LGBTQA - Discussion and support.

[seliph]

This gives me a whole new perspective. I'm not asexual, but I don't view and participate in romance the same way many people do. Although, I'm not opposed to being in a relationship and actually would like to be in one some day, I sometimes feel like I could be a-romantic because the relationship is only for someone else's company and to have someone to share inside jokes with, etc. Basically a best friend you exclusively "have fun" with.
Anyway, when I was at a summer therapy sanctuary like plae - and heard some of my acquaintance-friends (somewhere in the middle) talking about the LGBT group, I was excited and pleasantly surprised and went: "I wanna join!!!"
They were like "are you any of those letters?"
I said "well no....but half my best friends are"
"Then you don't need to be in the group. and friends aren't enough to justify"
I was like "ohh..okay :c"
I felt like it was the same as me being in a Minority/Black student union and was telling a non-black person that they couldn't join :/
But hearing what Gyro said really gave me a new perspective.

Being asexual means you aren't sexually attracted to people, it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with your romantic life.
That being said I'm glad you changed your mind, straight people being in LGBT spaces makes a lot of us feel unsafe and like we can't speak about our issues with straight people because of them being there.

I'm really conflicted with this because people on the asexual spectrum DO face a lot of discrimination - try telling an older relative you don't want children or a partner and see how they react. People get angry because aros and aces aren't "normal" in their eyes, and that they need to be "fixed" with the right relationship or whatever. So they definitely do face real problems - but on the other hand if they are otherwise cisgender and heterosexual, then I mean...that's inherently not LGBTQ by default. I'm not sure what to think.

We can all agree aro and ace people do face some prejudices and some horrible ones at that, however as bad as it is it still doesn't make them an oppressed group.

 

[Brookie]

Being asexual means you aren't sexually attracted to people, it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with your romantic life.

I meant a-romantic, Gyro (for myself)

 

[Dogemon]

I'm really conflicted with this because people on the asexual spectrum DO face a lot of discrimination - try telling an older relative you don't want children or a partner and see how they react. People get angry because aros and aces aren't "normal" in their eyes, and that they need to be "fixed" with the right relationship or whatever. So they definitely do face real problems - but on the other hand if they are otherwise cisgender and heterosexual, then I mean...that's inherently not LGBTQ by default. I'm not sure what to think.

I say I don't want kids all the time and I am pansexual lol, that isn't really just an ace/aro thing. An occasional snide comment about dating isn't the same as being beaten for being gay, see the difference here? People also don't get disgusted with an aromantic guy/girl having dinner in a restaurant like they do a gay/lesbian couple. Not to say aces/aros don't​ get crap for being themselves, but it is far less common/severe.

 

[seliph]

Asking for a friend who's gonna see a doctor about transitioning in a bit: Anyone know what they should expect?

Gonna add that they are trans friendly so there's no worries about that

 

[pawpatrolbab]

Asking for a friend who's gonna see a doctor about transitioning in a bit: Anyone know what they should expect?

Depends on the doctor really

 

[faelien]

Asking for a friend who's gonna see a doctor about transitioning in a bit: Anyone know what they should expect?

Gonna add that they are trans friendly so there's no worries about that

I've heard rumors of doctors being "trans friendly" but still holding back hormones because the patient won't completely conform to their gender standards, so hopefully your friend doesn't experience that. I've personally not tried to seen a doctor about transitioning so I don't know tbh. Hope it all goes easy and good tho!

 

[seliph]

I was moreso asking what the doctor will ask or talk about, stuff like that. Shouldda been more clear on that bit.

 

[Dogemon]

I was moreso asking what the doctor will ask or talk about, stuff like that. Shouldda been more clear on that bit.

From what one of my friends told me in the past, they usually ask things like what their desired end point is to look like, both realistically and non-realistically. Other than that, it was mostly general health questions and discussing the side effects of hormone treatments and what options would be feasible and which would be best for their specific needs etc.

 

[toonafeesh]

I'm kinda late with this post but I hope no one minds me butting into the aro/ace talk! I identify as both aro/ace (tbh I'm still questioning my orientation imsoconfusedrn, but for now I think the aro/ace spectrum fits me best) so I'd like to give my two cents on this. And excuse me if I do sound a bit bias or like a Straight Ally™, or if I completely miss the point @_@

I personally view them in the same area as cishets. They both are typically straight.

Aces can be straight, but aros aren't really straight? We don't experience romantic attraction to any gender, so I wouldn't group aros with straights-- but I'm mostly talking about people who are both..aro/ace lol. I hope that makes sense. I mean yeah, someone could be a male who's aromantic but heterosexual which makes them straight..

