opinion on political correctness?

[forestyne]

@forestyne: I totally agree. Both extremes are bad. In fact, I think the radical left and their bullying of the right wing is exactly why we have Donald Trump in office. I don't think the Russians have influenced our vote nor has James Comey tilted the election towards Trump. It's the anger from those who were fed up with society from the past four years. It was a dark time for conservatives, as they were treated poorly under Obama. I may not like who we have as president now, but I do think he got in because of how badly treated the voters were before the election. There were many other factors why he won, but this was one of them.

All their posts are like that. They are also to be added to my ignore list. It's just sad.

I've said since the election that the extremist feminist backlash against Trump was the reason why he won. The baby boomers got tired of these twelve year old bigot kids shoving these extremist views down their throats that they all got together and voted him in. Of course, he did also brainwash and manipulate an entire nation, thus dividing them, but that's a different story.

Every single race, gender and sexuality has their own set of individual struggles and problems, denying that one group's problems don't exist, on either ends of the majority to minority scale, is bigotry.

Denying that straight white men who are 'cancerous to society and we should all take up Hitler's ideology and kill them all' have their own problems to face in life is utter rubbish and bull****. The United State male-to-female suicide ratio alone is 3:1. Men file 17.5% of sexual harassment charges. The rate of suicide is highest in middle age — white men in particular. Men are much more likely to kill themselves and suffer from mental health problems. Denying that these problems exist because they are a majority is bullplop if I've ever heard it.

Denying that POC have their own problems to face in life is utter rubbish. A 1999 study found that doctors treat black and white patients differently, even when their medical files were statistically identical. When shown patient histories and asked to make judgments about heart disease, the doctors were much less likely to recommend cardiac catheterization (a helpful procedure) to black patients. Denying that those problems exist because they're a minority is utter rubbish.

Denying that these problems exist, just to protect your special snowflake ego, is pure bigotry.

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pwned


i've never spent so much time on WHO in my entire life lmfao

 

[Ghost Soda]

But those same cis white straight males are under pressure to be perfect in society and those same cis white straight males are five times more likely to kill themselves than women. They are just as vulnerable as the rest of the population, even more so. So if these straight white cis males are perfect and are completely problem-free and nobody needs to care about them, why does a statistic like this even exist?

Where did I say that cis straight white dudes lead perfects existences and have 0 problems. Nowhere. I was simply stating the fact that they don't and will never face homophobia, transphobia, racism or sexism.

Please bring out the statistics.

 

[moonford]

Where did I say that cis straight white dudes lead perfects existences and have 0 problems. Nowhere. I was simply stating the fact that they don't and will never face homophobia, transphobia, racism or sexism.

Please bring out the statistics.

Everybody can be affected by racism and sexism, denying that they can't face hate because of their race/sex is ridiculous. They won't face homophobia or transphobia because they aren't trans/gay so why bring that up, they will very rarely be targeted because of their sexuality because people who are LGBT+ are more understanding and know what it's like so they would never dream of putting someone through that but it still happens!

You are trying to get the point across that people should be treated equally but you are denying the fact that men who are white, cis and straight can face sexism and racism when they most certainly can. They may not get nearly as much racism or sexism directed towards them but they still are victims of it and the last time I checked minorities matter (and so they should) because it's all about equality.

Equality for everyone on Earth will never ever be achieved if we continue to behave like this.

Look at www.Salon.com for racist articles against white people.

Sexism against men here.

 

[koopakingg]

Where did I say that cis straight white dudes lead perfects existences and have 0 problems. Nowhere. I was simply stating the fact that they don't and will never face homophobia, transphobia, racism or sexism.

Please bring out the statistics.

"You can't be racist to white people!"

This statement. -_-

 

[forestyne]

I brought so many statistics that cis white straight men will face sexual abuse and significant mental health problems and make up a large majority of suicide statistics yet it's still all about minorities and what they don't suffer from. I'm offended that there's still a counter argument without statistics to back that bigotry up.

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"You can't be racist to white people!"

This statement. -_-

McBusted.

 

[moonford]

I brought so many statistics that cis white straight men will face sexual abuse and significant mental health problems and make up a large majority of suicide statistics yet it's still all about minorities and what they don't suffer from. I'm offended that there's still a counter argument without statistics to back that bigotry up.

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McBusted.

