Mafia Jailbreak Mafia Game Thread - Game Over, Town Wins!

[toadsworthy]

I'm confident that between rosie and panda, rosie is scum. Punchy is huge ? though. But I mean he wants to come out the gates swinging with some bs

Turned into

@Toads Because Punchy's power was out? I absolutely see it. Inactivity in of itself doesn't equate to scum. And before you say "why are you FOSing me then", it's not activity in of itself. See post #446.

I had been saying 5 million times over at this point how punchy gave us nothing and I wasn't gonna lynch or sus him for anything (ruling him out from sus during our cell), but people just wanted to sit there and focus on me without even comprehending that punchy could be mafia in the slightest. You turned that into I was low-key sussing punchy for inactivity even though I validated his reason.... but it doesn't take away from it was frustrating to have him do nothing. You thinking you have to tell me "inactivity doesn't equal scum" just showed you weren't listening to me, and seemed more like you were picking on dumb things to build up a case against me or just piss me off.

So I did have an initial conversation.... but it just wasn't enough for you. So I did exactly what you said I should.... but I should've done more? with one person absent and my initial efforts being avoided or one-liner

turned into

You're saying it's okay to take someone's comment saying they don't want to contribute? Even if you don't find that scummy (I'm not saying it inherently is), why are you okay with that? Town literally lives and breathes off of contributions. It is in your best interest as a presumed town player to get people to contribute, even when they don't want to.

And conversation with Rosie died. There was no where to go with that line of thinking. So why not ask her to get a better feel for her thought process?

No one said they don't want to contribute... and if I had seen that I would think its scummy. Panda answered the question, but it was clear she didn't want to probe deeper, not necessarily avoidant, but just quicker than I thought, which didn't lend well to conversation. And rosie I don't think really answered the question at all and at this point she was starting to fire back with my "hunch on punchy" which I have explained why I thought that was weird.

So it was just like, I felt like you were taking everything I was saying way out of context and twisting it to make me look worse and worse, like some agenda

 

[Arstotzkan]

why the ef are people just giving punchy a pass for not saying a SINGLE WORD

@Toads Because Punchy's power was out? I absolutely see it. Inactivity in of itself doesn't equate to scum. And before you say "why are you FOSing me then", it's not activity in of itself. See post #446.

Toads, this is what I was replying to

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No one said they don't want to contribute... and if I had seen that I would think its scummy. Panda answered the question, but it was clear she didn't want to probe deeper, not necessarily avoidant, but just quicker than I thought, which didn't lend well to conversation. And rosie I don't think really answered the question at all and at this point she was starting to fire back with my "hunch on punchy" which I have explained why I thought that was weird.

Yeah, Panda never said "I don't want to contribute" flat out. Nor did Rosie. Or Punchy (he didn't say anything at all). But what I'm trying to say is that your efforts at starting a conversation were shut down. I don't get why you didn't try something new, a new line of questioning ("Well if you'd like to focus on the present, what do you think we should focus on Panda", or "Rosie, if you think my suspicion was lame, who would you focus on, in my shoes?"). There were ways to probe, and I have a hard time seeing someone who tries and then lets it go as a town move. It appears to me like it's mafia being like "welp I did my part".

 

[N e s s]

Hey gang sorry for inactivity I?ve had a bunch of important **** going on, I might be able to catch up soon enough

 

[Arstotzkan]

Context for this quote:

You: I'm an easy target
Me: Toads you're acting too noobish
You: Okay.
You: I am gud player

I am taking excerpts from each to make the point clear. However, if you think context is an issue, I'll quote the originals from all. I encourage yall to read it.

However you also very much know that I’m a mess on my best and worst days of mafia, so I feel like you are leaving all that all out, and focusing in on me to get a quick lynch.

You're really underplaying your own ability here, Toads. You've been underplaying yourself a lot in general. It's one of the secondary reasons why I'm FOSing you. You aren't a noob. Didn't you play as the IE in one of the noob games? Like. C'mon man. You've been around this community for a while. You aren't top tier, but you aren't by any means bottom tier either.

I honestly think you are trying to town lead so hard with this hahaha, because you know I'm the only one who could really challenge you. I think you are trying to play a game of chess by doing all this so quickly, by coming out swinging and now voting me you are essentially trying to make it so I can't vote for you because otherwise I just look like OMGUS...

He makes himself out to be a mess who is weak and capable of being taken advantage of. I tell him that he really isn't. He then makes the claim that he is the only one who can stop me. And when I probed him on that (disclaimer that his emotional state at the time certainly played into the reply), he replies with this:

Because I've already voiced that I thought you were suspicious, you told me to act more experienced. so here I am.

He literally admits to "acting more experienced" because I told him to. I think that is changing self-presentation to better reflect how other people(I) perceive him. I would call that scummy because why would town feel the need to change their persona to fit another person's wishes, especially someone they FOS.

