Mafia Squeaky Clean Mafia - Day 3 - Ends Monday May 25 at 7pm EST

[bell account]

a janitor would def not be town aligned. not having a flip is harmful to town

well ive had an obvious wolf roleblocker claim before when prompted, role madness on these style of forums typically dont have safe fakeclaims for scum

 

[Damniel]

well ive had an obvious wolf roleblocker claim before when prompted, role madness on these style of forums typically dont have safe fakeclaims for scum

janitor is not a protown role so if there is a janitor they would probably (if they haven't already) claim townie. claiming townie for no reason seems to be the trend now

 

[bell account]

just because you dont think wolves will misplay doesnt mean you shouldnt give them the opportunity

 

[Damniel]

there was a lot of pressure on dino early day but no ones brought her up since or talked about her as a wagon. are people no longer sus on her or?

 

[toadsworthy]

well ive had an obvious wolf roleblocker claim before when prompted, role madness on these style of forums typically dont have safe fakeclaims for scum

i would not classify this game as a “role madness”

 

[Seroja]

there was a lot of pressure on dino early day but no ones brought her up since or talked about her as a wagon. are people no longer sus on her or?

here's the thing right, trundle was actually the only one scum leaning her. everyone else actually had her on a null/null-town/town lean. and yet I did not see Trundle interact with Dino even once. it's weird. not sure why most of everyone have him on town lean. I'm not seeing it.

 

[Damniel]

im still writing my post on my comments on all of D1. but mayorleaf, why do you like posts so much? what exactly do you like about them? its hard to have to notice the posts you like without knowing what your thought process is

 

[Geoni]

I have no opinions after catching besides catching I disagree with Dad, particularity on Trundle/Teddy and I don't think Bianca contributions to the game aren't helping us.


What are your opinions regarding his hesitant to contribute to the game? I don't see this in your read unless I am confused.


Ok but you don't think Trundle reasoning behind sussing DinoTown is meta and lacks substance? He's still hooked on it btw. Don't you find weird that he called me out regarding meta but still uses meta to back up his sus regarding dino?


How does this add anything to the game? I understand where you are coming from but you could be adding more. Your reads are filled with uncertainty so who are you most certain about?

@Antonio to put it simply Teddy had a readslist I found satisfying for the most part and gave me the impression he has actually been forming opinions on people despite the distractions but I don't believe I addressed that, probably because the guy is screaming town regardless.

Trundle similarly came back with reads that, while I disagreed with some of it, gave me the impression he has a wider view of the thread than just Dino but the meta stuff/contradiction you need to quote for me. I don't think his Dino read lacked substance but it did lack of openness but as far as I remember Trundle doesn't consider why something could also be coming from a town perspective because that didn't happen last game. I don't find it damning. I'm gonna see how the rest of the day went once I stop getting interrupted.

Also what did you find helpful from Bianca at the time you posted this?

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

Of course, I think a vote on either Teddy/Trundle could lead to a conclusion regarding Dad because if he is Mafia, he poses the biggest threat to Town compared to anyone else in this game. I also think that anyone who slightly Town read one of them could be potential sus as their behaviors are still quite suspicious.

This reads agendad granted you asked the question you did in #327 or you are really wanting to find a reason to push me on the basis of my reads being different than yours. Voting people for the sole purpose of figuring out a single person is something that feels like engineering to me but at least you're trying to solve something. Still, I'm pinged by it.

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

i'm still not really convinced on lynching kat but if she's not protesting and continues to be reluctant to contribute anything that suggests we shouldn't lynch her, then i don't really see why we wouldn't. the two votes on her thus far (trundle and geoni) seem town-motivated to me so i'll be willing to put my vote on her if it comes to it.

if kat flips town i'll be casting a very suspicious eye on geoni. trundle too, but mainly geoni because he's been weirdly argumentative towards me for pretty much no reason since the beginning of day 1 and nitpicked on me asking teddy to elaborate when i thought it was pretty clear i wasn't questioning on his mixup of the words how / who. i think geoni has been a bit elusive so far and is largely being townread by people because of his meta which i'm not familiar enough with. i think a lynch on kat will be fairly AI for geoni no matter what she flips


if i were to vote on my instinct for voltairenism, i'm not sure how much information could be gleaned from their death if they flip town (apart from you all probably scumreading me for it lol)

if they flip mafia, my bet is that bianca is also on the scumteam



bianca's reads are largely unhelpful but her read on voltairenism is the only one that doesn't explicitly contain the word 'scum', 'town', or both
if voltairenism flipped red, i'd be willing to call this a conscious effort on bianca's part to exclude herself from any potential discourse about her scum partner by not making a call either way

I don't like how this rolls off of what Antonio was saying about Kat's flip if town incriminating me, especially considering you join it down the line and then it gets janitored. Kinda solidifies that Kat probably wasn't a wolf. With Antonio it's at least coming off from a paranoia he has about me and could be his solving angle but with you I just get shade/reinforcement.

