OtakuTrash
mushroom lady
uh
hi
can i join de mafia
idk
hi
can i join de mafia
idk
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Mafia TBT Mafia General Thread 3.0 - Newbie Info/Hosting/Discussion
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Damniel
Openly Wolfing
there currently is an ongoing game im hosting. If you'd like be an observer, i can add you to the chat!
to play mafia, you'll have to wait until a new game opens up which will happen after this current one is finished
OtakuTrash
mushroom lady
where is the game?there currently is an ongoing game im hosting. If you'd like be an observer, i can add you to the chat!
to play mafia, you'll have to wait until a new game opens up which will happen after this current one is finished
Damniel
Openly Wolfing
Mafia - Into the MarioVerse Kingmaker- Mafia Win!
Here we go! Welcome to Into the MarioVerse, a Kingmaker! One day in the Mushroom Kingdom, Mario was out for his daily walk waiting for someone to kidnap the Princess. While walking, Mario found a strange mushroom. Upon eating the mushroom (as eating random mushrooms is completely safe), Mario...
www.belltreeforums.com
currently, the thread is locked for night phase. you can read what occurred in the beginning phase there.
OtakuTrash
mushroom lady
ok! ty
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Ok! I've read quite a bit, and I can join in for at LEAST 30 mins., because I have a shop to run.
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Damniel
Openly Wolfing
mafia is a very long term game. day phases last 48 hours, so there are usually hundreds of posts to read and analyze. I suggest reading the current game to see if its your style, as this game will last around a week and a half, so the next game won't start for quite a while
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to clarify once the game has begun, signups are closed, so you can only observe for this game
OtakuTrash
mushroom lady
ok! thanks for the info!
Hi all. The team has been discussing whether mafia still has a place within our current community. While we acknowledge that progress has been made since our TBT Direct 4.18.20, we still have concerns about user activity in this board. We need for you to work with us on this if the The Cellar is to remain open.
What we need from you:
It is important that you work with us on these issues. Right now we are putting too much of our own personal time into following mafia games because players are not taking the initiative to report rule-breaking content. If we cannot trust you to let us know when a post needs our attention then we will have to consider closing The Cellar. If you need further clarity on anything I have said in this post then you are welcome to ask questions and I will try to be as transparent as possible.
What we need from you:
- To keep posts within the community rules and guidelines:
- Into the MarioVerse Kingmaker had multiple instances of rude behaviour and censor bypassing, which violates sections 1.1. Respecting Others and 1.4. Prohibited Content of the community rules and guidelines respectively.
- Please note that going forward that we will be deleting these posts outright, in compliance with the same procedures we follow when addressing rule-breaking posts throughout the rest of the forum.
- To report rule-breaking posts:
- If someone makes disrespectful remarks toward another player, bypasses our swear filter, or an argument breaks out then we need you to report these posts. Section 1.8. Reporting of our community rules and guidelines details that users are to report content that violates our rules rather than engage with it. If a post is reported, we can swiftly remove it before it has a chance to start an argument.
- To follow staff instructions:
- There have been instances in mafia where users have tried to continue an argument even after a staff member has stepped in to put a stop to it. Failure to follow our instructions will lead to a game thread being locked. The exception to this is if we feel a single user is deliberately trying to get the thread locked. In these instances we will forcibly remove that user from the thread.
It is important that you work with us on these issues. Right now we are putting too much of our own personal time into following mafia games because players are not taking the initiative to report rule-breaking content. If we cannot trust you to let us know when a post needs our attention then we will have to consider closing The Cellar. If you need further clarity on anything I have said in this post then you are welcome to ask questions and I will try to be as transparent as possible.
