc doesn't mean I can't dress in a feminine way. I can dress however I want 


(and it's funny how even after explaining to my mom 62920 times that I'm _non-binary_ she still equates me being trans-masc to me being 100% men-identifying lmaoo)


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## BrokenSanity

Captain Jigglypuff said:


> -snip-


Hello Caption Jigglypuff
I see what you mean that makes sense
of course it's up to you to choose what you feel comfortable with and I'm not trying to shove things down people's throats
but I just thought I'd mention this, your comment reminds me a bit of myself
that sounds like you might be interested in "Agender" a identity where someone does not identify with a gender or gender identity 
it's also called "genderfree" sometimes. I speak for myself as the exact meaning of Agender is slightly different depending on who you ask and what it means to someone, *most* Agender people don't really care about that stuff and see ourselves as more of a person who is free to express their gender however they like but they don't think about what gender means to them 
and sees themselves more like a person or a human being rather then a man or a woman
I see what you mean about wanting to present as male(unless you are doing drag) because it's just easier that way
gender can be a headache sometimes so *some* people would rather forget about how they see their gender and express themselves freely

just thought you might be interested in this.


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## Croconaw

It makes me feel happy when little kids (younger than ten years old) refer to me using male pronouns. I heard a kid telling his mom that “I like his blue hair” referring to me. It’s so nice how little kids don’t form bigoted opinions and don’t make judgements. They don’t think twice about it. It made me smile. It’s just interesting to think about.

On another note, I made a pronouns page, but I have yet to link it publicly. I will eventually, definitely. I’m happy to have finally made one.


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## xSuperMario64x

so after going through a breakup I've thought a bit more abt my romantic orientation. I do still believe that I may be demiromantic, but the romantic stuff I'm willing to do is like... in a limited way if that makes any sense? like I love the idea of going out to eat and holding hands and watching shows together on the couch, but when it comes down to having to share a bed or the other person wanting a lot of physical affection, I get super uncomfortable and I just can't do that.

basically I don't really actually know how to describe it lol. I just hope that whoever I end up being with for a long time understands and respects my awkward situation.


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## Croconaw

This is something that I’ve been thinking about and it makes a whole lot of sense now… but back in 2011 when I first started to get into forums/online and stuff, I was literally a catfish. I’d tell people I was a boy because it felt nice to hear those pronouns when people refer to me. It made me feel like I was lying in a sense but being a male just felt right in my eyes. 

When I was about eight my parents (my mom - who I barely talk to ever - and my dad) knew something was up but didn’t say anything and let me open up when I wanted to. I was at this one girl’s birthday party and all of the girls there had to change into sparkly dresses. In the group photo, I stood there with my arms out just wanting to cry. I had the face of “kill me now.” They both just came to the conclusion that I was a lesbian, which I’d thought for the longest time was the case. I haven’t mentioned this to anyone in real life because in the back of my mind I’m still not 100% (I don’t think?) but this is what currently feels right. 

Anyway, just wanted to put this out here because I don’t think I was necessarily lying 10+ years ago, although it felt that way to me. So, yes, *in real life* I’m still a female that doesn’t wear name tags at work because people are already confused enough about my gender that my strictly-female name would confuse them even more. Although, name tags aren’t necessary at my current jobs.


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## smug villager

I consider myself non-binary or genderless but am most often perceived as a man these days after starting HRT. I think it's because the concept most people have of androgyny is just the absence of what are considered female characteristics. There's a whole host of issues with that from a feminist standpoint, but I am not really qualified to go into it.

Honestly, the more I reflect on it, I just have a problem with western society's concept of gender. Gender could have been a fun little thing if it wasn't so prescriptive. Growing up being raised as a little girl, I constantly felt like I was a square peg everyone was trying to force into a round hole, which seems to be a pretty universal experience, even among cisgender women and men, especially if they're LGBTQ+. There just aren't really many people who naturally fit the mold of "how a woman should be (eternally young and beautiful, but nurturing and a mother but only in the right way which is married in a way deemed acceptable, hairless, demure, innocent forever, kind, a good cook and servant, not too intelligent or too opinionated, etc)" or "how a man should be (stoic except for expressing anger, physically fit and willing to be violent on a moment's notice, hardworking always, doesn't require intimate friendships, etc)" and tick every box without trying. You can only make it work for you if you sand off your edges or redefine it for yourself.


