hi everyone so I'm gonna do a thing where I actually try!!!! because I need to!!!! so LISTEN pls
because I'm pretty sure town is ****ed if we mislynch. but we won't.
so, sataric was completely right about something:
he said there is one scum at least within minties, xine, and endless. xine died and flipped third party, and now I will lay out reason by reason why minties is scum.
I'll start off by saying that what sataric said is a GUARANTEE- purely for balance reasons. I can elaborate this in detail, but basically it is because of this: if there were two or more of these three on the same side, i.e. town, it would severely throw off the scumteam because of the other two really powerful players. while roles are random, most hosts tweak them in order for each side to have a fair chance. (so like, five new players aren't scum together against a highly experienced town)
so from the beginning:
1. minties has been giving me gut feelings since early d1 BUT I am really biased towards her cause she's a qt, so i ignored it, but here's why I felt that way:
I was actually wondering the same thing given that Sataric has always been difficult to read. He plays well as scum and as town, so the instant town read on him is confusing. I always see Sataric's posts as a little TL;DR because they contain a lot of general game overview with his opinion sprinkled in there. This is a closed set-up so it's not impossible for that "coupon" to be for a third party.
[snip]
How active do you plan on being this game?: Not really that active. The events that have happened have soured a lot of my taste for TBT mafia and I wanted to take a break from it.
How well do you think you scumhunt(Look to find mafia)? Why?: I think I spend a lot of time reading to find scum and then post large posts with all the **** I find. I'd like to think I'm pretty good at it, but have felt a lot less confident since the MU fiasco.
What should we expect from your play-style this game?: Less posting overall because my heart really isn't in it. I'll try to provide useful content, just will probably be less of a ***** this game.
I'm going to head to bed now though, been drinking a fair bit and have given myself a headache.
A. the thing about sataric possibly being a third party is entirely silly- 3rd party has NO motivation to reveal the coupon because then they will be expected to give the results of whatever the item is which they have genuinely no purpose to do except for the sake of being townread- but with someone like sataric, this is even sillier because he is experienced enough to come across as town without pulling something like this.
B. about the inactive/unmotivated part- ok this isn't typical of minties, and this part i think is probably genuine BUT Sataric put it perfectly: Minties is aggressive, and a highly competitive player. she is not the type to sit back and use the excuse constantly that she's not motivated to play while letting town be fed to the dogs (which is what is happening so far) and this spark, this passiveness that goes beyond feeling simply unconfident/ not as unmotivated is exactly what differentiates normal frustration versus scum tells.
I definitely feel what minties is feeling as well, due to what happened last game blowing up on my face, but I am wayyyyy too competitive to try to ~sit back~. and town!minties would be too.
2.
That's a really weird thing to suggest tbh. Why would you think there is a strongman?
this really is the first post that really started to make me feel that minties was scummy- she's addressing this to tardis, as in the tardis who was trying to lynch claimed non lethal third party, Tom, in MYLO because he thought Tom was SK. (which still would mean a loss for town anyway) tardis' town meta is questioning constantly, without regard to whether it sounds scummy or not.
when tardis has been scum he's quiet and lays back because he doesn't want to say too much or bring attention to himself, he was pretty easily suspected last game on d1 or d2 and had to fake claim (vig, ironically) to get out of being lynched.
regardless, especially since mafia has had strongarm in several of the last recent games and tardis is still relatively new it's not really even bad of a statement to begin with. this is where I think she's going for the easy lynches, same with ness - who gets fairly emotional as either alignment and has trouble towntelling.
3.
Basically he was distancing himself from town with his words. I always get really suspicious of players that use that sort of language "helping you guys" "I want to be useful to THE town" because it creates a sense of space between the player and the town. If you're town, then why would you say THE town? It doesn't make sense. In Ness' case though, his reaction to questioning after really didn't help out his case because he became overwhelmingly emotional.
@Entropy that paragraph is sort of direct at you too as the catalyst for Ness to get lynched was his grammar because Panda jumped on it and made Ness freak out.
If your playstyle is "picking through posts with a fine toothed comb", then you're clearly failing at doing that because I already addressed this dead horse more than once. Keep on beating it though. I literally stated that I would be slightly less active in this game compared to usual games AND also stated that I wasn't going to lurk in later posts. You would have known that if actually read my posts. It's not an excuse considering that I'm actually playing and posting more than one sentence each time I post. You actually have no idea what happened in the course of me signing up to this game or my game being ruined because you're new.