 

[toadsworthy]

well I had said already that no one was even recognizing punchy as a potential target, it felt like people were giving him a pass for being inactive.... people were talking about panda and I for scum, but punchy just kept getting left out.

I had said it a few times before that but no one was even listening. So still twisting my words, because I was never scum reading punchy for inactivity... and I had said it 3 times, it just baffled me no one else was saying that he could be a potential scum

 

[Arstotzkan]

well I had said already that no one was even recognizing punchy as a potential target, it felt like people were giving him a pass for being inactive.... people were talking about panda and I for scum, but punchy just kept getting left out.

I had said it a few times before that but no one was even listening. So still twisting my words, because I was never scum reading punchy for inactivity... and I had said it 3 times, it just baffled me no one else was saying that he could be a potential scum

I don't think anyone was instantly clearing him. It's just impossible to make a read on a silent person. There isn't really much that could have been commented on for Punchy being scum, which is why I wager people didn't.

Also, I don't understand how it's a twisting of words. You're implying that I was like "KILL THE HEATHEN HE IS SCUM FOR THINKING WE SHOULDN'T LET PUNCHY OFF THE HOOK". That was never the case. I replied to your question, and I then clarified how it was different from the explanation I gave you for how I saw you as sus, because I thought that needed clarification. You were mentioning a lot how you felt like I was calling you scum for various inactivity things, and I know it wasn't directly related, but I felt like it still benefited from the clarification.

 

[PunchyTheCat]

is illunie rune

bc she's apparently in call the ships to port

 

[Arstotzkan]

is illunie rune

bc she's apparently in call the ships to port

old user but yeah

 

[toadsworthy]

is illunie rune

bc she's apparently in call the ships to port

wait illunie is runeraider?

 

[Aquari]

I'm back, gonna try to make a reads list. might take some time

Teabagel - So I mean your tone throughout the cell A phase was pretty much town you to a tea (lol that pun), but you seem really defensive all of sudden which I don't get because I don't think you've had too much pressure put on you. I also don't get why you are sticking up for me if you are scum, but whenever I'm scum I do that "Pocket-the-person-who-is-gonna-get-lynched-so-I-look-better-when-they-die" thing all the effing time.

Could you explain why/how I seem defensive?

 

[Arstotzkan]

I've been making a big boi post on Toads, and I re-read day 2. And honestly? Toads tried. Legitimately. I think it was my frustration at the lack of posts in that day that came up as that. Toads, I'm sorry, that wasn't a legit point. I still SR him, but my reasoning there was bad. I do think you were awful hasty with Rosie still. I don't read her as scum at all.

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I'm going to preface this by saying that no matter how much I think you're scum toads, I do think you're a lovely person. I know feeling misheard sucks. Regardless of your alignment, I do care about not making you not miserable, and I know not understanding why you're being suspected feels frustrating as ****.

Alright, so this is gonna have random thoughts I have about Toads in it. Spoiler is actual content, headers are a brief synopsis. I'll make a read posts after a little break, long posts are effort bois

Synopsis of previous thoughts

Spoiler

• He's underplayed himself a lot. He makes himself out to be an easy target when he really isn't. He's definitely an emotional person, and if I were to be "taking advantage of his easiness" or whatever, I'd be calling him out on his emotional outbursts or something. But more on that below the synopsis. I feel he is taking less responsibility so that people will not pressure him as intensely.
• He shifted his "experience level" to match my beliefs when I called him out. I don't see town doing that.
• Getting him to state an opinion on who he'd like lynched today was more difficult than I felt like it had any right to be. Not committing ensures that he can't be pressed on his opinion, good for maf.

His emotional outburst isn't alignment indicative

Spoiler

I think toads was very emotional. I think that emotion is honest. But I suspect that emotion didn't come from my one post. I feel awful that I made you upset, but especially based on your next line saying this conversation was making you puke, I don't think that was the primary trigger. I think it was the culmination of feeling like you weren't getting anywhere with your defenses, a frustration that I feel would come up as both town or scum. So I consider this emotion spin on things as neutral, alignment tell wise. Toads, if that emotional outburst was fake, then that was kind of an awful thing to do. It's in the name of the game I guess, but I do want to recommend you not do that in the future. It's kind of a grey moral move. That last bit said - I think it was authentic. I just want to get that preface out there in case it wasn't.

Miscell Reads thoughts

Spoiler

I also don't get why you are sticking up for me if you are scum, but whenever I'm scum I do that "Pocket-the-person-who-is-gonna-get-lynched-so-I-look-better-when-they-die" thing all the effing time.

You are giving tea a lot of credit for a new player. I don't think that's a valid perspective at all.