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## xSuperMario64x

I've been out of a relationship for a few weeks now and it's kinda made me realize something. I think being aroace kinda blurs the line between platonic and romantic relationships for me, and I find that being really close friends with someone is just as fulfilling for me as being in an actual "romantic" relationship. I think if I ever do get in a relationship with someone I would like it to just be like a really strong friendship (or as one might say, queer-platonic relationship or QPR). I may still do "romantic" things like go to a movie or go out to eat, but those are things I would do with regular friends too so I don't even consider them inherently romantic. idk to me a partner would be someone who's a super close friend of mine, doesn't need the romantic label at all.

also i may still be demiromantic but it took me an embarrassingly short time to get over my ex considering I was with him for 2 months. I think that's the aro side of me saying "haha romance sucks" and just moving on.


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## Croconaw

xSuperMario64x said:


> I find that being really close friends with someone is just as fulfilling for me as being in an actual "romantic" relationship.


I relate to this statement. A close friendship may even be more fulfilling. I find that I’m affectionate towards close friends but only after a strong emotional bond is formed. Things never progress beyond a friendship, though. It makes me question if I may just not be into dating. I’m very open to affection in friendships but I’d have to be really close to the person, and it’s to the point where people assume I’m dating the person. It’s complicated for me.


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## Lady Timpani

How do you guys handle harassment? I got a dm on another site calling me slurs and saying I should die, the usual, and at first I was like "haha what a loser" but unfortunately it's still weighing on my mind a little. I'd hate for them to know that, though.

This is also part of the reason I'm afraid of actually giving online dating a whirl, I'm kind of terrified of matching with a dude posing as a woman.


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## Croconaw

There’s no best way to handle harassment. If the harassment is online, I’d say your best bet is to ignore them. I wish I knew of a way to not care what others think.  I wish there was a simple solution to that, but there isn’t. You just have to learn to not care and understand that words only have meaning if we give them meaning.

Also, I wouldn’t close yourself off to the possibility of dating online, even meeting people online. You’d miss out on some pretty amazing people. You just have to give people a chance.


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## Chris

Lady Timpani said:


> How do you guys handle harassment? I got a dm on another site calling me slurs and saying I should die, the usual, and at first I was like "haha what a loser" but unfortunately it's still weighing on my mind a little. I'd hate for them to know that, though.
> 
> This is also part of the reason I'm afraid of actually giving online dating a whirl, I'm kind of terrified of matching with a dude posing as a woman.


Absolutely report it. I can't speak for how all sites handle homophobia and death threats, but the three I help moderate (including TBT) don't tolerate it.

Your fears are definitely valid. Before meeting me, my partner met in-person with a man feigning to be a woman on a dating app. He had the audacity to act surprised when she immediately said she was leaving upon him introducing himself.

To minimise risk in case your date isn't who they described themselves to be (or if it is just going badly), always arrange to meet someone new in a public place. You are less likely to come to any harm if there are other people around. If in places that serve alcohol, there is sometimes a codeword or phrase written somewhere in the women's bathroom–_usually stall door, above the sinks, or near hand dryer_–for how to discretely ask the bar staff for help escaping a date gone wrong. Usually it involves asking for a specific fake bartender or drink. Although, I would imagine that even in places that don't utilise this system (everywhere should to be honest) that if you explain to an employee that you feel unsafe they would do whatever they can to help you out.


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## Lady Timpani

Chris said:


> Absolutely report it. I can't speak for how all sites handle homophobia and death threats, but the three I help moderate (including TBT) don't tolerate it.
> 
> Your fears are definitely valid. Before meeting me, my partner met in-person with a man feigning to be a woman on a dating app. He had the audacity to act surprised when she immediately said she was leaving upon him introducing himself.
> 
> To minimise risk in case your date isn't who they described themselves to be (or if it is just going badly), always arrange to meet someone new in a public place. You are less likely to come to any harm if there are other people around. If in places that serve alcohol, there is sometimes a codeword or phrase written somewhere in the women's bathroom–_usually stall door, above the sinks, or near hand dryer_–for how to discretely ask the bar staff for help escaping a date gone wrong. Usually it involves asking for a specific fake bartender or drink. Although, I would imagine that even in places that don't utilise this system (everywhere should to be honest) that if you explain to an employee that you feel unsafe they would do whatever they can to help you out.


