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Kidding. But really, they're antiquated as heck. Gender roles are just behaviors imposed on a person from the time they're born based on nothing but their birth sex. We now know gender can vary so widely, and that these roles are cannot be boxed up like we've been doing. People vary so vastly, and that's what's great about us. Truly no two people are the exact same, and our interests are so different from each other. So, I think it's just silly to have roles imposed on people based on the way they present themselves. I also believe it's incredibly harmful to us long-term. We're lucky to see these stereotypes slowly being done away with today.
Typical gender roles include:
masculine people "dont cry", that they're analytical, indepedent, and blunt.
feminine people are "overly emotional", nurturing, and home-oriented.
Not only are there people who just don't fit into the box of masc/fem, but saying someone shouldn't show emotion or that their emotions are "over the top" is inherently harmful. Children understand the concept of stereotyped gender very early on in development (before 2 years old!), and I hope we continue on the trend we're on now, doing away with old gender stereotypes.
I don't understand why the way a household is run needs to be based on gender at all, though. Wouldn't it be make more sense to base things off of everyone's individual skills/preferences/etc.? And how would that work for households with same-gender couples?
I see what you're saying. Although those things (skills/preference/etc) can still be the forefront of a household even if gender roles are utilitzed.
When I say gender roles, I don't mean man works, woman does everything else. I mean the psychological/parenting stuff- such as the mother helping their children become emotionally intelliegnt, whereas fathers are often better at teaching logic-based skills. Of course these roles can be flipped, shared, and aren't the same for every home. I'm just going off what I've learned about sociology and human behavior.
As for same-gender households, I'm not too sure. I don't have the knowledge to stake a proper opinion. Anyone who I've met that was in a same-gender relationship appears to just go with with the flow. One just takes on feminine duties and the other masculine out of what they feel comfortable with. Once again, sociological preference.
As someone who is female and has never wanted kids, I also hate gender roles because some people like to try to act like your life is pointless if you are able to have children and do not.
Umm, sorry. I did not have a childhood because I was pretty much forced to raise my siblings as if I was their parent. I am not giving up my adulthood too. I don't care who thinks I'm selfish. I don't exist just to be a baby making machine, sorry. There are more than enough humans in the world anyway.
I see what you're saying. Although those things (skills/preference/etc) can still be the forefront of a household even if gender roles are utilitzed.
When I say gender roles, I don't mean man works, woman does everything else. I mean the psychological/parenting stuff- such as the mother helping their children become emotionally intelliegnt, whereas fathers are often better at teaching logic-based skills. Of course these roles can be flipped, shared, and aren't the same for every home. I'm just going off what I've learned about sociology and human behavior.
As for same-gender households, I'm not too sure. I don't have the knowledge to stake a proper opinion. Anyone who I've met that was in a same-gender relationship appears to just go with with the flow. One just takes on feminine duties and the other masculine out of what they feel comfortable with. Once again, sociological preference.
I am very confused by your message as you seem to be almost contradicting yourself in it? You say that you don't mean gender roles but then your examples go on to feed into gender stereotypes - women are better suited for the "caring" roll whereas fathers are better suited for "logical" roles. Hm, where have I heard that before?
Those "roles" can obviously be flipped, shared, and aren't the same for every home because those roles have nothing to do with gender. I come from a single parent household. Single father. As such when I was younger he took on both the "masculine" and "feminine" duties because guess what? They're. All. Just. Jobs. They aren't gendered. What are, "feminine duties" in your opinion and what are "masculine duties"? Cooking, cleaning, and caring for children are often deemed, "feminine" but that's just parenting. That's just caring for a household. People threw those duties on women back in 1928 because those were daily tasks that needed to be done and women didn't work. Men decided that mowing the lawn and shoveling the driveway were, "masculine" for whatever reason (probably because it took a bit more strength to shovel and doing either of those while wearing an ankle length dress with a petticoat is much harder than doing it in pants), same with taking out the garbage. Those aren't actually masculine duties, they're just jobs that need to be done and they would get done even if there was no man or "masculine person" in the house.
