Ok but what makes you think that you belong to one rather than another?
Nothing?
Maybe it's just a feeling.
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What is gender?
- Thread starter Aniko
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Ok but what makes you think that you belong to one rather than another?
Nothing?
Maybe it's just a feeling.
B e t h a n y
I hate pears
I don't think I was portraying it in a negative light but I'm sorry if any one took it as that. Obviously it has psychological circumstances and I can't imagine what's it like to experience that. I didn't go into a lot of detail, but I know it isn't just a snap of a finger transition, there are stages to go through. Even though we have opposing views, I appreciate your response.
Ghost Soda
(he him or they them)
Gender isn't about body parts or how you were born. Ultimately, I think it's different for everyone. The only person that knows someone's gender is themselves, and it certainly isn't anyone's business telling other people how they should or shouldn't choose to identify.
toadsworthy
Tangsworthy
damnit, I tried really hard to say that you weren't, I just quoted you because you brought up the term gender identity disorder
Posters were asked to speak for themselves, it's alright if someone relate to a gender because of their genitals or gender role. It's a personal question.
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Like someone said earlier someone who identifies as male could prefer hanging out with females and share their activities without wanting of changing sex.
Same for a female, she could dress, talk, act in a "masculine" way, have nothing of what society sees as feminine and yet still identifies as female.
- - - Post Merge - - -
Like someone said earlier someone who identifies as male could prefer hanging out with females and share their activities without wanting of changing sex.
Same for a female, she could dress, talk, act in a "masculine" way, have nothing of what society sees as feminine and yet still identifies as female.
PizzaTotinoBoy
I am...Pizza Totino's Boy
Sex is what you're born as, physically, Gender is what of those sexes you feel most comfortable with, what you feel you physically are, at least that's how it can be seen today..(SEX PLAYS A VERY BIG, IF NOT NEARLY ENTIRE PART IN GENDER MIND YOU) Now, see, I don't think that there are 72 genders or however many on the "Gender Master List" there are. Something such as being "fiery and outbursting" isn't a gender. It's a personality trait, and I feel that a lot of people mix up, or use their personalities as "gender", which isn't correct(and really gives people who do have gender dysphoria, etc a bad name at times). Sure some people can feel like they're in between male and female, or neither at all, which is perfectly fine, whatever I don't really care. I do believe though, that mainly, there are two genders, male and female. Traits associating with them do exist, even if one can have the trait of the opposite, that's perfectly fine. Sure, you can identify as in between or neither but that's still based upon the male/female spectrum. But of course, having these traits doesn't mean you're one gender over another, if you have feminine traits as a guy but are still comfortable being a guy, then there's no problem with that, it doesn't mean you're trans or androgynous or whatever, it's whatever you're comfortable with. Note, when I say that I mean for everyone. I don't agree that there's 72 or whatever genders, I don't think using your personality to make your "gender" is necessarily right, nor do I think doing it for attention is right either(That's just insensitive to people who have actually had gender dysphoria.) I learned to go with what I'm most comfortable with when my ex not only thought but tried to make me into a woman. And of course, I nearly lied to myself. I nearly lied to everyone and nearly potentially became someone I knew I wasn't. I then realized that, all of this gender stuff being forced on many, and people being guilted for being cis, or male, or heterosexual, it was all a load of bull. I felt that way before but that's when I realized that it's just as bad as hating anyone else. Hating a man for being a man, who's comfortable being a man is absolutely awful, just as hating a woman for being female is wrong.
Sure, my opinions aren't agreeable with everyone. No, I don't think there's 72 genders, but I don't care what you do as long as you're not shaming others for not doing what you do, or you doing this stuff for attention, etc. I'm scared that people are lying to themselves for attention a lot of the time. Sure some people may have real, legit feelings but I'm still scared that some people are going to lie to themselves or be forced/manipulated into being something they don't really want to be. I'm scared that some of this is going to go too far, I'm scared that...Well, I'm just scared that sex and gender in general are going to be thrown out the window. I'm scared people are going to be shamed for being cis men or cis women.(They already are, especially men from what I've seen)
TLDR Gender, or at least what I see as the modern-day definition of it is a mental thing, there's mainly two but you can be others, and people won't agree with my opinions but oh well.
