Mafia The Battle of the Nobles- Endgame

[toadsworthy]

I'm gonna ISO people and look at their posts from last night and start with town reads because they're easier. I'll mention everyone, but really only hitting the main town/scum leans

Heyden - probably my strongest town lean so far. Regular good content, looking at several different people. In a game where there has been so much crap talked, I feel like your reads have been numb to it all while taking out the good points. Asking the right questions at stupid moments like Punchy asking for reads on himself. With all of what punchy is and does, Heyden validated his scum reads on punchy based on like word choice (#511). If he was scum I feel like there is so much easier points to get punchy for than putting in such an in depth anlaysis like that. I don't necessarily believe in the argument or that punchy is so scummy.... but I think it shows a lot about heyden. The only bad thing for heyden is he is picking the easiest targets... bianca, punchy, and temptations

Chele - I'm fully aware that we've been tricked by chele in the past, but I mean her content is pretty good. She has like a certain naiveness to her though that is reading genuine

To be honest Bianca, it’s probably not Vanessa because if she were scum, she’d be an arrogant KM and purposely choose a town person to lynch for the day. However, we cannot confirm that because she hasn’t chosen a lynch candidate yet. But as of now, she seems to be open to everybody’s opinion and wants to have the majority vote of everybody to lynch.

This post makes zero sense, because if mafia is chosen as kingmaker its not gonna be outright obvious. But like this doesn't sound like a scum theory to me... like if Chele is scum and writing this, she is on some next level stuff

Punchy - now punchy's being annoying, and its definitely not town helpful, but I'm about motives and scum-punchy doesn't have a motive to post about that "read me" crap. Punchy doesn't feel important and probably beat down from the 40 person game that he's not used to playing. Punchy wants to feel important and he isn't getting it. If he was scum I feel like he would understand his importance and wouldn't be thinking like this. I don't see him as scum, its enough for me to town lean him at the moment.

Important Nulls
Vanessa - I'm super glad that vanessa is king tbh because we all have a hard time reading her, however she is more likely to crack under pressure... and what better way to pressure her than this. So far she is the basic representation of what I expect from a king from either alignment on day 1, but what she does for the end of day will be telling.

Moving on to scum leans

Bianca - I read over the arguments about bianca and definitely think she is more scum-sided. I have been on the side of bianca before where she is very aggressive and we all think "how can she be faking, it feels genuine" and then she was scum. Through all of this, bianca is still remaining coherent and focused though.... bianca losing her mind is town bianca - ala tagsgate 2016.

Bianca is blunt. So when she is sussed as town she freaks out and screams about being town, but when bianca is scum she gets defensive in a weird way towards certain things

I am not concerned for mafia because my concern is for town so I guess my mind's direction is really towards the good of the town

like this just sounds forced and weirdly worded too

you are all ready to townlock people really?

I would think that mafia's #1 priority is to confirm everyone so they can kill or get close to the powerroles

And in all of this bianca's biggest scum read right now is Meta... like in all of this she didn't get upset at an actual player, she got upset at people using Meta and then she dipped out at the perfect time to hopefully allow someone else to get sussed and caught up over her while just trying to tear down the biggest arguments against her.

Trundle - I played scum with trundle in steven universe 2 and I was perplexed by the things he did, so he can be a loose cannon for the people thinking he wouldn't be drawing attention this early. This was from early on in SU2

I'm throwing people off in such a way that when I'm lynched they'll have no idea where to turn to. It has worked wonders in other mafia games. I plan to not be lynched today though, even if it means fake claiming.

I recognize that people can change, and its been a while for him in a game, but Trundle is probably one of the smartest people here. He knows what he's doing. The jump to AtE was just so out of character to what I expect from trundle, I think in the early games I compared him to a robot. Everything is just so out of characteristic and it reads all scummy to me. Underlying all this, he went into this game with restraint and said it himself, which seems more like a scum-aligned thought slip than anything town. Trundle/Vanessa team is not a thing at all, since he is the first one to really contest the active king. His main scum reads are Jacob because I don't know why and then proceeded to say that Vanessa is coasting when she is the 3rd most active person on this thread.