I'm really conflicted with this because people on the asexual spectrum DO face a lot of discrimination - try telling an older relative you don't want children or a partner and see how they react. People get angry because aros and aces aren't "normal" in their eyes, and that they need to be "fixed" with the right relationship or whatever. So they definitely do face real problems - but on the other hand if they are otherwise cisgender and heterosexual, then I mean...that's inherently not LGBTQ by default. I'm not sure what to think.

Being asexual means you aren't sexually attracted to people, it doesn't necessarily have anything to do with your romantic life.
That being said I'm glad you changed your mind, straight people being in LGBT spaces makes a lot of us feel unsafe and like we can't speak about our issues with straight people because of them being there.

We can all agree aro and ace people do face some prejudices and some horrible ones at that, however as bad as it is it still doesn't make them an oppressed group.

From my experience I don't get much discrimination since not many people know that I'm aro/ace, and I don't think other aro and ace people face much discrimination either? I'm assuming majority of the world don't even know that these identities even exist. And I think that's where some of the 'discrimination' comes from - that our identities aren't valid. I think that's as far as it goes; I know it's nowhere near as bad as the LGBT community.

But anyway, I don't really think there's an urgent need for A peeps to be included in LGBT spaces. I mean, it's really nice to be included but personally I don't like seeing people making a big deal out of it.

However I did attend a Mardi Gras parade with my bi friend, she asked me to go with her because atm I think I'm her only friend who knows she's bi and feels comfortable talking about it with me. There was an asexual float WHICH MADE ME SUPER HAPPY LIKE WOAH WE EXIST and it's just.. nice to be included? But if there wasn't an ace float I wouldn't be bummed out at all. I'd totally go to a gay bar with her too if she wants to meet people, but as an aroace I don't have any reason to go by myself. Of course I can't speak for straight aro/ace people.

Again, I'm sorry if my post missed the point or went in circles.. uhh tl;dr: please don't group all aces/aros with Straight™ people and I don't think it's important to include aces/aros in LGBT spaces since we don't face as much oppression as others. It's nice to be included, but it does feel a bit out of place/intrusive.

 

[visibleghost]

out of curiosity, what is everyone's opinions on cishet aces/aro/aroaces being in LGBT spaces? i dont mean this thread, but i mean places like gay bars, pride, joining lgbt support groups, etc?

cishets are cishets
if youre aro ace and cis youre cis but not straight, but you still dont "qualify" as lgbtq imo, tho youre obviously not straight.
the aro/ace community needs a space and i get why it has been included in the community bc it's considered weird to be aro/ace But ??? if youre straight and cis youre not lgbtq.....

im aromantic and asexual myself which means that im not straight but that doesnt mean my orientation makes me lgbt. to me my sexual and romantic identity isnt a big deal and i dont feel like lgbtq spaces are the place id want to discuss aro ace stuff, i'd rather do it in a seperate aro ace community (tho the ace community everywhere Suxz) or in autism lr trauma related spaces bc my sexuality is closely linked to those things

i view it the same way as other things that are looked down upon like poly or w/e. poly ppl can be lgbtq and there is an overlap between the communities but being poly doesnt automatically make you lgbtq.

I'm really conflicted with this because people on the asexual spectrum DO face a lot of discrimination - try telling an older relative you don't want children or a partner and see how they react. People get angry because aros and aces aren't "normal" in their eyes, and that they need to be "fixed" with the right relationship or whatever. So they definitely do face real problems - but on the other hand if they are otherwise cisgender and heterosexual, then I mean...that's inherently not LGBTQ by default. I'm not sure what to think.

thats not "aphobia" tho. many of the bad things ace ppl face are more linked to other issues imo it's usually not about aro/ace, more just "everyone wants children" attitude, gender stereotypes, in some cases ableism etc.
obviously aro and ace people arent 100% acceptef but no one is murdered for being ace and i think we need seperate communities (that obviously can overlap, they just need to not be the same community)

Asking for a friend who's gonna see a doctor about transitioning in a bit: Anyone know what they should expect?