I did report it, and luckily it was taken seriously. It was a throwaway account that I know was only set up to harass people, so I feel dumb for even taking it a little bit seriously, but even so, it did kind of hurt. 

Thanks for the advice! Public meeting is definitely something I have kind of advance planned for when I do join The Apps. I really wish my town still had a gay bar, I think that would honestly be preferable to apps even though bars aren't really my scene, but our local one closed down years ago, and I've tried searching for queer spaces on meetup but unfortunately haven't found any nearby me.

	Post automatically merged: Nov 24, 2022



Croconaw said:


> There’s no best way to handle harassment. If the harassment is online, I’d say your best bet is to ignore them. I wish I knew of a way to not care what others think.  I wish there was a simple solution to that, but there isn’t. You just have to learn to not care and understand that words only have meaning if we give them meaning.
> 
> Also, I wouldn’t close yourself off to the possibility of dating online, even meeting people online. You’d miss out on some pretty amazing people. You just have to give people a chance.


I had kind of a bad experience with a guy friend when I was a teenager-- we were online friends and he had trouble respecting certain boundaries I established, and I think that's kind of colored my online relationships since, because I've definitely been more reserved and hesitant to get close to people online as a result. There are lots of cool people I've met since that I've wanted to befriend, but that experience is always in the back of my mind and holds me back a little. I'm slooooowly working on it, though, mainly on the site where I got the nasty dm lol.


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## pottercrossing

I'm baaaaackkkk!

Alright, let's make this quick. 

Sexuality: Lesbian. This took me forever to come to terms with. Over the years, I have avoided the term lesbian solely because I still liked guys, or at least I convinced myself I did. I rotated through many terms in the last year and a half, bisexual, pansexual, omnisexual, biromantic, and omniromantic being the more prominent ones. The last guy I ever liked was my best friend, Caleb. Since then, I tried to convince myself I still liked guys, perhaps as a result of not wanting to disappoint my family if I were to come out, and that went on until mid-September when a fellow lesbian in my school's GSA (gay-straight alliance) helped me come to terms with the whole lesbian thing.

Gender: Demigirl. It means that sometimes I identify as female and sometimes as nonbinary/agender, something along those lines. But when I explain that to people, they say stuff like, "That sounds a lot like bigender," "Have you considered using the term bigender?" and "You know that the term bigender exists, right?" I am aware of all that, and the only reason I don't use that term is that whenever I tell people I'm bigender, they immediately say, "Oh, so sometimes you're a girl, sometimes you're a boy?" and I then have to explain the whole nonbinary/agender thing. Half the time, they still don't get it. So I use the term demi girl to avoid all that confusion.

Thank you for coming to my Ted-Talk, have a nice day.


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## Croconaw

So is anyone else AFAB (female at birth) but literally short and is self-conscious of their height? I’m starting to think the reason people think I’m 15 is because I’m passable as a male but 5’3” is extremely short for a male, whereas I’d probably appear older if I presented more feminine.

THE STRUGGLE.


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## Metal Scorpion

I recently came out as pan/demi-romantic (grey?) ace and felt a weight was lifted over my shoulder. After years of having trouble with where I was, I finally found an identity I was comfortable with.


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## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> So is anyone else AFAB (female at birth) but literally short and is self-conscious of their height? I’m starting to think the reason people think I’m 15 is because I’m passable as a male but 5’3” is extremely short for a male, whereas I’d probably appear older if I presented more feminine.
> 
> THE STRUGGLE.


honestly tho I was at a thrift store today looking at men's blazers bc I really want a suit jacket and they're all so huge, it made me realize how actually tiny I am  I'm also 5'3" and tbh I'm not self-conscious abt my height but it makes it incredibly difficult to find men's clothes that fit me. I tried looking in the boys section but they didn't even have any blazers there jxbgxysjw


I came here bc I was wondering if anyone knows of good reliable sources for trans exercise routines? while I was at the thrift store trying on a dressy jacket it made me realize how much I dislike my hips. it makes it difficult for me to wear men's clothes (and likewise, pass as a guy) and I would like to try an exercise routine that helps nb/trans guys get rid of hip fat without doing any kind of HRT (bc as it stands now I do not plan on doing that at all). I know that leg lifts and squats would probably help but idk much beyond that.