Sorry if I've come across as rude, but it's tiring. I'm a lesbian. My girlfriend and I aren't going to split household chores one way because she presents more masculinely than I do - that's ridiculous. There are plenty of same sex couples where there isn't somebody who appears more masculine or feminine than the other, too. People are just people. Household jobs are just jobs. Making certain jobs out to be more masculine or feminine than the other is sexist and demeaning.
I come from a single parent household. Single father. As such when I was younger he took on both the "masculine" and "feminine" duties because guess what? They're. All. Just. Jobs. They aren't gendered.
This always blew my mind. So if cleaning and cooking and laundry are deemed women's jobs, then what happens to single guys living on their own? Are they just going to live in a dump wearing dirty clothes and eating nothing? No, because those are just typical jobs that aren't gendered.
I don’t know why it matters. Different cultures value different things for different reasons so why would I care if some liked them or preferred them and others didn’t it makes no sense. We can’t force everyone to believe what we want them to and force them to comply with what we want. If you’re a girl and you want to watch diy shows in some sports team merch then you do you and if you’re a boy and want to wear a skirt and play with a dollhouse then you do you. I don’t care about that I dress how I want and so should you just don’t tell each other how to think either. I am bisexual and got far more hurtful behaviour towards me about that than what my hobbies and interests are and all of them were not typically male hobbies. You let gender define you if you deliberately rebel against it just as much as if you believe it does define you. Just do what feels natural and right to you and forget what everyone else is doing or what they say to you.
I see what you're saying. Although those things (skills/preference/etc) can still be the forefront of a household even if gender roles are utilitzed.
When I say gender roles, I don't mean man works, woman does everything else. I mean the psychological/parenting stuff- such as the mother helping their children become emotionally intelliegnt, whereas fathers are often better at teaching logic-based skills. Of course these roles can be flipped, shared, and aren't the same for every home. I'm just going off what I've learned about sociology and human behavior.
As for same-gender households, I'm not too sure. I don't have the knowledge to stake a proper opinion. Anyone who I've met that was in a same-gender relationship appears to just go with with the flow. One just takes on feminine duties and the other masculine out of what they feel comfortable with. Once again, sociological preference.
i think its worth noting that while there are studies showing gender differences between tasks, they seem to relate to how the child is raised and not due to biological differences (it seems that society trains and reinforces these differences from birth pretty much). parents/teachers/peers spend extra time rewarding/training certain traits based on gender (one way these stereotypes persist). for example, playing with toy blocks as a child may improve spatial reasoning, and encouraging children to develop their vocabulary and have meaningful and emotional conversations can improve communication and emotional intelligence. too lazy to pull relevant data atm (please forgive me lol) but if you have a child practice certain skills or expose them to certain environments, they will be influenced by them. i hope this makes sense, sorry im pretty bad at explaining things. people do have biological differences, but from what i have studied, enculturation and epigenetics (changes in your biology as a result of exposure to things in your environment) seem to be the the root of these perceived gender differences and not XX is better at caregiving than XY (for example)
just wanted to add that i agree it is harmful for children to be raised according to gender roles instead of allowing them to figure out and become secure with their own identities over time
I have always mostly conformed to gender roles, at least in the most stereotypical sense. But I still do not like them, and being told I like what I like because I am a girl (while possibly true, because who can say who I would be without the enculturation to how I present my gender)
Even though I never liked the idea of gender roles, since having my daughter my feeling have become more sharp. I see my daughter who is wild and free and unhindered by expectations and it has really made me reevaluate my identity and the ways my gender roles effected my whole life. It makes me think a lot about how being a ‘good girl’ for me at least, meant crushing a lot of things which only later in life I learned to express - like anger, which I still have trouble processing and expressing in a way that is healthy. It is hard to properly express this but it was an very odd experience for me. Though I never would have said I personally suffered much from gender roles, it makes me cry to think of my daughter being crushed to fit in some little box…and that makes me question the extent to which I feel my sense of self was influenced by gender expectations.
idk if I am saying this well, and I don’t want to make it seem like having a kid is a necessity or gives special unique insight to understanding, but more that I personally did not fully reflect enough on how gender roles effected my life until I saw it through the lens of considering my daughter.