Gonna add that they are trans friendly so there's no worries about that

when i went to a trans team around uuhh 6 months ago i filled in a bunch of papers and forms and "how much do u hate ur body" things. they were really binary and the doctor was Really Cis. the psychologist wasnt as bad but everything was very binary and a question was literally "do you sexually behave like a man or a woman?" which was... interesting.
For me the entire thing was really frustrating and annoying. They implied that i'm not Really trans because i'm at a point where i don't blame myself for what's "wrong" with my gender, instead i blame society Lel so obviously im cis -__-

in my case the doctor wasnt there a lot (i mostly met the psychologist) she was only there the first and last time. she talked about what they could help w and whatever but if you read about transition online for ten minutes you definitely get more information than i got from her. the only useful thing i got from it was that i learnt how it works with transition things there (like time things, legal things, when they let people get on hormones and stuff like that. the information about what happens to the body when you get on hormones wasnt very detailed but i knew everything already so that was not a problem.)

i didnt go further than that bc we decided that it's not a good time to start doing stuff and i am ok with my gender identity as it is (most of my gender identity is about social gender also im a dissociative mess so my concept of myself has been extremely blurry the last year-ish) so i stopped going there and havent started any kind of physical transition so idk what happens next lol.

I'm kinda late with this post but I hope no one minds me butting into the aro/ace talk! I identify as both aro/ace (tbh I'm still questioning my orientation imsoconfusedrn, but for now I think the aro/ace spectrum fits me best) so I'd like to give my two cents on this. And excuse me if I do sound a bit bias or like a Straight Ally™, or if I completely miss the point @_@

Aces can be straight, but aros aren't really straight? We don't experience romantic attraction to any gender, so I wouldn't group aros with straights-- but I'm mostly talking about people who are both..aro/ace lol. I hope that makes sense. I mean yeah, someone could be a male who's aromantic but heterosexual which makes them straight..

From my experience I don't get much discrimination since not many people know that I'm aro/ace, and I don't think other aro and ace people face much discrimination either? I'm assuming majority of the world don't even know that these identities even exist. And I think that's where some of the 'discrimination' comes from - that our identities aren't valid. I think that's as far as it goes; I know it's nowhere near as bad as the LGBT community.
But anyway, I don't really think there's an urgent need for A peeps to be included in LGBT spaces. I mean, it's really nice to be included but personally I don't like seeing people making a big deal out of it.
However I did attend a Mardi Gras parade with my bi friend, she asked me to go with her because atm I think I'm her only friend who knows she's bi and feels comfortable talking about it with me. There was an asexual float WHICH MADE ME SUPER HAPPY LIKE WOAH WE EXIST and it's just.. nice to be included? But if there wasn't an ace float I wouldn't be bummed out at all. I'd totally go to a gay bar with her too if she wants to meet people, but as an aroace I don't have any reason to go by myself. Of course I can't speak for straight aro/ace people.
Again, I'm sorry if my post missed the point or went in circles.. uhh tl;dr: please don't group all aces/aros with Straight™ people and I don't think it's important to include aces/aros in LGBT spaces since we don't face as much oppression as others. It's nice to be included, but it does feel a bit out of place/intrusive.

yo im aroace too and i think that obviously if you arent attracted to anyone in any way youre not straight. i'm not straight and i don't accept people calling me straight, however i know i dont have the same problems as people whose sexual identities are lgbq and stufffff.

i think we definitely need a community but not in the lgbt community. i dont mind people bringing ace and aro stuff up at pride but i think it should be done like how being black or any other non white race or living w a disability are brought into pride or other lgbt events.

But another thing uhhh idk how to put this but cis aroaces dont personally experience lgbt hate so they can be Woke Af but still be a "cishet" (as in expressing the typical cishet ignorance, not knowing what it's like, not understanding etc.) obviously aro ace people aren't straight but, like, cis aroaces can still have the Cis Straight Mindset. idk

 

[toonafeesh]

Oh yeah you're definitely right, I didn't think about the whole Cis Straight Mindset thing lol. I definitely agree with that, and.. pretty much everything you said 8'D

Yeah most of the aro and/or ace people I know don't like making a big deal of it either, like they don't feel the need to be included in LGBT spaces

 

[cornimer]

out of curiosity, what is everyone's opinions on cishet aces/aro/aroaces being in LGBT spaces? i dont mean this thread, but i mean places like gay bars, pride, joining lgbt support groups, etc?

As a panromantic ace who used to think they were a hetero-romantic ace, I personally find it a bit bothersome when people want to exclude aces from LGBT+ things. I completely understand that aces will never face the same struggles as other LGBT+ groups, but we certainly aren't accepted either. Personally, I think my mom would be more understanding if I were gay than she is of me being ace. There are still a lot of people who think we don't exist or are fakers, and excluding us from LGBT+ stuff wouldn't really be helping with that...

It also irritates me greatly when people group cishet aces with straight people. Even when I identified as a het ace I did not consider myself straight. Being straight involves having sexual attraction to the opposite gender. If asexuals do not experience sexual attraction, how can we be considered straight?