I usually don't bother looking up exercise routines like that bc they're generally aimed at women and helps them bring out their curves, which is literally the exact opposite of what I'm trying to do


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## BrokenSanity

xSuperMario64x said:


> -snip-


omg this feels like a huge relief knowing I'm not the only transguy/nb person who gets really bad gender dysphoria from my hips/err-not-so-masculine-body-shape
First of all, I read there is some clothing you can wear to hide the impression of big hips (like certain kinds of shorts or something) you should maybe look into that if your interested? 
As for workouts I know of these but idk if this is what your looking for ?


Spoiler



idk Pinterest gave me these so...


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## xSuperMario64x

BrokenSanity said:


> omg this feels like a huge relief knowing I'm not the only transguy/nb person who gets really bad gender dysphoria from my hips/err-not-so-masculine-body-shape
> First of all, I read there is some clothing you can wear to hide the impression of big hips (like certain kinds of shorts or something) you should maybe look into that if your interested?
> As for workouts I know of these but idk if this is what your looking for ?
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> idk Pinterest gave me these so...
> View attachment 471941View attachment 471942View attachment 471943


during summer months I do wear cargo shorts and that helps hide it well, but during winter months when I wear jeans I don't have any pants that fit like that (most men's jeans are way too big or way too long, it's pretty difficult finding a pair that actually fits properly). maybe I need to go pants shopping soon, hopefully I can find something.

also that might work, I think I've seen those particular pics before but they're worth a shot. I appreciate you sharing them w me


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## BrokenSanity

xSuperMario64x said:


> during summer months I do wear cargo shorts and that helps hide it well, but during winter months when I wear jeans I don't have any pants that fit like that (most men's jeans are way too big or way too long, it's pretty difficult finding a pair that actually fits properly). maybe I need to go pants shopping soon, hopefully I can find something.
> 
> also that might work, I think I've seen those particular pics before but they're worth a shot. I appreciate you sharing them w me


Your welcome! Sorry I can't help as much as I'd like, I actually am struggling with the same problem... (and as of now I don't want to take hormones) there isn't much I can do to actually change my body shape, at least there is clothing I can wear to pass
I've been trying to build muscle but it's really hard because of my genetics/other factors. Since I'm extremely underweight/skinny I'm really hoping if I gain weight my body shape will even out and my hips will look more natural with the rest of my body if that makes any sense.


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## ecstasy

what I'm REALLY confused about is my sexuality

for the longest time i thought i was just gay but I'm really not sure now?? I don't really tend to feel physical attraction towards people, unless I'm already dating them. you could say "demisexual", but in my last relationship i didn't really have sexual attraction most of the time. aceflux demisexual?? possibly, though since I'm plural that could be why I'm extremely confused about that part, IDK 

Anyway, on top of that i don't actually KNOW if I'm gay?? When I thought about my last partners and what would happen if they transitioned into a girl, I didn't mind it. It's just the fact both of my past relationships and all my "crushes" were guys. Also, I have never had a crush on anyone irl. It was only online. Which confuses me even more. I also wonder sometimes if what I was feeling was even romantic attraction _at all.  _I feel like I may have been idealizing them at many points but I can't tell. The fact I'm plural and the fact I'm mentally ill makes figuring out my sexuality SO MUCH MORE difficult than it should be. When I try to imagine myself in a relationship with a girl (fictional) it doesn't feel right, i tend to only have male fictional crushes. Of course fictional character attraction is different from real life people attraction but still AAUUUHH?? idk if I'm bi with a male lean, gay, aroace, pan and demiromantic or what??? 

I Know i have plenty of time to figure it all out but its kinda frustrating that this has to be so complicated!!! Lol


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## Croconaw

My struggle is my chest because I’m definitely _not_ flat chested, but my sports bra makes them less noticeable. Although, it’s not too noticeable with the shirts I wear.  I never thought about the pants, but outside of work, I always wear track pants. I like the Adidas ones with the zippered pockets. I prefer the athletic fit.


