Mafia TBT Mafia ~ The Binding of Isaac ~ Town Wins!

[Heyden]

Why are you angry about letting Daniel go, we got scum in the end anyway. We can look further into him tomorrow probably.

 

[glow]

whoa can I just say I'm genuinely impressed by Rune rn. p sure that's the longest post I've ever seen him make ever

So I'm thinking that I'm gonna die so I'm gonna post my opinions on everyone that I can before Night ends. I take forever typing these things up tho

Also is anyone else really interested by everyone saying "AY GOOD JOB WE DID IT TOWN" when they didn't even vote for Ness or even make a case on anyone. lmfao

 

[illunie]

whoa can I just say I'm genuinely impressed by Rune rn. p sure that's the longest post I've ever seen him make ever

So I'm thinking that I'm gonna die so I'm gonna post my opinions on everyone that I can before Night ends. I take forever typing these things up tho

Also is anyone else really interested by everyone saying "AY GOOD JOB WE DID IT TOWN" when they didn't even vote for Ness or even make a case on anyone. lmfao

Firstly, thanks.
And yeah, I believe someone called out Luca on this.

 

[Arstotzkan]

@Rune Someone close to Daniel died. I think that'd be a totally legit reason for giving up. You don't?

Also ftr I'm replying to your thing rn Rune. Probably the last big post I'm making tonight though because my brain hurts x-x

 

[Ayaya]

Just woke up, let me reply to this before looking at the thread

@dough Mkay.

So my scumspect is Ayaya.

I've been lowkey suspicious of her this entire game, but didn't want to say much because I didn't want to cause day to get derailed like it did last game and I didn't want her to really know I was suspicious so she'd be acting like she would normally. However, with the Ness lynch, I feel much more confident in her being scum, so here we go. Hopefully not too much salt this time.

WARNING: This post is long af. A TL;DR is here if you're afraid of being overwhelmed:

Spoiler: TL;DR

She's seen defending Ness pretty hard, and she seems to try to not make it too obvious and when she finally does air it out, she explains how he could be scum which means a null read. Speaking of which, she contradicts herself quite a bit, omits information, becomes very vague, discourages conversation, and blatantly ignores questions. So Sheriff, if you're out there, please investigate her. I'd be very grateful

---

The first thing that made me start to scum read her was this:This seemed like she was trying to cut off conversation to the point of calling people who were in it scummy. I pressed her on this point:She never responded. She even quoted my question in her analysis of this discussion (her 3rd post), but she never answered. So I know she saw it. But here we are, without an answer. And without one, the only thing I can assume she was doing was trying to cut off discussion out of intimidation. I think this was a little psychological manipulation on her part.

Firstly, my intention to cut it off was to stop us from discussing it further. I said before the game started that we might end up discussing who have which items instead of scumhunting on D1, and we didn't discuss items at all but ended up discussing KP, which is why I wanted it to stop. I did say though that it at least got a discussion going, that I already said towards you twice. That is meant as a positive comment because any discussion is better than just jokes or meme. It even got me to try discern scum from there (and apparently I was right since Ness ended up being scum)

The "scum might be hiding between them" idea was based on how previous games, scum are more likely to join/continue discussion about meta in games (ex: Ender joining Sataric in GoT, Daniel speculating about KP in GoT)

I didn't answer the question because I honestly don't know a better way. Maybe I should've answered with "You got us something to work with though" but at that time I was gonna be busy for the rest of the day and wanted to spend my remaining time reading the thread instead

Then there's this post:
First off, you pretty blatantly omitted some relevant posts. Can't really think of a good reason to do that other than wanting to put the people who you did quote into a mosh pit of scumminess or if you wanted to avoid these posts for some reason. I don't think it's the former because you null/town read most. Maybe you wanted to justify a townie read on dough or you didn't want to mention meow? I'm not really sure why, but I definitely can't see a town motivation behind omitting posts.

That was a mistake on my part... I thought the discussion stopped after dough and I pointed it out so I stopped reading further to quote posts and code my post. I did see them when I read through the thread, but dough already seemed town for pointing it out and m3ow's post on Panda makes sense and fits with her meta from previous games, so I didn't see the need to mentioned them on my next post.