bell account
Senior Member
please do not delete any posts that could possibly ruin the game
why does the mafia community need to be subject to the rules of the rest of the community as a whole in the first place? i dont see how you can expect the same standard of behavior when so much emotional investment is required, not to mention the idea that some actions and reactions can be faked to intentionally mislead players. trying to enforce sitewide behavior rules is no bueno especially during a game as it can ruin integrity
after a game if some players need warnings reprimands or slaps on the wrist id say thats different or if players are misbehaving on other parts of the forum
why does the mafia community need to be subject to the rules of the rest of the community as a whole in the first place? i dont see how you can expect the same standard of behavior when so much emotional investment is required, not to mention the idea that some actions and reactions can be faked to intentionally mislead players. trying to enforce sitewide behavior rules is no bueno especially during a game as it can ruin integrity
after a game if some players need warnings reprimands or slaps on the wrist id say thats different or if players are misbehaving on other parts of the forum
As long as posts comply with the Rules and Guidelines then they will not need to be deleted. Whether or not a post needs to be deleted is entirely dependent on player behaviour.
The mafia community is a very small part of the greater TBT community and thus needs to follow the same rules as everyone else. We wouldn't make an exception for any other group of users and as such we won't give mafia players a pass to break our rules either. If mafia players are unprepared to follow our rules concerning respecting others then I'm afraid the game no longer has a place within our community.
Yeah I feel deleting whole posts is a little extreme when sections could just be redacted, especially if the post contains content irrelevant the problem, but I guess the moral of the story is to just not be rude so your post isn't deleted lol.
At heart, this is an Animal Crossing forum with The Cellar just being an extension of the community for which a small amount of people play mafia, so naturally this subforum will assume the rules instated, much like every other subforum and even the Discord channel. I think you're right in mentioning that words and expressions are often dramatised to create reactions and get a point across or whatever, but there *should* be a line a drawn especially when it comes to insulting one demeanour bc quite often there is a clear line between an insult and contesting another person, e.g. "Your logic is kind of stupid, why would you scumread me for X" vs a "You're so stupid, you will never have any form of intelligence to understand the mechanics of the game", for which I'm assuming the latter occured bc I didn't see what was actually said.
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And there was a ban/warning system once upon a time, but I don't think that's allowed anymore bc it goes against the blacklisting rule this forum holds. I guess you could just opt for WOTC if it's certain players repeating the same behaviours and causing the game to be reprimanded.
You've hit the nail on the head with this post.
You are right that elements to exclude players from games have been removed due to conflicting with our rules regarding blacklisting. If there is a user with questionable behaviour and the host is genuinely concerned about letting them participate in their game then I would suggest that they either make a Contact the Staff thread or they can message me directly. We do not want anyone to feel bullied or excluded on TBT, so if there is a valid reason to not allow someone to join the game then it should be handled by a staff member.
Damniel
Openly Wolfing
Thank you for looking out for us and trying to keep the Cellar open. While I completely understand the need for rule compliance and concern over quality of posting, please also consider that this is the first time that concerns over rule compliance have been directly addressed to players in the Cellar. I understand that a warning was made in the April Direct, but the Cellar is a unique subforum where most of our player base don’t leave the Cellar to check any other subforums and many don’t check/even know about the Directs. I appreciate that you’re posting the specific rules in this thread as more players are more likely to see them and keep them in mind for future games.
I think it’s completely understandable that the staff has the concerns over keeping the Cellar open, but I think it’s important to keep in mind that this is the first time in a while that the rules have been directly posted here. I just ask that statements regarding the Cellar also be posted here along with in Directs. Many of our current players have joined TBT entirely for mafia and come from forums, such as Epicmafia and Mafia Universe, where curse filters and other post quality rules just don’t exist and simply aren’t aware of them here. I think having the rules listed, like you do here, in a Cellar thread will be very important for mafia players to easily see.
While we are a very small community, I believe that mafia is an important part of TBT history that even many past/current staff have some personal connection to. Many current players (including myself) have found a renewed sense of belonging on the forums through mafia. The mafia community is a close-knit group that has formed deep bonds that would have not been made in any other part of the forum; and the formation of these bonds are what I believe to be a core goal in TBT’s philosophy.