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## oddbear

this is probably triggering so i’ll put it in a spoiler (although i‘m still not entirely sure how those work)


Spoiler: TW: transphobia, mental health



so i just got tiktok for the first time since 2019, and i decided to make a video showing how much i’ve changed (i mean, not much considering i just came out as trans to my parents). probably shouldn’t have because, when you’re surrounded by people who love and support you, you kind of forget that some people are just awful. i only got 3 comments because, once i got the notification, i immediately deleted my tiktok, but from what i remember they were along the lines of “oh naw wtf” and saying that i’m 4 and already calling myself trans, calling me and my parents losers. i’ve already been dealing with my thoughts doubting myself and also GOING TO SCHOOL IN TEXAS (although i’m not out yet at school) so i already just feel awful about myself.  and, of course, when something bad happens on social media i have to delete every single account i have to make myself feel better for some reason.



anyways, my name is adrian, and i’m a trans guy


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## BrokenSanity

Croconaw said:


> My struggle is my chest because I’m definitely _not_ flat chested, but my sports bra makes them less noticeable. Although, it’s not too noticeable with the shirts I wear.  I never thought about the pants, but outside of work, I always wear track pants. I like the Adidas ones with the zippered pockets. I prefer the athletic fit.


Have you ever considered chest binding? Just a suggestion if you feel more comfortable with a flat chest.


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## Croconaw

BrokenSanity said:


> Have you ever considered chest binding? Just a suggestion if you feel more comfortable with a flat chest.


I’ve been strongly considering it but don’t know how to go about finding the right size. I don’t want to get one that’s too big or small. I haven’t really looked into sizing.


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## BrokenSanity

Croconaw said:


> I’ve been strongly considering it but don’t know how to go about finding the right size. I don’t want to get one that’s too big or small. I haven’t really looked into sizing.


If you are interested in one, gc2b sells binders and they have a sizing chart + measuring instructions for you to use, if you are in between sizes it's best to go up a size. Underworks has binders too but I don't really trust them as much as gc2b because Underworks originally made their binders for cis men with gynecomastia but then they started to become popular with transguys/enbys and gc2b is specifically run by trans people and makes binders for transgender/NB people. Just whatever you choose please do not ever get one of those crappy cheap binders off Amazon.


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## Croconaw

BrokenSanity said:


> If you are interested in one, gc2b sells binders and they have a sizing chart + measuring instructions for you to use, if you are in between sizes it's best to go up a size. Underworks has binders too but I don't really trust them as much as gc2b because Underworks originally made their binders for cis men with gynecomastia but then they started to become popular with transguys/enbys and gc2b is specifically run by trans people and makes binders for transgender/NB people. Just whatever you choose please do not ever get one of those crappy cheap binders off Amazon.


Thanks for the information. I’ll have to find a measuring tape just laying around, or I may be able to buy one when I’m out with my dad. I think they’re included in most sewing kits, and since I know how to sew, it won’t be too awkward picking one up. _I do need more black thread anyway, haha._


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## Rubombee

BrokenSanity said:


> If you are interested in one, gc2b sells binders and they have a sizing chart + measuring instructions for you to use, if you are in between sizes it's best to go up a size. Underworks has binders too but I don't really trust them as much as gc2b because Underworks originally made their binders for cis men with gynecomastia but then they started to become popular with transguys/enbys and gc2b is specifically run by trans people and makes binders for transgender/NB people. Just whatever you choose please do not ever get one of those crappy cheap binders off Amazon.