Plus this is D1, and I can only spend a few hours reading this thread, I didn't want to focus on players who I townread subconsciously and prefer to focus on anyone who I think is behaving weird.

Now onto the reads you made:
The part that concerned me was the bold. Compare this to her read of Daniel:
So getting a discussion going is scummy if it's done by Jacob, and null if it's done by Daniel? That seems a bit shady.

Again, Ayaya contradicts herself:
Now the contradiction here isn't as obvious, but look at the tone of the how she says it. With her read of me, she says "she posts a lot to make it harder for town to find info" and followed it by "Thought unlike..." and gave things that I did that were pro-town, making the 1st item seem like her problem with me. However, in Panda's post, she says "I don't think someone who's trying to contribute should be seen as scum" and "she posts a lot that it's easier to find slips if she is scum", which is basically what was said about me in a positive light (whereas when she said the same thing to me, it was spun into a more negative light).

Huh, and you don't find it fit to give Rune a reason besides nothing stood out to you about him? That seems like a very null indicator - a town read off of that seems kind of odd. But that's more besides the point.

And I kind of pointed this out already, but dough did join in on the conversation you considered suspicious so.

---

---

 

[illunie]

@Rune Someone close to Daniel died. I think that'd be a totally legit reason for giving up. You don't?

Also ftr I'm replying to your thing rn Rune. Probably the last big post I'm making tonight though because my brain hurts x-x

I already answered that, so read the post and don't try and spin it for your scummate.

 

[PandaDarling]

I've been reading all your post and im going to go back and read as much of the game as i can....i have work tonight but hopefully i can come up with some kinda post for you all before D2.

 

[illunie]

Just woke up, let me reply to this before looking at the thread



Firstly, my intention to cut it off was to stop us from discussing it further. I said before the game started that we might end up discussing who have which items instead of scumhunting on D1, and we didn't discuss items at all but ended up discussing KP, which is why I wanted it to stop. I did say though that it at least got a discussion going, that I already said towards you twice. That is meant as a positive comment because any discussion is better than just jokes or meme. It even got me to try discern scum from there (and apparently I was right since Ness ended up being scum)

The "scum might be hiding between them" idea was based on how previous games, scum are more likely to join/continue discussion about meta in games (ex: Ender joining Sataric in GoT, Daniel speculating about KP in GoT)

I didn't answer the question because I honestly don't know a better way. Maybe I should've answered with "You got us something to work with though" but at that time I was gonna be busy for the rest of the day and wanted to spend my remaining time reading the thread instead


That was a mistake on my part... I thought the discussion stopped after dough and I pointed it out so I stopped reading further to quote posts and code my post. I did see them when I read through the thread, but dough already seemed town for pointing it out and m3ow's post on Panda makes sense and fits with her meta from previous games, so I didn't see the need to mentioned them on my next post.

Plus this is D1, and I can only spend a few hours reading this thread, I didn't want to focus on players who I townread subconsciously and prefer to focus on anyone who I think is behaving weird.



I find Jacob to be scummy because of his other post (that I quoted there), while Daniel at that time didn't seem too odd for me from his posts. Those reads were also based on their other posts, I just used that list to start discerning scum bc like I said, scum is likely to join the discussion.

I didn't contradict myself because I did not intend to paint you on a negative light. I was just saying how I thought you were scum in the past game where you behave similarly in the game when you were town, my mistake was thinking someone is scum purely because they made a lot of filler posts (which in that game, I was still hesitant too) and did you not notice I refered to your play while I talking about Panda? This part



And I already said in my reply to you that you actually got a discussion going now with how we have more inactive players, something that I pointed out in Papers Please where it's good with lurkers but bad when other players are active.

Town-read on Rune and not null because his posts doesn't stand out to me, and his post about glad being town seem genuine. Null read on you because you mentioned that you want to change your playstyle but didn't, null on Panda because her filler posts isn't towntell to me (otherwise I would've pointed it out), null on Ness because of the "let's do some math here" comment.



Ok, I was townreading Ness and now I'm scumbuddies with him??? Firstly, I didn't think he's scum because of this claim:



I thought it was weird how he went back to playing aggressively and condescending to accusations pointed at him, instead of trying to play calmly and getting defensive. He behaved similarly to when he was Vengeful Veteran Granny in Scummy and with that claim, I thought he might be blue. I still think his aggressive playing is weird which is why I pointed it out.

