Mafia The Battle of the Nobles- Endgame

Quotes from Resistance (Scum Punchy)
Sorry if any of these have been posted already, I don't really remember which exact quotes have been shown. I'm just trying to give an overall picture of how he acted as scum in one particular fairly recent game so people can compare.

Punchy said:

how heavy of a townlean am I
1-10

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I'm pretty sure this one has been brought up, but he was asking people for opinions on him just like he did in this game.

Punchy said:

this is literally reeking obvious scum. why vote yes when you could nay it and explain in detail why it is a bad idea, because I don't see anything wrong with it. If this fails, it is either Vanessa and I've really screwed up with Dolby, or Toads. Think of all possible teammate for toads in case this fails.

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"Literally reeking obvious scum" sounds like the language he has been using in this game

Punchy said:

I think that the scumteam is Dolby/Antonio slot. His constant denial that they're a possible team is telling imo

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It could also alternatively be Dolby/Toads

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This is where the Dolby/Toads push starts

Dolby responded saying basically, literally how could I be teamed with toads (since they had a giant post war)

Punchy says,

yes.

This post war could totally be faked imo

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Punchy said:

Is dedenne a compatible toads teammate

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Punchy said:

Actually

could this be vanessa/toads

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Whenever he asked questions they were just one-liners like this and he never looked into them himself.
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Punchy said:

I'm yaying this mission because I'm town and I trust Vanessa more than toads because toads is the only compatible partner with dolby who could have failed the previous mission

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note that he was buddying with me (his partner) this game until the very end when we had no choice but to bus each other
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Toads @me said:

Lol why wouldn't you just say that you are town
Why is this worded so awkward

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Punchy said:

grasping at straws once again

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Accusations were also presented as one liners. Also he low-key defended me
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Punchy said:

is it just me or is Dolby making no sense

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Punchy (@Toads) said:

LOL WHAT

Two 180s in one post. SCUM!

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Strong, one-track minded language again
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Punchy said:

Literally I have been advocating for Toads/Dolby all game

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Toads @that said:

Yes but it makes no sense because me and Dolby have wanted to kill each other... what would possess you to continue to think that we would be a team? And did you even read my posts

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Punchy in response to Toads said:

Hard bussing literally all game, distancing, etc. yes Bianca confirm me/Dedenne/VaNESSa

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Like in this game, he didn't actually pull up evidence to back up his claim. The "me/Dedenne/Vanessa" was in the context of who he thinks is town btw

Punchy said:

send the mission

Toads and Dolby are scum. Vanessa open your eyes

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Literally everyone at this point was saying Toads and Dolby made no sense but he still kept pushing it.

Punchy said:

This is bleeding obvious Toads/Dolby team

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Dolby respond to my earlier inquiry

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Punchy said:

Provide evidence that you two are not teamed. I don't want "oh we were arguing all game so we must not be teamed"

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Punchy said:

That's literally "oh we were arguing all game so we aren't teamed" stop dodging the question and give actual evidence

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Punchy @Toads said:

but you both got those missions passed?

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Also dolby yaying my proposal and then you yaying soon after? totally staged.

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I think you get the point. TL: DR of his scum behaviour in this game was:
-One liners
-Tunneling a team that didn't make sense
-Buddying/defending scum partner until he had no choice
-Occasionally throwing out random ideas but then not following up
-Not really being open to other people's reasoning or defense
-Not providing quotes to back-up his accusations

And everyone had him townlocked for the majority of this game. Off the top of my head I can see some similarities to this game as I highlighted, but make of it what you will. I still want him lynched either way.

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One main DIFFERENCE to this game is that he did not use any AtE or show much emotion, but keep in mind that he was never pushed or scumread, and he has been constantly pushed in this game.

thanks vanessa!! that's so helpful. and that explains the AtE since he's being so heavily pushed (esp if he has the main mafia role like others suggested)

On a different note:
Unravel pulled up the post where Jacob mentioned Chele, Ness and Bianca as his townleans with Ness sandwhiched in the middle. I find it particularly interesting that he mentioned Ness because while Chele and Bianca had been participating actively, Ness wasn't really? All I remember Ness doing really was fighting with Trundle. I guess since Jacob was going after Trundle it would make sense in his perspective to townlean Ness. But...idk, I could def see them as a team from this.