And want to add in my support to those who don’t want to have kids - and it is so rude and condescending than people telling you they know your own mind better than you, or that they somehow even think the potential to change your mind negates your current opinion. Even if you do change your mind it 1. Is still none of their business 2. doesn’t mean you somehow didn’t know your own mind, or have the right to feel however you want. 3. Whether you end up having kids or not, that is not the end all be all of meaning in your life.
My opinions on gender roles are fairly complicated, so bear with me if you're curious to read my rambles. The short version is that I think they, like any other form of painting strokes of overgeneralizations over an entire group of individuals based on whichever arbitrary factor (for the scope of this discussion, gender), is the wrong way of going about understanding people.
I grew up in a household where I never left my mom's side and she was (and still is) a "full-time" stay-at-home wife of her own choosing. Early on in her professional career, she realized she had no major career ambitions.
In more recent years, I've reflected on seeing my mom always at home, taking care of my sister and me, doing all the cooking, basically all the cleaning, etc. and have come to my conclusion that the stay-at-home persona isn't for me. I would get bored out of my mind.
I studied a STEM field in university. Even though my program is traditionally seen as a more balanced program in terms of female to male student ratios, my class was still ~60% male, if I remember correctly. The majority of my professors were male.
I did a number of internships as part of my university program, so it really boggles my mind that a lot of professions are gatekept for men or women. For a society that supposedly values meritocracy, I have no words to express my feelings that irony and hypocrisy.
From a psychological and emotional standpoint, I've always seen myself as a caring, empathetic person (and I've gotten this feedback from close friends and coworkers as well). Yet, ironically, I struggle with putting my own emotions into words (alexithymia). So a big part of me struggles to attribute these two traits I have to me being a woman. Rather, I see it as my parents did well with instilling a solid, reliable moral compass in me.
I'm a proponent of taking action and am a problem-solver, so I do my best to steer my mind away from blaming things on external factors over which I have no control, like society. From my experience, blaming external factors switched on "learned helplessness" mode in my brain and resulted in me taking no action to improve my current situation at the time.
Instead, now I acknowledge the imbalance of opportunity, power, etc. due to societal factors then focus my energy to work with factors that are within my control. A mental exercise that I use in (my male-dominated) workplace for important presentations and discussions is asking myself if I would feel nervous or have anxious thoughts if I was a stereotypical Caucasian man brought up in North America. It has done wonders for my confidence levels. Whoever said "fake it 'til you make it" might have been onto something.
As a woman who studied a STEM field and is working in a related job, the biggest issue is that this "fight" for equality between both sexes has swung too far the other way and instead of enabling men to sit back and reflect on the systemic issues that create barriers from women entering or staying in STEM fields, it broods resentment and men push back. I've seen some "feminists" on Reddit claim this perspective is merely a symptom of the patriarchal mindset being so deeply engrained in everyone's minds, even my own as a woman; however, I think it is merely a reflection of human nature and instead reflects the zero-sum game that late-stage capitalism has painted our society to be.
I also question what feels like an agenda being pushed that the distribution in STEM needs to be 50% men and 50% women. Again, I feel like this is swinging too far in the opposite direction. Why isn't the focus instead on encouraging and empowering anyone who is curious; is interested in solving complex problems; and would like to make positive impacts in the world through hardware, software, and/or service to go into STEM, regardless of their biological sex, socioeconomic background, race, religious beliefs etc.? Each of us is so much more than just man or woman.