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

```i think a lynch on kat will be fairly AI for geoni no matter what she flips```

Like what does that even mean lol. Also I don't recall being townread by multiple people over my meta.

 

[bell account]

im still writing my post on my comments on all of D1. but mayorleaf, why do you like posts so much? what exactly do you like about them? its hard to have to notice the posts you like without knowing what your thought process is

i find its best to ignore trying to read into likes/reacts on forums where theyre allowed
its like the same thing as trying to watch online activity to angleshoot whos a wolf

 

[g u a v a]

im still writing my post on my comments on all of D1. but mayorleaf, why do you like posts so much? what exactly do you like about them? its hard to have to notice the posts you like without knowing what your thought process is

mostly that i agree with whatever they're saying. can stop if it's throwing you off tho ;o)

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

i find its best to ignore trying to read into likes/reacts on forums where theyre allowed
its like the same thing as trying to watch online activity to angleshoot whos a wolf

yeah pretty much this. good luck trying to get anything from what i like. i'd focus more on what i've typed since half the time it's an instagram-level like aka its basically meaningless. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Geoni]

I don't know if this kind of thought is useful to us rn because a) you could be seeing trundle and geoni as a threat b) you think that people wouldnt risk geoni both because he could be a good ally for town and people still have the misslynch for last game in their minds or, in case you are town c) actually I dont think if one of them is maf you give us any closure on who is other ones, it is just good that it's one mad down. My point is that this is an infinite loop of hypothesis acrobatics and it can make anyone second guess their vote

???

It's too bad Volt is gone. I like that they had a problem with the line of thoughts I touched on above but this is so gobbledygook.

 

[Damniel]

taking a break to go to bed for the night. left on page 14 but here's what stood out to me the most

Spoiler: it's a lot of quotes

Last game DinoTown was more reserved and quiet but now seems overly enthusiastic to make a good impression on everyone. It just is raising a big red flag for me. I think enthusiastic D1 starts like that are always super suspicious.

i find it quite odd that people gave trundle so much towncred so quickly when this was really the only thing he said about dino for a while. he casts the first suspicion but doesn't follow through with it. other people comment on dino, but trundle shouldn't have gotten that much towncred for it

It's been literally ages since I've played on here. I moved like 3 years ago so maybe??? Has it really been that long oh god

in the beginning of the game and on discord when she signed up, Kat seemed very excited to play. she even was reluctant to sign up on discord because she said she'd be too involved. her just randomly giving up is very out of character given this context. unless something happened to her irl (i hope she's okay), i think her sudden loss of interest would have to do with her role/knowledge she wouldn't flip

There's no back tracking in my statement, I just feel there's too many people on DinoTown and we should be putting pressure on everyone during day 1. I just find it weird that all the discussion is about Dinotown.

Scum benefit from the lack of pressure and the lack of discussion of other people. There hasn't been much discussion on other people. Everyone is a suspect and based on last game behavior, I believe no one should be universally town read and everyone should be a suspect no matter what. Shawo went under the radar because everyone there townread him and I don't think that should happen again.

No, I stick by my suspisions but we should be talking about other people as well. Also, if you don't think we should be talking about other people and keep the discussion on DinoTown, just say it. Don't put out there that I am some hypocrite when I said we should be talking about other people, not that we should not be talking about DinoTown.

antonio wants to talk about others but doesn't bring others up first. towards the EoD, Kat becomes really the only person anyone talks about and the discussion is on either kat or role names. if antonio wanted to talk about other players, why did they let kat and role names be the only conversation. i remember that they said they'd be down for a volt lynch, but barely talks about them and goes back to talking about roles (which is a poor waste of time)

you shouldnt be trying to control the flow of discussion if people want to talk about dinotown then thats what should be discussed theres no "talk about everyone equally" law or anything and if you try to force that content becomes engineered hence the parallel to engineered wagons
it doesnt help

it seems bell (when they read the game) has a good sense of what's going on and brings some original thought. good substance

If you have something to say about me, please say it.