While I understand the concerns for keeping the Cellar open, I believe that players now being able to see the rules and being directly made aware of these concerns will help us stay compliant with them. I understand it’s difficult to keep up with games that hit 1k+ posts, so I think letting players/hosts be aware that reporting can be done (like you're doing now) can help with that stress. Perhaps there are veteran members of our community that can will enforcing site rules as part of staff? Unsure on this, but perhaps it can be part of another discussion. I’m well aware that games can get heated and emotions can get high and I hope that we can continue working with staff to keep the Cellar we love open.
Arstotzkan
A scum mom
I’m lurking more these days but I feel the need to at least voice that I, as well as a lot of people, would definitely not want to see the Cellar closed. It’s a place that means a lot to us, and losing it would sting. Any decision staff makes would be respected of course, but this isn’t just some cesspool of negativity. It’s brought a lot of us together, and I think it can easily continue in that role.
That said, if issues go unreported, I’d assume that means the offended party and the offender feel as if they can work things out, i.e. they don’t want staff intervention. I don’t think you should put that burden on yourself to oversee something if it isn’t getting reported, because if that assistance is wanted, it’ll get pinged.
What will necessitate oversight though is if you feel that staff should be the final say on who can and can’t join games. Preventing users from feeling excluded is a valid concern! But at the same time, I think it’d be very hard for staff to judge that without knowing the history of each game. If you want to go down that road, I would either promote one of us to a sectional moderator so people familiar with the game and community could oversee it, or promote someone else to look over the section full-time. You’re putting a lot on yourself by trying to pull multiple duties when this in of itself should be its own job, imo.
It means a lot that staff cares about the health of the community. I think we all do. I’m confident that this can come to a place that we’re both happy with
That said, if issues go unreported, I’d assume that means the offended party and the offender feel as if they can work things out, i.e. they don’t want staff intervention. I don’t think you should put that burden on yourself to oversee something if it isn’t getting reported, because if that assistance is wanted, it’ll get pinged.
What will necessitate oversight though is if you feel that staff should be the final say on who can and can’t join games. Preventing users from feeling excluded is a valid concern! But at the same time, I think it’d be very hard for staff to judge that without knowing the history of each game. If you want to go down that road, I would either promote one of us to a sectional moderator so people familiar with the game and community could oversee it, or promote someone else to look over the section full-time. You’re putting a lot on yourself by trying to pull multiple duties when this in of itself should be its own job, imo.
It means a lot that staff cares about the health of the community. I think we all do. I’m confident that this can come to a place that we’re both happy with
Damniel
Openly Wolfing
i think there may be the issue that players don’t know that they can report issues directly to staff as many just tell the host who will try to resolve things themselves. But i do agree that mafia players are usually more level headed due to the nature of the game, so a lot of sarcastic comments just don’t phase them as much. i think as long as players know they can report issues to host or directly to staff, it can be resolved in one way or another
Arstotzkan
A scum mom
@ Daniel yeah def, reporting is always good for when its needed!
Tbh, the more I think about it, the more I really like the idea of outright deleting posts with problematic content. I think that in of itself is a punishment for bad behavior since there would be the expectation of them reposting with the relevant content that got cut, and retyping things stinks. But that works, since being mean to people also stinks
Edit (I don’t want to keep making new notifications for people sksbsk): Just for clarification, the concerns yall at staff are raising are absolutely legitimate, and making excuses for them only highlights the problem further. We shouldn’t act as if we’re different because we’re not. The rules broken aren’t exactly rocket science either. They’re basic common decency, and no real excuse can be made to defend that. I can only hope that post helps people realize as such too.
Tbh, the more I think about it, the more I really like the idea of outright deleting posts with problematic content. I think that in of itself is a punishment for bad behavior since there would be the expectation of them reposting with the relevant content that got cut, and retyping things stinks. But that works, since being mean to people also stinks
Edit (I don’t want to keep making new notifications for people sksbsk): Just for clarification, the concerns yall at staff are raising are absolutely legitimate, and making excuses for them only highlights the problem further. We shouldn’t act as if we’re different because we’re not. The rules broken aren’t exactly rocket science either. They’re basic common decency, and no real excuse can be made to defend that. I can only hope that post helps people realize as such too.