Croconaw said:


> Thanks for the information. I’ll have to find a measuring tape just laying around, or I may be able to buy one when I’m out with my dad. I think they’re included in most sewing kits, and since I know how to sew, it won’t be too awkward picking one up. _I do need more black thread anyway, haha._


copypaste from trans people i know:

"gc2b has gone downhill so not them. underworks is alright. shapeshifters and spectrum outfitters are great, though uk based. for them is a recent one that friends have had a great time with."

apparently, about gc2b:
"Their quality has just been p poor in the past like, 2ish years? Like they don't bind evenly, they're constructed more poorly, the constriction is painful for some, etc."

and apparently spectrum binders' don't fit everyone? but someone else said they loved theirs, so


(if you want more info i can ask them, since this is just what i've seen them say)


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## BrokenSanity

Rubombee said:


> copypaste from trans people i know:
> 
> "gc2b has gone downhill so not them. underworks is alright. shapeshifters and spectrum outfitters are great, though uk based. for them is a recent one that friends have had a great time with."
> 
> apparently, about gc2b:
> "Their quality has just been p poor in the past like, 2ish years? Like they don't bind evenly, they're constructed more poorly, the constriction is painful for some, etc."
> 
> and apparently spectrum binders' don't fit everyone? but someone else said they loved theirs, so
> 
> 
> (if you want more info i can ask them, since this is just what i've seen them say)


Yes I saw a reddit post saying something about gc2b isn't what it used to be in the few recent years, but this is only one source I found, I've been looking at chest binder information for months and months this year and everyone is recommending gc2b and Underworks isn't that bad, I have never heard of shapeshifters and spectrum outfitters before and I'm in the USA not the UK. I just got my binder ordered from gc2b I really hope it's not going to be as bad as what you and that reddit post are saying, people are still recommending gc2b in 2021 and 2022 I feel like I don't really have many places to choose from.


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## xSuperMario64x

I personally got mine from gc2b and it works pretty well as long as it's washed every other day 

I can't speak for any other brands unfortunately.


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## BrokenSanity

xSuperMario64x said:


> I personally got mine from gc2b and it works pretty well as long as it's washed every other day
> 
> I can't speak for any other brands unfortunately.


If you don't mind me asking, what year did you get your binder in and do you still have the same binder you've always had?


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## xSuperMario64x

BrokenSanity said:


> If you don't mind me asking, what year did you get your binder in and do you still have the same binder you've always had?


the one I have currently is my only one, and I've had it for about a year and a half. It still works pretty well! I would def like to get a second one soon though so I can switch between them when need be.


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## ali.di.magix

My brother, who is much younger than me, lowkey called me out and asked "are you asexual?". It was quite confronting to me as I've never said anything to anyone irl about any labels I have and/or am considering. Afterwards I was like _wow is it really that obvious_ lmao. 

I still don't know if the aroace label suits me. I feel like "no interest in relationships but open to the possibly" describes me best lol. If I were going to be really specific, I think bi-oriented aroace would be the most suitable (still unsure about the bi bit though lmao).


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## xSuperMario64x

I'm back making some more crazy self observations lmaooooo

so what did I say I am before? demiromantic? well I'm thinking that aroflux might be more descriptive. I think demiro still does apply to me somewhat but honestly over time my interest in stuff like that fluctuates so much. I go through phases where I'm like head over heels for anyone I like, and then I have other times where I literally couldn't care less abt romance and I'm perfectly content being alone and only having friends. it's so weird lol.

I'm honestly not one to put 7000 labels on myself, I'm pretty content just telling people I'm aroace and trans-masc, but it is p cool to discover new things abt LGBT stuff and myself


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## Croconaw

Yeah, so I got into a conversation this morning with a coworker (I’d consider her a friend) about pronouns. She asked me if I used she/her pronouns and I just nodded as I’m not all that comfortable coming out in the workplace yet. Especially since I’ve been at this one a while. Although, I think she’d be supportive because she’s good friends with a MTF transgender person. Also explains why she seemed to think I wasn’t being 100% when I nodded.


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## xSuperMario64x

speaking of coming out at work, I'm forced to hide in the closet bc apparently my supervisor is homophobic/transphobic (considering she has one of those "police lives matter" US flags and an NRA sticker on the back door i can safely assume she's conservative) and if she found out I'm trans she would very likely try to find a reason to fire me. I like my job and working with cats at a rescue, but going in every work day and being misgendered bc I can't come out without risking being fired is just awful 

I wouldn't even work there except that being disabled makes it really difficult for me to find a job that accommodates my needs. it took me about a year to find the job I have and I only got it bc a family friend also works there. if I ever find another job that can provide the same accommodations _and_ accepts me as an LGBT+ person I will leave my current job as soon as I can. you can also bet I'm gonna tell people in the community abt her homophobia bc while running a cat rescue is a good thing, hating the LGBT+ community that much is inexcusable to me.