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All this to say I would rather see Ness as the lynch after Punchy than Toads, at least as of right now.

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N e s s said:

To be honest I'm starting to think things aren't adding up so clearly at the moment, something isn't right

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Don't get me wrong I kinda feel like Punchy's death is a necessity but I'm starting to think that everything isn't as it seems, Yoads has a point that everyone is being really quick to hop on this

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This post is kinda weird
He's vaguely telling everyone to be cautionary but he didnt really do anything after. Its like he knows something is going to happen and he wants to get towncred after it happens? Idk
Also Yoads is a new one and I like it lmao

didn't trundle and dolby both town read ness, not saying they're incapable of being wrong as i find ness pretty suspicious (not a lot of content but he does seem genuinely busy, found his jacob post pretty helpful) also dolby is pretty good at reading ness, and seemed to town read him. i'm mainly really giving him town credit as he has punchy as his biggest scum read as me which obvious aligns with how i see the game playing out but that could be incorrect, happy to look into ness more but i'm not that convinced. also punchy most recent message is accusing ness of being scum so.. that makes me think ness is town naturally i know he also said toad could be scum but he grouped bianca with ness and not toad which is strange

also can we take a look at trundle's reads before he died

my scumpool is the following people - toadsworthy, Temptations, Vanessa, Punchy, amazonevan, tae, Chele

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he was right about jacob, the least we can do is think about what he has said. personally i'd rule out chele and temptations from this though

Vanessa said:

-One liners
-Tunneling a team that didn't make sense
-Buddying/defending scum partner until he had no choice
-Occasionally throwing out random ideas but then not following up
-Not really being open to other people's reasoning or defense
-Not providing quotes to back-up his accusations

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So this is what Scum punchy is?

One Liners

Punchy - Hunger Games said:

I'm sorry
can I vote you now

Not providing quotes to back-up accusations

Punchy - Hunger Games said:

ILY
vote waffles. SHE IS EXACTLY MIRRORING HER BEHAVIOR IN APM. oh my god. DOLBY. Look at Waffles' behavior in the last like 12 hours and right before Waffles was lynched in APM

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Tunneling Waffles in Hunger Games / throwing out wild ideas and not following up

Punchy said:

I still want to lynch waffles, but I highly doubt that would pick up steam. HE FLIPPING JUST DID AN ANTI TOWN THING LIKE SMH WHY. plus I could totally see the mafia, encouraging him to vote NL to basically clear him, because that's what's happened.

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He also high key called out Rune as a SK early on in this game

Punchy said:

so the reason that I was sus of rune is that I asked Dolby about balancing, and he said that an SK should only be put into a game of 15 players or more. I thought that that's why Vanessa insisted on having a 15 player game. Ofc Ness could have said something similar, but I highly doubt that.

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Here is his AtE were all questioning too... he does it a lot and unnecesarily early when he is town.

Punchy from Hunger Games said:

hi
so basically this happens every game (I've always been town except once in a nonserious game) I get sussed for just being Punchy
and then Town proceeds to lynch me. I partly blame myself for being weird this game, for not having dinner before the game. That's why I was a "robot". Also, I'm down for a Waffles (unravel) lynch, I'll reread the thread in the morning and post my thoughts about that.

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Fuchsia mafia Punchy and Dad were mafia and won. Punchy claimed that dad was tunneling him so he does not always buddy up to his scum partner. Punchy made much better accusations at people that at least had a reason and he followed along in a conscious train of thought.

SOOOOO Punchy is not as cut n dry as you would think.