The way you've stacked your FOSs in your reads also makes little sense from your disambiguation in trying to figure out which cells got it right. Your priorities are Cell A, Cell C, Cell A, then Cell B? When you sound like you were kind of eh between her and Punchy, whereas you felt the other two lynches were scummy [x] [x]? I don't get your logic here.

His process in FOSing me was suspect

Spoiler

Spoiler: Quotes in Question

Who do you want as the lynch, Toads?

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Given what you know

In cell A, I was between ilunie and Kat, but I don?t think I would get anywhere with that... tea?s recent posts are weird, but I don?t know why a scum tea would be trying to stick up for someone as sunk as I appear to be. So not anyone from cell A

~snipped for brevity~

Gimme one person Toads

Fine you, I think you overwrought the whole mediator perspective during your phase. Being very careful to appear like you are going to each person and looking/organizing their input, when that is very much your scum meta. Hard to nail that down though because it is very town-oriented of a move, but you?re obviously good enough to pull that off.

You?re also a good enough player to confidently come flying into this phase and lead a quick lynch on me. However you also very much know that I?m a mess on my best and worst days of mafia, so I feel like you are leaving all that all out, and focusing in on me to get a quick lynch. My cell was messy, but like given the circumstances I don?t think I was out of line in my pressure and thought process. Also you?re reasoning for all this was ?you were excited at the start and I expected you to pressure the people in your cell. You did that, but not enough? is a dumb reason to scumlean me.... I did what you say I should do, but it?s like not enough? Idk how much else one can get from someone who just does one liners, someone giving scum vibes, and someone not even there. So I think it?s funny that you went from mediator in phase 1 to pointing a major finger at me right away, not really focusing on anything else. If you were actually concerned about mediating I feel like you would have continued to get more input from all people (especially cell c) right now, but instead you have directed almost all of your attention at me

Scum mommy slipping up, because her appetite for town blood was so strong she wanted to just lynch this little mushroom

His change in tone here was incredibly noticeable. He was very hesitant between me and ilumnie, but then his tone changed to much more confident, especially in that last post. There was one post between his final FOS and "scum mommy", and that post was unrelated (Tea was answering some questions). I don't think town gets that confident that quickly. There's also his read on Maddie:

I've posted what I thought about maddie and you from that cell. I thought Maddie sounded like an awkward panicked mafia most the time, and then she kinda tails pinned at the end to get kinda emotional which also reads new scum. The way she talked it was very forward, but then she tried to come across like a new player at times.... it was really strange

whereas this is his feelings on his own cell's lynch:

I was not fully convinced she was scum, because Punchy was literally nonexistent, but I wasn't gonna vote an inactive... and between Rosie who was feeding me all this bs and Panda who came out talking pretty confident, it was no brainer to vote rosie. I do want Panda to keep talking to help me convince myself that wasn't a bad choice. But I feel like I'm getting targeted for my cell because I actually played the game vs everyone else was avoidant. So you can all stand on the outside and say I'm scummy and Rosie looked town. But it sure af didn't feel like that and I don't think anyone would've reacted differently.

It sounds like there was a lot more doubt in Rosie than there was in Maddie. Which I'm not blaming you for. I agree. But when why focus on the cell you think has a higher chance of having lynched correctly than the ambiguous cell?

"Reaction Test"

Spoiler

I alluded to this but I don't think I've fully explained myself

but i have a hunchy that its gonna be punchy. I'm psychic

This is a meme answer. Absolutely fine. I don't see this is a reaction test like what Toads later claimed.

but also toad why do u have a hunch about punchy being scum like u said before?? how?s that much different to me placing a ?temporary? vote on them

It was a hunch two posts in, no backing behind it.... kind of a reaction to see if anyone else lad kinda bandwagons with it :eyes:

it was kinda like a reaction test to see if anyone would jump on it... and it looks like someone did

This feels like trying to make something intellectual and cute out of a RQS answer. There isn't much Toads can say to this point, but this felt like he was making himself out to be Big Brain.

 

[toadsworthy]

*yawn*

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I'm back, gonna try to make a reads list. might take some time




Could you explain why/how I seem defensive?

I ISO-ed your posts and you seemed defensive, at the end of your cell moreso not recently, so I apologize for saying it was "all of a sudden"... I actually think your reaction to punchy's realization is genuine

 

[Aquari]

Geoni said it first.

Anyway now that you know does that change your opinion of him? What do you think now?

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Also theres light hearted banter and then flaming each other. Just cut it out. Youre both clogging up the thread with insults anyway.

*yawn*

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I ISO-ed your posts and you seemed defensive, at the end of your cell moreso not recently, so I apologize for saying it was "all of a sudden"... I actually think your reaction to punchy's realization is genuine

Ah alright, Which of my posts in particular seemed defensive?

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what the heck? why is that first quote there? ignore that top quote!