I don't think I defended him at all?? He was acting weird to me but not enough to make me think he's scum, and as I said above, I thought he's a PR because he's behaving similarly as Scummy.

Where did I say I see a reason for a Ness lynch?

---

TL;DR You're taking what I said or don't say completely out of context and painting me as manipulating when I'm not???

But thank you for writing this post and explaining the flaw in my reads. I probably should be clearer in my points as it seems sometimes people misinterpret them as something else, when I tend to be clear about my point (ex if I don't state that you're weird/scummy in any of my posts, then I don't think you're scum)

Once again I did not see you as scummy for your amount of posts. Stop taking what I said out of context.

Gonna read the thread now.

Just wanted to point out that this is basically the same as my post in the major points, such as that she was never defending Ness, when it looks like she hasn't read it yet.. This also confirms my theory I'm pretty sure, but I'll wait for a direct answer.

 

[Arstotzkan]

I already answered that, so read the post and don't try and spin it for your scummate.

Honestly I'm skimming so I skimmed over that - sorry about that!

I don't think you can view something like this from an objective view point, though. RL circumstance is a motivator for things, and you have to take that into account.

My brain is spinning pretty hard rn though so I'm going to take a nap. Gonna reply to longer posts tomorrow.

 

[Ayaya]

Ok wait let me reply to Runeraider first

@Ayaya: Please, why did you say that constant posting was a scumtell in the last game, and not in this game? If I'm right, this will be another debunk, but until I get word from her on this, it's still an unresolved point.

Firstly, thank you for explaining what I intended to say in my posts <3 I think you did a better job explaining it than I did haha.

To answer your question, the two players who did this are known for their filler posts. Panda is always known for her filler posts because she posts a lot, but lately she's improving as well. I find her improvement odd in Papers Please but I'm not one to lynch a player solely because they changed their playstyle (I think I said the same thing on other games too?)

I focused on Kat on Papers Please because I heard she's a good player, and I thought it was odd how in that game, she made more filler posts compared to other experienced players like Minties, Ender, and Sataric (something I also mentioned in my reads on her in the last game) she ended up dying with me revealing herself as town which made me learn that a lot of filler posts =/= scum trying to hide information. I pointed out why I think she's odd in obs chat to her too. I also learned from Tom on N1 that Kat usually questions people as town to start discussions (which fits with her meta now)

Which is why I think filler posts aren't enough as scumtells in this game. In fact, like I said about Panda, it helps us to have more posts to work/base on compared to lurking and posting at the minimum (like you did in Papers Please )

@Minties: Sorry for not quoting your posts properly but editing Sarasa and Rune's so I can reply is already tiring for me T_T

Sarasa essentially summed up most of what I was thinking reading through Ayaya's posts. If you haven't read her post on Ayaya, go do it now.

Ayaya's Reads


Ayaya is usually pretty solid in posting reads, but I feel like all of these were very non-accusatory because it was all town and null reads with the exception of Jacob who is a fairly weak player. I feel like her posts so far come off as a lot of overview of what players have said to try and look like they're contributing a lot of text.

TL;DR
-Town read Runeraider, Oath, Doughssant, Panda, Ness and Daniel
-Scum read Jacob and voted for him
-Go read Sarasa's post

My "solid posts" are usually done after D1, where I have more evidence to work with. And what am I supposed to do when I don't think them as scum (enough)? Paint them as scum over any bad behavior then later have scum use it against me to say I was starting a bandwagon on them? I didn't think them as worth focusing enough and that was it. I had my eye on Jacob who seemed more scummy than null or town.

Okay I hope I make myself clear. I'm glad you guys at least pointed out why you think I'm scum instead of like Ender repeating "Ayaya is scum" in GoT (which... made me take a slight break from that game because I can't even defend myself from that alone.)

 

[EpicGamer12]

Wow, we have a lot to go off of. I'm going to wait until D2 to start analyzing more thoroughly because I'm busy until then + I want to see what we can get from death information. In the meantime if you have any questions on me regarding my last post feel free to ask away.