Temptations - I was wrong about scum reading temptations last time, so I'm cautious since they do seem a lot like the last game.

But would you be providing evidence to prove that back up your decision to ignore the majority if scum is playing with the bandwagons? There are 16 people in this game and only 4 mafia aswell. I'm just worried because I don't really know if you actually have the towns best interest in mind. Between 1 to 100, what are the chances of you actually overriding the majority vote and making the decisions for the game.

but I really didn't like his questioning of vanessa about her ideas for king and this interaction... it seems too interested. I get town wondering that, but it also reads scum-cautious. Otherwise their questioning seems better than last time

Why do two people, unravel and trundle, have Jacob as their biggest scum read? I don't see anything yet

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The biggest points seemed to be on bianca and trundle and punchy from last night.... so thats my thoughts

 

[EpicGamer12]

It's not that I don't think you are acting in the best interest of the game, I'm just stating that we should scumread if you aren't.

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Trundle, you didn't answer my question. Also, Vanessa not voting for herself is not scumming so your reaction towards her is very cocky. I mean, if she would vote for herself and she is Town (and knows it) then that would be a bad play from her.

In all honesty I have not been reading your posts very thoroughly. What did you ask me?

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@toads I don't think it's fair to draw a parallel between me and unravel both scumreading Jacob. I was the first person to say anything, and Heyden shortly after. unravel following suit should not be alignment indicative of me, but perhaps AI of her. Your other stuff on me is reasonable. Also, thank you for the compliment. I also made a big post on Jacob, not sure if you missed that or not.

 

[toadsworthy]

The most confusing thing I've read unravel's play

Idk much about Jacob as town but he seems kind of place I kinda feel weirded out he mention something scum is between me, trundle and mog but scumleans all 3. Why would you scumlean someone who just saw someone's post and laufs at it then another person being fragile about their playstyle. Mog is just really genuine and concern about it I'm cool with it pointing out why I'm like this we all have different taste of humor. I do like how trundle pointed out that Jacob is playing passive in RQS part which kind of leave me scummy vibes right there

For Ness I hate how pushy he was to trundle not a fan of meta thing cuz people can just change their style anytime I'm sure some of us know this. Mafia can have a guts to push and took advantage of it.

Why pick out Jacob from this and defend mog, what made you believe her over Jacob. Lots of people do the "I think one of these three people could be scum" thing. Mog comes off genuine no matter what, I want to ISO her and Jacob next from last night, but I just thought it was weird you picked mog's side for a seemingly bias reason.

Then you defend trundle who has been probably the most abrasive, albeit for a reason though. Like I want more on these reads because I have no idea why you Town read mog and trundle while thinking at the same time Jacob is scum

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In all honesty I have not been reading your posts very thoroughly. What did you ask me?

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@toads I don't think it's fair to draw a parallel between me and unravel both scumreading Jacob. I was the first person to say anything, and Heyden shortly after. unravel following suit should not be alignment indicative of me, but perhaps AI of her. Your other stuff on me is reasonable. Also, thank you for the compliment. I also made a big post on Jacob, not sure if you missed that or not.

Yeah I just don't know why everyone is scum reading jacob... but let me find these posts by Heyden and you, I just found unravel's

 

[EpicGamer12]

Just because you think I'm inconsistent or are there more reasons?

I want to read through your posts which I will do later, but my gut feeling/vague impression from just reading the thread is that you are not actually trying to find mafia. You seem to be letting town "find" mafia for you. I think both your scum leans are weak (considering you keep going back and forth on me).

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The most confusing thing I've read unravel's play



Why pick out Jacob from this and defend mog, what made you believe her over Jacob. Lots of people do the "I think one of these three people could be scum" thing. Mog comes off genuine no matter what, I want to ISO her and Jacob next from last night, but I just thought it was weird you picked mog's side for a seemingly bias reason.

Then you defend trundle who has been probably the most abrasive, albeit for a reason though. Like I want more on these reads because I have no idea why you Town read mog and trundle while thinking at the same time Jacob is scum

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Yeah I just don't know why everyone is scum reading jacob... but let me find these posts by Heyden and you, I just found unravel's

Yeah... Again I want to iterate that I have not really interacted with Waffles this game, she has only attempted to interact with me. If she's town, she clearly likes my ideas. If she turns out to be mafia, maybe it means my reads are bad and she is trying to jump on it to mislynch today.