The reason people are more inclined to trust Entropy or even seriously consider her viewpoints is because everyone ignored her in previous games when she was RIGHT. She doesn't post giant long cases on people, but that doesn't mean she's stupid or something. She tends to keep her actual reasoning and her cards close to her chest. I don't think that it's smart at all to completely disregard her thoughts as people did that last game and she was spot on.
there are several things I have wrong with minties points here: trying to pick on miharu (who's also a relatively newer player) and for oversimplifying something that was actually much more complicated.
first off, ness is a native English speaker and miharu is not. and like I said, he wasn't purely lynched for that sentence and saying so is entirely wrong and over simplifying everything else as well- he was overreacting about several different things prior to that (hence why he was defending himself when he was saying "im just trying to help the town" and was not the catalyst at all. it was his uncalled for emotion when responding to something else (although he did proceed to continue to act this way)
second, I had a decent case written about ness that didn't even mention ~that slip~ so the fact that she uses this to push miharu to try to bring attention to her is just plain slimy, because she simplified it and removed the context of what happened with ness.
4. gonna make this separate cause 3 was getting overwhelming, and I think this is important: this part is about the quote above in bold, which is a response to tui
the tone throughout is extremely hostile. I almost wanna say it's an overreaction and being over defensive because of how minties normally is, I mean I DO get the frustration and the emotion that carries over from last game- trust me. but the intimidation card is definitely being played here, especially with the first line. for someone that says she's gonna ~lay back~ this game, she gets wayyyy too fired up just by tuis questioning of her.
what's even more amazing about this reply is that you don't see this kind of fire when it comes to her suspicions, it's just when she's being provoked. I actually lost a game (scummies) because of minties doing this- she was pretty passive throughout the game (trundle noticed it out of all people) and I had my gut feelings against her so I inspected her, guiltied her BUT I still didn't lynch her because I was busy but also because of how intimidating she was being- when I pushed her for being passive it sparked her to make a case in retaliation. and this is basically what she's doing now, but in a different form- she shows the most emotion and aggression when she's being pushed and then proceeds to attack those that are pushing her. she didn't only do this with tui, you can see how she responded when sataric pushed her as well.
6. endless as scum has NO motivation whatsoever to kill xine, considering if he would have left her alive, he had a decent shot at lynching her considering her push on ashtot
further, I completely townread the bit about him making a case on xine but not wanting to post it until it is fully developed. yes I realize this could totally be a lie (hence why I asked him, and I am sure he will post them), but that's some pretty low level mafia tactics that I HIGHLY doubt endless would try to pull here. I'm fully confident that his scumread and frustration was sincere- he did use a couple logically fallible arguments, yes, which I didn't let him just get away with- but....
What.
You're misunderstanding my point entirely.
The point of that post was that Tui was disagreeing with me on the relevance of meta (saying it was very relevant) while simultaneously claiming that I was less town because I was <doing something that is nullified by my meta>. The problem here is the double standard, not that he's using meta.
And your push on Oak is different completely, because you're using your knowledge of his play from multiple past games, which fits my criteria of more-than-one. Quite literally the only thing I told him to stop doing (and re-iterated for people to not do) was use a single game as evidence. The reason for this is that this evidence is circumstantial, and inaccurate.
And perhaps I went overboard with what I called Xine. To be fair, I'd just woken up to a last minute flip onto a power role using a methodology I detest. That being said, Xine is probably mafia this game so I don't feel that sorry - not empty words either, I'll explain tomorrow. I've the case mostly written out (haha funny joke, I'll probably write at least as much again as what I have written), but I'm too tired to finish it right now. This'll wind up really awkward if I get night killed, but honestly, it's better I provide a well rested case and potentially don't have the opportunity to submit it than I complete and present a case that may have several over-sights and errors in it.
this response where he realizes he went too far really showed me his genuine emotion in this, and as someone that seems like such a Type A personality like he is would be A LOT more controlled and collected when being pushed by a player like xine.
this is my strongest read all game, I'm beyond confident so pls sheep me, if I was mafia I'd be pushing for Hayden (oak) or endless because that would be much easier and it's what most people wanna do anyway, and if you don't agree with what I'm saying, then question me and I will try to explain everything even more but I spent a lot of time on this so
I really urge you all to vote with me for Minties now.
ps I'm literally writing this all on my phone so there's not really as many quotes as I would have liked AND it's not very well proofread so I'm sorry if I ****ed up somewhere, but if you want me to pull them when I get home I can do that as well