a lot of dino's posts come off as defensive or too conscious of image and i don't like it

I'm not sure. I find it weird that Bell is stating that I said we shouldn't talk about Dino when I said we should talk about everyone (which includes dino) because mafia benefits from the lack of discussion of other people.

again, kat became the only person really talked about and id argue mafia benefited from lack of lynch options

Well, you're blunt about me being self-obsessed and I'm honestly a little hurt you're judging me like that when we don't know each other very well, and even more confused about why you call me self-obsessed then try and justify it straight after, but that's beside the point.

If my pride in my achievement is so normal, why do you think the others seeming to pick on it so much as making me looking scummy or otherwise bad?

My first post was made in a very tired state, pushing myself to stay up until 12 was a bad idea (but now I know).
I currently feel a little annoyed by everything that's going on around me because being the center of attention is bad enough when it's not to point fingers at you for being mafia, but I still want to play the game and want to go back to my state of enthusiasm for playing.
I'm not sure I can get back my confidence after this, though.

dino uses a lot of emotion in their defensiveness even though she did fine in the heated mess of last game lol

I'm taking this approach, because everyone else is allowing me to at the moment, but you are right, nothing would get done, and this is the same reason, playing this way of I don't have an argument in case people turn on me, I'm gone, so might not see it, but it's a little high risk, high rewards, being able to be on the second row once you decide to stand out. Until I have built enough data and character on myself, I would rather be in the middle ground and not frontstagen, that's what I meant by not being able to sustain a spotlight.
Be sure that I'm still here the next cycle, I will be saying a lot more.
Now I ask you, how do you think is most likely hiding something?

my gut is telling me to wait a little bit longer, before I accuse someone of anything.

Yes! I might be killed off tonight, but in my mind I'm playing the game to win and have the best outcome for the town. that's why even though I'm not saying much, I believe my game is high stakes, high rewards, because by doing these I have the most to lose, since I might be an easy target for the mafia or untrusty to some during the voting phase. My game style is for the long run, so hopefully I can stay all the way.

Cliché but I prefer to trust everyone and be killed, than being suspicious of everyone. Innocent until preven guilty. That's why I don't mind sharing my gameplay style. If that gets me killed so be it, I tried my hardest. This by doesn't mean I'm not playing to win.

i really reallllly don't agree with how teddy is choosing to play. i was too harsh in saying i didn't like every single post, but i said that mainly because of how much i disagree with this perspective. you should be focused on getting as much information as possible, if you die you die but maf is less likely to kill you if you're not helpful at all. also trusting everyone is like the exact opposite of what to do in mafia. first, suspect everyone and form town reads by what you think is the least likely to be scum. i don't necessarily think this is scum indicative, but this play style is not really helpful imo

I know this is off-topic but:

I need to get rid of my grown flowers

Do you need flowers but you don't want to wait? Well then, come to my town and steal all my flowers away. No hybrids unless in the field, I already locked up my hybrids...

www.belltreeforums.com

I need help

antonio actually posts useless filler on multiple occasions

Arstotzkhan - I liked how they questioned Teddy when everyone was focused on DinoTown. Of course that don't mean much but their questioning did eventually lead to teddy posting their opinion.

interesting how ultimately antonio votes kat over a role name instead of behavior. because "donald trump is most likely scum/TP" with an OP saying there's a story as to why role names don't make sense

I am still suspicious of DinoTown as her posts this game are very different from her posts last game when she was town. I think she has a case of Mafia-Verbosity Fever because the post length difference between the two games is very peculiar. Once again, this raises a red flag for me. Last game as town, DinoTown was quite reserved and short-winded in her posted style and to see the progression of one little sus to such a blow up makes me think DinoTown is mafia. This is still a mafia lean (I apologize for saying read > lean in my first post) but I think based on this D1 pressure it will be relatively easy to solve Dino by D2.

trundle becomes pretty consistent in voting Kat and sticking with his original scum read of dino which is a logical progression to me

 

[Geoni]

Actually I'm fine with that wording, it's coming from an inquisitive line of thought. Carry on.

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

Actually I'm fine with that wording, it's coming from an inquisitive line of thought. Carry on.