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Wow what are those
Also if outsiders joining the forum can't be assed to skim the rules oop on them
Ace Marvel
Merry & Happy
I feel super sad reading this, because outside of the games, I really care for you and we got to this point and is bad.
Outside the games we are friends, so let's work together to prevent the Cellar from being closed, there is not point with arguing since the decision has been made.
I think right now, some people need a break, including myself. I always have tried to never make things personal or attack someone directly, and if you ever feel like I did, I'm sorry. You are all awesome, so let's keep the game going and be happy.
Outside the games we are friends, so let's work together to prevent the Cellar from being closed, there is not point with arguing since the decision has been made.
I think right now, some people need a break, including myself. I always have tried to never make things personal or attack someone directly, and if you ever feel like I did, I'm sorry. You are all awesome, so let's keep the game going and be happy.
The best thing hosts and players can do to help enforce the forum rules and prevent interruptions in the game is to report posts that insult others. It's beneficial to the game (and the forum) to correct a user's behavior as soon as possible so large arguments don't have to be removed.
While arguing is a part of the game, arguing about someone's intelligence or personal traits is not necessary and crosses a line that will require moderators to intervene. Regardless of how far other communities allow the arguing to go, we have rules against being rude to other users and this applies whether it's done purposely as a game tactic or happens in the heat of the moment.
Reporting a post does not necessarily mean that a user will be banned or even that any action will be taken at all. The moderators make judgements about every report we receive anywhere on the forum. Users aren't banned unless they've either already received multiple warnings or do something very bad. We also have a pretty good reputation for being fair and a few of us have played mafia before, so don't be afraid to report if you think something might be crossing the line.
Also, if a specific user's behavior constantly risks interrupting the game, the host should consider disqualifying them.
While arguing is a part of the game, arguing about someone's intelligence or personal traits is not necessary and crosses a line that will require moderators to intervene. Regardless of how far other communities allow the arguing to go, we have rules against being rude to other users and this applies whether it's done purposely as a game tactic or happens in the heat of the moment.
Reporting a post does not necessarily mean that a user will be banned or even that any action will be taken at all. The moderators make judgements about every report we receive anywhere on the forum. Users aren't banned unless they've either already received multiple warnings or do something very bad. We also have a pretty good reputation for being fair and a few of us have played mafia before, so don't be afraid to report if you think something might be crossing the line.
Also, if a specific user's behavior constantly risks interrupting the game, the host should consider disqualifying them.
Posting a new thread in here with these requirements is absolutely doable. I'll get to work on that either later this evening or tomorrow.
If an issue goes unreported then this is a problem. We need posts to be reported so that we can remove them and, if necessary, warn the user responsible. We won't try and mediate your friendships - we just need to be able to handle rule-breaking posts.
We have seen tools such as banning and wisdom of the crowds used to purposely exclude or bully other users in the past. Let me put it this way: if a host wishes to exclude a player from a game, they should have a good reason to do so and be able to effectively communicate that with us. If we agree then we can let that user know - authoritative decisions like this are typically better received from staff members than regular users. Please don't think us incapable of doing a little research ourselves to come to a well-informed decision.
I'm going to take this moment to remind everyone that game hosts are not moderators. Beyond disqualifying a player who is actively ruining a game, as Jeremy mentioned above, they have no place in scolding other users or telling them that they can't play a game. That is our job, and we make sure to handle these things in a consistent and fair way.
We have discussed your proposal and came to a unanimous decision not to add a cellar moderator. There should not have to be a need for one. What we want is for you to be able to play a game without a staff member needing to watch the thread, but with the knowledge that in the event the forum rules are broken that you will take the initiative to get our attention by pressing the report button. If a moderator is needed to watch game threads like a hawk then what that tells us is not that we need a cellar moderator, but rather that mafia games are not able to be hosted appropriately on The Bell Tree.
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