Capitalism vs Socialism

[-Apples-]

Of the two economic systems, which one do you prefer more? Please stay on topic, and do not disrespect others. This isn’t just about capitalism and socialism, but also about any issue related to business and economics.

My take:

My vote isn’t based on how the poor or rich are treated, but rather based on economic freedom. That being said, capitalism is far from perfect, but it’s better than socialism. People should be allowed to choose what jobs they get, where they live, what schools they go to, and what doctors they visit. Business owners should be allowed to decide how their businesses are ran, there should be fewer regulations on business, and no business should be banned in America over what they believe.

Other things related to capitalism and socialism:

• I support commonsense environmental regulations to reduce pollution. But I’m against the ban on airplanes, plastic straws, and meat.
• I support religious liberty. They can’t use religion to discriminate against others (since that’s not even using religion), but they should be allowed to exercise their beliefs as business owners and opt out of doing something if it contradicts their beliefs.
• I am against single-payer universal healthcare. Nobody should have to wait months for an operation, and the government can’t choose how doctors perform their work.
• I support minimum wage laws, but oppose raising it drastically.
• I support lower taxes and less government.
• If there are any business regulations I do support other than worker safety and anti-discrimination laws, it would be the ban on political correctness. It’s one thing if an employer or employee wants to stay politically correct, but they shouldn’t use it to fire their employees.

 

[oath2order]

Socialism does not mandate who gets a job in what business. That's called a planned economy. Not all socialist countries are planned economies.

I agree that business owners should decide on how their businesses are ran but unfortunately for business owners, they're entering into the public sphere. I am far more in favor of protecting a minority's right to live where they want as opposed to being forced to move because every business in town decides to exercise a "right to discriminate".

I always have to bring up this theoretical. Let's say you're black and live with your family in a family home in a small town in Arkansas. You survive on paycheck to paycheck, sometimes being able to set aside some money for your savings. One day, the only grocery store in town gets a new owner. They don't like black people and refuse to serve them. The next town over is 100 miles away. Should this black person have to go 100 miles out of their way to get what they need to live, or should the business be mandated to serve them? The answer is simple. Either you believe minorities should be forced to move because rascist business owners refuse to serve them, or you believe that businesses should not be allowed to deny customers their business because of rascism.

Nobody serious is trying to ban meat and airplanes and putting that in your argument is a strawman. A ban on plastic straws is a distraction tactic by corporations to take away from real economic change.

They can’t use religion to discriminate against others (since that’s not even using religion)

I can cite countless verses of religious texts that support discrimination. I'm sorry to be the one to tell you this, but religion inherently is discriminatory.

People in America die before they get their operation because they can't afford it. People in America die before they get their operation because there are waiting lists. You can say what you want about socialized medicine but it's certainly got some better results than here. Better infant mortality, longer life spans.

• If there are any business regulations I do support other than worker safety and anti-discrimination laws, it would be the ban on political correctness. It’s one thing if an employer or employee wants to stay politically correct, but they shouldn’t use it to fire their employees.

Really? You don't think that employers should get to fire their employees over what they say? You're fine with, say, a fascist preaching fascism in a math classroom? A Nazi janitor who preaches his beliefs as he cleans the synagogue?

• I support minimum wage laws, but oppose raising it drastically.

I agree. It needs to be raised slowly.




Note: I spell "racist" and "racism" as "rascist" and "rascism" because it's a portmanteau of "racist" and "fascist".

 

[Antonio]

Another political thread!?

These threads always end up locked.

Regarding the topic, I believe we should have some socialism to help out people who need it. Heck, we already do like public roads, usps, k-12 education, etc.

People shouldn't be suffering.

 

[KrazyKarp]

I have to also emphasize that one of the core natures of many religions is discrimination. I specifically have great concern over religions that discriminate against LGBT+ people. Saying they shouldn't do anything that goes against their religion with the stipulation that they don't discriminate is a contradiction. You can't do both.

 

[Aerious]

Alright. Since you caught me at a time where I have literally nothing better to do, let’s talk.

Economic freedom has to do with social mobility. People need access to quality education. You want to make the point that people should be able to choose which schools they go to, completely ignoring those in poverty. We’re locked into school zones depending on where you live – where you live/your socioeconomic status determines where you go to school. While it’s nice to pretend as though everyone has the funds to move and the ability to choose, that’s not plausible. Why don’t we discuss the fact that there needs to be more funding to close the education gap? Why don’t we address the fact that poverty inhibits one’s ability to study, causes lowered IQ, amongst other responsibilities (having to drop out to aid family, for instance).