Mainly, I just want everyone to be happy with who they are and with eachother. It's not possible to be perfectly like this, but...People just need to know what's right and wrong sometimes, and what they're completely doing is exactly what they're fighting against.
Be what you want, but don't lie to yourself. Know what is logical, know what doesn't make sense, or what doesn't fit the criteria of what you're trying to be and use that to figure out who you really are, because I have a feeling a lot of people don't. Maybe that's just me, I've never felt any feelings of wanting to be out of the "norm" in gender, so I wouldn't know, this is all coming from that point of view so please excuse me if my opinions are "wrong" to some. They're just opinions.
And that's all I have to say about it. I know I rambled on, and my opinions aren't even that well organized but I hope something can be fished out of it.
EDIT-Sorry for my mess of a post, I don't even know if my thoughts came onto words there. It's a headache of a topic and it's really hard to talk about sometimes.
Sure, my opinions aren't agreeable with everyone. No, I don't think there's 72 genders, but I don't care what you do as long as you're not shaming others for not doing what you do, or you doing this stuff for attention, etc. I'm scared that people are lying to themselves for attention a lot of the time. Sure some people may have real, legit feelings but I'm still scared that some people are going to lie to themselves or be forced/manipulated into being something they don't really want to be. I'm scared that some of this is going to go too far, I'm scared that...Well, I'm just scared that sex and gender in general are going to be thrown out the window. I'm scared people are going to be shamed for being cis men or cis women.(They already are, especially men from what I've seen)
TLDR Gender, or at least what I see as the modern-day definition of it is a mental thing, there's mainly two but you can be others, and people won't agree with my opinions but oh well.
Mainly, I just want everyone to be happy with who they are and with eachother. It's not possible to be perfectly like this, but...People just need to know what's right and wrong sometimes, and what they're completely doing is exactly what they're fighting against.
Be what you want, but don't lie to yourself. Know what is logical, know what doesn't make sense, or what doesn't fit the criteria of what you're trying to be and use that to figure out who you really are, because I have a feeling a lot of people don't. Maybe that's just me, I've never felt any feelings of wanting to be out of the "norm" in gender, so I wouldn't know, this is all coming from that point of view so please excuse me if my opinions are "wrong" to some. They're just opinions.
And that's all I have to say about it. I know I rambled on, and my opinions aren't even that well organized but I hope something can be fished out of it.
EDIT-Sorry for my mess of a post, I don't even know if my thoughts came onto words there. It's a headache of a topic and it's really hard to talk about sometimes.
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So we can say it's a state of mind that is not necessary related to societal norms. It's an headache right.
100 years ago, we had a conception of gender that was different from now and it will continue to change.
Maybe we won't need genders anymore in the future, I don't know. Correct me if I'm wrong, a cisgender is someone who is fine with their sex assigned at birth, it doesn't mean they follow gender roles, it doesn't mean that they represent themselves in a feminine way or masculine way.
UglyMonsterFace
Arize from Azulon
The traditional definition of gender is the same as sex - it is based off your genitals, so male or female. Nowadays, gender is now a word used to define how a person feels or identifies themselves as, rather than the scientific traditional meaning. I would still go with the traditional definition, but honestly, it's just words. If you want to use the word gender in the more modern way, that's fine. All that matters is that people have the freedom to express themselves in whatever way they want, as long as it isn't harmful to anybody or to themselves. But scientifically speaking, there is only male/female and changing the definition of the word cannot change science.
PizzaTotinoBoy
I am...Pizza Totino's Boy
Yeah, basically. I mean, physicality also has something to do with it but it's mainly the mindset of how you feel about that physicality, in which most people are completely fine with what they were born with, while other's are not necessarily. I do think it's going to change, I do think that a lot of things are certain..."trends" I guess you could say that will change in the future only to be replaced with other such trends. I mean, I'm not saying everyone's gender issues are a phase, they could be(Like in my case for a very short time but you could argue it was my ex merely influencing me) but I do think a lot of modern-day things like the arguably ridiculous "Gender Master List" are going to become a thing of the past someday. How it'll change? no clue. I won't really care though as long as people don't try shoving beliefs down my throat, or anyone else's. That's a major problem I have with a lot of people honestly.