I'm offended that people can't google statistics when they are there and easy to find. -__-

 

[forestyne]

Everybody can be affected by racism and sexism, denying that they can't face hate because of their race/sex is ridiculous. They won't face homophobia or transphobia because they aren't trans/gay so why bring that up, they will very rarely be targeted because of their sexuality because people who are LGBT+ are more understanding and know what it's like so they would never dream of putting someone through that but it still happens!

You are trying to get the point across that people should be treated equally but you are denying the fact that men who are white, cis and straight can face sexism and racism when they most certainly can. They may not get nearly as much racism or sexism directed towards them but they still are victims of it and the last time I checked minorities matter (and so they should) because it's all about equality.

Equality for everyone on Earth will never ever be achieved if we continue to behave like this.

Look at www.Salon.com for racist articles against white people.

Sexism against men here.

I doubt it will be read since my sources were completely ignored as if I spouted rubbish, so all I will say is that even though they won't be killed for being that gender and that race, there are lots of other problems that men will face that extremist feminists will deny and not understand. Men experience sexism. Men experience prejudices and discrimination (even though it's not widely reported and I'm not even saying "reverse racism is real omgomg #whiteopression) for what the media paints them as - women-beating, black-hating sexists. Painting a man up to be a perfect, strong man with no problems/irrelevant problems is sexist in itself.

 

[Leen]

"You can't be racist to white people!"

This statement. -_-

You can't be racist to a white person. Racism is the systematic oppression of a people, and in this case, minorities, or marginalized groups. So in order to actually be racist against a white person, we would have to go back in time and put in place a system that would benefit a marginalized group.

You can be prejudiced towards a white person, but you can't be racist.

 

[Soda Fox]

Haven't caught up but can you both please stop name calling?

Ghost Soda, you don't get to tell people that they shouldn't say hurtful things and then stay camping people bigots. This makes you a hypocrite.

Forestyne, you know Ghost doesn't like some of the words you're using to describe him. Can you show a little respect please?

I'll have more to say when I catch up but I think you're both being very childish.

 

[forestyne]

If I keep looking up suicide statistics for this argument, Google's gonna hmu with a suicide hotline recommendation saying "are you okay?"

 

[Soda Fox]

You can't be racist to a white person. Racism is the systematic oppression of a people, and in this case, minorities, or marginalized groups. So in order to actually be racist against a white person, we would have to go back in time and put in place a system that would benefit a marginalized group.

You can be prejudiced towards a white person, but you can't be racist.

Racist is prejudice against a race. You can certainly be racist against anyone of a different background.

 

[forestyne]

You can't be racist to a white person. Racism is the systematic oppression of a people, and in this case, minorities, or marginalized groups. So in order to actually be racist against a white person, we would have to go back in time and put in place a system that would benefit a marginalized group.

You can be prejudiced towards a white person, but you can't be racist.

Yes, reverse racism doesn't exist. I did clarify my response that white people do experience prejudices rather than racism.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Racist is prejudice against a race. You can certainly be racist against anyone of a different background.

racism
noun
prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.

So, I mean.... yeah.... but it's not common to call it racism when it's against white people for some reason. But technically you're correct, based on the definition of racism.

 

[Ghost Soda]

C/Ping older arguement forestyne never responded to:

I was using that as an example of "opinions" that shouldn't be respected. I never said anyone was flaunting white privilege. Don't drink and argue online, kiddo!

lel You can keep on hiding behind "opinions" all you want here but when you think that anyone that's different than you deserves to be abused and killed than I have literally no obligation to treat you and your crummy "opinions" with respect. Respect's a two way street, mate, and if you refuse to treat us and our lives with respect then don't act all surprised when we don't feel like bending over backwards for you.

And last time I checked, nobody's being sent to jail for being a bigot. If you really want to go around making a donkey's behind of yourself and spew bigotry, than go ahead and do you. But nobody's obligated to stay silent while you do.

You say it's clear what the difference is, yet you have yet to say why. Imagine this; A man is in a forest waving around a gun when he accidentally shoots someone. Yes, he didn't try to hurt anybody, but that doesn't change the fact that someone was hurt because of his negligence. By willingly and knowingly choosing to do something that could really hurt others, you're basically saying "screw anybody that gets hurt over my actions because I need to have this!!!" It's one thing to just make jokes like that in private, (I still down see why you would, but ok.) but when you make them in public there's always going to be the chance of a survivor hearing you make jokes about what they went through.

Anyways, you've made it abundantly clear that the rights for people to spread hate speech and bigotry matter more to you than the people who are affected by it. You say that people who spout these hateful views shouldn't be called out while expecting the people that are being attacked by them to respect their abusers and then demonizing anyone who has the gall to get upset.