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## Croconaw

_I’ve been posting in here a lot lately, rip._

I was considering getting a chest binder. I’ve been unfortunate enough to have what is considered “larger breasts.” I don’t know my size because I’ve only ever worn sports bras, but my sports bras are sized Medium. The small was wayyyy too small.

Are there more risks binding with larger breasts? The sports bras I use have compression (obviously not as much as binding does) but I’m wondering if I should just stick to the sports bras I’ve been wearing or if I can safely bind with the correct size.


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## xSuperMario64x

Croconaw said:


> _I’ve been posting in here a lot lately, rip._
> 
> I was considering getting a chest binder. I’ve been unfortunate enough to have what is considered “larger breasts.” I don’t know my size because I’ve only ever worn sports bras, but my sports bras are sized Medium. The small was wayyyy too small.
> 
> Are there more risks binding with larger breasts? The sports bras I use have compression (obviously not as much as binding does) but I’m wondering if I should just stick to the sports bras I’ve been wearing or if I can safely bind with the correct size.


honestly I think it would be worth it to try a binder. idk about other companies but gc2b makes binders of all different sizes and you could prob find one that would work for you. I'm in a similar situation that you're in (having a larger chest), and my only gripe is that I do have to put mine in the dryer for ~15 min otherwise it loosens up a bit. but if you expose it to heat and allow it to tighten again it should be fine.

also want to note that companies will usually tell you not to dry your binder bc heat makes it shrink, but like I said, in my case if I don't put it in the dryer it becomes too loose and doesn't bind properly anymore. it's honestly just a matter of trial and error to see what works for you


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## Chris

I need to vent. It is 6am and I can't sleep and this keeps replaying in my head.



Spoiler: Christmas



So, I spent Christmas with the in-laws. My partner's aunt brought up that I'm gay within the first 30 seconds of meeting. We were still mid-handshake. Immediately after my MIL comes over with a glass of wine and says, "you're going to need this" and boy was she right. I have never had a partner's relative crack so many jokes about my sex life - when they ventured into BDSM territory I wanted the earth to swallow me whole. My FIL kept topping up my glass throughout dinner and as soon as we were done eating told her he was driving her home. So many people apologised for her behaviour. I was warned about what she was like but nothing could have prepared me for the reality.


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## LadyDestani

Chris said:


> I need to vent. It is 6am and I can't sleep and this keeps replaying in my head.
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Christmas
> 
> 
> 
> So, I spent Christmas with the in-laws. My partner's aunt brought up that I'm gay within the first 30 seconds of meeting. We were still mid-handshake. Immediately after my MIL comes over with a glass of wine and says, "you're going to need this" and boy was she right. I have never had a partner's relative crack so many jokes about my sex life - when they ventured into BDSM territory I wanted the earth to swallow me whole. My FIL kept topping up my glass throughout dinner and as soon as we were done eating told her he was driving her home. So many people apologised for her behaviour. I was warned about what she was like but nothing could have prepared me for the reality.


I'm so sorry you had to deal with that. It really wasn't any of her business and what an awkward topic for dinner conversation. At least it sounds like your MIL and FIL were supportive.


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## Chris

LadyDestani said:


> I'm so sorry you had to deal with that. It really wasn't any of her business and what an awkward topic for dinner conversation. At least it sounds like your MIL and FIL were supportive.


We ended up discussing her behaviour at length this evening and it turned out there was more that I hadn't even clocked onto. It was like I was some sort of freak show performer to her - there were just so many questions that you shouldn't ask someone you've only just met. Most I'm sure no one else at that dinner table actually wanted to know the answer to! 

The rest of the family are so supportive of our relationship and do their absolute best to be respectful. That aunt though. Christ. I'm glad we don't live local.


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## Croconaw

I had to exchange my small binder for the next size up. Hopefully the medium one fits. I honestly hope I don’t need to make a second exchange, although gc2b makes it gc2b. I’m eager to for it to arrive because I’m sort of stressing if it will fit.


----------