Again, I know that other LGBT+ members have a much, much harder time and it is much easier and safer to pass through society as an ace, but when it comes to having to figure out ourselves, relationships and our place in an over-sexualized world, aces still do face struggles and it would nice to not be written off by everyone.

I'm sorry if I offended anyone this is just my opinion

 

[Bowie]

I feel like it's important to let everybody into the circle. We're all after the same very basic things: freedom, equality, and acceptance, and I feel like it's a matter of "the more the merrier", to be honest. If we want these things, we need to stand together as one and help each other. Pushing people out only makes us seem like the prejudice.

 

[seliph]

As a panromantic ace who used to think they were a hetero-romantic ace, I personally find it a bit bothersome when people want to exclude aces from LGBT+ things. I completely understand that aces will never face the same struggles as other LGBT+ groups, but we certainly aren't accepted either. Personally, I think my mom would be more understanding if I were gay than she is of me being ace. There are still a lot of people who think we don't exist or are fakers, and excluding us from LGBT+ stuff wouldn't really be helping with that...

It also irritates me greatly when people group cishet aces with straight people. Even when I identified as a het ace I did not consider myself straight. Being straight involves having sexual attraction to the opposite gender. If asexuals do not experience sexual attraction, how can we be considered straight?

Again, I know that other LGBT+ members have a much, much harder time and it is much easier and safer to pass through society as an ace, but when it comes to having to figure out ourselves, relationships and our place in an over-sexualized world, aces still do face struggles and it would nice to not be written off by everyone.

I'm sorry if I offended anyone this is just my opinion

Cishet ace people are het whether they like it or not. It's not fair to claim "straight aces don't exist", but then not deny gay aces, or bi aces, or pan aces. Straight is in the same boat here. It doesn't disappear just because "ace" is after it. Being straight doesn't mean you have to have sex, it just means you are only attracted to the opposite gender, which cishet aces are.

I'm repeating myself and others here but: While aces get some **** handed to them but it's different than other LGBT people. Aces are not systematically oppressed. You won't be denied a job or denied marriage or be kicked out for being ace. You probably won't be murdered either. I don't understand why aces want to be included in LGBT spaces so bad, as if it's just a cool kids club when they don't face any of these things.

I don't deny aces need some form of support and perhaps a community, but as VG said, it doesn't have to be the LGBT community.

It seems to me that the biggest problem cishet aces face is lack of visibility and while yes you guys should get recognition, it doesn't have to be through the LGBT community. I don't know why ace people are so hung up about the LGBT community including them when we don't have to for you guys to be visible and taken seriously.

I feel like it's important to let everybody into the circle. We're all after the same very basic things: freedom, equality, and acceptance, and I feel like it's a matter of "the more the merrier", to be honest. If we want these things, we need to stand together as one and help each other. Pushing people out only makes us seem like the prejudice.

Cishet aces basically already have freedom and equality and acceptance. The only problem they have is some people don't believe that they don't like to bang people and I hardly see that as a problem as it is.

 

[riummi]

Yoikes this makes me so confused so I guess i'll stay out of this thread even though I did want to at least be a bit of a part of it

 

[Esphas]

lgbt people aren't accepted by cishets so they need that community
ace people are accepted so they don't need the community
i'm a cis gay male and i don't care if they're excluded or not personally because i'm not involved with the community but i can see why they wouldn't want ace people joining them for no reason

 

[tumut]

I really wish there was a different symbol for LBGT because honestly the rainbow **** is so gross

 

[Ghost Soda]

I won't speak for anyone else on this but I personally don't mind including ace and/or aros in LGBTQIA+/MOGAI, tbh.

 

[seliph]

lgbt people aren't accepted by cishets so they need that community
ace people are accepted so they don't need the community
i'm a cis gay male and i don't care if they're excluded or not personally because i'm not involved with the community but i can see why they wouldn't want ace people joining them for no reason

My confusion is what can LGBT communities actually do for them other than say "yeah you exist", which we can already do without having them in our support groups and stuff? What else do cishet aces need support for?

 

[moonford]

I think asexual people and aromantic people should be included in the LGBT+ community, because I believe the community is about comforting minority sexualities, gender identities and so on. The LGBT+ community should be accepting of all the minority identities and sexualities with open arms even if they don't suffer nearly as badly as gay or trans people.

The community is about mutual understanding, respect and love so I don't think it's right to exclude asexual and aromantic people from that, even if they don't suffer like gay and trans people. I just repeated myself but I feel like it was necessary here.