Nobody should be obligated to accept bigoted attacks towards them. Being rightfully upset that someone has hurt you doesn't give them the right to hurt you even more!

Everybody can be affected by racism and sexism, denying that they can't face hate because of their race/sex is ridiculous. They won't face homophobia or transphobia because they aren't trans/gay so why bring that up, they will very rarely be targeted because of their sexuality because people who are LGBT+ are more understanding and know what it's like so they would never dream of putting someone through that but it still happens!

You are trying to get the point across that people should be treated equally but you are denying the fact that men who are white, cis and straight can face sexism and racism when they most certainly can. They may not get nearly as much racism or sexism directed towards them but they still are victims of it and the last time I checked minorities matter (and so they should) because it's all about equality.

Equality for everyone on Earth will never ever be achieved if we continue to behave like this.

Look at www.Salon.com for racist articles against white people.

Sexism against men here.

Look, I'm getting real tired of this argument here. TBH, I really don't want to get into the whole "does reverse racism/sexism" exist can of worms. I was/am just getting tired of apple's victim complex.

Haven't caught up but can you both please stop name calling?

Ghost Soda, you don't get to tell people that they shouldn't say hurtful things and then stay camping people bigots. This makes you a hypocrite.

Forestyne, you know Ghost doesn't like some of the words you're using to describe him. Can you show a little respect please?

I'll have more to say when I catch up but I think you're both being very childish.

Thank you. Look, I wasn't trying to say that anyone here and now was a bigot, but if I did I'm sorry. This argument is using a lot of brain stamina. :U

 

[moonford]

C/Ping older arguement forestyne never responded to:





Look, I'm getting real tired of this argument here. TBH, I really don't want to get into the whole "does reverse racism/sexism" exist can of worms. I was/am just getting tired of apple's victim complex.

People will gradually leave this thread, so let's start now. How about that?
I'll go first unless someone feels like throwing out another point which is interesting.

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Yes, reverse racism doesn't exist. I did clarify my response that white people do experience prejudices rather than racism.

- - - Post Merge - - -



racism
noun
prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.

So, I mean.... yeah.... but it's not common to call it racism when it's against white people for some reason. But technically you're correct, based on the definition of racism.

Definitions = Facts.
We should respect the words we are given and use them correctly, it's not common because racism against white people isn't as common 'so racism against white people should be called something different', isn't that kinda racism in itself?

Don't reply to me because I won't reply to you, k? K? c;

 

[Tao]

Please point out to me where I said we couldn't ever make any jokes ever. If hearing "don't make jokes that rely on bigotry and hurting others" causes you to reach the "we can't ever make any jokes ever again" conclusion, maybe you ought to reevaluate your sense of humor there, bud.

Many would argue that humor is largely drawn at the expense of somebody/something else, or "hurting others" as you put it.

"hurting others" is a pretty wide net to cast, so in saying that, yea, you've pretty much said "no, I don't like humor", since that covers almost everything from Roy Chubby Brown and the Three Stooges to Tom & Jerry and Red Dwarf.

Other than that I guess we have "lulzxDs0r4nd0m!!!1!1!111" humor and "that's a reference/quote, so it's a joke for some reason", and if that's all we're allowed to laugh at, then I'm fine with a humorless world.

Where did I say that cis straight white dudes lead perfects existences and have 0 problems. Nowhere. I was simply stating the fact that they don't and will never face homophobia, transphobia, racism or sexism.

I see you're using the Buzzfeed definitions of those words rather than the actual definitions.

I'm just gonna pick those goalposts up and put them back where they belong...Sexism is treating somebody differently based on their sex. Racism is treating somebody differently based on their race. White males are not excluded from that and saying they are is ironically both sexist and racist.

And irony is fundamentally based in misery, so, I dunno, make up your mind. Is "hurting others" okay or not? You're givin' me mixed signals here, dude.

And please stop jumping the gun on rape jokes.

But I got a real doozy involving a quadruple amputee and 2 dwarfs.

 

[UglyMonsterFace]

You can't be racist to a white person. Racism is the systematic oppression of a people, and in this case, minorities, or marginalized groups. So in order to actually be racist against a white person, we would have to go back in time and put in place a system that would benefit a marginalized group.

You can be prejudiced towards a white person, but you can't be racist.

I hate when people say this. This is the definition of racism in its simplest form:

rac?ism
ˈrāˌsizəm/Submit
noun
prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior.

Where does it say that it has to be institutionalised?