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Punchy was a detective in that game and all those quotes were from before he claimed

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That game being hunger games

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mogyay said:

didn't trundle and dolby both town read ness, not saying they're incapable of being wrong as i find ness pretty suspicious (not a lot of content but he does seem genuinely busy, found his jacob post pretty helpful) also dolby is pretty good at reading ness, and seemed to town read him. i'm mainly really giving him town credit as he has punchy as his biggest scum read as me which obvious aligns with how i see the game playing out but that could be incorrect, happy to look into ness more but i'm not that convinced. also punchy most recent message is accusing ness of being scum so.. that makes me think ness is town naturally i know he also said toad could be scum but he grouped bianca with ness and not toad which is strange

also can we take a look at trundle's reads before he died


he was right about jacob, the least we can do is think about what he has said. personally i'd rule out chele and temptations from this though

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Punchy accusing ness of being scum could be distancing. I dont recall him even saying why he scumleaned ness but maybe I missed that post
Out of trundles list I want to look into evan the most
That's all I have time to say I have class for 4 hours now bye

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@toads I know punchy frequently uses AtE as town but he's never been pressured as scum so we wouldn't know if he also uses it as scum, is the thing. So AtE isnt really a good point to go off for townreading him imo
Like what I mean is you can't say "he only uses AtE as town, his scum games don't have AtE" when he had no reason to use AtE as scum
Ok now bye

the points about ness in jacob's reads and ness town reading him are interesting

From a PoE perspective Ness very well could be scum, but I'll have to look into his posts specifically later to see if there is a motive or agenda for anything

Out of the Jacob townreads I think Ness is most likely to be scum from a PoE and content basis. Not only was he avoiding Jacob, but Ness has been pretty under the radar and got into an early fight with Trundle.

While I agree punchy should go, I won't be surprised if he flips town. He's done a ton of scummy things but I still think his EoD 1 behavior belies scumhood. I am maybe 60% sure he's scum

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going to look at the compatibility of toads/ness

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may also iso ness

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N e s s said:

Im just gonna merge these RQS

What is your timezone and how active will you be?
CST and pretty active
Preferred pronouns and/or nicknames?
He/him and please type my username as Ness
Do you prefer being town or mafia?
Mafia
Guess the scum team:
Trundle, Jacob, Chele, Biancasbotique
Who would you fearkill N1?
Dolby, Toadsworthy, Jacob
Who can best read you/who can you read the best?
I can probably read Punchy, heyden, Rune and Evan the best. Toadsworthy can probably read me better than anyone here.
Do you think it's fair to read people based off their RQS answers?
Yeah some of these answers will be good to look back on later on in the game. The Guess-maf question might help later and maybe the fearkill one.

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Hmmm early scumread of trundle, Jacob, chele, and bianca for little reason...guess who Jacob read as town? Chele and Bianca...and scumread Trundle...could this be coordination and distancing on Ness and Jacob's reads perhaps?

N e s s said:

look out toads we're going to be called a team together

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Literally the first interaction between toads and ness in the game is Ness joking about being teamed with him due to voting similarly. Projection? I brushed it off as an obvious joke but you never know.

Does Ness usually like spamming in posts when he's scum? lol I'm looking too deeply into things but just a thought.

In this longer post, Ness goes into Jacob interactions/mentions, and sticks toads in his nulls

N e s s said:

Chele, tae, Toadsworthy, Evan, and I guess I'll have to reconsider Bianca if Punchy is town

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Ness lists the people to look into if Punchy is town here. Thing is I don't see any reasoning he throws these names together

N e s s said:

To be honest I'm starting to think things aren't adding up so clearly at the moment, something isn't right

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Don't get me wrong I kinda feel like Punchy's death is a necessity but I'm starting to think that everything isn't as it seems, Yoads has a point that everyone is being really quick to hop on this

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A mention of toads, piggybacking on his logic. Hmm. So it seems Ness and toads do not interact much at all with each other, heck barely even mentioning each other.

Overall the vibe I'm getting from Ness is that he tends to interact mainly through fighting with a particular person (Trundle, then Punchy), punctuated by snippets here and there interacting with others. But a strong majority of his posts revolve around Trundle and Punchy, which gives me slight pause on being gung ho for killing Punchy if we assume Ness is scum.

Toads mentioning or interacting with ness

toadsworthy said:

weird, but I'm not happy with you so far. I think calling out me and ness early like this is a scum dolby thing. Like it draws attention to people being vocal so that scum can blend in more by being less vocal

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To my knowledge this is toads' first mention of ness. Note how he's upset with dolby's call out on them both, and it turns out Dolby is town. I think this is a rather minor point though and it quickly got brushed aside

toadsworthy said:

I want to see more reads outside of ness by the end of the day though

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Spam oh that’s what ness is sayig

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Another quick mention, just asking trundle to give more reads aside from a ness read.