We can also cover how people don’t choose where they get to live. Rent is increasing with minimum wage. I’m saying this from a landlord’s POV (because I actually own property, unlike you, I’m assuming). It’s not fair how those in poverty are treated. Social mobility is incredibly difficult to achieve, especially since the odds are stacked against people in poorer neighborhoods (worse quality of education, etc.) Not to mention general health increases with one’s social standing. Those in poverty don’t have access to basic needs e.g. food, shelter, general healthcare, general necessities. How are they to achieve upward social mobility with rent prices increasing, gentrification, etc.?

Lowered taxes benefits people like me. Which is hilarious because I’d rather others have access to basic needs. There’s the opportunity to split healthcare into private and public as well. Insurance companies have caused the prices of American medical procedures to rise drastically. A knee replacement in America is about $50,000, in compared to private knee replacements in England costing around £11,400. Families go bankrupt to pay for procedures here. I’m lucky that my family has money and access to good insurance and quality of healthcare. What about those who can’t? Can you afford to drop $50,000 if you can’t afford insurance? What’s your solution? Quit acting like a conflict theorist by venting your opinions into the void and actually aid in creating solutions to these qualms.

Political correctness has nothing to do with the first amendment and rights of the worker. The first amendment allows you the right to be an ass, but it doesn’t mean that people are going to support you. Corporations care about appearances and business. Have you wondered why pride icons arise in the month of June? By appeasing to groups of people, they garner more business, thus earning more money. If a corporation wants to fire an employee for not representing their business well, they have every right to. You should support this per “there should be fewer regulations on business.” Speaking on “no business should be banned in America over what they believe,” they aren’t. People just don’t want to support them, and they have to abide by anti-discrimination laws. Go ahead and look into EEOC lawsuits, particularly the intersectional ones.

Now, I implore you to research philosophy prior to making another political thread. Marcus Aurelius and Stoicism touch on the importance of the dialectic. Everyone should strive to learn more and better themselves instead of baiting debates.

 

[Antonio]

Alright. Since you caught me at a time where I have literally nothing better to do, let’s talk.

Economic freedom has to do with social mobility. People need access to quality education. You want to make the point that people should be able to choose which schools they go to, completely ignoring those in poverty. We’re locked into school zones depending on where you live – where you live/your socioeconomic status determines where you go to school. While it’s nice to pretend as though everyone has the funds to move and the ability to choose, that’s not plausible. Why don’t we discuss the fact that there needs to be more funding to close the education gap? Why don’t we address the fact that poverty inhibits one’s ability to study, causes lowered IQ, amongst other responsibilities (having to drop out to aid family, for instance).

We can also cover how people don’t choose where they get to live. Rent is increasing with minimum wage. I’m saying this from a landlord’s POV (because I actually own property, unlike you, I’m assuming). It’s not fair how those in poverty are treated. Social mobility is incredibly difficult to achieve, especially since the odds are stacked against people in poorer neighborhoods (worse quality of education, etc.) Not to mention general health increases with one’s social standing. Those in poverty don’t have access to basic needs e.g. food, shelter, general healthcare, general necessities. How are they to achieve upward social mobility with rent prices increasing, gentrification, etc.?

Lowered taxes benefits people like me. Which is hilarious because I’d rather others have access to basic needs. There’s the opportunity to split healthcare into private and public as well. Insurance companies have caused the prices of American medical procedures to rise drastically. A knee replacement in America is about $50,000, in compared to private knee replacements in England costing around £11,400. Families go bankrupt to pay for procedures here. I’m lucky that my family has money and access to good insurance and quality of healthcare. What about those who can’t? Can you afford to drop $50,000 if you can’t afford insurance? What’s your solution? Quit acting like a conflict theorist by venting your opinions into the void and actually aid in creating solutions to these qualms.

Political correctness has nothing to do with the first amendment and rights of the worker. The first amendment allows you the right to be an ass, but it doesn’t mean that people are going to support you. Corporations care about appearances and business. Have you wondered why pride icons arise in the month of June? By appeasing to groups of people, they garner more business, thus earning more money. If a corporation wants to fire an employee for not representing their business well, they have every right to. You should support this per “there should be fewer regulations on business.” Speaking on “no business should be banned in America over what they believe,” they aren’t. People just don’t want to support them, and they have to abide by anti-discrimination laws. Go ahead and look into EEOC lawsuits, particularly the intersectional ones.

Now, I implore you to research philosophy prior to making another political thread. Marcus Aurelius and Stoicism touch on the importance of the dialectic. Everyone should strive to learn more and better themselves instead of baiting debates.

THIS THO

 

[Xeleron]

Mixed economy

 

[Oblivia]

Going to lock this here due to the number of low-quality/sarcastic replies.

I also want to point out that when a thread is made with statements that the majority of the community disagrees with, there's bound to be some discourse. I'm not saying anyone's wrong and I appreciate those of you who posted well-thought out replies, but I think we can all agree that these things never go well here!