Ghost Soda
(he him or they them)
I love how people keep arguing "there r only two sexes!!!11", like all intersex people just disappeared or what?
UglyMonsterFace
Arize from Azulon
Lol, why are you always so passive aggressive and sarcastic, rather than actually adding to the conversation or being respectful? :/
EDIT: Of course I'm aware of certain conditions, such as hermaphrodites, etc. However, I always just thought of that as having both male and female traits, rather than a third gender..
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PizzaTotinoBoy
I am...Pizza Totino's Boy
Yep, I use Gender and Sex interchangeably myself too. I have to agree with pretty much everything you say here, science cannot be changed, like you said, and sure, I'm fine with everyone expressing themselves as long as nobody's hurt.
I was about to say that myself.
I always considered those conditions to still be on the male/female spectrum myself and more of a "mix" of the two, but again I wouldn't know, I haven't experienced/known anyone like that before, so I may be wrong there, but that's what I always saw it as myself.
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What one has between their legs, assuming they have legs, and hormones/chromosomes might not be well defined. If you lose what is between your legs or your hormones change, is your mind will change as well? not sure about that. Same for gender role, if society suddenly decide to change gender roles and fashion, will you follow the new trends?
Ghost Soda
(he him or they them)
Sorry bout that, I don't think you deserve the ol' saltness train as things are.
And anyways, if they're a mix of "female" and "male" traits, than what exactly decided which binary gender they are then?
PizzaTotinoBoy
I am...Pizza Totino's Boy
From what I can tell, a lot of the time, usually there are a lot of genetic, hormonal, etc. tests done as the child develops. That and, probably what the child is most comfortable with, depending on the family it grows up with I'm sure. There's so many factors I'm sure it's done in many different ways, with or without surgeries, etc.
A "mix" of male and female traits is only to describe a lot of the physical parts of it, not necessarily hormonal or genetic. I'm sure there's lots of people who are more male or female oriented in those aspects, or even completely in the middle. It likely varies from person to person so there can't be a definitive answer when you think about it.
But maybe I'm somehow wrong, I wouldn't know, so please excuse me if I am on something.
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Makes me think, there are people that are not fine with the gender assigned at birth, but also don't have genital dysphoria, I mean they are fine with their body as long as they can express the right gender, or maybe they just need to change a few things. And there is the opposite too, having genital dysphoria without gender dysphoria. I'm not sure about trends though, even if I know what you mean, like for anything else, a person may be confused about a lot of things including gender and orientation at some time and change their mind later, or maybe they just don't feel at ease in the society.
PizzaTotinoBoy
I am...Pizza Totino's Boy
Oh yeah, definitely, I agree with you there. I know I was confused for some time, I know a lot of people who were but I also do think a lot of people jump on this sort of thing, like any other talked-about topic just for attention, and even to fit in at times if they want to feel like a part of something. I think that can go both ways.
I can see your first point too. I mean, there's a lot of people who transition and don't plan on doing certain things, only changing a few things to feel comfortable with themselves. That definitely exists.
UglyMonsterFace
Arize from Azulon
The only thing I meant by female or male traits are what is defined scientifically as male or female, rather than any social construct. So uterus, vagina, ovaries are female and penis and testicles are male. If there are the rare cases where traits from both of these genders are present in one person, then they just simply have traits for both and they can identify with the more dominant traits they have. But say a person was born with a penis, but on the outside they look entirely feminine, they are still biologically male because appearance isn't what makes a gender, and neither are emotions or outfits or hobbies, etc. Now this doesn't mean that a born male cannot identify as female, but what you identify as does not negate science, but science should also not define who you are as a person. So if you want to live life as a female, male, non-binary, whatever, it is perfectly fine, regardless of science, because you are being true to who you are emotionally and psychologically
I don't know if that's what you were asking? This is just my opinion and if you can respectfully convey your opinions as well, I will respect yours. Remember, not everyone will agree and we should be able to have an open conversation rather than a judgmental one ^_^
See, this question doesn't make sense to me.
If gender is what you feel you are and sex is what you physically are, the reason I feel that I am a boy is because I am happy with the gender my sex comes with by "default", if you will.
If I considered myself a girl, but still had a disco stick, then I'd say that's precisely what makes me belong to one rather than the other. If I did the whole transition, then I'd be a girl in every way.
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