 

[toadsworthy]

I think you are still making vast assumptions and misconstruing things.

He shifted his "experience level" to match my beliefs when I called him out. I don't see town doing that.

I made a joke because I was getting frustrated more and more with you, so me saying "I'm an experienced player now" or whatever I said was more of a jest. Bad joke, but yeah I was getting pissed. I don't know what "shifting experience" even means or looks like, and if you can bring up valid examples of me playing stupid vs playing experienced then fine thats valid.... but I don't think I've done that, I've literally had to be even keeled and defend myself because as always, people jump down my throat and I have to over explain myself.

He's underplayed himself a lot. He makes himself out to be an easy target when he really isn't. He's definitely an emotional person, and if I were to be "taking advantage of his easiness" or whatever, I'd be calling him out on his emotional outbursts or something. But more on that below the synopsis. I feel he is taking less responsibility so that people will not pressure him as intensely.

I said it kinda seemed like you were taking the things I was saying out of context and treating me unfairly by saying things like "inactivity doesn't equal scum" to me out of context.

Getting him to state an opinion on who he'd like lynched today was more difficult than I felt like it had any right to be. Not committing ensures that he can't be pressed on his opinion, good for maf.

I quite frankly gave you my pick, it was you because you I felt like you played mediator and all fences. My priority was reading cell C and when I did that I gave my whole reads. No one else has done that, and no one else has given their pick. Thats because you haven't asked them, I bet if you stopped tunneling me and asked others, they too would also be hard pressed to give an answer.

I didn't want to FOS you back and my pick up of confidence was because I didn't want to come across as just OMGUS, even though I had said in my Cell that I thought you were suspect. You basically had me in a corner and I knew if I had said anything back it would've just been OMGUS.... however that was the time I started really not giving a ****, so I said I'm probably getting lynched and so I'll be damned if I just let you walk all over me

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Ah alright, Which of my posts in particular seemed defensive?

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what the heck? why is that first quote there? ignore that top quote!

these ones i had starred

Idk, I'm not buying it. Something about it just seems off. If he wanted "consistent" pressure then why wouldnt he ask questions like you were doing? He just slapped on a vote and called it a day.

At this point im almost fully confident in liam being scum.

This and idk why you were so confident in liam being scum, because I highly doubt he is

Gonna post my "reads" list, though not at extravagant and intellectual as kat's but its how im feeling as of now with everything thats going on (It's still a WIP though obviously):

idk why you were low-key defensive about your reads before you posted them.

And why would you need to convince me of anything, seems kinda like a scum move to try to manipulate a newer player to do your bidding,,,

What ilunie said was out of line for this, but I thought your response was a little sharp

 

[PandaDarling]

uhhhh.... guys i'm sorry i didn't really get around to catching up with the thread and i apologize.... i ended up baking a bunch of gingerbread men..... forgive me please.

 

[radical6]

Toad can you further expand your logic on Panda. I talked about it in my last post.

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You have like. I think 20 hours left Panda. Should be fine.

 

[Aquari]

Fair enough i guess, toad. Anyways heres me reads/opinion list for now. again its WIP

Toad- Scumlean. I kinda thought you were town(ish) at first but your recent posts/convo with arstotskan seems SO defensive and it just comes across TO ME as nervous scum or scum that just doesnt care anymore...

Arstotskan- Townlean. I havent spotted anything sus and it seems like theyre trying their best to extract info out of everyone. (could be a scum move though to lead town astray but i dont think thats whats going on, idk im dum.)

antonio- Like i said before, him pressuring radical about her question about scum knowing eachother seemed really unecessary and i honestly think he was just blowing it way out of proportion to see if anyone else would run along with it and get rad lynched, not to mention he dropped all that REAL quick once Ness made a defense for rad which i thought was pretty darn strange.

pandadarling- Neutral, I havent been able to pick up anything from their posts...

punchy- townlean. I got no scummyness from their posts at all and they made some darn solid points in their post about toad

 

[radical6]

So far votes have been for Kat and Toad and I'm more inclined to vote for toad atn unless another option pops up

Maybe Panda because theres not much to go off of and I feel like she couldve just been ignoring the thread since Toad townread her for..a not so logical reason?

 

[PandaDarling]

So far votes have been for Kat and Toad and I'm more inclined to vote for toad atn unless another option pops up

Maybe Panda because theres not much to go off of and I feel like she couldve just been ignoring the thread since Toad townread her for..a not so logical reason?

That’s a bad reason to be suspicious of someone, just sayin.

 

[Geoni]

Current Votecount

toadsworthy (1): Astrotzkan
Astrotzkan (1): Toadsworthy

With plurality in effect, toadsworthy is set to be lynched. You have 8 hours and 10 minutes to vote before day 4 ends at 9pm EST on Tuesday the 10th.