 

[toadsworthy]

Is there more to heyden's argument than this?

Jacob's scumpool of Mog/Waffles/Trundle felt off, as if he's pushing for lynches that won't happen (except Trundle), esp when Mog's displaying pretty town behaviour and Waffles hasn't really posted much. Jacob hasn't posted enough yet for me to determine anything but its just that one post that rlly stuck out to me.

 

[tae]

my eyes are severely dialated from my eye exam this morning but as soon as i’m not straining and giving myself a head ache i’m gonna read all the **** i missed from last night. someone help

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how long do eyes stau dialated for. there’s like 9 hours left before night so i should be good

 

[EpicGamer12]

Is there more to heyden's argument than this?

Not at the moment, it was more gut for him. It was pretty gut feeling for me too. It's hard to explain reads based off gut feelings and wording. I usually just call people out for being scum and don't explain why.

 

[toadsworthy]

I'm voting bianca now because between her and Trundle's AtE (which why are we AtE-ing on day 1) hers looks more inducive to scum alignment than trundles which is just out of left field.

Trundle what do you think of Bianca last night... in fact what do you think of most people in this game because you only really have focused on a few and just said others were town or scum

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I havent even gotten into Dolby or Mog or this Unravel/Jacob/Trundle/Heyden because something is weird about it to me... but I need to actually do work at work lol so I'll be back when I leave here

 

[EpicGamer12]

I'm voting bianca now because between her and Trundle's AtE (which why are we AtE-ing on day 1) hers looks more inducive to scum alignment than trundles which is just out of left field.

Trundle what do you think of Bianca last night... in fact what do you think of most people in this game because you only really have focused on a few and just said others were town or scum

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I havent even gotten into Dolby or Mog or this Unravel/Jacob/Trundle/Heyden because something is weird about it to me... but I need to actually do work at work lol so I'll be back when I leave here

I have posted all the reads I currently have already. If you missed it, here they are:

Dolby - town
toadsworthy - town
Vampnessa - mafia
Heyden - town
Bianca - town but I could very well be wrong
Jacob - mafia
Ness - probably town

 

[toadsworthy]

Why do you think vanessa is scum and why talk about it while she is king?

I too don't think vanessa should be townread so far, but I wouldn't put her on scum lean... nothing so far in her kingship has made me think she is really town, and the lack of that makes me scum lean her. More to come when she finished her kingship

 

[EpicGamer12]

Why do you think vanessa is scum and why talk about it while she is king?

I too don't think vanessa should be townread so far, but I wouldn't put her on scum lean... nothing so far in her kingship has made me think she is really town, and the lack of that makes me scum lean her. More to come when she finished her kingship

I mean, I literally just explained a few posts ago why I think she is scum. Also why not? King is not a free-of-criticism pass. I know she is not going to lynch herself, but the more she is pushed now the more likely it is we can lynch her in a future day.

 

[toadsworthy]

I want to read through your posts which I will do later, but my gut feeling/vague impression from just reading the thread is that you are not actually trying to find mafia. You seem to be letting town "find" mafia for you. I think both your scum leans are weak (considering you keep going back and forth on me).

This, sorry it was in the same post as your response from the previous conversation.
I definitely see this as well.... but thought that saying it this early would give too much time for her to cover up, so I wanted to see what she did from this time on before putting her in scum or town

 

[Dolby]

Ordered as people come to mind while I read the thread. Four hours of classes start at 11 AM and I started making this at 10 AM so I'm in a bit of a hurry to say the least

Antonio-Townlean. Yeah, I didn't like what I saw as faketells earlier, but thinking back to his previous games as scum (notably Korean War), the single best thing that I can say for his alignment is that he isn't floundering and actually put forward some good content on Punchy. More importantly though, I personally feel that Antonio's tone feels pretty genuine, which strikes me in comparison to Korean War (last scum game of his that I really remember) because they were trying to say as little as possible, but dress it up as reads. Where they have little their pretty blatant about it. If they're scum, they've vastly improved their alignment play

Unravel-Nullish/Town, but I do feel that it's important to go into the slot a bit since it was something that I wanted to push earlier and has changed significantly: I actually like the content that they've done later since it seems like none of it comes from scum Unravel. In particular, I like her post on Jacob, which is someone that I actively dislike right now and her's is the only post to really go into depth on Jacob.