Referring to the post above, Dan ninja'd

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

Yeah I'll read that later Dan

 

[Damniel]

the 3am music is playing so that's my cue to sleep. i'll finish my comments on page 14 beyond but as you can see my main suspicions stay on dino and antonio for inconsistent behavior and focus on finding role names

 

[g u a v a]

yay finally someone else is wary of trundle's bold first move.

 

[Geoni]

Voting for Volt, in the grand scheme of things, likely wouldn't do much. I don't see many people coming to Volt's defense, actually, more likely my vote being the start of a wagon (assuming I'd be the first vote, given there currently are no votes for Volt.) considering what people have said about being okay to vote Volt. Maybe not a wagon big enough to cause a lynch with the Kat wagon to play, but still. Who voted Volt would be useful if a lynch did happen and Volt flipped town - especially if anyone chose to vote Volt because they didn't want to vote Kat (maf buddies trying to protect?). If Volt was lynched and flipped red, however, I'm not sure if I'd be able to pinpoint any notable interactions between other players as to who might be teamed up, since, like I said, no-one really seems to be particularly sided with Volt for much. If there was no lynch on Volt, I think who voted the same as me wouldn't be useful information until later into the game.

On the other hand, placing a vote for Kat is more likely to actually have a lynch at the end of it, considering that wagon has already started. If Kat flipped town, I think I would certainly need to give Teddy a good look. Some have mentioned that Teddy+Kat looks town/town but I am more convinced that it's two different sides there, at least currently. Teddy's reaction to a Kat lynch would, of course, be helpful in making this judgement. Similar with Geoni. If Kat flipped red, I think it would be much easier to pick out or rule out potential partners since Kat has been interacting with the rest of the player base significantly more than Volt has.

@DinoTown you're like the third person with this take and it feels like you are giving up on the idea that Volt could be a wagon for the sake of Kat revealing two players because you have wolf/town reads with a lot of confidence. And the wagon only had two people at that point...

 

[DinoTown]

Of course, there's a janitor-type thing going on in the cleanly mafia game. Of freaking course there is. Dangit.

Hello, Damniel, nice to see you, promise we'll try and solve this game before your Champs lol.

@Damniel you mentioned that I was coming off as defensive yet managed okay in the heat last game. Don't forget to consider the fact that last game the heat wasn't on me.

@Geoni I'm not giving up on the idea of a Volt wagon. I stated several times after that post that I want Volt to be the next wagon. I just decided that Kat would be a more useful vote in terms of what the lynch could tell us. That went down the plughole, but hey ho.

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

i think her sudden loss of interest would have to do with her role/knowledge she wouldn't flip
[/spoiler]

What do you think are the chances Kat was the janitor and wiped themselves? I know that sounds like a weird possibility but at the same time a janitor that can wipe lynches also sounds weird

 

[Geoni]

that's convenient

i'm Ideonella Sakaiensis, a bacteria that breaks down/degrades plastic

does that make anything any clearer? no
this roleclaiming is not helping us at all and is literally just distracting us from choosing who to lynch, which we need to do in the next two hours.

i'm actually inclined to believe claiming was a distraction tactic by arstotzkhan because i really doubt she wouldn't have read toads' disclaimer in the OP dissuading us from trying to determine alignments from role names

I still dislike this post, roleclaiming and proceeding to criticize the evaluation of them but moreso adding that Kat claiming was a distraction tactic feels like a pushy opportunity if I assume Kat wasn't mafia.

 

[Damniel]

What do you think are the chances Kat was the janitor and wiped themselves? I know that sounds like a weird possibility but at the same time a janitor that can wipe lynches also sounds weird

from her behavior, i find it a strong possibility that kat was aware that she wouldn’t flip. i’m leaning towards that maf knew that kat would flip, meaning she was either targeted before the game started, or she was maf with this power

Post automatically merged: May 20, 2020

dino please talk about why you put so much interest in role names and even claimed when the OP says role names should not be used for reads and you were not a wagon yet. what do we benefit from having so many role claims now

 

[DinoTown]

dino please talk about why you put so much interest in role names and even claimed when the OP says role names should not be used for reads and you were not a wagon yet. what do we benefit from having so many role claims now

What's that got to do with anything?
Also it really didn't seem like I was on the table for anyone, wdym yet?
I'll answer, just tell me what an existence of a wagon on me has to do with that in the slightest?