 

[oath2order]

Wow, we have a lot to go off of. I'm going to wait until D2 to start analyzing more thoroughly because I'm busy until then + I want to see what we can get from death information. In the meantime if you have any questions on me regarding my last post feel free to ask away.

Are you scum

- - - Post Merge - - -

Metanalysis of your inactivity says yes

 

[illunie]

Are you scum

- - - Post Merge - - -

Metanalysis of your inactivity says yes

Don't be so rude, show some manners oath.
At least let him say yes first.

THIS IS A JOKE, DON'T TALK IT OUT OF CONTEXT YOU SPECIAL SNOWFLAKES

 

[EpicGamer12]

Are you scum

- - - Post Merge - - -

Metanalysis of your inactivity says yes

no I am not but here is something to help you out with your ineffective drawing to conclusions

 

[illunie]

Honestly I'm skimming so I skimmed over that - sorry about that!

I don't think you can view something like this from an objective view point, though. RL circumstance is a motivator for things, and you have to take that into account.

My brain is spinning pretty hard rn though so I'm going to take a nap. Gonna reply to longer posts tomorrow.

Sorry if that came off as cold, sometimes it's easy to forget that the players in here are actual people.
Looking forward to see you take on it.

- - - Post Merge - - -

*your

 

[Chrystina]

Don't be so rude, show some manners oath.
At least let him say yes first.

THIS IS A JOKE, DON'T TALK IT OUT OF CONTEXT YOU SPECIAL SNOWFLAKES

Are you going to capitalize and bold everytime you make a joke because of my reply to your 1st joke on D1?
I just find it funny tbh, because my comment was really not that serious, saying "suspicious..." rather than typing out a huge read on you.

if you're not then just disregard this.

 

[illunie]

To answer your question, the two players who did this are known for their filler posts. Panda is always known for her filler posts because she posts a lot, but lately she's improving as well. I find her improvement odd in Papers Please but I'm not one to lynch a player solely because they changed their playstyle (I think I said the same thing on other games too?)

I focused on Kat on Papers Please because I heard she's a good player, and I thought it was odd how in that game, she made more filler posts compared to other experienced players like Minties, Ender, and Sataric (something I also mentioned in my reads on her in the last game) she ended up dying with me revealing herself as town which made me learn that a lot of filler posts =/= scum trying to hide information. I pointed out why I think she's odd in obs chat to her too. I also learned from Tom on N1 that Kat usually questions people as town to start discussions (which fits with her meta now)

Well, my theory was that you had learned from your mistakes and not to judge people on this point, but your reasoning was much better.

- - - Post Merge - - -

Are you going to capitalize and bold everytime you make a joke because of my reply to your 1st joke on D1?
I just find it funny tbh, because my comment was really not that serious, saying "suspicious..." rather than typing out a huge read on you.

if you're not then just disregard this.

It's not just you that does it, people have literally made reads on me for stupid jokes. I'm pretty sure I got lynched for it once. The disclaimer is just a joke, though, yeah.

 

[Jacob]

It's not just you that does it, people have literally made reads on me for stupid jokes. I'm pretty sure I got lynched for it once. The disclaimer is just a joke, though, yeah.

maybe it'd be in ur best interest if you didn't make jokes anymore. obviously u know people are going to look into it, people look into everything in mafia.
imo posting jokes falls under the "strategic spam" category, distracts people, and generally a tactic used by mafia.
even if you post a "disclaimer."

just sayin

 

[Heyden]

Well just gonna state my current thoughts about the game, not gonna go into detail just yet, because things could change over night but...
Null
Dolby
Crys
Stardusk
Iggy Koopa
Soda Fox
mother of all llamas
oath2order

Town
Ayaya
Jacob

Inbetween/Unsure
Alexi
Panda1376
m3ow_
Minties
Trundle
Trojan
Beardo

Suspicions
SarasaKat
Call me Daniel
Lucanosa
Runeraider

To summarise, can you guys please post more so we don't have to deal with the inactivity and lurking. I know some of you are busy and whatever but it would be nice if you could try and post.

 

[illunie]

Town
Ayaya

Suspicions
SarasaKat
Runeraider

Uh, no.
You can't seriously think that both the person you posted a case about AND the person who rebutted the case about your townread are both scum. If that was true, why would I be defending Ayaya?