Bianca-Scumish, here is where my reads start to drop off. I dislike Bianca for three major things 1. They're reads are a bunch of nulls mashed up within fluff that lengthens their posts (which has worked on some people and make them think that it's content apparently) 2. "Mocking/I don't understand/dismissive" tone towards some accusations reminds me of past scum play 3. AtE didn't set right. Notable thing is that Punchy/Bianca prob isn't a team (also prob not Bianca/Antonio, they just dismiss Antonio printer problems as pure non-AI if teammates). As well as a few pushes on relatively inactive people I specifically don't like

Punchy-Yeah this is something that I've conflicted on, I do think that he's somewhat scummish because a lot of his reads lack backing, thus it feels that he's lashing out and making his conclusion before he makes his reasoning, hence, SL

**** it, just gonna make a list, I have half an hour, gonna be one sporadically until 2:15 PM PST

TLs
Antonio
Chele
Rune
Mog
Toads
Ness

Null
Heyden
Unravel
Vanessa
Evan
Tae
Trundle
Jacob

Uncomfortable
Punchy
Bianca

 

[cornimer]

I mean my opinion of myself is that I've done at least some amount of work, I started the whole Bianca charge and have questioned multiple people including Trundle and Rune (who nobody had really questioned yet minus the Evan RQS thing on D1.) Heyden and Chele did all the work on Punchy, that is true, but to say I *only* went off what other people said the whole game and didn't hunt for scum myself is inaccurate. But then again how much is my opinion of myself is really worth, not much.

Also, if you look at or know my other town games, I'm never much of a leader. The only game where I went out of my way to ISO everyone and make my own evidence is when I was scum in RHOM. I'm usually not super confident in my reads and usually sit in the background and follow what other people are saying (which is why I always get mislynched as town), and I'm trying my best to be more active and a leader as king but I mean I can only do so well at something I'm bad at.

 

[Jacob]

Posting this here as to not just drop a vote unexplained. I'm voting trundle based off of what I've mentioned earlier. I'll most likely be back before EoD but I have a lot of book shopping and involvement fair so I'm kinda slammed with stuff.

If it helps Vanessa, I'd also be willing to switch to Unravel, Antonio or mog, in that order. I know ppl are town reading them for the most part for tone and effort and stuff- and they're my weaker scum leans- but I think both mog and Antonio are aware enough to mimic their town play as mafia, tbh

 

[toadsworthy]

Dolby does that mean you would vote bianca today?

 

[Dolby]

Dolby does that mean you would vote bianca today?

ATM, yeah because I think Punchys behavior can be explained by doublegaming (which I didn’t find the post explaining it, but a few people did mention it)

@Jacob, just gonna day that I disagree that Antonio is capable of emulating town meta in regards to that

 

[toadsworthy]

Posting this here as to not just drop a vote unexplained. I'm voting trundle based off of what I've mentioned earlier. I'll most likely be back before EoD but I have a lot of book shopping and involvement fair so I'm kinda slammed with stuff.

If it helps Vanessa, I'd also be willing to switch to Unravel, Antonio or mog, in that order. I know ppl are town reading them for the most part for tone and effort and stuff- and they're my weaker scum leans- but I think both mog and Antonio are aware enough to mimic their town play as mafia, tbh

what do you think about heyden's point on you picking easier targets?

 

[mogyay]

jacob's been going after me and waffles and trundle before we had even posted in the game lmao and i'm not meant to find it strange that his opinion hasn't changed one bit since his initial post, why are you so determined we're all scum?

there's something up with that, it's strange

 

[Dolby]

jacob's been going after me and waffles and trundle before we had even posted in the game lmao and i'm not meant to find it strange that his opinion hasn't changed one bit since his initial post, why are you so determined we're all scum?

there's something up with that, it's strange

Btw, my reads did up being ordered, so he’s bottom of my nulls