Here's another:

1: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race

2a: a doctrine or political program based on the assumption of racism and designed to execute its principles
b: a political or social system founded on racism

3: racial prejudice or discrimination

The bolded statement might be what you are talking about, but racism is an umbrella term, and as you can tell, has other brackets of definition other than the one you like to use to support your agenda. You can be racist as an individual, or as a political system. So yes, a person of colour can be racist against whites. In fact, the idea that white people cannot experience racism, is in fact, RACISM. It is racist to assume that a white person is automatically racist because of white privilege, or that a white person can't suffer the same poverty or discrimination within a governmental system. How about Asians? Can we experience racism? Asians have the highest rate of success in America (even more so than whites). Is this Asian privilege? It must mean that Asians are favoured, right? NO, my friends, racism can be expressed by all, and experienced by all. Maybe in different ways, but yes, it is still racism.

I just get really annoyed when people try to say white people must have gotten to Harvard or Yale because they are white, or that white people are automatically ignorant about other people's cultures, or if a white person goes to Africa to do charity work it is assumed it's because they feel like they are superior and are just pitying the poor people of Africa. That is a type of racism that we people of colour don't often experience. But it's still racism.

 

[Soda Fox]

Please point out to me where I said we couldn't ever make any jokes ever. If hearing "don't make jokes that rely on bigotry and hurting others" causes you to reach the "we can't ever make any jokes ever again" conclusion, maybe you ought to reevaluate your sense of humor there, bud.



I don't know why people keep spouting this "respect all opinions" stuff. The idea that I should treat harmful opinions like "we need protect white people from other races!!!" and "gay people deserve to go to heck!!" as being equal to "POC and LGBT people are human beings and deserve to be treated with respect" is, frankly, pure bologna.

And supporting equal rights yourself doesn't give you a free pass to spout bigotry. So if I see someone make a "hurr durr i identify as a fighter jet" or whatever like it's pure comedy gold and dig their head in the sand when called out, than I really don't care if they're a total grade A homophobe/transphobe or "actually an ally!!". If it quacks like a duck.



But there's a difference between telling bad jokes before, but feeling guilty and knowing better now vs telling trashy hurtful jokes in the present and than sticking your fingers in your ears and going "wahh wahhh sjws are taking my freedon of speech" when you're called out.



That's like saying that as long as you're not trying to hurt anybody, that you should be able to shoot bullets into the air or something. "I wasn't trying to hurt anybody" means squat when exactly that happens. You don't know if a sexual abuse surviver might be walking by when you tell your oh so funny rape joke. And if you were so imaginative, you should be able to think of jokes that aren't "lol gay people/trans people/black people/ect are different than us!!! #joke!!!"

And since you keep bringing up that chicken joke, please bring proof that it's about suicide. As far as I know, it's a joke because you expect something crazy to happen but it literally just gets to the other side of the road.

Sorry if the formatting is a little wonky. I'm on my phone and reading the firm between games ok Mario Kart 8.

Firstly, why should anyone respect your opinion if you think respecting others opinions is "bologna"? You need to be willing to extend the olive branch first if you expect the same respect in return. And, again, if you show respect and others don't, take it in stride and be above that.

Secondly what's "trashy" or offensive to you might be hilarious to 10other people. So try not to police what people joke about. If you don't like it, voice your opinion, and if it doesn't stop, remove yourself from the situation.

 

[Jeremy]

We've had to go through this thread because part of the discussion turned into an aggressive argument. If you can't respectfully disagree with someone, you shouldn't be posting in threads like this. Please read our rules and guidelines for more details:

1. Community Guidelines

• Respecting Others
  • Respect other Bell Tree members in your posts, private messages, visitor messages, Wi-Fi ratings, and other conversations.
  • If you disagree with someone, please do so in a dignified manner and refrain from using personal attacks.
  • Keep your criticism constructive and avoid posting anything that belittles another user.
  • Do not intentionally provoke or instigate a negative reaction out of another user. This is also known as trolling.
  • If another user is disrespectful or makes a personal attack, do not attack them back. This will create a lengthy series of attacks known as a flame war.
  • Do not use someone else's thread for your own purchases/interest. If you want to buy something, make your own thread.

Users have already been infracted for rude posts in this thread, and if it continues we will have to close it.

 

[kayleee]

the only thing that worries me is people who actually find rape jokes funny

 

[-Apples-]

the only thing that worries me is people who actually find rape jokes funny

At least I don't. I don't get why people even laugh at that.