Believe me, I understand why things are now being swung in an extreme in the opposite direction—otherwise, the status quo will never change. I just wish the people pushing these agendas and painting these narratives could see that extreme change never leads to sustainable and/or desired outcomes over longer time horizons.
I hope my ideas and opinions make sense. If you've read all the way through, I commend you for having the patience to take in all that.
Even though I never liked the idea of gender roles, since having my daughter my feeling have become more sharp. I see my daughter who is wild and free and unhindered by expectations and it has really made me reevaluate my identity and the ways my gender roles effected my whole life. It makes me think a lot about how being a ‘good girl’ for me at least, meant crushing a lot of things which only later in life I learned to express - like anger, which I still have trouble processing and expressing in a way that is healthy. It is hard to properly express this but it was an very odd experience for me. Though I never would have said I personally suffered much from gender roles, it makes me cry to think of my daughter being crushed to fit in some little box…and that makes me question the extent to which I feel my sense of self was influenced by gender expectations.
idk if I am saying this well, and I don’t want to make it seem like having a kid is a necessity or gives special unique insight to understanding, but more that I personally did not fully reflect enough on how gender roles effected my life until I saw it through the lens of considering my daughter.
I think this makes a lot of sense. While reflecting on ourselves, it's a lot easier for our minds to give way to our cognitive biases and blind spots. However, when observing another person, as you do in the case while raising your daughter, the mental separation makes it easier for you to notice things that you would not otherwise notice with yourself.
And want to add in my support to those who don’t want to have kids - and it is so rude and condescending than people telling you they know your own mind better than you, or that they somehow even think the potential to change your mind negates your current opinion. Even if you do change your mind it 1. Is still none of their business 2. doesn’t mean you somehow didn’t know your own mind, or have the right to feel however you want. 3. Whether you end up having kids or not, that is not the end all be all of meaning in your life.
This is also an excellent point. Whether or not one wants children is definitely an individual choice. It was never and should never have been a familial, societal, etc. decision.
Personally, this is a question I frequently think about because I still don't have a definitive "yes" or "no" to the question of wanting children. In an ideal world, I definitely would want children; however, I feel as though today's world is far from ideal and between climate change, geopolitics, and wealth inequality alone, the idea of bringing a new life into this world just doesn't make rational sense to me.
as a non-binary person,
they suck. especially since i'm forced into these gender roles on a daily basis, feels like chains engraved into my body from society.
gender roles are useless. as others have mentioned there is no 'gendered' clothing, colors, toys, etc. we've just created this weird hierarchy as we have progressed thru society where blue should only be for boys and pink should only be for girls and because we are taught ideas like this from a young age it becomes ingrained in our brains as normal but for what reason exactly, because that's how it always has been?
anyways i think that we are progressing into a new society where 'opposite gender roles' are becoming far more acceptable, and i love that.
Gender roles are dumb as heck. Do you really need your gender to tell you what you can or can’t do? Identify however you want and be whoever you want to be. Social constructs shouldn’t be the one telling you how to build yourself up.
I thought gender roles were recommendations on how the 2 genders interact and cooperate with each other to raise the next generation. Assigning roles that would amplify the best of masculine traits for guys and the best feminine traits for girls. For example more girls would prefer hospitality compared to being in construction or being a lumberjack. No one is saying they can’t but they’d probably be unhappy and prefer more feminine roles. Gender roles are recommendations/ideals nothing more but there’s a reason why they exist.
they’re god awful. im in high school and i identify as queer. i express my gender fluidity very openly and got bullied a lot for it my freshman year. its gotten to the point where i have to use gender neutral bathrooms when possible bc i dont feel safe in men’s bathrooms. i also have rlly bad dysphoria. a lot of male traits make me rlly uncomfortable when they’re forced on me. i present more feminine as well, so (for example) when i dont shave for a while i get rlly uncomfortable emotionally. i also have some issues when it comes to my parents but whatever im not an adult yet i cant do anything abt it.