Toads does some ISOs of people in this longer post, notably leaving ness out. Though he really only focused on main town and scumleans (so in essence nulling Ness at this time)

Toads last mentioned ness in the post before mine actually, which is interesting:

toadsworthy said:

the points about ness in jacob's reads and ness town reading him are interesting

From a PoE perspective Ness very well could be scum, but I'll have to look into his posts specifically later to see if there is a motive or agenda for anything

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Floating the possibility of scum!ness, but only based on "PoE." Talking about PoE when there's still three scums left and plenty of townies?...lol. I'll be looking for your follow up on investigating Ness because I'd love to see you distance

I think more can be found in the toads/dolby fight; Dolby might have died because toads felt dolby was becoming more and more of a threat as Dolby turned on him. Though Toads addresses that here:

toadsworthy said:

If I'm scum and punchy is scum... why kill dolby? everyone by now knows what he was thinking, thats not gonna stop you guys from lynching the two of us. But in this world, why would I purposefully put myself in the middle of two of my scummates knowing I can't save one. With a whole game ahead of me, would that really be worth it? Also why would I align myself so closely to punchy and have him start saying that anyone who town reads him should be sus. If I'm going through all the trouble to fight off everyone on him, why allow him to say that.

If I'm scum and punchy is town, still why would I kill dolby? He was saying that I would be cleared if dolby came up town which I would know ahead of time and keep him to make me look better.

none of these scenarios make sense

If punchy is scum, ya'll are still gonna lynch me because of everything dolby said...

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I get the logic on the first part (toads and punchy both scum) but I really don't think his point on Toads scum/Punchy town makes any sense. If punchy says dolby flipping town would make him townread Toads, then why not kill dolby? unless Toads is concerned that punchy townreading him would lead to town scumreading toads.

Overall: Toads/Ness is a very likely scum pairing that we should prioritize after punchy dies. As I type this, I am reminded of another time Toads/Ness were a scumteam that I dug up, and I will attempt to find that game to put my finger on potential similarities between what they're doing now and what happened then. The only thing I can really say if one or both are town is that Ness has been rather unremarkable in his presence this game; a lot of people aren't really looking at him too closely. So that could be why toads hasn't said much to or about him.

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I realize I mentioned ness could be scum from PoE as well but I'm talking more specifically in the context of a town punchy world; idk where toads is coming from with his "PoE" point. Also, for someone who supposedly hates locking ourselves into PoE, why would he scumread ness off of PoE?

That’s because I’ve had to spend most my time defending my read on punchy or explaining myself... seeing as how we’re focused on killing punchy, I haven’t had time to move on.

What did you think of vanessa and my look at punchy meta? And the comparison

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And PoE is relevant once you get kills... so how we said unravel and trundle were among the first to sus and actively lead a jacob lynch, by PoE they are far less likely to be scum.

Nothing really sticks out to me from ness to have him fall into that category

update- i am on page 21 im getting there. ik i probs shouldnt read all of it but i feel like i'll miss something. also is it day or night

Dedenne2 said:

update- i am on page 21 im getting there. ik i probs shouldnt read all of it but i feel like i'll miss something. also is it day or night

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we're in the first 24 hours of day 2 rn! also hi ded : )

Evan I'm interested in why you only ISOd toads and ness' posts in relation to each other? Do you think one could be scum and one could be town? I guess I find it peculiar that you jumped straight to them as a pair.

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Because regardless of toads, I think ness's actions surrounding jacob (and Jacobs townlean of ness) are Sketch

mogyay said:

we're in the first 24 hours of day 2 rn! also hi ded : )

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ok thanks and hi mog : )

zzz is Rune here

i wonder if punchy has just given up lol

1 hour and 44 minutes until we could end this

this is still a shady lynch

Rune, if you’re willing to send the lynch now, I’ll end day early

punchy is strongman!